TDs looking after themselves

Zebra3

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/rates-freebie-for-enda-but-not-for-oxfam-3357990.html

Fair play to them.

They want us to pay new taxes on our homes to cover private gambling debts, they want charities to pay as well, but themselves?

F**k no!!! :rolleyes:

Sunnyisland

We here stories after stories about our TD,s and goverment parties every day,and yet the Irish people will still vote for the same people in the next General Election.

shedweller

Same as it ever was!

Fromthetrees

Rates should be slashed across the board anyway but having one law for 'us' and one law for 'them' just proves once again the type of society we live in.

Boo-urns I say, boo-cunting-urns.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Nothing new in this.

Myrddin

Rich politicians in tax exeption shocker

mikemac1

google maps

The article calls it lavish.
Just an ordinary looking office, nothing lavish about it


The street is lined with pubs though, Castlebar looks to be a great place for a session

Thoie

I believe that constituency offices should pay rates, and charity shops should possibly be exempt, the Indo has shown its tabloid tendencies again by referring to Kenny's HQ as "lavish". A quick look on Google maps shows that it's not exactly the Taj Mahal (though it is right next door to an Indian takeaway).

Myrddin

mikemac1 wrote: »

The article calls it lavish.
Just an ordinary looking office, nothing lavish about it

Thoie wrote: »

the Indo has shown its tabloid tendencies again by referring to Kenny's HQ as "lavish". A quick look on Google maps shows that it's not exactly the Taj Mahal (though it is right next door to an Indian takeaway).

What difference should it make whether its lavish or not? Every other premesis on that street pays no doubt extortionate rates so why shouldnt this one...lavish or not?

Zebra3

At a guess, I'd say it's lavish enough inside.

Not that it matters.

Thoie

EnterNow wrote: »

What difference should it make whether its lavish or not? Every other premesis on that street pays no doubt extortionate rates so why shouldnt this one...lavish or not?

Did you actually read what I had written?

galwayrush

Seriously, that is about as surprising as discovering water is wet.

Chips Lovell

Properties occupied by the state are exempt from rates. Presumably that's the reason. If they were liable they'd be claiming it back in expenses anyway. Looks like a non-story.

Zebra3

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Properties occupied by the state are exempt from rates. Presumably that's the reason. If they were liable they'd be claiming it back in expenses anyway.

Well, I'm sure Edna will happily stump up and pay what would be due by anyone else.

He did get voted in on a ticket for "Change" after all, or was that just a load of crap? :rolleyes:

Replies from FG apologists welcome.

stoneill

Imagine that - TD's not having to pay for stuff that the rest of us have to.

Thoie

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Properties occupied by the state are exempt from rates. Presumably that's the reason. If they were liable they'd be claiming it back in expenses anyway. Looks like a non-story.

That raises the question of why, if they're state properties, are they allowed dress them in their party colours?

KeithTS

If Enda owns the office, fair n'uf pay rates, however, if it's a state building it makes sense that its exempt. Why pay only to have it go to the people who paid it.

Can't see what the bother is about tbh.

keith16

realies wrote: »

We here stories after stories about our TD,s and goverment parties every day,and yet the Irish people will still vote for the same people in the next General Election.

Well it's not as if we have much a choice now, is it?

gbee

Don't know why this comes up all the time, it's still all tax payers money, if we make them pay taxes and rates, it's just more expenses and more taxes from us.

dxhound2005

Here is the same story from the same paper 5 years ago and even then it was old news.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/tds-offices-exempt-from-council-rates-1265023.html

Chips Lovell

Thoie wrote: »

That raises the question of why, if they're state properties, are they allowed dress them in their party colours?

If decking your office out in party colours is considered part of doing you job as a TD, then probably yes.

