Brian Crowely MEP (what is he doing?)

evolving_doors

Godge wrote: »

Ming's case is different to Crowley but that doesn't give him a free pass.

Very few employers would continue paying 200k a year for six months to someone in that situation.

Also a carpenter or a bricklayer can't work from home, neither can a MEP.

Ming is being paid expenses for the cost of travelling to Europe and it still getting them. Haven't seen him say he is handing them back.

He is like the pigs in Animal Farm.

Fair enough but have you heard him say he isn't handing them back either.

What if he gave the money to charity! (a la Alan Shatter!)

mikom

Godge wrote: »

Ming's case is different to Crowley but that doesn't give him a free pass.

Very few employers would continue paying 200k a year for six months to someone in that situation.

Also a carpenter or a bricklayer can't work from home, neither can a MEP.

Ming is being paid expenses for the cost of travelling to Europe and it still getting them. Haven't seen him say he is handing them back.

He is like the pigs in Animal Farm.

The same Ming that cost us the least to get elected to Europe, as we pay for the reimbursements after all .........

Luke ‘Ming’ Flanagan spent the least amount in getting elected at €38,093.

http://www.thejournal.ie/election-2014-spending-1672435-Sep2014/

The same Ming that pumped half of his €93,000 salary into "recreational facilities" in his Roscommon-South Leitrim constituency.

http://www.joe.ie/uncategorized/luke-ming-flanagan-to-donate-half-his-td-earnings-to-local-projects/15299

I'd read over Animal farm again if I were you.

katydid

mikom wrote: »

The same Ming that cost us the least to get elected to Europe, as we pay for the reimbursements after all ..........

Talk about warped logic..even though Ming doesn't do a proper job, he costs the taxpayer less to elect so we should be grateful to him...

Wow.

Your link to him putting half his TD's salary back into the community is three years old. It says he was going to do it. DID he do it? And does he give half his MEP's salary? At least, considering he hasn't actually worked for half of it this year, that would be some kind of payback.

mikom

katydid wrote: »

Talk about warped logic...because Ming doesn't turn up for his job as he should, he costs the taxpayer less money so we should be grateful to him...

Wow.

It was a reply to the pig from animal farm comment.
Rewarp that logic.

efb

touts wrote: »

I do actually. When an employee is no longer capable of doing the job their position may be terminated. Crowley would fit that standard by even the loosest application of the terms in the private sector. I have seen two or three similar cases to his in my career. Employers are under no obligation to keep an employee that can no longer do to the job. You have to follow set procedures and policies and you may have to offer a redundancy package but once an employee is no longer able (or won't be for some considerable period) to do the job employment law is fully on the side of the employer.

It is not as if he does not have a track record of non attendance. A quick look at Vote Watch Europe exposes a DISMAL picture.

July 2009-Dec 2009 He turned up to work 82% of the time. As we will see that is excellent by his standards. But it's not so good by attendance standards in the private sector. Verbal warning territory.

Jan 2010-June 2010 0% He didn't turn up to work once. HR and company doctor definitely involved. Possible written Warning Territory. Pay cut to welfare allowance would be pretty standard in the private sector but I'll bet it didn't happen here.

July 2010-Dec 2010 He managed to turn up for 88% of the votes. An improvement we'll try for 100% next month shall we.

Jan 2011-June 2011 Oh No. Things are slipping again. 30% attendance. HR are seriously involved. Termination with a package now being looked at.

July 2011-Dec 2011 0% He didn't turn up to work once. Now people have said he was seriously ill in this period but also in this period he was looking for the Fianna Fail nomination for the presidency. If I was an employer and had an employee out sick and then found out he was basically off doing interviews for another job I'd be furious. Now we are looking at termination without a package.

Jan 2012-June 2012- 0% Again he didn't turn up to work once. Now not even the union would be supporting him

July 2012-Dec 2012 49%. What do you even do with him now. At less than 50% you have no idea if he is going to turn up to work or not but in his case he won't step aside and allow you hire someone to replace him because he might turn up a few days and want his desk. That wouldn't be tolerated in the private sector.

Jan 2013-June 2013. 0% Why do we even printing a clock in card for him.

July 2013-Dec 2014: 93%. Wow. That's amazing for him. Is his contract up for renewal or something. Oh yes it is.....

Jan 2014-June 2014. 0%. I warned you not to give him that bloody contract extension...

June 2014-Dec 2014. 0% Crowley? Crowley? Ammmm oh I'm not sure he still works here. I think he left. Let me check the company directory. Well would you believe it. Apparently he is still on the books.


