Pre pay power

Whispered

Does anybody use these http://www.prepaypower.ie/

I was wondering if they are any good, worth switching to and if they are much more expensive. They say that they "match the equivalent Electric Ireland Standard Electricity Price Plan " but I'm not sure if that will bring our bills up or down.

I'd be interested in hearing how people find it on a day to day basis. Have you ever run out? About how much do you spend a day? etc.

KoolKid

I use it. Per unit its dearer than ESB but you will use less & be more aware.
If you run out of credit in the evening or over a weekend or bank holiday it will not cut out untill 9am the following day.
Seems to average around €3-4 a day.

Thunderbird2

have it here . So do most of the neighbours around here .. no huge surprising bills .
you use much less and waste less as you switch off everything you don't use ...

highlandseoghan

A few people believe that by this time next year 80% of householders will have a pre pay meter installed. Who do you have your supply with at the moment? If your struggling to pay your bills at the moment most of the main electricity and gas suppliers will install a meter for you.

Anyone I know that has got a pre pay meter has cut down there usage because they are paying more attention to everything that is using elecricity. They seem to be a great idea and if they help the home owner save money even better.

Whispered

It sounds good then. We definitely want to cut down on the big surprise bills, we're also both looking to cut down on our consumption.

We're with airtricity at the moment.

highlandseoghan

One of my friends thats delighted with it is with airtricity. He was just struggling to pay the bills every time they came in and he rang airtricity and i think a week later he had it all set up and ready and Ive never seen someone become so energy efficcent it happened overnight but its saving him a fortune. After seeing the effect it had on him I am strongly considering giving airtricity a call. I am very bad at leaving things plugged in and lights on.

Shifty

Their website says they match the equivalent Electric Ireland Standard Electricity Price Plan unit price and standing charge for Urban 24h, Rural 24H, Urban Nightsaver and Rural Nightsaver plans.

There is also a Public Service Obligation Levy (which applies to all electricity customers irrespective of supplier), and a prepayment service charge of 37.5 cent per day.

Not sure if the 37.5 cent charge a day (works out at approx €136 a year) is inclusive of VAT)

I agree with others as it is prepay, there is the incentive to cut down on unnecessary usage.

Davy

I would do the figures before rushing into this and signing an 12 month contract. If you switch to a bundle plan with gas and electrical, or similar, chances are you will save maybe 15 or 20% roughly depending on usage. Obviously this will help for consumption at first but after awhile that novelty might wear off a bit, and then you stuck paying standard rates as opposed to the other tariffs that are around, bearing in mind the standard rates are the highest.

KoolKid

Another thing to note... AFAIK there is still a promotion where you get someone to refer you & both of you get €20 credit..

M cebee

sounds daft to me anyhow in most cases
-switching to a dearer rate and the hassle of prepay
-it's not that hard to reduce usage to manageable level imo
-suppliers prob pushing it.suits them.

Bruthal

M cebee wrote: »

-suppliers prob pushing it.suits them.

Yea, not much doubt about that imo as well.

highlandseoghan

The people that I have talked to that switched, they switched because they were struggling to keep money for when the bills came in not because of finding it hard to cut down on there usage. I know my friend is on a low income and doesnt have enough income to put money aside and his bills were getting out of control because he was only paying a little off the bill each time it came so the balance was been put onto the next one on top of what they used the following two months.

Pre pay just lets him keep on top of things easier without getting into debt. He has just become a lot more energy aware since getting it in.

Bruthal

highlandseoghan wrote: »

The people that I have talked to that switched, they switched because they were struggling to keep money for when the bills came in not because of finding it hard to cut down on there usage. I know my friend is on a low income and doesnt have enough income to put money aside and his bills were getting out of control because he was only paying a little off the bill each time it came so the balance was been put onto the next one on top of what they used the following two months.

Pre pay just lets him keep on top of things easier without getting into debt. He has just become a lot more energy aware since getting it in.

There is no doubt it can help people budget better. But there is also no doubt that it suits the supplier.

highlandseoghan

100% agree it suits the supplier. I actually think if your paying by pre pay it should be cheaper because the supplier has the money in there account before the electricity / gas is even used.