ManMade

Don't charities receive state money( or as commonly put on here tax payers money!!!)? If commercial rates were reduced wouldn't the state simple reduce these donations?

sfwcork

Does he get free pints in the pubs too?now that would cause caos

tombozo

Funny how all these 'perks' get voted through the system with no fanfare? the same when during the budget they opted to vouch all expenses, but to lesson the blow they increased their expenses limit by 10 grand!
10 grand by 166 TDs? How many respite grants would that pay for?

GalwayGuy2

Replies from FG apologists welcome.

So everybody that disagrees with you is an FG apologist?

monkeypants

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Properties occupied by the state are exempt from rates. Presumably that's the reason. If they were liable they'd be claiming it back in expenses anyway. Looks like a non-story.

Are these offices owned by the state rather than by the party?

dxhound2005

tombozo wrote: »

Funny how all these 'perks' get voted through the system with no fanfare? the same when during the budget they opted to vouch all expenses, but to lesson the blow they increased their expenses limit by 10 grand!
10 grand by 166 TDs? How many respite grants would that pay for?

The legal question would be whether a politicians office could be regarded as a commercial operation set up for the purposes of making a profit and thus be regarded as liable for commercial rates. Premises occupied by charitable organisations are already exempt except where the premises are being used for commercial purposes like charity shops. The whole thing goes back to the Valuation Act of 2001 and is hardly new news.

http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2001050300005?opendocument

The Valuation Bill continues the existing exemption from rates of any land, building or any part of a building occupied by a charitable organisation which uses the land or building exclusively for charitable purposes, other than for profit. This means the administrative offices used by a charitable organisation, as well as buildings used directly for charitable relief, are exempt from rates. Buildings used by a charitable organisation for commercial use, such as charity shops, are engaged in a commercial activity for profit, despite the final use to which the profits are put. Therefore, such premises, like other commercial premises, are subject to rates. I fully acknowledge the valuable work undertaken by charities and charity shops and the contribution they make towards the Irish and international community. However, I consider charity shops should not be exempted from rates in the Bill. In this regard, the criteria for rating under the valuation code is based on occupation and the purpose for which the property is used. Charity shops are engaged in a commercial activity for profit, despite the final use to which any profits are put. Charity shops are in direct competition with other shops. Many of them are now selling brand new rather than second-hand goods. Second-hand shops are also subject to rates and such shops are likely to be aggrieved by having their competitors exempted from rates.

Biggins

shedweller wrote: »

Same as it ever was!

Indeed - big time.

* http://bigginsblog.wordpress.com/2013/01/13/the-irish-cronyism-abuses-still-continues-unabated-more-broken-promises/

* http://bigginsblog.wordpress.com/2012/09/21/the-cronyism-nepotism-continues-no-change-then-from-fianna-fail/

* http://bigginsblog.wordpress.com/2012/04/22/phil-hogan-fine-gael-and-more-cronyism/


Sadly people will still vote for them.

Sully

Biggins wrote: »

Indeed - big time.

* http://bigginsblog.wordpress.com/2013/01/13/the-irish-cronyism-abuses-still-continues-unabated-more-broken-promises/

* http://bigginsblog.wordpress.com/2012/09/21/the-cronyism-nepotism-continues-no-change-then-from-fianna-fail/

* http://bigginsblog.wordpress.com/2012/04/22/phil-hogan-fine-gael-and-more-cronyism/


Sadly people will still vote for them.

There is no alternative. All parties, including Sinn Fein, lie and say things during an election or in opposition they haven't a hope of implementing. I think that boils down to the electorate more than it does the parties.

We have probably one of the more honest parties in government and a party that was more honest during the election, that being Fine Gael. A lot of people talk about broken promises and stuff - but a lot of stuff they are doing was in their party manifesto. A lot of people were well warned the budgets were going to be very tough and there was no easy pathway that was going to be taken. Not to say that there were misleading statements and promises within, but compared with other elections and parties, there better.

bijapos

Sully wrote: »

There is no alternative. All parties, including Sinn Fein, lie and say things during an election or in opposition they haven't a hope of implementing. I think that boils down to the electorate more than it does the parties.