Now Ming is different. Ming's case is clearly an unexpected medical emergency. As an understanding employer we will try to facilitate him as much as possible with things like working from home etc. But once the baby and mother are both home and well we'll expect him back to work full time in the office.

Redundancy is not sacking though

efb

I also don't think voting is mandatory and em certainly not the sumtotal of their job

touts

efb wrote: »

Redundancy is not sacking though

I have dealt with a lot of employees who got redundancy and considered themselves sacked. Very often redundancy is not voluntary.

efb

touts wrote: »

I have dealt with a lot of employees who got redundancy and considered themselves sacked. Very often redundancy is not voluntary.

Compulsory redundancy is still not sacking no matter what people consider it is

efb

katydid wrote: »

Do you? You are entitled to Force Majeur, which is three days in any period of twelve consecutive months and five days in any period of thirty six consecutive months, for URGENT matters concerning a family member's illness. That is the only paid leave of absence you are entitled to under employment law. Anything else has to be unpaid.


As for certified sick leave; in the public service you are entitled to a maximum of three months in four years. You don't get anything like that in the private domaine.


Employment law, for some reason, doesn't seem to apply to politicians.

Anything else is at the employers discretion not necessarily unpaid

efb

katydid wrote: »

Talk about warped logic..even though Ming doesn't do a proper job, he costs the taxpayer less to elect so we should be grateful to him...

Wow.

Your link to him putting half his TD's salary back into the community is three years old. It says he was going to do it. DID he do it? And does he give half his MEP's salary? At least, considering he hasn't actually worked for half of it this year, that would be some kind of payback.

How do you he hasn't worked??? Voting is only one aspect of it

touts

efb wrote: »

I also don't think voting is mandatory and em certainly not the sumtotal of their job

It certainly isn't mandatory but 0% is just taking the piss. And the Vote watch website also contains Stats for drafting legislation, asking questions and such and in Crowley's case it is just as dismal as his voting record. He has done very very little in the last 5 years in comparison to most other MEPs. And it is not as if he is doing a Jackie Healy Rae on it and spending all his time as a glorified councillor. Crowley isn't seen in Munster in between election campaigns.

efb

touts wrote: »

It certainly isn't mandatory but 0% is just taking the piss. And the Vote watch website also contains Stats for drafting legislation, asking questions and such and in Crowley's case it is just as dismal as his voting record. He has done very very little in the last 5 years in comparison to most other MEPs. And it is not as if he is doing a Jackie Healy Rae on it and spending all his time as a glorified councillor. Crowley isn't seen in Munster in between election campaigns.

I'm defending my rep Ming

Phoebas

touts wrote: »

It certainly isn't mandatory but 0% is just taking the piss. And the Vote watch website also contains Stats for drafting legislation, asking questions and such and in Crowley's case it is just as dismal as his voting record. He has done very very little in the last 5 years in comparison to most other MEPs. And it is not as if he is doing a Jackie Healy Rae on it and spending all his time as a glorified councillor. Crowley isn't seen in Munster in between election campaigns.

That's an interesting website:
Both of these guys have atrocious records. All of Ming's 36 votes (out of 217) were over two days in July - where he mostly registered his vote as an abstention.

That's not to say he wasn't around - he is marked as 'Didn't Vote' on a good number of the votes (as opposed to 'Absent'), but I suppose he wouldn't want to be passing up his daily attendance allowances.

Ming's record

Crowley's record

touts

efb wrote: »

I'm defending my rep Ming

Well in that case I agree with you. I don't agree with his politics but As the father of a child who was also premature I have a lot of sympathy for his position. If he is still doing nothing in a few months then my sympathy will end but while his wife and child are both seriously ill people should be more understanding. It is a temporary issue. Crowley is different. He has a track record of inability to do the job over 5 years and there is no sign that he has any intention of returning to work.

If I understand it correct, Mings baby and mother are not in hospital. Therefore, the danger has passed and nothing to stop him carrying out the duties he was elected for. I would also feel he can well afford to hire professionals to support his wife and daughter while he is away.
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/people-are-not-stupid-its-getting-worse-ming-hits-out-at-services-across-ireland-30762435.html

katydid

efb wrote: »

I also don't think voting is mandatory and em certainly not the sumtotal of their job

It's not mandatory, but it shows an engagement with their job and their purpose for being there. AND is a good indication of their attendance at their job.

Godge

Phoebas wrote: »

That's an interesting website:
Both of these guys have atrocious records. All of Ming's 36 votes (out of 217) were over two days in July - where he mostly registered his vote as an abstention.