Whispered

Well. The main reason I'm thinking about switching is because I'm not working much at the moment so have a very very low income. This means that when a bill comes in, my husband looks after it because I wouldn't have been able to put any money aside. Because I'm home more it just feels wrong. So I was thinking that if we had prepay it would take a bill from him and allow me to contribute more easily.

However, looking at it costing approx 4 euro a day. Means it's approx 170 for 2 months. Currently our 2 monthly bill averages out at about 200 for both electricity and gas so it would cost us a fair bit more.

I might just have to manage my money better

Bruthal

Whispered wrote: »

Well. The main reason I'm thinking about switching is because I'm not working much at the moment so have a very very low income. This means that when a bill comes in, my husband looks after it because I wouldn't have been able to put any money aside. Because I'm home more it just feels wrong. So I was thinking that if we had prepay it would take a bill from him and allow me to contribute more easily.

However, looking at it costing approx 4 euro a day. Means it's approx 170 for 2 months. Currently our 2 monthly bill averages out at about 200 for both electricity and gas so it would cost us a fair bit more.

I might just have to manage my money better

The 3 or 4 euro a day mentioned by koolkid would likely be his own average daily use, rather than the average of all customers, if that is what you base your 4 euro a day on.

The difference in price would be small when going onto the pre pay setup, although I also think it should be at minimum, no dearer.

frankmul

I think that using prepay power makes you more energy conscious, that is how you save money. You could become aware of your energy usage by simply reading your meter daily and working out how much it cost you on a daily basis. I used to read our meter every night when I put the dogs in. I used my phone to take a picture of the meter. I had a time and date and reading all together. I could go back then and work out what I had used over a period of time.

jackreacher

hi guys,
can any of the people who have gone with pre pay stick up a picture of what the keypad etc look like in a proper installation.

does the customer decide where the keypad goes or does it have to be right next to meter?

highlandseoghan

The meter my friend got from airtricity is a small box and he can plug it into any socket in the house. Ive no pic of it tho. He just has it plugged into a socket in the box room out of the way.

Tazz T

Sets a bad precedent, IMO. I can see people starting to go without electricity at all for periods and energy companies putting up prices for those not on prepay. There's also the danger of not integrated smoke alarms, house alarms and lights (safety issue) not working when you need them.

If you want to save money. Start learning to switch things off. I have sockets installed on all my standby switches that I can switch off from a single switch wherever I am before I go to bed. If you get one of those power consumption meters (I got mine for free when I shopped for a new provider), you'll soon learn where all the power is going.

Bruthal

Just looking at the esb rates now to do a comparison.

Unit price is €0.1928 or 19.28 cent per kwh
Standing charge is €125.78 a year

For prepay power, the rates are exactly the same.

But where the pre pay hit you, is with a pre pay service charge of €136.71 a year. So it is like having just over two standing charges for the privilege of pre paying.

That`s near €3 a week, or about €23 extra per bill.

frankmul

Tazz T wrote: »

If you want to save money. Start learning to switch things off. I have sockets installed on all my standby switches that I can switch off from a single switch wherever I am before I go to bed.

Have you any details on that switch. Is it a remote control switch

ted1

Bruthal wrote: »

Just looking at the esb rates now to do a comparison.

Unit price is €0.1928 or 19.28 cent per kwh
Standing charge is €125.78 a year

For prepay power, the rates are exactly the same.

But where the pre pay hit you, is with a pre pay service charge of €136.71 a year. So it is like having just over two standing charges for the privilege of pre paying.

That`s near €3 a week, or about €23 extra per bill.

But no one pays standard rate, there is the direct debit discount and the ebills discount , so it's more than just 37.5c a say

ted1

highlandseoghan wrote: »

The meter my friend got from airtricity is a small box and he can plug it into any socket in the house. Ive no pic of it tho. He just has it plugged into a socket in the box room out of the way.

That's not a per pay meter, that's just a kwh meter which shows usage.
They can effective to help people understand what is using power and what unplugging or turning it off does

ted1

KoolKid wrote: »

I use it. Per unit its dearer than ESB but you will use less & be more aware.
If you run out of credit in the evening or over a weekend or bank holiday it will not cut out untill 9am the following day.
Seems to average around €3-4 a day.

Seems a bit much, what type bulbs are using? Have you done anything to reduce usage? It's all well and good not having to pay a bill. But if your not being energy efficient your only kidding yourself

.G.

