What do you think?

Cass

Just looking for some thoughts or opinions.


During the "good years" most people were able to buy pretty much whatever they wanted whenever they wanted, Even then though people drew a line between paying full whack to being overcharged.

I bring this up because of a recent trip. I was driving around a few dealers that i have frequented for some years looking at rifles with my Father, and a friend. I seen a gun i had a serious interest in some 2 years ago. Back then i wa promised they would be available in July 2010, but after speaking to the dealer he told me he got them in for the first time only a month ago. So from the off the rifle is over 2 years "late".

Leaving that aside i asked the price. It scared the crap out of me when he told me. Before i say the price allow me to break down the price in the US.

The gun can be gotten for between $450 - $580 in the states where they are produced. That is full retail price. Adding in shipping, tax, duties, etc. i've worked it out that the rifle would cost me €600 - €665 ($790 - $875) depending on exact charges, and place where it was bought. That's $190 - $300 (€140 - €220) more than the cost of the rifle new, but not too bad considering all the charges.

The price i was told was €900 for the rifle. That is $1,200 or to put it another way between 2-3 times more than the full retail price in the states. Now the dealer buy from the main importer. I presume the main importer does not pay retail price, but cost price. Also as a main importer they would be importing other models so shipping would not be such an expense.

My issue/question is how or why are we still being asked to pay such prices. I'm not a business person so do not fully understand the ins and outs of costs, etc. associated with running a business. However how can they ask me for €230 - €300 more for the same rifle? Considering i'm going to be paying full whack all along the buying, importing process.

Now i understand that in business the object is to make money. I don't begrudge anyone making a few quid, but that seem like piss taking to me. If you assume the importer can buy them at cost price of say $350 each unit. Shipping being slightly less due to larger orders, and all other aspects considered, the same rifle should be standing them at most €450 - €500 all in. By the time the importer gets their touch, the dealer his the rifle might go up to €700. Thats still a long way off €900.


Now for fairness sake i will not mention the dealer or rifle. I don't want to purposely pick on one brand/make/importer/dealer. Plus i've dealt with this dealer for years because he has been the best value, cheapest, best service, etc i have received over the years. Hence the reason i go back, and will continue to do so.

Where is it going wrong though. Are the importers oblivious or ignorant to the market? Do they realise that with a few clicks of a button we don't even need to get out of our chairs to buy guns, ammo, accessories? Are they not interested in being competitive? If for no other reason than to stay in business.


It strikes me as"we'll get as much as we can before the SHTF". Plus with the rifle "overdue" by over 2 years it also leads me to believe that they are not aware of demand/interest in the products.



Any thoughts, opinions, and/or similar experiences?

rowa

Cass wrote: »

My issue/question is how or why are we still being asked to pay such prices. I'm not a business person so do not fully understand the ins and outs of costs, etc. associated with running a business. However how can they ask me for €230 - €300 more for the same rifle? Considering i'm going to be paying full whack all along the buying, importing process.


Any thoughts, opinions, and/or similar experiences?

Well a dealers restricted licence is €2000 a year for a start, the security requirements eg. monitored alarm probabily another €1,000, rates on one gunshop i know are €3000 a year, the rent (irish style upward only rent reviews) say €1000 a month or 12 k a year, pay yourself a pittance of a tenner an hour is €20800 per annum, total €38800 before you buy stock in , pay electricity or other bills, or have to suffer tyre kickers coming in putting €100 deposit on a 2k shotgun and not coming back for 18 months, or having stock sitting on the shelf for a year because the gardai want to mess someone around on an application Etc, we don't live in america and don't have the economies of scale that they do.

Cass

I understand about the issues of running a business from the position of costs. One dealer told me about 2 years ago that he had over €30,000 of stock "sold" in the back room for the last 6 months. Yet he was struggling to keep the lights on daily.

rowa wrote: »

.......we don't live in america and don't have the economies of scale that they do.

I meant to include this point in my long winded post above, but forgot. I wouldn't dare compare Ireland to America. Our enitre shooting population would hardly cover one county in one state so it's a no go. So i get that there is a price difference.

My point, if there is one, is why such a large mark up? Keeping in mind the above about costs, and the fact that i would not begrudge anyone making a bob, some of the prices really are OTT.

If the importer buys from the states he pays less then you or i would. Cost not retail. Adding in all the costs of taxes, etc. he has the rifle in far cheaper than what is being asked for them. It was the same with another brand of rifle. The price in the states did not change, and still has not, yet the price of this rifle has increased by over €300. As a side note the rifle still costs €850 more than the equivalent price in the states.

