Mother jailed for not sending her three daughters to school

Death and Taxes

A story from todays Indo.
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/mother-jailed-for-not-sending-her-three-daughters-to-school-3356650.html

A mother of three has been sent to jail for failing to ensure her children attended school, they had missed 36% of the Sept to December Term, it was not the first time that she had been in court over this.
There was no evidence of any kind of abuse or neglect other than she is too easy going on the kids, one of whom she claimed was being bullied.
Is sending her to jail really the answer? I'm not convinced it is myself, but what are your views?

Tipsy McSwagger

Should have got detention instead.

StormWarrior

If she's in prison, who's looking after the kids and making sure they go to school now?

Boombastic

StormWarrior wrote: »

If she's in prison, who's looking after the kids and making sure they go to school now?

Their father?

conorhal

At the end of the day she was abusing her children. If you deny your children and education you steal their future. She needs to grow up and act like a parent or face the consequences.

Bummppd

Boombastic wrote: »

Their father?

And why wasn't he sent to jail? Why was the Mother solely responsible?

Andy!!

Sounds severe and counter-productive to me.

She should have stabbed a guy 30 times instead, that only gets you a suspended sentence in Ireland.

PinkFly

StormWarrior wrote: »

If she's in prison, who's looking after the kids and making sure they go to school now?

It takes two to make babies?

2rkehij30qtza5

conorhal wrote: »

At the end of the day she was abusing her children. If you deny your children and education you steal their future. She needs to grow up and act like a parent or face the consequences.

Couldnt agree more.

Death and Taxes

Boombastic wrote: »

Their father?

A bench warrant has been issued for his arrest regarding his failure to attend court on the same charges.

Boombastic

Bummppd wrote: »

And why wasn't he sent to jail? Why was the Mother solely responsible?

It seems he is been looked for, so perhaps not minding the children.
From the article


Activating a previous suspended sentence for keeping her children at home, Judge David McHugh said her household was "chaotic".

A warrant was also issued for her husband when he failed to appear in Blanchardstown District Court to answer similar charges.

Death and Taxes

conorhal wrote: »

At the end of the day she was abusing her children. If you deny your children and education you steal their future. She needs to grow up and act like a parent or face the consequences.

Cant agree that she was denying them an education, the evidence indicates they attended school the majority of the time but that she was too liberal in accepting their claims that they felt unwell.
I just wonder if state intervention through means other than prison might be more productive, social services etc.

hairyprincess

The judge had 'no hesitation' in sending her to jail, did the judge hesitate four a moment to think of the impact doing that would have on the children? Did hesitate for a moment to consider giving help to the family, i.e. social welfare supports, counselling perhaps for the mother to get to the root of the issue.

Pathetic. Goes to show families are not thought highly of

Bummppd

How long was she sentenced to?

Boombastic

Bummppd wrote: »

How long was she sentenced to?

28 days

ted1

hairyprincess wrote: »

The judge had 'no hesitation' in sending her to jail, did the judge hesitate four a moment to think of the impact doing that would have on the children? Did hesitate for a moment to consider giving help to the family, i.e. social welfare supports, counselling perhaps for the mother to get to the root of the issue.

Pathetic. Goes to show families are not thought highly of

The children ate being put first. The mother by not sending the kids to school is depriving them of the basic human rights and a chance of a good life, in my view she is unfit to be a mother

crybaby

hairyprincess wrote: »

The judge had 'no hesitation' in sending her to jail, did the judge hesitate four a moment to think of the impact doing that would have on the children? Did hesitate for a moment to consider giving help to the family, i.e. social welfare supports, counselling perhaps for the mother to get to the root of the issue.

Pathetic. Goes to show families are not thought highly of

Maybe the judge can raise the kids for her while she's off getting her free counselling for being a lazy cow.

kraggy

hairyprincess wrote: »

The judge had 'no hesitation' in sending her to jail, did the judge hesitate four a moment to think of the impact doing that would have on the children? Did hesitate for a moment to consider giving help to the family, i.e. social welfare supports, counselling perhaps for the mother to get to the root of the issue.

Pathetic. Goes to show families are not thought highly of

The judge was activating a previously given suspended sentence.

She was already in court for the same thing before and continued to allow her children to stay at home.

She deserves to be sent to prison. How many warnings do you think people should get?

gbee

conorhal wrote: »

At the end of the day she was abusing her children. If you deny your children and education you steal their future. She needs to grow up and act like a parent or face the consequences.

I'd could say the opposite in fact.

Children need to be free to grow themselves. School should encourage and stimulate. IMO, most schools merely brainwash the innocence and I think this is a bigger crime.

Death and Taxes

crybaby wrote: »

Maybe the judge can raise the kids for her while she's off getting her free counselling for being a lazy cow.

Enlighten us, you are in possession of facts not know to the rest of us? Perhaps she needs to be compelled to attend counselling or parenting classes, perhaps she needs help with raising her kids, that doesn't automatically make her lazy or a "cow".
The childrens best interests should be at the heart of any state intervention, locking their mother up is hardly in their best interests. what do you suggest the state do?