We have probably one of the more honest parties in government and a party that was more honest during the election, that being Fine Gael. A lot of people talk about broken promises and stuff - but a lot of stuff they are doing was in their party manifesto. A lot of people were well warned the budgets were going to be very tough and there was no easy pathway that was going to be taken. Not to say that there were misleading statements and promises within, but compared with other elections and parties, there better.

Being more honest than FF stilll doesn't make FG honest, not by a long shot, in fact they are still a pack of liars well and truly in the pockets of developers. Being a little bit better than one of the most appalling parties in Western European politics is nothing to be proud of, fact is FG could be a lot better if they wanted, but they choose not to.

And no they were not honest during the elections, they were utterly dishonest, everything from national policies "not another red cent" to god awful parish pump politics from the future Taoiseach "maintaining services at Roscommon hospital". And let's not forget their proposed reforms on party funding, political reform etc or promises to implement findings of the Mahon tribunal.

A pile of bollix, I'm just glad I stuck them at the bottom of the ballot along with FF.

Biggins

Sully wrote: »

...We have probably one of the more honest parties in government and a party that was more honest during the election, that being Fine Gael.

Are you serious?

You haven't heard about the various antics of our Minister for Health for example or the questions that now hang over the head of Phil Hogan in his own local constituency about planing permission being given after been refused clear-cut twice before he got involved apparently - and that just two examples in the last two weeks!

There are many others that are involved in similar antics in Fine Gael alone presently.
One of the most honest parties currently in government?
Either someone is leading you astray, having a laugh or quite simply not keeping you informed.

Sully

bijapos wrote: »

Being more honest than FF stilll doesn't make FG honest, not by a long shot, in fact they are still a pack of liars well and truly in the pockets of developers. Being a little bit better than one of the most appalling parties in Western European politics is nothing to be proud of, fact is FG could be a lot better if they wanted, but they choose not to.

And no they were not honest during the elections, they were utterly dishonest, everything from national policies "not another red cent" to god awful parish pump politics from the future Taoiseach "maintaining services at Roscommon hospital". And let's not forget their proposed reforms on party funding, political reform etc or promises to implement findings of the Mahon tribunal.

A pile of bollix, I'm just glad I stuck them at the bottom of the ballot along with FF.

I wasn't comparing them against just Fianna Fail. Sinn Fein are probably the second biggest crowd of liars in the Houses of Government at this moment in time, just behind Fianna Fail.

I never said they didn't mislead during the election either, a lot of what they promised and said they would do - they have. The 'Not another red cent' was a prime example. A lot of what the government have implemented in the budgets, Labour highlighted during the election and said they would put a stop to it. Remember all those newspaper adverts?

The Roscommon Hospital appears to be more lack of information than just being a broken promise. I really cant see them being stupid enough to make a blatant lie several times over knowing they would go back on it and knowing they could (and have) lost an electoral area and a TD. It appears when they were in office they saw the problem fully and had all the data to hand and knew there was no choice but to close it.

mountai

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Properties occupied by the state are exempt from rates. Presumably that's the reason. If they were liable they'd be claiming it back in expenses anyway. Looks like a non-story.

WRONG !!! ---- If a property is leased to a state body (thus occupied by the State) it is NOT exempt from new rates .

Sully

Biggins wrote: »

Are you serious?

You haven't heard about the various antics of our Minister for Health for example or the questions that now hang over the head of Phil Hogan in his own local constituency about planing permission being given after been refused clear-cut twice before he got involved apparently - and that just two examples in the last two weeks!

There are many others that are involved in similar antics in Fine Gael alone presently.
One of the most honest parties currently in government?
Either someone is leading you astray, having a laugh or quite simply not keeping you informed.

Did I say everything was going swimmingly without problems or questionable actions?