Getting away from the states v ireland issue another example. I rang up a main importer for a particular brand of accessory. I was told the item i wanted would take 3 months, and cost €220. I thought the time frame was excessive more so than the price. I ordered it online, and for €147 i had the part in 4 days. Cheaper, easier, and much quicker.

I suppose what i'm asking is are we happy to pay, what in my mind is, more than an appropriate profit to the suppliers.

It wasn't me!

Also, that sort of rent could well be much, much higher. One small business in a rural town I'm familiar with had the lease expire a year or two ago. At the time they were hoping to negotiate a new agreement. Their previous rent was €70k per year. Add the other costs of business on top of that as illustrated by rowa and it's pretty easy to see where prices come from. Especially given that most dealers don't work within densely populated areas where it's easy to predict some sort of foot traffic pattern. Irish dealers may be covering the potential for slow periods by pricing a little bit higher again so that if they hit a rough patch, they can still afford their fixed costs. Small markets like ours don't get much by way of good deals I'm afraid, just the nature of it.

Conmaicne Mara

Cass wrote: »

My issue/question is how or why are we still being asked to pay such prices. I'm not a business person so do not fully understand the ins and outs of costs, etc. associated with running a business. However how can they ask me for €230 - €300 more for the same rifle? Considering i'm going to be paying full whack all along the buying, importing process.

I asked a dealer about a particular type of ammunition. It was available elsewhere but for money I considered to be silly. He had it on sale for €5 a box, or 25% less than others. I got chatting to him and asked how that was possible. Now I am hazy on details, but the gist was he buys it as direct as possible and doesn't wait for "middlemen" to receive shipments which then get doled out to other dealers, at a price.

fish slapped

In my opinions such mark up's have been and unfortunately will be present.
I have given the example before on such discussions and will again ...

I was looking for my first 223 a number of years back having sold my hornet and checked around for the best cash price on a CZ. I rang several dealers and was given an array of prices around the 1000 quid mark. the most expensive was 1250 quid !!!! :eek::eek:

I ended up buying it in Tipp for 650 quid. the dealer was still making a few bob at that price. So how could the 1250 be justified in any sensible manner???? ... GREED!!!!

rowa

But how can a dealer who operates from commercial premises with all its associated overheads compete with the kitchen table dealer ? The kitchen table dealers were banned but the s.i was never signed so i am told.

fish slapped

With 600 of a mark up on one transaction ... he shouldn't try to pay the weeks rent with one sale.

overheads and being competitive are what you look at when setting up ... therefore you cut your cloth to suit...

Cass

rowa wrote: »

The kitchen table dealers were banned but the s.i was never signed so i am told.

Do you mean those that has premises attached or at their residence?

As said above if that is the case then i can see why the larger, commercial dealer would need to get a few quid more. However i am not talking about a couple of quid. As fish slapped said the price differences between dealers is astonishing. Whether this is down to their supplier or simply looking to milk the most from it is irrelevant. To a degree.

How can they justify the huge price difference or more to the point how do they stay in business. if i seen a price difference of 20-40% i'd be staying away from such dealers.

However as i said before i'm not on about this as a "bash the dealers" thread. I'm more interested to know why they charge what they do, how they can justify the prices, where they get their goods from, etc. IOW if two dealers are sellig the same item but one for 30% more than the other. Why? Did his supplier charge more. If so why? If not then why does his product (exact same) warrant 30% more cost. Because his costs are higher? If so, and without being a dick, how is where he is located/his overheads my "problem" to the extent that i should have to pay more so he can remain in his location/business.

Getting away from the dealer end. Why do suppliers, that can buy in bulk at cost price, etc. charge so much for the goods that by the time the dealer tacks on his bit the price of the item is double the original price. I mean as i outlined above if i can buy from another supplier, at retail, for less than the main importer here why does the main importer still buy from their source. Why not simply buy from where i bought mine at a much lower price, still make the same profit, but with the final retail price being a lot less than it was previously.

fish slapped

It seems it's justifiable, so long as WE, the shooting public, continue to pay it...

people still buy popcorn at the cinema, even though it has a mark up of 10,000% ... yes 10,000% :mad:

tac foley

Bleeve me that it is not just Ireland where this happens - the yUK is exactly the same - TWO pounds for each dollar plus about 10% is quite normal here for US-made guns and optics.

