Oil Boiler only runs for few seconds

islanderre

Hello All,

I have a Firebird Oil Condensing Boiler that's two years old. Nearly certain thats its a Riello burner????
I noticed that it would fire for few seconds then off (Running noise continues) and so forth and then on 3rd or forth attempt would fire and stay fired until it cuts out on temperature. I then dipped the tank and as it was very low I knocked off the boiler and today got the tank topped up with 500 litres @ .90cent a litre.

I bleed the burner by slackening off the screw while the boiler was trying to fire....... I did this three separate times, no air bubbles and pressure of fuel seems good.
Same issue as above continues......burner fires for few seconds then off (Running noise continues) and so forth.....the RED LIGHT DOES NOT ILLUMINATE.

So, I intend next week (Away till Mon afternoon) to remove burner form the boiler body, clean the photocell and clean off any carbon from the burner tip and ignitor electrodes.

Anyone have any other pointers for me......

Thanks all
Islanderre

Billy Bunting

islanderre wrote: »

Hello All,

I have a Firebird Oil Condensing Boiler that's two years old. Nearly certain thats its a Riello burner????
I noticed that it would fire for few seconds then off (Running noise continues) and so forth and then on 3rd or forth attempt would fire and stay fired until it cuts out on temperature. I then dipped the tank and as it was very low I knocked off the boiler and today got the tank topped up with 500 litres @ .90cent a litre.

I bleed the burner by slackening off the screw while the boiler was trying to fire....... I did this three separate times, no air bubbles and pressure of fuel seems good.
Same issue as above continues......burner fires for few seconds then off (Running noise continues) and so forth.....the RED LIGHT DOES NOT ILLUMINATE.

So, I intend next week (Away till Mon afternoon) to remove burner form the boiler body, clean the photocell and clean off any carbon from the burner tip and ignitor electrodes.

Anyone have any other pointers for me......

Thanks all
Islanderre

What screw ????

corkgsxr

Has it been serviced in the last while. Amazing how many problems ars sorted with a nozzle and set the pressure.

Not spraying properly cant ignite properly.

dpofloinn

Did you turn the oil pressure adjusting screw when you were bleeding the burner ?

islanderre

Not servised since commissioned 2 years ago...... I did remove the burner last year and hover out the combustion chamber and the 'shelves' within it. Reason for this was the fire valve had become faulty and the exhaust was very smokey.....

The screw I used to bleed the burner is the one after the pump..... its a # 4 allan head if I remember correctly. Its the same screw the plumber (now is Australia) used to bleed it during commissioning.

Islanderre

Billy Bunting

I would go for dirty photocell, but theres a lot more to a service than remove burner form the boiler body, clean the photocell and clean off any carbon from the burner tip and ignitor electrodes.

dpofloinn

So essentially the boiler is firing but its taking 3 or 4 go's to ignite?when it ignites does it stay on or does it cut out?if its the former its possible that the photocell may be dirty or faulty and not recognize the flame

TPM

islanderre wrote: »

Not servised since commissioned 2 years ago...... I did remove the burner last year and hover out the combustion chamber and the 'shelves' within it. Reason for this was the fire valve had become faulty and the exhaust was very smokey.....

The screw I used to bleed the burner is the one after the pump..... its a # 4 allan head if I remember correctly. Its the same screw the plumber (now is Australia) used to bleed it during commissioning.

Islanderre

Did you use A or B to bleed the burner

TPM

Billy Bunting wrote: »

I would go for dirty photocell, but theres a lot more to a service than remove burner form the boiler body, clean the photocell and clean off any carbon from the burner tip and ignitor electrodes.

And flue gas analysis

islanderre

TPM, I undone 'B' from your photo.

What I mean when I say it ignites is the following.
Turn the boiler on, running noise sounds...... few seconds later it ignites for 2-3 seconds then back to running noise for few seconds, ignites for 2-3 seconds and on and on and on.

I let it do the above ignite for 2-3 seconds 12 times this evening and then turned it off and removed the fuse on its power supply until I get back to it on monday afternoon.

TPM

islanderre wrote: »

TPM, I undone 'B' from your photo.

grand thats the right one

islanderre wrote: »

What I mean when I say it ignites is the following.
Turn the boiler on, running noise sounds...... few seconds later it ignites for 2-3 seconds then back to running noise for few seconds, ignites for 2-3 seconds and on and on and on.

could need to be bleed some more, or the photocell needs cleaning or is faulty.
you can take out the photocell without taking the burner off the boiler, the photocell could be very tight, if the end of it is black and needs to be cleaned this is a sign that something else isnt 100%.

islanderre wrote: »

I let it do the above ignite for 2-3 seconds 12 times this evening and then turned it off and removed the fuse on its power supply until I get back to it on monday afternoon.