The Minister of Health, regardless of who is in that position, is a political hot potato that is and will always be the target of a witch hunt. There appears to be serious questions over how he handles various tasks within office. Its the biggest issue facing the government but nobody has been able to prove beyond reasonable doubt he wasn't acting in the best interests - even Sinn Fein touched on the subject but only under Dail protection so they couldn't be touched.

As for Phil Hogan - what exactly are you referring to? I can't recall anything significant in the past two weeks and the above was a story knocking around ages now, not just in the past two weeks.

Either way, the above example, all you can show me is Ministers looking after their own constituencies - parish pump politics. Nothing of such huge significance that it could bring down the government or result in individual resignations. Parish pump politics is an electorate problem also - these TDs wont have a chance of being (re) elected without looking after their own back yard while in office.

Even in the houses of government, they are probably one of the more honest parties - Sinn Fein have proven to be far from it, and we all know Fianna Fails record dates centuries and not just a recent shocker. They are far from perfect, they could be doing things a fair bit differently, but a considerable number of policy implementations and the severity of the budget and economic woes well well known and warned prior to the election.

bijapos

Sully wrote: »

I wasn't comparing them against just Fianna Fail. Sinn Fein are probably the second biggest crowd of liars in the Houses of Government at this moment in time, just behind Fianna Fail.

Doesn't change the fact that FG are a blatantly dishonest party. They could be honest. They choose to behave otherwise.

I never said they didn't mislead during the election either, a lot of what they promised and said they would do - they have. The 'Not another red cent' was a prime example. A lot of what the government have implemented in the budgets, Labour highlighted during the election and said they would put a stop to it. Remember all those newspaper adverts?

We're talking about FG here, they made a lot pf promisies that they never implemented and that they have no intention of ever implementing. That's called lies, that's being dishonest.

The Roscommon Hospital appears to be more lack of information than just being a broken promise. I really cant see them being stupid enough to make a blatant lie several times over knowing they would go back on it and knowing they could (and have) lost an electoral area and a TD. It appears when they were in office they saw the problem fully and had all the data to hand and knew there was no choice but to close it.

All the info on Roscommon hospital was clearly out in the open before the election, Enda Kenny made a promise to maintain services for the sole rewason of short term gaining votes, when he and the dogs on the street knew that services there were to be cut back. It was a blatant dishonest act by Kenny. The hospital is not closed btw, what they did was shut down A&E, this in a farming area, the most dangerous industry in the country.

Sully

bijapos wrote: »

Doesn't change the fact that FG are a blatantly dishonest party. They could be honest. They choose to behave otherwise.

I wouldn't call them a 'blatantly dishonest party'. Far from it.

We're talking about FG here, they made a lot pf promisies that they never implemented and that they have no intention of ever implementing. That's called lies, that's being dishonest.

They also made a lot more promises they have implemented.

All the info on Roscommon hospital was clearly out in the open before the election, Enda Kenny made a promise to maintain services for the sole rewason of short term gaining votes, when he and the dogs on the street knew that services there were to be cut back. It was a blatant dishonest act by Kenny. The hospital is not closed btw, what they did was shut down A&E, this in a farming area, the most dangerous industry in the country.

Incorrect. What is public knowledge and what is known behind government buildings is different. This is why opposition parties pre-budget submissions used to be laughed at by Fianna Fail - they didn't work and that was because what was in the public domain wasn't the full extent of the problem. Parties should get access to costings by the Dept. of Finance for their pre-budget submissions to help get a good idea of the problem - some parties to this day wont bother (Sinn Fein and their Wealth Tax).

Biggins

Sully wrote: »

Did I say everything was going swimmingly without problems or questionable actions?

The Minister of Health, regardless of who is in that position, is a political hot potato that is and will always be the target of a witch hunt. There appears to be serious questions over how he handles various tasks within office. Its the biggest issue facing the government but nobody has been able to prove beyond reasonable doubt he wasn't acting in the best interests - even Sinn Fein touched on the subject but only under Dail protection so they couldn't be touched.

