An Post €1.75M Fraudster - Criminal or Victim?

byronbay2

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1218/court-tony-o-reilly.html
We have been discussing this on the Gambling forum (yes, I like an occasional flutter!) since last night but I would like to bring the topic to a wider audience, even if that means entering the jungle that is AH.

The story is that 37 year-old post office manager Tony O'Reilly from Carlow (a married man with a 2 year-old child) stole over €1.75 million from his employer (An Post) over the course of 14 months and used it to gamble with bookmaker Paddy Power. He was a very obvious compulsive gambler (he had a turnover of €10 million in his PP account during the 14-month period and placed a €40K bet on Norwegian Ladies Football at one point) and, of course, lost every penny of the money he stole plus all of his own money.

An Post eventually (after, what I consider, a farcical delay) realised what had happened and brought in The Gardai. He was questioned and immediately admitted his crime. He cooperated fully, was charged and pleaded guilty to six charges of theft. Yesterday, he was sentenced to 4 years in prison with 1 year suspended.

Here's the thing: I'm no bleeding heart liberal but I have rarely read a story where I have felt so sorry for the criminal. It was a first offence, nobody was hurt, he admitted his crime and helped Gardai with their investigation, he pleaded guilty, he did not enrich himself in any way and, in my opinion, there are fairly extreme extenuating circumstances for the crimes he committed, in so far as he was addicted to gambling. He has now given up gambling and wants to help others in his situation. I certainly think that a 1-year sentence would have served the same purpose as a 4-year one for this man - I hope he's released after 6 months like most of the real criminals in jail!

The other matter I want to discuss regarding this case is the culpability (or otherwise) of Paddy Power. Mr. O'Reilly was very obviously a compulsive gambler. PP have a code of conduct that precludes it from taking bets from people it believes might be compulsive gamblers. Also, all their staff are trained to spot the signs that a customer may have a problem and to offer them help and advice. All I can say in this situation is: FAIL!! A Post Office manager with a turnover of €10 million in his PP account?? If there was ever an obvious problem gambler, it was Tony O'Reilly. Instead of helping him, Paddy Power wined and dined him with all-expenses paid trips to The Curragh and The Aviva Stadium. Despicable behaviour by PP in my opinion. They knew beyond any doubt that the guy had a serious gambling problem that would inevitably lead to personal catastrophe and did nothing to help him. On the contrary, they happily took him for every penny he had and every penny he could defraud his employers of - so much for their obligation to social responsibility and responsible gambling!

As a side bar, I also personally believe that Paddy Power should return the €1.75 million lost by Mr. O'Reilly to An Post. He was gambling, like all compulsive gamblers, with ZERO chance of winning i.e he would keep gambling until he had nothing left no matter how much he won at any stage along the way. That, in my opinion, is why PP are so culpable - they knew the inevitable outcome better than anyone!

Anyway, rant finally over - this is undoubtedly my longest ever post on Boards. What do you think about this situation? Let me just say, I have no connection whatsoever with Mr. O'Reilly and no general antipathy towards Paddy Power, except in this instance. I have a long-standing account with them and am delighted that an Irish company is doing so well and employing so many.

seamus

So if PP should refund the money, does this mean that publicans should refund alcoholics?

Victim, my arse. When you start stealing in order to serve your own personal hobbies, it should instantly ring alarm bells in your head to go and get help.

This guy was no idiot, even thinking about defrauding his employer should have caused him to realise he needs help. I don't understand the compulsive need to take pity on people who walk into things with their eyes open and get burned.

Rented Mule

I always feel the same way about those poor bankers and developers.

Ghandee

Bet ya 40,000€ he doesn't serve the whole sentence. :pac:

geeky

He's not a victim. He has an illness, some would just say a problem, but there is literally no way you can justify stealing millions from your employer.

He has hurt people, because An Post's services will be affected by this loss. No, it's not a junkie killing and robbing someone, but there's no such thing as a victimless crime.

Agree with you totally about Paddy Power. I'd like to see a bit more detail about their policies re compulsive gamblers - and exactly when they determine someone has a problem.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

geeky wrote: »

He has hurt people, because An Post's services will be affected by this loss. No, it's not a junkie killing and robbing someone, but there's no such thing as a victimless crime.

growing and smoking your own weed is one

MagicSean

He's a criminal. And I don't know where exactly you get the idea that stealing 1.75m is a victimless crime. Where do you think it comes from?

knucklehead6

paddy Power probably thought is was ANOTHER Tony O Reilly....A rich one. That way a 10 mill turnover wouldn't be out of the ordinary...

sits back to watch the fun.