Be careful letting it try to fire that many times it could damage the burner

shane0007

Clean the photocell. If symptom persists, disconnect photocell lead from control box and press reset button. If it goes to lock out, it is a faulty photocell. If symptom is same, it is a faulty coil.

Dtp79

TPM wrote: »

grand thats the right one



could need to be bleed some more, or the photocell needs cleaning or is faulty.
you can take out the photocell without taking the burner off the boiler, the photocell could be very tight, if the end of it is black and needs to be cleaned this is a sign that something else isnt 100%.




Be careful letting it try to fire that many times it could damage the burner

Think it's the photocell. Also don't clean the nozzle!! Call an Oftec technician

islanderre

Thanks allot for all the replies and guidance everybody.

I'll try and sort if Monday Afternoon and report back on Tuesday Evening............ no internet down the shicks!!!!!!!!!!!! If I'm lucky I'll get enough mobile coverage to reply monday but that's never guaranteed!!!

Thanks again

Blackhole

I have similar problems. I`ve just bought my house and the 2006 Riello RDB 1 burner hasnt been fired up for 3 years. I have put 100 litres in the tank which just about covers the outflow. When i start the boiler the fan runs for approx 20 seconds then it sparks for about 5 seconds then cuts out. I then hit the red reset button and bleed it using the long brass nut shown in the post above. I get fuel pumping out, close the grub screw and it fires up for approx 20 seconds.....then stops again.....and so on.

The oil tank is approx 25 m from boiler. Is this an issue???

Any help would be appreciated.

dpofloinn

After 3 years idle you Really and truly you need a full service by properly trained and certified OFTEC engineer It could be any number of things from a sludged up oil line, a dirty/faulty photocell to a seized oil pump

corkgsxr

Blackhole wrote: »

I have similar problems. I`ve just bought my house and the 2006 Riello RDB 1 burner hasnt been fired up for 3 years. I have put 100 litres in the tank which just about covers the outflow. When i start the boiler the fan runs for approx 20 seconds then it sparks for about 5 seconds then cuts out. I then hit the red reset button and bleed it using the long brass nut shown in the post above. I get fuel pumping out, close the grub screw and it fires up for approx 20 seconds.....then stops again.....and so on.

The oil tank is approx 25 m from boiler. Is this an issue???

Any help would be appreciated.

First thing id do is change the nozzle. It could be just dribbling out and you wouldnt know

shane0007

Better to have it serviced completely as needs pump pressure check & a list of other checks. 25m is not an issue as long as head height is maintained for that distance.

islanderre

Blackhole,
As others have said; considering the boiler has not been run for 3 years for safety reasons it is probably best to have a qualified plumber completely service your boiler.......... one other thing to bear in mind is that the flue could be restricted due to a birds nest thus the risk of flue fumes not flowing correctly thus a poisoning risk to you and others.

Only reason I'm going to carry out the checks as mentioned by the other posters to my original query is because the boiler was operating perfect up to last week............. had it not, I'd deffo be calling in an expert....... heck; if I'm not successful on Monday getting it to fire; I'll have no choice anyway considering the freeze we are currently getting embedded in.

Regards,
Islanderre

Blackhole

Is it possible to test the photocell and solenoid valve using the multimeter and if so, how?

Would I be right in saying that if the solenoid valve was faulty then no fuel would get to the jet at any stage??? The fact that it fires up for a few seconds would then mean the solenoid was ok????

Also, it is sparking ok. Does this mean the photocell is working?

Would the burner require a flow of oil or is it capable of sucking oil from the tank? I dont have much oil in the tank....not enough to actually flow out at the boiler end. Could this be the problem?

(I know I should be calling a qualified plumber but I love trying to fix things myself)

jimf

Blackhole wrote: »

Is it possible to test the photocell and solenoid valve using the multimeter and if so, how?

Would I be right in saying that if the solenoid valve was faulty then no fuel would get to the jet at any stage??? The fact that it fires up for a few seconds would then mean the solenoid was ok????

Also, it is sparking ok. Does this mean the photocell is working?