Got a nasty bill before Christmas,way out of whack with what we usually use.

Got myself an owl monitor and I can see where the power is going but not a lot of scope for stopping it! All essentials items and all items where used in the same manner as before this bill so really weird why the usage went up so much.

I'm a sparks and I'm still struggling to find a way of reducing our usage without throwing the wife and kids out the house

I switched to Electric Ireland from airtricity for a small saving,every little helps. 17.35 cent per KWH and a lower standing charge

Bruthal

ted1 wrote: »

But no one pays standard rate, there is the direct debit discount and the ebills discount , so it's more than just 37.5c a say

Well its there as a clear comparison.

Im not sure what you mean by no one using standard rate.

ted1

Bruthal wrote: »

Well its there as a clear comparison.

Im not sure what you mean by no one using standard rate.

I mean you change providers and they offer you all kind of discounts once these expiry then move again

ted1

superg wrote: »

Got a nasty bill before Christmas,way out of whack with what we usually use.

Got myself an owl monitor and I can see where the power is going but not a lot of scope for stopping it! All essentials items and all items where used in the same manner as before this bill so really weird why the usage went up so much.

I'm a sparks and I'm still struggling to find a way of reducing our usage without throwing the wife and kids out the house

I switched to Electric Ireland from airtricity for a small saving,every little helps. 17.35 cent per KWH and a lower standing charge

Change out all the bulbs, I'm sure you fine this .
Stick a timer switch on mon essentials. I had the TV, blue ray , amp, sub woofer , Apple TV , hard drive upc, broadband and phone all on at the same time. I put the phone, UPC and broadband on one adopter and then put a timer on the others. Turns off a 2am and back on at 9 am . That's 180 hours a month if things on standby eliminated

Bruthal

ted1 wrote: »

I mean you change providers and they offer you all kind of discounts once these expiry then move again

I put up the post as a like for like comparison. Bit hard to do that including all deals of the week etc.

I myself prefer to avoid derect debits of utility bills. Maybe Im the only one in Ireland. But thats how it is.

highlandseoghan

@Ted 1 This is a pay as you go meter. I dont know how it fully works it must have another part connected to the meter outside. Then he has this box that can be moved to any socket in the house. He has a card that he goes in to the shop and gets a top up and enters the code from the recipt into this box in his house. I will try and get you a picture and find out more about it and charges.

.G.

ted1 wrote: »

Change out all the bulbs, I'm sure you fine this .
Stick a timer switch on mon essentials. I had the TV, blue ray , amp, sub woofer , Apple TV , hard drive upc, broadband and phone all on at the same time. I put the phone, UPC and broadband on one adopter and then put a timer on the others. Turns off a 2am and back on at 9 am . That's 180 hours a month if things on standby eliminated

I use CFL or 4w LED throughout the house and they are off unless someone is in the room in question. Nothing gets left on standby ever,if its not being used its plugged out. The only things using power at night or when we are out is the fridge and the house alarm. All of this has always been the case but our usage still went up

The reason for the shock with the bill was because our usage habits didn't seem to change but our usage almost doubled so clearly they did change and we didn't notice.

The monitor helps spot things that are power hungry so we can limit use,like my PC which I built for gaming a few years back with high end power hungry parts and may no longer be as power efficient as it once was so have to cut back on that.

Have the Owl monitor in about 2 weeks now and all in all it seems we are heading for a "normal" bill next time out.

I wouldn't go pre pay,doesn't appear to save much if anything from what I can see here. Just get a usage monitor,watch it closely and switch supplier to whichever one offers the best deal at the time.

Bonkers.ie very good for cost comparisons.

cast_iron

ted1 wrote: »

But no one pays standard rate, there is the direct debit discount and the ebills discount , so it's more than just 37.5c a say

Which means this pre pay is all the more expensive again, does it not? As they don't seem to offer any discount like that.

I can't see how paying them an extra €25 odd euro per bi-monthly bill is seen as a way of saving money.
If people are tight on money, it's completely illogical to have this extra charge on your bill every time.
Just use some cop on and don't waste power, or purchase an owl monitor with a one off charge to monitor usage.

Madam_X

False economy if the units cost more. You can still make pre payments/monitor your usage if you get a bill. As far as I know, you have to be in arrears for ESB/Airtricity/BG to install a pre-pay meter.