As for Phil Hogan - what exactly are you referring to? I can't recall anything significant in the past two weeks and the above was a story knocking around ages now, not just in the past two weeks.

Either way, the above example, all you can show me is Ministers looking after their own constituencies - parish pump politics. Nothing of such huge significance that it could bring down the government or result in individual resignations. Parish pump politics is an electorate problem also - these TDs wont have a chance of being (re) elected without looking after their own back yard while in office.

Even in the houses of government, they are probably one of the more honest parties - Sinn Fein have proven to be far from it, and we all know Fianna Fails record dates centuries and not just a recent shocker. They are far from perfect, they could be doing things a fair bit differently, but a considerable number of policy implementations and the severity of the budget and economic woes well well known and warned prior to the election.

Knowing just how much is going on by FG in cronyism and corruption since they got into power alone - I totally disagree with you about just how honest they are in government.
I also disagree that SF (although no saints) are second in line as the biggest liars around.

...And regards the latest Phil Hogan antics, I'm not going on about his letter involving Travellers, I'm not going on about his shutting down of 6 planning inquires, I'm on about his involvement in reversing planning permission for a building that very many didn't want.
I would politely suggest further reading and research.

bijapos

Incorrect. What is public knowledge and what is known behind government buildings is different. This is why opposition parties pre-budget submissions used to be laughed at by Fianna Fail - they didn't work and that was because what was in the public domain wasn't the full extent of the problem. Parties should get access to costings by the Dept. of Finance for their pre-budget submissions to help get a good idea of the problem - some parties to this day wont bother (Sinn Fein and their Wealth Tax).

Incorrect yourself. All parties had access to DoF costings in Autumn 2010, this was one of the forst times it was ever done. Kenny and FG knew what they were on about, they also have control over the budget, the reason to shut down the A&E in Roscommon was budgetary, no other reason.

Sully

Biggins wrote: »

Knowing just how much is going on by FG in cronyism and corruption since they got into power alone - I totally disagree with you about just how honest they are in government.

Do enlighten me further as to their scandalous behaviour while in government. I'm surprised no opposition party has tabled a motion of no confidence if they are as bad as you claim.

I also disagree that SF (although no saints) are second in line as the biggest liars around.

The same party who is against water & property charges in the South, yet happily implements them a few miles North?

The same party who is against the EU/IMF (a foreign body) ordering the Irish government about, but happily lets the UK government dictate to them a few miles up North?

The same party who is against austerity and claims it doesn't work, in the South, but happily implements it up North?

The same party which claims a wealth tax is the solution to all our problems yet wont get it costed by the Dept. of Finance to see if it would actually work?

The same party which wants to raid our pension reserve fund yet is furious when the government does likewise?

The same party which gives out about expenses, yet has some of the highest expenses claims?

The same party which gives out about TDs wages, yet draws down the full wage?

The same party which doesn't want to admit that that their leader is a former IRA leader and likewise when they had a candidate for the Presidency, didn't want to admit to his involvement in the IRA?

The same party which has a TD that is linked to numerous murders as he was a bomb maker for the IRA, admits to be doing so and the party defends him saying that while he made bombs for the IRA he doesn't have blood on his hands? And when the going got tough, they deflected with a well timed press release knocking the government?

Christ, I could keep going here and I haven't even touched how they are getting on up North and the scandals they have been hit with. Sitting it the opposition seats and preaching to the people how things would be different if they were in power, yet they do the exact same as the government do anyway when in power up North?

Its sickening.

Biggins

Sully wrote: »

I'm surprised no opposition party has tabled a motion of no confidence if they are as bad as you claim.

I'm surprised you didn't even know that one had taken place: http://www.thejournal.ie/no-confidence-dail-vote-713313-Dec2012/

Sinn Fein CERTAINLY has it problems and has answers to give - but perhaps no more so then the current corrupt government in power.