Would the burner require a flow of oil or is it capable of sucking oil from the tank? I dont have much oil in the tank....not enough to actually flow out at the boiler end. Could this be the problem?

(I know I should be calling a qualified plumber but I love trying to fix things myself)

disconnect the oil feed hose as it enters the bottom of the burner if you dont have a good steady flow of oil at this point then your wasting your time and no the fact it fires for a few seconds doesnt mean the coil is ok and again no the fact its sparking doesnt mean the photocell is working

Blackhole

Thanks Jim, I`ll sort the flow out first and see where i get to.

DGOBS

Photocells cannot be accurately tested with a multimeter
Solenoids have a resistance of approx 100ohms on and RDB

Sounds like a photocell issue, but can always be a control box problem

Clean the lens of the photcell first, replace and see what happens. If it cycles off after 1-2 seconds of firing with no lockout, try firing the boiler with it completely disconnected (in that state it should fire for 5 seconds then lockout) if it does, new photcell

If the cell was dirty in the first place, it would indicate the boiler needs to be service and combustion set correctly

corkgsxr

burner should suck the oil. long as theres a tiny flow itll be fine.

Blackhole

DGOBS, thanks....I`ll stick the meter on the solenoid. The photocell was clean when I checked it. I`ll run that test you mention.

CorkGSXR....thanks...no I dont even have a trickle, but I was able to suck it out (doesnt taste the best mind you). I have ordered more oil this morning as the level in the tank just covers the outflow and no more. There are a few twists and turns before the pipe eventually gets to the boiler so there probably isnt enough oil pressure at the tank.

corkgsxr

you could have a airlocked line so.

best way to do it if you have alot of twists and turns is turn off your tank

disconnect the pipe at the tank.

disconnect into the burner and put the flexy into something to catch the fuel.

blow hard from tank to boiler. takes serious effort. now if you have a compressor or something to blow the fuel out for ya all well and good, but it is possible just blowing.

when you get the line empty as you can. connect it back up by the tank. turn it on and the empty line wont airlock. turn it off once you get oil out at the boiler and connect up again

crock!

A poor flow of oil did you check the filter on the oil line. but I agree with dgobs photo cell or control box.

Blackhole

The filter is clean.

CorkGSXR, an airlock is a possibility as I moved the tank and added in 4 yards of pipe. I`m getting more oil delivered tomorrow. I`ll blow the pipe out as you recommend and hopefully the added oil pressure will give me a decent flow.

islanderre

Hello all again,

Updating on the boiler issue I posted this thread about. Went down to it yesterday, bleed the fuel again, removed the photocell (was not too dirty) and yes!!!!!!! she burst into life and is ticking away nicely since.

Thanks alot to everyone for posting their thoughts / guidance and suggestions.

Regards,

Islanderre

kcoleman

I am currently having problems with my firebird oil condensing boiler.

The boiler will ignite for 5-6 seconds before cutting out. However, this is only the happening when the side panel door is closed on the boiler. If I remove the side panel, and leave the unit open, the boiler will run away as normal.

For some reason the air is not circulating inside the boiler. I have checked the flue to make sure that it's not blocked.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!

shane0007

kcoleman wrote: »

I am currently having problems with my firebird oil condensing boiler.

The boiler will ignite for 5-6 seconds before cutting out. However, this is only the happening when the side panel door is closed on the boiler. If I remove the side panel, and leave the unit open, the boiler will run away as normal.

For some reason the air is not circulating inside the boiler. I have checked the flue to make sure that it's not blocked.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!

Chamber door seal is leaking or the flange gasket is leaking, thus causing poc's re-cycling.
Boiler engineer call out time I'm afraid.

Billy Bunting

You need to have it serviced, sounds like flue gases are leaking inside the housing.

scudo2

Your boiler is out of tune and needs a professional service. Boiler not running also indicates fumes leaking from it inside boiler hut. When door is open the burner is getting nice fresh air with 20.9 % oxygen in it. ( I would have just said 21% Oxygen but some people here are sticklers for proper facts, fact !)


Anyway, I was saying about the fumes that ALL 100% should be going out the chimney. the Oxygen level is down to about 5% in fumes and if this is leaking out in boiler hut it results in boiler cutting out.

You need a proper service by somebody with a flue gas analizer.

Somebody here on Boards is offering a 30% discount and distance is not a problem if you live in Ireland. For legal reasions I cannot give out a name, but look up NO NAME he's a laugh.

shane0007

scudo2 wrote: »

Somebody here on Boards is offering a 30% discount and distance is not a problem if you live in Ireland. For legal reasions I cannot give out a name, but look up NO NAME he's a laugh.