MagicMarker

geeky wrote: »

but there's no such thing as a victimless crime.

Yeah there is.

TwoShedsJackson

he did not enrich himself in any way

I could have sworn he enriched himself to the tune of 1.75 million. His choice to then gamble away the lot of it.

somefeen

Its an illness yes.
But so is drug addiction, we don't let drug addicts off for stealing.

Steal money, blow it on drugs
Steal money, blow it on gambling.
Same thing

Leroy42

There is really two aspects to this The first is the man himself. He may have an addiction but he made the choice to take the money. He lost 1.75m, but the OP states that he had account of 10m so could have lost way more than that. 4 years with 1 suspended means he will serve about 2, maybe less, which seems far enough.

The other aspect is PP and should they return the money. My reading is that if you buy a stolen car from someone, even if unknown to yourself, the car will be seized. PP now know that this money is stolen, I can't see any difference.

opinion guy

TwoShedsJackson wrote: »

I could have sworn he enriched himself to the tune of 1.75 million. His choice to then gamble away the lot of it.

Exactly. If he had and addiction to coke and hookers and spent it on coke and hookers would you be as sympathetic ? Alternatively - if an alcoholic hit someone in his car whilst drunk would we excuse it because he is an alcoholic ?

He may not have ended up enriched, but he certainly enjoyed the money whilst he had it.

Eh wait a minute.....

When the account was examined, it was found that over the period of time it had had a turnover of €10m, with €8.3m in winnings and €1.7m in losses.

According to that he won more than he lost....where is it now ?

Bipolar Joe

Not going to get too much into this, but the sentence, based on what is typical for sentencing in this country, is way too big. You can be a violent recidivist, and walk away with four months, sometimes nothing, every time. This gets you four years, one suspended? What a joke.

Boombastic

Ghandee wrote: »

Bet ya 40,000€ he doesn't serve the whole sentence. :pac:

Double or quits: The garlic man will be mentioned:pac:

listenup

seamus wrote: »

So if PP should refund the money, does this mean that publicans should refund alcoholics?

Victim, my arse. When you start stealing in order to serve your own personal hobbies, it should instantly ring alarm bells in your head to go and get help.

This guy was no idiot, even thinking about defrauding his employer should have caused him to realise he needs help. I don't understand the compulsive need to take pity on people who walk into things with their eyes open and get burned.

well bloody seamus

Death and Taxes

byronbay2 wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1218/court-tony-o-reilly.html
We have been discussing this on the Gambling forum (yes, I like an occasional flutter!) since last night but I would like to bring the topic to a wider audience, even if that means entering the jungle that is AH.

The story is that 37 year-old post office manager Tony O'Reilly from Carlow (a married man with a 2 year-old child) stole over €1.75 million from his employer (An Post) over the course of 14 months and used it to gamble with bookmaker Paddy Power. He was a very obvious compulsive gambler (he had a turnover of €10 million in his PP account during the 14-month period and placed a €40K bet on Norwegian Ladies Football at one point) and, of course, lost every penny of the money he stole plus all of his own money.

An Post eventually (after, what I consider, a farcical delay) realised what had happened and brought in The Gardai. He was questioned and immediately admitted his crime. He cooperated fully, was charged and pleaded guilty to six charges of theft. Yesterday, he was sentenced to 4 years in prison with 1 year suspended.

Here's the thing: I'm no bleeding heart liberal but I have rarely read a story where I have felt so sorry for the criminal. It was a first offence, nobody was hurt, he admitted his crime and helped Gardai with their investigation, he pleaded guilty, he did not enrich himself in any way and, in my opinion, there are fairly extreme extenuating circumstances for the crimes he committed, in so far as he was addicted to gambling. He has now given up gambling and wants to help others in his situation. I certainly think that a 1-year sentence would have served the same purpose as a 4-year one for this man - I hope he's released after 6 months like most of the real criminals in jail!

The other matter I want to discuss regarding this case is the culpability (or otherwise) of Paddy Power. Mr. O'Reilly was very obviously a compulsive gambler. PP have a code of conduct that precludes it from taking bets from people it believes might be compulsive gamblers. Also, all their staff are trained to spot the signs that a customer may have a problem and to offer them help and advice. All I can say in this situation is: FAIL!! A Post Office manager with a turnover of €10 million in his PP account?? If there was ever an obvious problem gambler, it was Tony O'Reilly. Instead of helping him, Paddy Power wined and dined him with all-expenses paid trips to The Curragh and The Aviva Stadium. Despicable behaviour by PP in my opinion. They knew beyond any doubt that the guy had a serious gambling problem that would inevitably lead to personal catastrophe and did nothing to help him. On the contrary, they happily took him for every penny he had and every penny he could defraud his employers of - so much for their obligation to social responsibility and responsible gambling!