What's the deal with the PrePay Power meter and using more than you've paid in for? Do you get cut off after a certain point if you don't top up or does it let arrears build?

Please Kill Me

Madam_X wrote: »

What's the deal with the PrePay Power meter and using more than you've paid in for? Do you get cut off after a certain point if you don't top up or does it let arrears build?

I signed up with these yesterday. When talking to the rep, he explained that when you run out of "credit", you get cut off. However, they "promise" not to cut you off if it's the weekend, but will at 8am on the Monday morning. When you then top up, you're working from a negative. So if you've used €10 over the weekend and top up by €20, you're only getting €10 worth.

Bruthal

cast_iron wrote: »

Which means this pre pay is all the more expensive again, does it not? As they don't seem to offer any discount like that.

Yea thats what ted was getting at I think.

I can't see how paying them an extra €25 odd euro per bi-monthly bill is seen as a way of saving money.

I dont think thats the idea. It helps people budget better. But it really helps the utility company as much or more, by getting extra money from people that may be on the pre pay because of difficulty, and delayed payments and hounding them for money, is eliminated.

If people are tight on money, it's completely illogical to have this extra charge on your bill every time.

Yea it is, as again, its of more benefit to the provider, and they charge for it. It should be no dearer than the standard billing method.

Just use some cop on and don't waste power, or purchase an owl monitor with a one off charge to monitor usage.

Even using the absolute minimum, it can still be quite expensive though. What is easy to pay for one family, might be difficult for others.

ted1

Please Kill Me wrote: »

I signed up with these yesterday. When talking to the rep, he explained that when you run out of "credit", you get cut off. However, they "promise" not to cut you off if it's the weekend, but will at 8am on the Monday morning. When you then top up, you're working from a negative. So if you've used €10 over the weekend and top up by €20, you're only getting €10 worth.

Don't forget 20c bank charges with every top up.

So a good bit dearer, you can set up board gains or Esb on Internet banking and transfer when ever you have money, I transfer about 35 every second week and rarely have to pay a bill.

You should think about doing something like that as it works out much cheaper

Bruthal

ted1 wrote: »

you can set up Esb on Internet banking and transfer when ever you have money, I transfer about 35 every second week and rarely have to pay a bill.

Yea thats what I do myself

Claregirl

We got a shocker of a bill just before Christmas and went all gung-ho trying our best to get it down - just got Jan bill and we managed to save a whole euro

I've a good idea what's causing the wastage one teenager - daily showers for 15mins, cleans his room by filling the washing basket constantly eating (using oven) and filling the dishwasher - feck sake I caught him one morning with just his underwear in the dryer - he wanted them warmed up before he put em on:eek:.

I'd be embarrassed to tell people what our bill is it's crazy for three of us especially when we're all out of the house Mon - Fri

Thinking of changing to Eirtricity as they're showing up as cheapest on Bonkers.ie but not sure can the rate be increased during the 1 year contract?

cast_iron

Bruthal wrote: »

I dont think thats the idea. It helps people budget better.

I know I might sounds a bit smart saying this, but anyone who is tight on money, really shouldn't be spending more as a way of trying to save it. It's a complete false economy, and will only leave them worse off, regardless of what they think.
Paying someone €25 bi-monthly, just to keep a better eye on usage makes no sense to me. Unless you are wasting power by having lights and heaters/immersions etc. on unnecessarily, you will save nothing.
A once off charge for an owl monitor will show you exactly what you are using, i think they even have a cost setting to tell you exactly how much things are costing you.

Yea it is, as again, its of more benefit to the provider, and they charge for it. It should be no dearer than the standard billing method.

I don't agree there. If people are willing to pay for a service, then I say fair play to any company who can make a few bob from it. It is not an essential service.
And they must recoup the install and parts costs somehow.

The internet banking idea seems a far better idea than this prepay power if you ask me.

Bruthal

cast_iron wrote: »

I know I might sounds a bit smart saying this, but anyone who is tight on money, really shouldn't be spending more as a way of trying to save it. It's a complete false economy, and will only leave them worse off, regardless of what they think.
Paying someone €25 bi-monthly, just to keep a better eye on usage makes no sense to me. Unless you are wasting power by having lights and heaters/immersions etc. on unnecessarily, you will save nothing.