I have had enough of your cheap skate digs & if your life is that miserable that you have to comment about me in every thread, then I think we should take this to the Mods to sort out.
You are taking this far beyond weird & you are taking it far beyond a joke.

jimf

also make sure the insulation from the door panel is not loose and falling down on top of the air intake when the door is fitted

scudo2

Photo cell on firebird have a tendency to give trouble if not totaly clean also.

Its 1 1/2" to the right of the red reset button. Wriggle and pull it out and clean the front sensor. A bit of handy info for you but you'll still need a service.

What area are you in ?
Maybe we can help.

KoolKid

Enough of this.
Scudo take a weeks holiday from here and come back with a better attitude if you want to continue posting here.
The lads here give their time and help generously and do not deserve or want your snide remarks.

KoolKid

Posts deleted and one muppet banned.
Please don't feed the trolls.

Billy Bunting

Thats very selfish of you Koolkid, Gary wanted to ban someone.

KoolKid

Ahh there will be plenty more. We seem to attract the persistent types here.

shane0007

I bet that was our marching friend QBE or whatever he calls himself.

Wearb

KoolKid wrote: »

Posts deleted and one muppet banned.
Please don't feed the trolls.

Ahhh Ref............:(

KoolKid

shane0007 wrote: »

I bet that was our marching friend QBE or whatever he calls himself.

No , but there was some obvious matches to other friends ...;)

shane0007

KoolKid wrote: »

No , but there was some obvious matches to other friends ...;)

Oooh, pray tell, pray tell....

crzybkr73

hello my pump is turning and seems to be able to pump oil internally. the problem is that it does not come out from the line that goes to the nozzle. could this be the solenoid or its valve that are faulty. or could it be the small double spring assembly that is inside when the pressure adjustment bolt is removed. sorry if my terms are incorrec. ps i have an old pump i disassembled to try to figure the problem out. photocdell clean and new nozzle fitted but cant get oil to go that far.
thanks

Wearb

crzybkr73 wrote: »

hello my pump is turning and seems to be able to pump oil internally. the problem is that it does not come out from the line that goes to the nozzle. could this be the solenoid or its valve that are faulty. or could it be the small double spring assembly that is inside when the pressure adjustment bolt is removed. sorry if my terms are incorrec. ps i have an old pump i disassembled to try to figure the problem out. photocdell clean and new nozzle fitted but cant get oil to go that far.
thanks

If pump pressure is ok, then its probably the solenoid valve or coil that is wrong. Are you getting lots of oil out of the bleed screw when pump is running? How did you discover that it is pumping oil internally?

crzybkr73

yes a good flow comes from the bleed screw. i removed the pump outer cover to clean the filter. it was pretty muggy with grit and probably water damage. i will pressure test the pump tomorrow

Wearb

crzybkr73 wrote: »

yes a good flow comes from the bleed screw. i removed the pump outer cover to clean the filter. it was pretty muggy with grit and probably water damage. i will pressure test the pump tomorrow

Not looking good for the pump at all. Wouldn't bet too much on you being able to get a steady acceptable pressure reading, but you never know.

agusta

crzybkr73 wrote: »

yes a good flow comes from the bleed screw. i removed the pump outer cover to clean the filter. it was pretty muggy with grit and probably water damage. i will pressure test the pump tomorrow

looks like a new pump.They dont like water/grit.You can test the coil by checking the resistance between the two wires.It should be 100 ohms.

jimf

crzybkr73 wrote: »

yes a good flow comes from the bleed screw. i removed the pump outer cover to clean the filter. it was pretty muggy with grit and probably water damage. i will pressure test the pump tomorrow

you will then need to remove the source of your problem as well as new pumps don't like water either

scudo2

crzybkr73 wrote: »

yes a good flow comes from the bleed screw. i removed the pump outer cover to clean the filter. it was pretty muggy with grit and probably water damage. i will pressure test the pump tomorrow

Water damage, looks for want of better words, white snotty substance in the filter in oil pump, filter on nozzle and similar sneeze splashes on blast tube. If so you will have to test oil tank for water and if so get it syphoned /pumped out as its at the button 2" of the tank.
If you only replace oil pump it won't last long. + boiler needs to be serviced.

Did oil come out the small pressure pipe at the back of the pump ?