Boombastic

gbee wrote: »

I'd could say the opposite in fact.

Children need to be free to grow themselves. School should encourage and stimulate. IMO, most schools merely brainwash the innocence and I think this is a bigger crime.

Plenty of time to grow and express themselves during the holidays. She could have home schooled them, if she was against the ethos of schooling.

conorhal

gbee wrote: »

I'd could say the opposite in fact.

Children need to be free to grow themselves. School should encourage and stimulate. IMO, most schools merely brainwash the innocence and I think this is a bigger crime.

Ah, stow the hippie BS. I suppose you imagine that during this time off they were exploring nature, reading, learning a new language from their neighbors, learning about life by sailing down the Mississippi on a raft with Huck Finn.... Na, they were probably sitting at home dossing on the X-Box after pulling a sickie, future NEDs in the making, with a parent that practices not so benign neglect.

the_syco

Anyone know how little they went to school last year?

Activating a previous suspended sentence for keeping her children at home

I'm guessing not a lot last year, and this is a kick up the arse to ensure they goto school this year.

gbee wrote: »

Children need to be free to grow themselves. School should encourage and stimulate. IMO, most schools merely brainwash the innocence and I think this is a bigger crime.

If let go, the kids will enter post-primary lacking some of the basics, and this would hinder any chance of them reaching any potential.

Rasheed

gbee wrote: »

I'd could say the opposite in fact.

Children need to be free to grow themselves. School should encourage and stimulate. IMO, most schools merely brainwash the innocence and I think this is a bigger crime.

Then take them out of school altogether and comply with home schooling rules and be done with it.

She was well aware if the rules and broke them more than once. I agree with the judge.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/education/the_irish_education_system/home_education.html

Rasheed

hairyprincess wrote: »

The judge had 'no hesitation' in sending her to jail, did the judge hesitate four a moment to think of the impact doing that would have on the children? Did hesitate for a moment to consider giving help to the family, i.e. social welfare supports, counselling perhaps for the mother to get to the root of the issue.

Pathetic. Goes to show families are not thought highly of

Social welfare support? There was no mention of financial problems.

As for counselling, I don't think it would help her 'liberal' ideas. She got her warning, she offended again, she was then punished.

token101

Why aren't the kids in care? This person obviously isn't fit to be a parent so just remove the kids and break this circle of **** parents raising feral kids who become **** parents.

Show Time

conorhal wrote: »

At the end of the day she was abusing her children. If you deny your children and education you steal their future. She needs to grow up and act like a parent or face the consequences.

Must be great to see things in just black and white.:rolleyes:


There has to be more to this story.

gbee

conorhal wrote: »

Ah, stow the hippie BS. I suppose you imagine that during this time off they were exploring nature, reading, learning a new language from their neighbors, learning about life by sailing down the Mississippi on a raft with Huck Finn.... Na, they were probably sitting at home dossing on the X-Box after pulling a sickie, future NEDs in the making, with a parent that practices not so benign neglect.

Sadly: QED.

conorhal

Show Time wrote: »

Must be great to see things in just black and white.:rolleyes:


There has to be more to this story.

Must there?

Yakult

Wheres the father in all of this? Is he not as responsible for their kids not attending school?
Also find it funny how she will probably serve more time behind bars than actual criminals.. Justice served Irish style.

Only bright side is now maybe the kids will be sent to priso.. I mean school!

Boombastic

Yakult wrote: »

Wheres the father in all of this?...........

On the run:)

CruelCoin

Bummppd wrote: »

And why wasn't he sent to jail? Why was the Mother solely responsible?

Most likely he was working, and she was at home.

Hard to stop your kids mitching when you're not in the same location.

Show Time

conorhal wrote: »

Must there?

The mother could have issues at home for one thing depression as example number one which could be possible if she is raising three teenage daughters on her own.

Boombastic

Mum is jailed for failing to send her children to school

The accused, who is in her 30s, said she was the one at home who got her children "up and going" and brought them to school

Boombastic

Show Time wrote: »

The mother could have issues at home for one thing depression as example number one which could be possible if she is raising three teenage daughters on her own.

What gives you the impression she was doing it alone? Her husband is mentioned in the article. There is a warrant out for his arrest to face similar charges.

Show Time

Boombastic wrote: »

What gives you the impression she was doing it alone? Her husband is mentioned in the article. There is a warrant out for his arrest to face similar charges.

I am only playing devil advocate on this one as i get the strange feeling there is more to this story.