The opposite works out, too, although I understand, from your POV, that it's hard to have much sympathy. Anything that costs eu1000, once it gets to the USA or Canada, costs around $1310 [today], so any European item of shooting equipment is well loaded by the time it gets to the stores. Funnily enough, it does not seem to apply to propellants.

When I was in Walmart in Eugene last Fall, they were dealing the rather nice Ruger 10/22 heavy barrel in stainless with the composite stock for $399.00 - remember that Oregon has no sales tax either. Right now, that's eu305.

How much is that rifle in RoI?

Answer is, I don't know, but some of YOU do.

Here in UK it's £599.95 - that's $972.00....and YOU are complaining?

tac

One shot on kill

Its greed that's exactly what it is and it comes from the top. We see it every day trying to get stuff from the us the customs have a field day. And the true be known every one trying to keep up with the tiger now he is gone along with everything else and everyone is suffering including RFDS.

clivej

tac foley wrote: »

When I was in Walmart in Eugene last Fall, they were dealing the rather nice Ruger 10/22 heavy barrel in stainless with the composite stock for $399.00 - remember that Oregon has no sales tax either. Right now, that's eu305.

How much is that rifle in RoI?

Answer is, I don't know, but some of YOU do.

Here in UK it's £599.95 - that's $972.00....and YOU are complaining?

tac

They run about €650-700 here so not so bad.

I could get one in a Tipp dealers last year at €599

moby30

I cant bare listening to the Whingers in some of these gunshops. Rates, rent, overheads blah blah blah. I basically just walk out and never go back, the very same way I do when I see them trying to screw me on a price so if thats the way they run there business I feel no sympathy for them. We all know about the recession and things are tough and I understand as much as anyone about having to make a profit to stay in business but unfortunately trying to pull the wool over someones eyes and making the "Quick Buck" instead of trying to get repeat custom will just close you down. It is a very difficult step for any business to take when you see that turnover and profit are down to reduce prices when your brain is telling you the obvious thing is to increase them but its the only way as far as Im concerned to get customer loyalty and repeat business.

IRLConor

tac foley wrote: »

Bleeve me that it is not just Ireland where this happens - the yUK is exactly the same - TWO pounds for each dollar plus about 10% is quite normal here for US-made guns and optics.

The opposite works out, too, although I understand, from your POV, that it's hard to have much sympathy. Anything that costs eu1000, once it gets to the USA or Canada, costs around $1310 [today], so any European item of shooting equipment is well loaded by the time it gets to the stores. Funnily enough, it does not seem to apply to propellants.

When I was in Walmart in Eugene last Fall, they were dealing the rather nice Ruger 10/22 heavy barrel in stainless with the composite stock for $399.00 - remember that Oregon has no sales tax either. Right now, that's eu305.

How much is that rifle in RoI?

Answer is, I don't know, but some of YOU do.

Here in UK it's £599.95 - that's $972.00....and YOU are complaining?

tac

Just for the purposes of comparing like with like, I ran the numbers on bringing that rifle into Ireland:

||Total
Purchase Price|$399|$399
+ Delivery|$50|$449
-> Euro @ 0.766814||€344.30
+ Duty @ 3.2% (TARIC code 9303300000)|€11.02|€355.32
+ Distributor Markup @ 5%|€17.77|€373.09
+ Retailer Markup @ 5%|€18.66|€391.75
+ VAT @ 23%|€90.10|€481.85


Now, the delivery and distributor/retailer markups are very low. In reality I'd expect the delivery to be higher (rifles are heavy) and for the distributor and retailer markups to be higher (you can't expect to run a business on less than €20 per rifle sold) so if clivej saw one for €599 then it's a very decent price.

Also, while it's true that the $399 is Walmart's retail price I can't imagine that a distributor here would get a wholesale price any better than that. I suspect that Walmart's wholesale price is excellent and that their margins are minimal. I wouldn't be surprised if Walmart's retail price is lower than the wholesale price available to distributors in a low-volume market like Ireland.

clivej

IRLConor wrote: »

Just for the purposes of comparing like with like, I ran the numbers on bringing that rifle into Ireland:

||Total
Purchase Price|$399|$399
+ Delivery|$50|$449
-> Euro @ 0.766814||€344.30
+ Duty @ 3.2% (TARIC code 9303300000)|€11.02|€355.32
+ Distributor Markup @ 5%|€17.77|€373.09
+ Retailer Markup @ 5%|€18.66|€391.75
+ VAT @ 23%|€90.10|€481.85


Now, the delivery and distributor/retailer markups are very low. In reality I'd expect the delivery to be higher (rifles are heavy) and for the distributor and retailer markups to be higher (you can't expect to run a business on less than €20 per rifle sold) so if clivej saw one for €599 then it's a very decent price.