Sully

bijapos wrote: »

Incorrect yourself. All parties had access to DoF costings in Autumn 2010, this was one of the forst times it was ever done. Kenny and FG knew what they were on about, they also have control over the budget, the reason to shut down the A&E in Roscommon was budgetary, no other reason.

Considering no other party wants to re-open it or touch the hot topic, its safe to say it was more then budgetary. The locals don't even believe that - many believe Kenny did it to get at their local TD for going against him. Many others felt that the hospital was very quiet anyway and wasn't exactly needed.

Besides, The Health Information and Quality Authority had a report done that recommended the closure.

Chips Lovell

mountai wrote: »

WRONG !!! ---- If a property is leased to a state body (thus occupied by the State) it is NOT exempt from new rates .

http://www.valoff.ie/doc/ValuationAct2001.pdf

(3) Subject to section 16, relevant property, being a building or part of a building, land or a waterway or a harbour directly occupied by the State (including any land or building occupied by any Depart- ment or office of State, the Defence Forces or the Garda Sı ́ocha ́na or used as a prison or place of detention), shall not be rateable.

Sully

Biggins wrote: »

I'm surprised you didn't even know that one had taken place: http://www.thejournal.ie/no-confidence-dail-vote-713313-Dec2012/

Sinn Fein CERTAINLY has it problems and has answers to give - but perhaps no more so then the current corrupt government in power.

I don't take much notice of what Sinn Fein propose and that was more to do with budgets than the government. They wont be elected into government so they are just doing it for the publicity and not for the people. More spin.

Sinn Fein has a lot more to give than Fine Gael or the other parties, even Fianna Fail, that's for sure.

byhookorbycrook

Hmmm, Sinn Féin and health issues...flight to America, anyone?

bijapos

Sully wrote: »

Considering no other party wants to re-open it or touch the hot topic, its safe to say it was more then budgetary. The locals don't even believe that - many believe Kenny did it to get at their local TD for going against him. Many others felt that the hospital was very quiet anyway and wasn't exactly needed.

Besides, The Health Information and Quality Authority had a report done that recommended the closure.

Firstly the TD (Denis Naughton) resigned AFTER the decision was made to shut it, if however as you say Kenny did shut it to get back at a TD then the man should resign as Taoiseach. if he is going to use a hospital closure to get back at someone he is clearly too petty for such a position.

Secondly, neither the hospital nor the A&E is quiet,, both were busy even tough services in Roscommon hospital have been pared back over many years.

Thirdly, again I repeat it was A&E that was shut, not the hospital. The hospital, minus the vital A&E unit is open.

Fourthly, the HIQA report, (which did not necessarily recommend the closure of Roscommon) was made months before the GE. Here's a link

Sully

bijapos wrote: »

Firstly the TD (Denis Naughton) resigned AFTER the decision was made to shut it, if however as you say Kenny did shut it to get back at a TD then the man should resign as Taoiseach. if he is going to use a hospital closure to get back at someone he is clearly too petty for such a position.

I'm well aware he resigned after. I never said Kenny shut it to get back at him, I said that is what some people think. Its the conspiracy.

Biggins

Sully wrote: »

I don't take much notice of what Sinn Fein propose and that was more to do with budgets than the government. They wont be elected into government so they are just doing it for the publicity and not for the people. More spin.

Sinn Fein has a lot more to give than Fine Gael or the other parties, even Fianna Fail, that's for sure.

Your right in one thing - Sf won't get into government this generation around it seems.

FG and FF are already quietly looking to amalgamate at the next election to keep them out.
This, despite a number of FG members preparing to jump ship, quitting at the next general election (Fergus O'Dowd is one), and perhaps to cover their ass make up for those leaving, knowing they might not get re-elected anyway.

Just a few sample situations FG and Enda should answer for, big or small:

* It’s been exposed that Enda Kenny told the Department of Finance to bend the rules on pay rates for advisors so that his former advisor Ciaran Conlon could be awarded a pay increase of 35 thousand euros.