That's not to say he wasn't around - he is marked as 'Didn't Vote' on a good number of the votes (as opposed to 'Absent'), but I suppose he wouldn't want to be passing up his daily attendance allowances.

Ming's record

Crowley's record

He doesn't have to worry about the attendance allowances, he gets 50% of them even though he doesn't attend. Nice work if you can get it.

nice_guy80

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If I understand it correct, Mings baby and mother are not in hospital. Therefore, the danger has passed and nothing to stop him carrying out the duties he was elected for. I would also feel he can well afford to hire professionals to support his wife and daughter while he is away.
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/people-are-not-stupid-its-getting-worse-ming-hits-out-at-services-across-ireland-30762435.html

Surely a parent has the right to spend time with their own child.
I think he's moving the family to Brussels in the New Year

nice_guy80

nice_guy80 wrote: »

Surely a parent has the right to spend time with their own child.
I think he's moving the family to Brussels in the New Year

Of course they have! That is not in doubt. However, one has to question his ability to carry out the duties of an MEP. If he's unable to attent the European Parliament, he should step aside and devote his time and energies to his family. They are far more important.
Brian Crowley should do the same until his health improves. His welbeing is far more important than any EU decisions/debates.

I wish good health to all, especially Mings baby and Brian Crowley, in the coming years.

katydid

nice_guy80 wrote: »

Surely a parent has the right to spend time with their own child.
I think he's moving the family to Brussels in the New Year

Of course a parent has the right to spend time with their own child. But the law has not yet granted paid paternal leave in this country. And in countries that have it, it is parental leave shared with the mother.

Ming does not have parental leave, he has taken time off work for long periods of time while continuing to draw an extremely generous salary. That is immoral.

michael999999

katydid wrote: »

Of course a parent has the right to spend time with their own child. But the law has not yet granted paid paternal leave in this country. And in countries that have it, it is parental leave shared with the mother.

Ming does not have parental leave, he has taken time off work for long periods of time while continuing to draw an extremely generous salary. That is immoral.

Almost as bad as the bloody teachers and there 3 months in summer, 3 weeks at Christmas a couple of weeks at easter and there days off for "training"!

katydid

michael999999 wrote: »

Almost as bad as the bloody teachers and there 3 months in summer, 3 weeks at Christmas a couple of weeks at easter and there days off for "training"!

No days off for training..

I have good holidays, but when I have to be at work, I am there. If I am sick, I get a cert, and that's limited in duration. If I was to take indefinite uncertified leave I would lose my job. And rightly so.

Godge

michael999999 wrote: »

Almost as bad as the bloody teachers and there 3 months in summer, 3 weeks at Christmas a couple of weeks at easter and there days off for "training"!

Is whataboutery the standard response for everything you try to defend?

Aidric

Still getting away with it.

https://twitter.com/TJ_Politics/status/659818883516379136]

touts

Aidric wrote: »

Still getting away with it.

https://twitter.com/TJ_Politics/status/659818883516379136]

According to votewatch he has maintained his 0.00% vote record in this parliament. You can get it on an app now for future reference for the next election.

shanered

It is a complete waste of a seat.

Red Kev

Ming making up for lost time, 98.2% voting record on 2015, 84% overall.

http://www.votewatch.eu/en/term8-voting-statistics.html#/#18/0/2015-01-01/2016-01-01//

Ignoring Crowley, all RoI MEP's have about 88% attendance, 90% for 2015.

kenmccarthy

I assume brian crowley unable to attend at votes due to health reasons..... but surely , and I don't wish to be harsh , if that's the case it would be best for all is someone else could "have a go" ????

touts

kenmccarthy wrote: »

I assume brian crowley unable to attend at votes due to health reasons..... but surely , and I don't wish to be harsh , if that's the case it would be best for all is someone else could "have a go" ????

The health issues were there last term when he missed almost the whole 5 years before suddenly voting every time in the last couple of months. He campaigned in the election specifically on the basis that all that was behind him. He also wanted the FF nomination for the presidency on the basis that he was fit for the office and felt strongly enough about that snub to leave the party (after being re-elected to Europe of course). Clearly he misled the electorate so being harsh is justified. If he completes this term in office he will have worked only 3-4 months in 10 years. He should have never run for re-election and he should step aside.

Anyway its not as if he needs the money. Between his Senate pension and his European pension the man's annual retirement income would be more than most of his constituents earn in several years working. Not bad for a man who became a full time politician in his early 20s, hasn't done a real day's work in his life and has done basically nothing for 10 years.

kenmccarthy

Fair comments....have to agree.... His income or pension don't come into it for me.....but a 0%voting record........that's something else...bit of a slight on those who voted for him.