Paying as you go, can help some people budget better. A sudden 200 euro bill can leave people badly stuck, where as paying as you go, that wont happen. It might help some people spend a little less on some pints at the weekend etc.

I dont see it as a money saving method, just a better budgeting one. If they only have the exact amount needed to pay all bills without any disposable left, then they cant get by with paying a little extra with pre pay.

A once off charge for an owl monitor will show you exactly what you are using, i think they even have a cost setting to tell you exactly how much things are costing you.

Again, the pre pay is not a money saver imo really. Just a budgeting one.

I don't agree there. If people are willing to pay for a service, then I say fair play to any company who can make a few bob from it. It is not an essential service.

In many cases, its possibly taking advantage of both peoples difficulties, and lack of awareness, so maybe you`re right, fair play to them for seeing the opportunity I suppose.

And they must recoup the install and parts costs somehow.

By indefinitely charging 25 extra bi monthly? They are also saving on billing, collection, and hiring a company to badger people with phone calls.

The internet banking idea seems a far better idea than this prepay power if you ask me.

Thats how I have been doing it for years.

cast_iron

Bruthal wrote: »

Paying as you go, can help some people budget better. A sudden 200 euro bill can leave people badly stuck, where as paying as you go, that wont happen. It might help some people spend a little less on some pints at the weekend etc.

You're not wrong there. But I suppose my point is, that if someone is that tight on money, perhaps they would be better served making an effort to monitor usage and waste than having those pints or whatever they are spending their disposable income on, than paying a premium on their bills.

In many cases, its possibly taking advantage of both peoples difficulties, and lack of awareness, so maybe you`re right, fair play to them for seeing the opportunity I suppose.

By indefinitely charging 25 extra bi monthly? They are also saving on billing, collection, and hiring a company to badger people with phone calls.

That's not a hidden cost! If it was €100 per bill and people were still willing to pay it, then bigger fool them, I say.
And yes, it's nothing more than taking advantage of people who are either struggling with cash flow and/or do not realise it's actually more expensive. However, if people deemed it an unfair or unreasonable service, then it would not pay to offer the service. It's quite simply how all business works, be it right or not. I've yet to meet a business that is a charity.

Personally, I'm all for free enterprise. A huge amount of purchases are on products that people do not actually need. This is one of them. With a bit of awareness and cop on when it comes to power usage, there is no need for such a product. It will only cost the person more in the long run, and perhaps even in the short term.
Essential services are a bit of a different matter, and I'm not in favour of companies profiteering on that.

Bruthal

cast_iron wrote: »

That's not a hidden cost!

Its hardly for installation costs either.

cast_iron

Bruthal wrote: »

Its hardly for installation costs either.

I don't think anyone has said it is. It's irrelevant what the company does with the money anyway.

It's a bit like Sky tv's model of selling their product. Years ago, it would have been about £250 punt to get a sky dish and box in. That must be about €500+ in today's money. Needless to say, Sky was a bit of a luxury back then. These days, they give it to you for (all but) free, but of course the monthly premium is higher. It has proven highly successful as evidenced by the plethora of dishes around the country these days.

It's a bit like a form of credit I suppose. Company forgoes the install charge, but makes it back over time on the subscription charge. That's how people seem to like to buy things these days.
I would guess if pre pay power were to charge the actual cost of installing the meter up front and have a slightly lower service charge, it wouldn't be half as popular. Especially since it's aimed at those with cash flow issues.

Bruthal

cast_iron wrote: »

Bruthal wrote: »

Its hardly for installation costs either.

I don't think anyone has said it is.

cast_iron wrote: »

And they must recoup the install and parts costs somehow.

Perhaps I read it wrong. Wouldnt be the first time. Depends how you interpret it I suppose.

It's a bit like Sky tv's model of selling their product. Years ago, it would have been about £250 punt to get a sky dish and box in. That must be about €500+ in today's money. Needless to say, Sky was a bit of a luxury back then. These days, they give it to you for (all but) free, but of course the monthly premium is higher. It has proven highly successful as evidenced by the plethora of dishes around the country these days.

Id say the number of dishes up might be higher than the number of paid subscriptions. I could be wrong, which again is regular enough.