* The Irish Fine Gael and Labour government cabinet rewarded themselves on October 18th 2011 with another perk! They can now have the luxury of being able to drive on bus lanes!

* "We Will Not Introduce A Rise In Student Fees" - Pre-election Fine Gael 2010... but... A Rise In Student Fees!" Post election Fine Gael - 2011

* Noonan: ‘I never promised I’d burn senior bondholders’ 15th November 2011... Really?
Noonan intends to burn AIB, Irish Nationwide Bondholders 15th June 2011
http://www.newstalk.ie/2011/news/noonan-intends-to-burn-aib-irish-nationwide-bondholders/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/137/captureowb.jpg/

* More lies? Only after THREE days in power the new government has got off to a start Fianna Fail members would be proud of! Mr Kenny appointed 15 junior minister - after promising exactly two years ago today to reduce the number of posts to 12. Enda Kenny named the 15 junior ministers - nine for Fine Gael and six for Labour.
Kenny appointed the same number of junior ministers as the outgoing government on €130,000-per-year each. Kenny admitted he had made the commitment two years ago, but used an excuse that it had not been included in Fine Gael's general election policy or the coalition's Programme for Government - so they could get away with backtracking on their own words to the people of Ireland!

Link: http://www.independent.ie/national-news/kenny-reneges-on-pledge-to-reduce-ministers-2575551.html


* Varadkar said that not another “red cent” would be put into the banks - but wait... the Central Bank announced in March 2011 that the banks would require €24bn. €19bn of this met by the taxpayer July 2011. Another 17/18 BILLION going to the banks in bailout in 2012! Its 18 Billion for 2013.

More lies?

* Sell the EBS
During the election Fine Gael pledged to sell EBS. What happened? FG made it happen that despite previous words EBS has now been merged with AIB instead.

More lies?

* FG 5 point plan: No new taxes including no income tax increases.

Minister Noonan: “I am not going to rule out any tax initiative, or any tax increase or any tax reduction.”
Universal Social Charge NOW INCREASED TO €132+ A MONTH

* They opposed the public sector pension levy – “It is a crude and unfair system.” (Brendan Howlin)
Now they won’t rule out more cuts to public service pay.

* The Programme for Govt states: “We will legislate to end upward only rent reviews for existing leases.”

What happened?

More lies?

* FG Manifesto: Promised a new “powerful consumer champion”, giving it “additional powers – by constitutional change if necessary – to break up public and private sector monopolies and cartels.”

Still waiting...

* The Programme for Government clearly states “we will introduce the necessary legal and constitutional provisions to ban corporate donations to political parties.”

Corporate donations continue and Enda Kenny has confirmed that there will be no constitutional ban put to the people.

* There will be no more “golden handshakes” for public servants that have failed to deliver.
...Big payoffs for senior civil servants continue.

* FG had previously promised to reduce the number of TDs by 20
The Electoral Act proposed a cut of as little as 6 TDs.

* The Programme for Government stated “We will maintain social welfare rates”
What happened?

Want more lies?

* FG pledged they would cut the number of junior Ministers to 12.
What happened? Once elected they appointed 15 Junior Ministers.

* Fine Gael pledged to abolish 145 quangos in their document Reinventing Government.

What REALLY happened?

By end Oct 2011, they had abolished 5, but had created 8.

* Enda Kenny, July 2010: “I do not accept the Government’s guillotining of Bills in any shape or form.”

...But by November 2011 they had guillotined almost a dozen Bills.

* Enda Kenny promised to direct all Ministers to focus entirely on their new portfolios in the first 100 days and completely avoid constituency work.

However, Kenny himself repeatedly broke this promise with dozens of appointments in Mayo every week - and what about Phil Hogan, O'Reilly and many others?

More lies?

* Ministerial advisors will be subject to salary caps

What has happened and continues to? Most Ministers’ advisors have breached the cap.