Is home schooling recognised in ireland

melekalikimaka

bluewolf wrote: »

Is home schooling recognised in ireland

yes

Frank Black

Boombastic wrote: »

The accused, who is in her 30s, said she was the one at home who got her children "up and going" and brought them to school

or not, as the case may be.

gbee

bluewolf wrote: »

Is home schooling recognised in ireland

Yes, there should be a good thread in parenting on it.

hoodwinked

at the end of the day its a good thing, too many parents out there while not being abusive can be so lazy they would give their child the week off school so they (the parents) can have a lie in! :rolleyes:

ITS_A_BADGER

Really no body knows what the reason is why the mother kept her kids at home, only the mother and possibly the father if he is on the scene (they seem to imply they are separeted)

Solicitor Orla Farrell told the court the offences stemmed "not from wilful neglect in parenting terms, but she is sometimes overly indulgent with her children when they present with illness"

Tells me that the kids could see mommy as a pushover and feigning illness will yeild the result of no school.
I feel that 28 days in jail was a harsh sentence for her, they could have maybe sent some sort of social worker or something over to the house in the mornings to make sure the kids went to school or something like that. To give her a final chance to get them to school everyday. Denying kids education is wrong, but sending the mom to jail for 28 days is a bit much. When she gets out of jail and if she doesnt send her kids to school everyday after that there is some other reason to it

Death and Taxes

Rasheed wrote: »

Social welfare support? There was no mention of financial problems.

As for counselling, I don't think it would help her 'liberal' ideas. She got her warning, she offended again, she was then punished.

So were her kids!
My point is that is locking up the parent in the best interests of the kids?
If it is , how so?

hairyprincess

I don't see how sending the mother to prison is going to aid the situation in any way. Proper assistance in the form of parenting classes, and counselling is what this woman and ultimately her children, needs. It serves absolutely no purpose to have her locked up. She needs to be shown how to parent her children properly.

Have a read of this story, the balance between the two is way off, inmo.

http://http://www.donegaldaily.com/2013/01/18/mum-drove-with-customs-officer-on-bonnet-of-car-and-child-in-backseat/

A woman drove almost 20 metres with a customs officer clinging to the bonnet of her car with her child in the back after failing to stop at a checkpoint.

He then sent Ms Duggan on a four week driving course.

Fining her €350 for careless driving Judge Paul Kelly said: “This is the most extraordinary case. She has hopefully learned from this experience and she had better implement everything she has learned on this court or she will be put off the road.”

gbee

ITS_A_BADGER wrote: »

Tells me that the kids could see mommy as a pushover and feigning illness will yeild the result of no school.

In that case an investigation into the school should be ordered immediately. It raises the question why the children would not want to go to school.

Death and Taxes

token101 wrote: »

Why aren't the kids in care? This person obviously isn't fit to be a parent so just remove the kids and break this circle of **** parents raising feral kids who become **** parents.

Yeah, like putting kids into care has such a great rep in this country!

Squ

gbee wrote: »

Sadly: QED.

What?

Czarcasm

ITS_A_BADGER wrote: »

Tells me that the kids could see mommy as a pushover and feigning illness will yeild the result of no school.
I feel that 28 days in jail was a harsh sentence for her, they could have maybe sent some sort of social worker or something over to the house in the mornings to make sure the kids went to school or something like that. To give her a final chance to get them to school everyday. Denying kids education is wrong, but sending the mom to jail for 28 days is a bit much. When she gets out of jail and if she doesnt send her kids to school everyday after that there is some other reason to it

Just speaking from my own experience of this phenomenon, where parents are lackadaisical about sending their kids to school, the most common underlying reason is that the parents just couldn't be bothered. In cases where I've seen this happen, the school would've made every effort to work with the parents to get the kids to school, social workers would've intervened and tried to help, but the response from a lot of parents in my experience is "yeah well I'm taking my kids out of that school anyway!".

I attended a meeting before Christmas where the parents of a family were neglecting sending their children to school. It was the final straw in months of intervention from the school, social workers, and even the Gardai were represented at the meeting to try and help the parents. I felt after the meeting that they had defiantly thumbed their noses up at "the system", coming out with classics like "you won't take my children away from me", etc.

Their children's attendance is being monitored now, but they're not far from where this case ended up. So for those that say "must be more to this story", there certainly is- the articles mention nothing about the behind the scenes efforts that would've been made by all concerned for the children's welfare, and those concerned having to listen to cliches like "I'm a good parent, don't question my parenting skills, you're interfering in something you know nothing about", ad nauseum.

The parents are convinced "the system is against them", and "the system" is the problem. It could never be as simple surely as they're just too disinterested in their child's welfare to make the effort to see that they get a good education? Surely not?

Actually, it is. And some people just need to grow up and take some responsibility for their children's behaviour.

Rasheed

WileyCoyote (Accelleratii Incredibus!) wrote: »

So were her kids!
My point is that is locking up the parent in the best interests of the kids?
If it is , how so?

In the long run. She will, hopefully, learn her lesson and make a resolution to send her children to school every day. They will then have a better quality of an education and any problems of falling behind can be rectified now.

long range shooter

Under UNs human rights,every child have the right to an education.

http://www.un.org/cyberschoolbus/humanrights/resources/plainchild.asp

But to put the Mother in jail,is a bit harsh if you ask me?
I wonder if the mother ever did get a proper education???the apple usually don't fall far away from the tree.

Frank Black

gbee wrote: »

In that case an investigation into the school should be ordered immediately. It raises the question why the children would not want to go to school.

So, just to clarify.
Any child not wanting to go to school on a particular day should result in a formal investigation into that school?

We better start hiring some more public servants to carry out these investigations so.