Also, while it's true that the $399 is Walmart's retail price I can't imagine that a distributor here would get a wholesale price any better than that. I suspect that Walmart's wholesale price is excellent and that their margins are minimal. I wouldn't be surprised if Walmart's retail price is lower than the wholesale price available to distributors in a low-volume market like Ireland.

Is there not the US export license as well to add???

IRLConor

clivej wrote: »

Is there not the US export license as well to add???

Ah, true, I had forgotten that. How much does that run to normally?

zeissman

My mate wanted a warne 20 moa rail for his remington so I priced one with the main uk supplier and it was £133 sterling plus delivery,
I got the same rail delivered to my door from the US for 87 euro.

BattleCorp

IRLConor wrote: »

Just for the purposes of comparing like with like, I ran the numbers on bringing that rifle into Ireland:

||Total
Purchase Price|$399|$399
+ Delivery|$50|$449
-> Euro @ 0.766814||€344.30
+ Duty @ 3.2% (TARIC code 9303300000)|€11.02|€355.32
+ Distributor Markup @ 5%|€17.77|€373.09
+ Retailer Markup @ 5%|€18.66|€391.75
+ VAT @ 23%|€90.10|€481.85



I'm not in favour of being ripped off but we have to be realistic here.

There is absolutely no way that a gun dealer could survive on 5% markup. A gun dealer in Ireland would need to be on at least 35% markup, if not more, to be able to stay in business here in Ireland. And he'd want to be a shocking busy gun dealer at that.

In an earlier post, somebody quoted a gun dealer as saying that he had €30,000 worth of stock sold in his back room. 5% of €30,000 is only €1,500. Where would that get you in todays economy trying to run a business.

If a dealer sold one gun per day and made €100 per gun, then he'd still only make €600 per week. That wouldn't even cover his wages let alone the cost of premises, rates and all the other stuff mentioned in an earlier post.

The reason stuff is so dear here in Ireland is because of the size of our shooting community. It's too small. It's an economy of scale thing. If we sold as much guns as Tesco sells food, then we would start seeing reducing prices.

*For the record, I'd just like to state that I'm not a gun dealer or affiliated to one, or overly friendly with one for that matter. I'm just stating my opinion.

IRLConor

BattleCorp wrote: »

I'm not in favour of being ripped off but we have to be realistic here.

There is absolutely no way that a gun dealer could survive on 5% markup. A gun dealer in Ireland would need to be on at least 35% markup, if not more, to be able to stay in business here in Ireland. And he'd want to be a shocking busy gun dealer at that.

Agreed. As I said above:

IRLConor wrote: »

Now, the delivery and distributor/retailer markups are very low. In reality I'd expect the delivery to be higher (rifles are heavy) and for the distributor and retailer markups to be higher (you can't expect to run a business on less than €20 per rifle sold) so if clivej saw one for €599 then it's a very decent price.

BattleCorp

^^^^^^^^
Point taken.

Cass

What bothers me the most is the differences in prices.

I bought my savage FTR for €1,550. At the time i got prices of up to €1,850. Why?

According to some of the reasons here it's because a dealer has to pay more for rates, rent, etc. so he feels the need to pass this onto his customers. So if the dealer i bought from is making his money, with mark up, at €1,550 what the hell is the dealer charging €1,850 making.

This is not only about rifles, although guns do provide the platform for making larger profits (i assume), it's about all aspects of shooting.

When i was in the height of my clay shooting days i was buying cartridges by the thousands. Minimum of one, but sometime up to the limit of my license (3,000). I was being charged €55 per slab or €210 per 1,000 (not a huge mark up on cartridges or so i'm led to believe from the various dealers i've spoken to). When a few lads came to a shoot, and we got talking i mentioned the price i was paying for the cartridges. They asked me to put them in contact with the dealer as their local supplier was charging €70 per slab with no discount for bulk buying. The person they bought from had no overheads (shop, etc) So what was his excuse for charging €15 more per slab.