As a side bar, I also personally believe that Paddy Power should return the €1.75 million lost by Mr. O'Reilly to An Post. He was gambling, like all compulsive gamblers, with ZERO chance of winning i.e he would keep gambling until he had nothing left no matter how much he won at any stage along the way. That, in my opinion, is why PP are so culpable - they knew the inevitable outcome better than anyone!

Anyway, rant finally over - this is undoubtedly my longest ever post on Boards. What do you think about this situation? Let me just say, I have no connection whatsoever with Mr. O'Reilly and no general antipathy towards Paddy Power, except in this instance. I have a long-standing account with them and am delighted that an Irish company is doing so well and employing so many.

A first offence that went on for years, he systematically stole from his employer.
How do you mean nobody was hurt, he stole €1,750,000 from us, the taxpayer.
He did enrich himself, to the tune of €1,750,000!
As for your whole it's not his fault, Paddy Power let him spend the money, that is just ludicrus.
are you saying that it would have been worse if he stole for something else like holidays? He stole it to spend it, end of.
That said I am not that fond of the idea of locking up non violent offenders if another sensible alternative can be provided.

Odysseus

seamus wrote: »

So if PP should refund the money, does this mean that publicans should refund alcoholics?

Victim, my arse. When you start stealing in order to serve your own personal hobbies, it should instantly ring alarm bells in your head to go and get help.

This guy was no idiot, even thinking about defrauding his employer should have caused him to realise he needs help. I don't understand the compulsive need to take pity on people who walk into things with their eyes open and get burned.

I don't know if you can call a serious addiction a hobby? I really doubt he had his eyes open as such, all sorts and levels of denial, rationalisations, etc going on there. Addiction can't exist without those process.

If only is was so easy to recognise you need help; I would be out of a job.

ringadingding

The biggest question here is what kind of systems are in place that an post are duped so easily, I mean is nobody checking the money above the office managers ?

Tippexing out amounts and rewriting them ?

Pulling piles of 50's out with pliers ?
Replacing 2c coin bags for 2 euro ones

Any company I've worked for involving cash would have that pounced on this from the first discrepancy.

The person above this guy should be fired too....

LittleBook

byronbay2 wrote: »

An Post eventually (after, what I consider, a farcical delay) realised what had happened and brought in The Gardai.

The only part I agree with is this. Any company where an employee can steal this kind of money over that length of time is not being run properly and is probably in violation of money laundering regulations with such unusual cash activity going unnoticed for so long.

seamus

Odysseus wrote: »

I don't know if you can call a serious addiction a hobby? I really doubt he had his eyes open as such, all sorts and levels of denial, rationalisations, etc going on there. Addiction can't exist without those process.

That doesn't remove any blame from him though.

I'm aware that addiction is not easy in any sense of the word, but I do know that one of the first steps in tackling addiction is acknowledging that it's entirely on your shoulders and no-one else's.

So I don't think it's an unreasonable standard to expect an addict to be held fully to blame for his/her actions.

ScumLord

I knew them savings stamps weren't secure!

charlemont

Fúck him, He deserves it.

opinion guy

WileyCoyote wrote: »

That said I am not that fond of the idea of locking up non violent offenders if another sensible alternative can be provided.

On the one hand I agree with you here - it only costs more money to lock him up and does neither him, nor anyone else any good. Its also disproportionate to the light sentences people get for violent crimes of late. A suspended sentence + community service might be better. However, on the other hand, I do think some of the people involved in the banking frauds should be imprisoned.

opinion guy

opinion guy wrote: »

According to that he won more than he lost....where is it now ?

I think the 8 million was the culmination of money won and lost numerous times while the 1.7m loss was the initial investment. Surely if there was 6 million sitting in the account he would have been able to hire a better lawyer

donegal_road

knucklehead6 wrote: »

paddy Power probably thought is was ANOTHER Tony O Reilly....A rich one. That way a 10 mill turnover wouldn't be out of the ordinary...

sits back to watch the fun.

wouldn't surprise me if this is part of what happened

Glenbhoy

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

growing and smoking your own weed is one

I think not.