It's a bit like a form of credit I suppose. Company forgoes the install charge, but makes it back over time on the subscription charge. That's how people seem to like to buy things these days.
I would guess if pre pay power were to charge the actual cost of installing the meter up front and have a slightly lower service charge, it wouldn't be half as popular. Especially since it's aimed at those with cash flow issues.

They would have to remove their free meter claim from the site anyway.

Also on the "How it works" page, it says they guarantee to match the electric ireland unit price and standing charge. And on the same page, a button to click to sign up. It could be easy enough to click away and not realise the extra cost there. That line might make people who do have difficulty comparing like with like at times, feel its no dearer.

Anyway, as you say, if people are prepared to pay extra for something they could manage themselves, then some company`s will facilitate them.

It will be a useful service for some no doubt. Time will tell them better than we can.

cast_iron

Bruthal wrote: »

Perhaps I read it wrong. Wouldnt be the first time. Depends how you interpret it I suppose.

Well I would say they would have to recoup install costs as part of the service charge. I didn't mean that the indefinite €25 bi-monthly charge would be purely for installation. Sorry if that came across.

Id say the number of dishes up might be higher than the number of paid subscriptions. I could be wrong, which again is regular enough.

I'd say you are dead right (as you are more often than not:))
I just used it as an example to show how their business model has changed.

It will be a useful service for some no doubt. Time will tell them better than we can.

Yes, it is an interesting service alright.

meercat

Claregirl wrote: »

- feck sake I caught him one morning with just his underwear in the dryer - he wanted them warmed up before he put em on:eek:.

cheers claregirl
made me laugh out loud
cherish the memories









and keep reminding him;)

.G.

Claregirl wrote: »

We got a shocker of a bill just before Christmas and went all gung-ho trying our best to get it down - just got Jan bill and we managed to save a whole euro

I've a good idea what's causing the wastage one teenager - daily showers for 15mins, cleans his room by filling the washing basket constantly eating (using oven) and filling the dishwasher - feck sake I caught him one morning with just his underwear in the dryer - he wanted them warmed up before he put em on:eek:.

I'd be embarrassed to tell people what our bill is it's crazy for three of us especially when we're all out of the house Mon - Fri

Thinking of changing to Eirtricity as they're showing up as cheapest on Bonkers.ie but not sure can the rate be increased during the 1 year contract?

Bloody kids:),mine have TV's,Playstations,dvd players running non stop,not as bad as showers and dryers but they are both pre teen,they'll drive me mental when they hit that age!

Pull the pull cord on the shower after 5 minutes,that'll get him out of it:D

I banned the use of a dryer in our house for years too,the cost isn't worth it,air dry all the way!

As an aside and not aimed at you but I've never understood the need for dishwashers. Most of them tell you to rinse stuff before you put it in which will in fact remove most of the dirt anyway so why not bloody wash them by hand and save some money,especially with water charges on the way!

A pet hate of mine.:)

ted1

superg wrote: »

Bloody kids:),mine have TV's,Playstations,dvd players running non stop,not as bad as showers and dryers but they are both pre teen,they'll drive me mental when they hit that age!

Pull the pull cord on the shower after 5 minutes,that'll get him out of it:D

I banned the use of a dryer in our house for years too,the cost isn't worth it,air dry all the way!

As an aside and not aimed at you but I've never understood the need for dishwashers. Most of them tell you to rinse stuff before you put it in which will in fact remove most of the dirt anyway so why not bloody wash them by hand and save some money,especially with water charges on the way!

A pet hate of mine.:)

The dishwasher is the only white good that is more efficient than doing it manually, it heats the exact amount of water required, no more no less. Asides from that there is very little going on in them.

They also use very little water.

Bruthal

ted1 wrote: »

The dishwasher is the only white good that is more efficient than doing it manually, it heats the exact amount of water required, no more no less. Asides from that there is very little going on in them.

They also use very little water.

Where did you get that one from?

ted1

Bruthal wrote: »

Where did you get that one from?

Here's one article http://www.gizmag.com/dishwashers-save-water-hand-washing/11410/

I know I've seen a better report in a journal some where but I'd have to dig it out

Edit: here's another article. http://www.treehugger.com/kitchen-design/built-in-dishwashers-vs-hand-washing-which-is-greener.html