I could go on naming incident, but as said i'm not trying to get at anyone. We all say we are free to shop around however the businesses that refuse to reduce prices, use overheads as an excuse, over charge, etc are still in business. Which means people are still buying from them. Are we so used to paying more that we don't question the prices anymore? As i said above if i can order the same product for a lot less, and have it sent to my door quicker than what dealers can supply it to me for then why do the suppliers/dealers not order in the same fashion.


Example. I want a rail for my rifle. A dealer quotes me €150 & 2 month wait. I order online, and get it for €100, and within 5 days. The dealer says he cannot match these prices. Why? If he buys them for €120 and marks them up to €150 so that when he sells them he makes enough to cover rates, rent, costs, etc. then he risks loosing business as he would have done with me.

Now if he buys them from the same online place i bought mine, for cost or in bulk and they set him back say €80 per unit. He can now sell them for €110, still make his €30 profit, and keep me as a customer who would rather see him have the business than send it abroad for the sake of a €10.

I realise the prices are not going to work as easily as that in all instances, but you get the idea. So again, getting away from the dealer for a moment, where or who are they buying off that i can get the item cheaper online as an individual than they can from a main importer buying in bulk and at wholesale prices? What is it that has them going back to this "middle man" and incurring another charge that they must pass onto their customer to retain some sort of decent profit?

They can change their suppliers, keep the customers (you know the ones that keep them in business) happy, and maintain a return customer business rather than a one off "killing" type business.

fish slapped

I'd have no problem with 35%/ 40% or even 50% ... it's when it's 100+% that it's a problem for me.

Asking €150+ for something I can buy online and have shipped from the states for under €70 is my issue ...

BattleCorp

Cass wrote: »

What bothers me the most is the differences in prices.

I bought my savage FTR for €1,550. At the time i got prices of up to €1,850. Why?

According to some of the reasons here it's because a dealer has to pay more for rates, rent, etc. so he feels the need to pass this onto his customers. So if the dealer i bought from is making his money, with mark up, at €1,550 what the hell is the dealer charging €1,850 making.

This is not only about rifles, although guns do provide the platform for making larger profits (i assume), it's about all aspects of shooting.

When i was in the height of my clay shooting days i was buying cartridges by the thousands. Minimum of one, but sometime up to the limit of my license (3,000). I was being charged €55 per slab or €210 per 1,000 (not a huge mark up on cartridges or so i'm led to believe from the various dealers i've spoken to). When a few lads came to a shoot, and we got talking i mentioned the price i was paying for the cartridges. They asked me to put them in contact with the dealer as their local supplier was charging €70 per slab with no discount for bulk buying. The person they bought from had no overheads (shop, etc) So what was his excuse for charging €15 more per slab.


I could go on naming incident, but as said i'm not trying to get at anyone. We all say we are free to shop around however the businesses that refuse to reduce prices, use overheads as an excuse, over charge, etc are still in business. Which means people are still buying from them. Are we so used to paying more that we don't question the prices anymore? As i said above if i can order the same product for a lot less, and have it sent to my door quicker than what dealers can supply it to me for then why do the suppliers/dealers not order in the same fashion.


Example. I want a rail for my rifle. A dealer quotes me €150 & 2 month wait. I order online, and get it for €100, and within 5 days. The dealer says he cannot match these prices. Why? If he buys them for €120 and marks them up to €150 so that when he sells them he makes enough to cover rates, rent, costs, etc. then he risks loosing business as he would have done with me.

Now if he buys them from the same online place i bought mine, for cost or in bulk and they set him back say €80 per unit. He can now sell them for €110, still make his €30 profit, and keep me as a customer who would rather see him have the business than send it abroad for the sake of a €10.

I realise the prices are not going to work as easily as that in all instances, but you get the idea. So again, getting away from the dealer for a moment, where or who are they buying off that i can get the item cheaper online as an individual than they can from a main importer buying in bulk and at wholesale prices? What is it that has them going back to this "middle man" and incurring another charge that they must pass onto their customer to retain some sort of decent profit?

.

When a dealer buys through existing chanels, the dealer probably gets 30 days credit or some such arrangement. It helps his cash flow by getting credit. If he buys online he has to pay up front. Not many businesses can afford to pay up front for something that they may not get to collect on for up to a year or two in some cases. This might work for smaller items but certainly wouldn't work for rifles costing thousands of euro.

Also, not everybody comes back to collect what they have ordered.