What about all the workers in the gun factories who would lose their jobs if everyone was to adopt such selfish actions? What about the high end jeep manufacturers and retailers and all their employees who would also lose out if drug dealers could no longer afford to splurge out on new wheels? What about the suppliers of equipment to drug enforcement agencies? What about the employees of drug enforcement agencies.....


Back to the main story, the guy had a problem and has been punished, Power's should refund whatever portion of the money can be directly identified as coming from that customer. As many have said, they claim to have all sorts of systems in place for identifying this sort of behaviour and you'd worry about the systems if this particular instance wasn't flagged. I'd actually expect them to make a sizeable donation or likewise by way of reparation.

Odysseus

seamus wrote: »

That doesn't remove any blame from him though.

I'm aware that addiction is not easy in any sense of the word, but I do know that one of the first steps in tackling addiction is acknowledging that it's entirely on your shoulders and no-one else's.

So I don't think it's an unreasonable standard to expect an addict to be held fully to blame for his/her actions.

I in no way said or implied any of that, I stated that serious addictions are not personal hobbies.

Of course he has to take personal responsibility for the position he is in; however, there are very strong processes involved in addictions that prevent the subject from seeking help.

The man is in a horrible position but he is the one that got himself there.

One of the first steps is overcoming the denial and other processes and acknowledgeing their is a problem; without that nothing can happen.

However, addictions are complex pathological states which would lead me to say that chap is neither a victim nor a criminal, he may have engaged in criminal activities but I think there is a difference.

Slattsy

I bet €40k the OP regrets posting this in AH :pac:

Corkbah

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

growing and smoking your own weed is one

doesn't that mean that the drug dealers suffer a loss in revenue - if everyone does the same, drug dealers go bust !!...the entire illegal drug industry could suffer !!

Boombastic

Corkbah wrote: »

doesn't that mean that the drug dealers suffer a loss in revenue - if everyone does the same, drug dealers go bust !!...the entire illegal drug industry could suffer !!

And the Gardai would miss out on a lot of work and publicity.

opinion guy

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

I think the 8 million was the culmination of money won and lost numerous times while the 1.7m loss was the initial investment. Surely if there was 6 million sitting in the account he would have been able to hire a better lawyer

Having a flash lawyer would be a bit of a give away as to having the cash no ?

Corkbah

Boombastic wrote: »

And the Gardai would miss out on a lot of work and publicity.

and overtime !! ...dont forget the overtime !!

Cienciano

somefeen wrote: »

Its an illness yes.
But so is drug addiction, we don't let drug addicts off for stealing.

Actually, a lot of them do. Saying to the judge that they have a drug problem but are going to tackle it by going into rehab is a get out clause for a hell of a lot of junkies.

PizzamanIRL

You answered your own question in the title. Fraud = crime.

He hardly spent every cent of the 1.75 million in the bookies. He probably splashed out on something along the way.

Odysseus

Cienciano wrote: »

Actually, a lot of them do. Saying to the judge that they have a drug problem but are going to tackle it by going into rehab is a get out clause for a hell of a lot of junkies.

Do you have to use the term Junkie? Going into rehab is one of the hardest things a person will do, believe me it is not a cushy number.

Going into to treatment to detox or going into rehab they are different are not get out of jail free cards.

Often the judge will make a treatment/rehab order.

This is something a judge will consider, it does not remove blame, as I siad it is only one of the things a judge will consider.

I write a lot of court reports for addicts; believe me they are not get out of jail free cards.

Corkbah

Odysseus wrote: »

Do you have to use the term Junkie? Going into rehab is one of the hardest things a person will do, believe me it is not a cushy number.

Going into to treatment to detox or going into rehab they are different are not get out of jail free cards.

Often the judge will make a treatment/rehab order.

This is something a judge will consider, it does not remove blame, as I siad it is only one of the things a judge will consider.

I write a lot of court reports for addicts; believe me they are not get out of jail free cards.

I think the other person is saying that your reports are basically used to get a lighter sentence, used by solicitors/barristers to assist their clients.

I've seen it myself in court a few years back.... barrister stood up and said his client suffers from alcohol addiction and has been an alcoholic for in excess of 20yrs ..... little girl sitting next to the defendant turns to her and says "but mammy, you dont drink" ...only that I was within earshot myself that I'm willing to repeat it (I cant for the life of me remember what case it was but it was in ct3 in the round hall of the four courts - so it was not a circuit criminal court matter)

Solicitors often get clients bumped up or even put onto the waiting list for rehabilitation clinics so they can say that their client is making efforts and is on a waiting list, I know there are a number of people annoyed that some solicitors get their clients fast-tracked on FAS courses (I'm assuming it still happens) ... just because it would look like they are making efforts to change their lives.