* FG and Lab Manifestos: They promised vetting of appointments to state boards by the Oireachtas.

What has happened?
Party political appointments have been made, without any oversight or transparency. In one very simple example of many available, in October 2011, they appointed the former head of AIB Investment Management as head of the New Era quango, without revealing her pay or conditions.

If you want more lies and topics which Fine Gael needs to answer for - I have more.

Fine Gael being the most honest government?
Your having a laugh!

emo72

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

http://www.valoff.ie/doc/ValuationAct2001.pdf

what has a political party office got to do with the state? im pretty sure nothing.

if i start a political party in the morning and decide to run for office, will my headquarters be exempt from rates?

Sully

Biggins wrote: »

Your right in one thing - Sf won't get into government this generation around it seems.

FG and FF are already quietly looking to amalgamate at the next election to keep them out.

Sinn Fein wont get into government through no fault of their own. Nothing to do with any other party. Plus, there is nothing to suggest that FF & FG are secretly looking at amalgamating never mind being in a coalition together (which would be the peoples choice).

This, despite a number of FG members preparing to jump ship, quitting at the next general election (Fergus O'Dowd is one), and perhaps to cover their ass make up for those leaving, knowing they might not get re-elected anyway.

More nonsense I see. You say a "number of" but only name one. They are in government less than two years so I doubt anybody is even thinking of the next election, because nobody knows what will happen between now and then. They are still very popular in the polls so even if they were, there are no grounds for them to worry.

I never heard O'Dowd was retiring, could you link me to that source?

Just a few sample situations FG and Enda should answer for, big or small

Whereas on the other hand, I could point you to several promises not reneged upon and good work done by the government.

Biggins

Sully wrote: »

Sinn Fein wont get into government through no fault of their own. Nothing to do with any other party.

They could if they increased their numbers along with independents and maybe with another party.
Buts thats theory - we know they won't.

Sully wrote: »

I never heard O'Dowd was retiring, could you link me to that source?

I cannot presently as its only emerged at a local level - there is more to his reasons but they cannot be reported here as it would be inappropriate.
I shall PM you - and I think you will understand why.

Sully wrote: »

Whereas on the other hand, I could point you to several promises not reneged upon and good work done by the government.

any good works done by any government does not cancel out their many lies.
This applies for the present government as does the past ones.

The fact is that FG (in my and many eyes) are just as full of cronyism, lies and have many equal questions to answer.

Sully

Biggins wrote: »

They could if they increased their numbers along with independents and maybe with another party.
Buts thats theory - we know they won't.

That would be a very unstable government because I don't think many independents would go into government with Sinn Fein for a start. It would also mean that FG/FF/Lab had **** all seats to form a government themselves.

Sinn Fein would need to have a fantastic election and as it stands, that's not going to happen. Not in my lifetime it would appear anyway, the polls gave a little hope but it didn't last.

I cannot presently as its only emerged at a local level - there is more to his reasons but they cannot be reported here as it would be inappropriate.
I shall PM you - and I think you will understand why.

Personal reasons are hardly cause to use as a stick to show the government TDs are already jumping ship.

any good works done by any government does not cancel out their many lies.
This applies for the present government as does the past ones.

The fact is that FG (in my and many eyes) are just as full of cronyism, lies and have many equal questions to answer.

You will never have a party that will get elected and wont break a promise. Ever. Will the good outweigh the bad? I think in many areas the points you make about broken promises were not that bad.

- College fees going up were unavoidable. Even the USI wont offer a credible solution to the problem

- Cant see the EU allowing Ireland stick the two fingers to the bondholders.

- Paycaps will be broken - silly idea anyway. People coming from the private sector are taking a pay cut to work in the public service so to get them in there has to be a compromise.

- Junior Ministers had their salary cut, and stopped from going overseas on St. Patrick's Day. Never going to be fully scrapped or brought much further down than they are.

A lot of the points you raised could be argued back with a valid point. Should they have mislead people by saying so? No.