It is quite logical to expect some dealers to have very different prices as a lot of them would have very different cost bases. A dealer working out of a rented premises or maybe have a mortgage would have to add in a percentage of his rent into the price of his firearm to help cover costs. A guy working out of a premises that has no rent or no mortgage could reasonably be expected to have his prices lower as his cost base is lower. That's the luck of the draw and is the same for every business.

Every local authority sets their own Rates and they differ greatly from area to area. This is another cost that can be variable. Some might have to add on to the price of the firearm to cover this cost. There are loads of variables that would contribute to different prices.

It's quite concieveable that a dealer selling a rifle for €1500 could only make the same amount of money as a dealer selling the same make of rifle for €1200.

Yes, there are some very greedy dealers out there but price differentials can't be taken to be greed in all cases.

Vizzy

Cass,I think you are not asking "Why are prices dearer in Ireland or UK than in USA or online" and asking "why is dealer A more expensive than dealer B" and the answer is simple - Greed.
There may be some slight differences in operating costs/overheads but there is no excuse for €15 difference for a slab of clay pigeon cartridges or €100 on a gun.
Simple rule of economics ,if they are too dear don't buy off them.

However,in fairnes to dealers,I think that a good working relationship with the dealer also pays off.For instance I can get a slab of Eley Olympic 28g 8's for €50 and would get them cheaper if I went for a group buy and my local dealer can get me Seeland gear cheaper than I can get it on the net and I can try it on and not buy if it doesn't fit.
Just my €100 worth

Cass

BattleCorp wrote: »

Yes, there are some very greedy dealers out there but price differentials can't be taken to be greed in all cases.

Vizzy wrote: »

Cass,I think you are not asking "Why are prices dearer in Ireland or UK than in USA or online" and asking "why is dealer A more expensive than dealer B" ..............

To both the quotes above i would like to say that i am in no way taking pot shots at dealers. Vizzy is right in that i'm not trying to compare prices because it's just not practical. I knew before posting this thread that buying power, market, population, country of manufacturing, etc. all have influences on costs.

I'm just trying to understand the costs. My other main point for this thread was not to focus solely on the dealers, but on the middle men, importers, suppliers too. IOW does a dealer that buys from supplier A buy the product with an already high mark up on it than say buying from another dealer that uses supplier B. Is it the suppliers that cause the higher than average price due to them adding a higher than normal mark up on their end? Do all dealers buy from the same one, two, etc suppliers. Hence why some dealers are similar in price then others so much higher. Can the dealers "bypass" the middle men and reduce overall cost yet maintain profit margins so as to stay competitive, and in business?

............ and the answer is simple - Greed.

There may be some slight differences in operating costs/overheads but there is no excuse for €15 difference for a slab of clay pigeon cartridges or €100 on a gun.
Simple rule of economics ,if they are too dear don't buy off them.

I don't doubt that some do not care about repeat business, and look at customers as "if they want it they'll pay what i'm asking or go elsewhere". It just surprises me that they are still in business.

However,in fairnes to dealers,I think that a good working relationship with the dealer also pays off.For instance I can get a slab of Eley Olympic 28g 8's for €50 and would get them cheaper if I went for a group buy and my local dealer can get me Seeland gear cheaper than I can get it on the net and I can try it on and not buy if it doesn't fit.
Just my €100 worth

Absolutely, and again i must stress this is not getting at dealers. I have had a long standing and good relationship with the dealers i have used, and two in particular that have gone above and beyond the call of duty for customer service.

My reason for this thread was the fact that the rifle i was looking at can be bought personally for 30-35% less than in a dealers. I was curious as to why considering i would be paying full retail from the dealer, all taxes, duties, shipping, license fees, etc. I would imagine a dealer could bypass the middle man, buy at wholesale, import, and sell cheaper, but still maintaining profit margins.


@Battlecorp. Thats a very good point about credit, and the ability to work a business on stock that has a very slow sale rate. I mean even if everything works out the best way possible a gun from time of purchase to the dealer collecting the money is a minimum of 2-3 weeks, and possibly up to and beyond a year. So i have no doubt the trade is a life long commitment.

However as Vizzy said it's not the prices, so much, as the inconsistencies.

zeissman

I think its the gun importers that are making the big profit.
There is only one supplier for each brand of firearm in this country so if you want a certain make of rifle your dealer cant shop around, he has to go to the sole importer.
I know a few dealers who were bringing in guns from other dealers in the uk because it was cheaper than buying from the irish importer.
I think in the case of your savage rifle Cass your dealer was happy to make a small profit where the other guys wanted a lot more.