Criminals in this country (in my opinion) have every opportunity afforded to them yet the level of recidivist crime is scary !! ...last week there was a 25yr old woman with 215 (or around that) previous convictions, there was a guy yesterday (if my memory is correct) ...32 previous convictions and he only spent a month in prison !!

As regards this guy - he knowingly defrauded and stole from his employer and by-proxy stole from public coffers (An Post are still a government organisation ...right ??) .... gambling is addictive, yes, online gambling is even more addictive as you do not physically see the money disappear...but it does and unless the government do something about it ...it will continue to happen.

I also agree with another previous comment about the internal procedures of An-Post should be investigated .... when that level of money can go missing without an internal audit or investigation....something is fundamentally wrong with the procedures.

byronbay2

Slattsy wrote: »

I bet €40k the OP regrets posting this in AH :pac:

I'll take that bet!!!!!

Seriously, I don't regret starting the thread even though I got a lot of replies of the kind I would have expected from AH. I had a certain reaction to reading about the case and wanted to see if others felt the same - I don't take the replies personally at all.

Just in case there is any confusion about the €10 million mentioned: that is turnover, he never (obviously) had €10m in his account. Every bet he made didn't lose so there was a lot of turnover as he gradually worked his way through the €1.75 million to get to zero.

Also, when I said nobody was hurt by his crime, I meant physically. I agree he needs to be punished for what he did but feel that a 4-year sentence is disproportionate based on all the circumstances outlined.

super_furry

I don't think you can take the motives behind the theft into account. He stole €1.75million is the beginning and ending of the story for me.

Thrill

Criminal. Hopefully this wake-up call will force him to get the much needed help he needs.

Odysseus

Corkbah wrote: »

I think the other person is saying that your reports are basically used to get a lighter sentence, used by solicitors/barristers to assist their clients.

I've seen it myself in court a few years back.... barrister stood up and said his client suffers from alcohol addiction and has been an alcoholic for in excess of 20yrs ..... little girl sitting next to the defendant turns to her and says "but mammy, you dont drink" ...only that I was within earshot myself that I'm willing to repeat it (I cant for the life of me remember what case it was but it was in ct3 in the round hall of the four courts - so it was not a circuit criminal court matter)

Solicitors often get clients bumped up or even put onto the waiting list for rehabilitation clinics so they can say that their client is making efforts and is on a waiting list, I know there are a number of people annoyed that some solicitors get their clients fast-tracked on FAS courses (I'm assuming it still happens) ... just because it would look like they are making efforts to change their lives.

Criminals in this country (in my opinion) have every opportunity afforded to them yet the level of recidivist crime is scary !! ...last week there was a 25yr old woman with 215 (or around that) previous convictions, there was a guy yesterday (if my memory is correct) ...32 previous convictions and he only spent a month in prison !!

As regards this guy - he knowingly defrauded and stole from his employer and by-proxy stole from public coffers (An Post are still a government organisation ...right ??) .... gambling is addictive, yes, online gambling is even more addictive as you do not physically see the money disappear...but it does and unless the government do something about it ...it will continue to happen.

I also agree with another previous comment about the internal procedures of An-Post should be investigated .... when that level of money can go missing without an internal audit or investigation....something is fundamentally wrong with the procedures.

Well in that case, if the person was getting treatment the judge should have been asking where are the reports from the treatment providers. In my experience courts are not happy with being told that someone is in treatment, they want written reports detailing that.

I dislike writing courts reports because as far as I'm concerned a persons treament is not for public comsumption.

Now I can't speak for evey treatment unit, but I can't tell you solicitors have not imput in relation to waiting lists for HSE treatment clinics or detox unit. Yes we have one for the whole country.

I disagree about how my reports are used, if the subject gets a lighter sentense it is not because of my report. It is because of the work the person has undertaken to address their situation which is reflected in my report.

I give a report yes, that includes what the person has done, how they have responded to treatment, how they have engaged in treatment. If the do not engage or respond I write that or tell a client that they are better off not getting a report from me.

So a report only reflects any changes or attempts to change that a subject undertakes, that I can objectively stand over. It has never happened to me, but a judge can go what the fcuk is this writing; get him here in front of me to explain this. Hence we are very careful what we write.

Also as some people think we do, we never mention the question of sentensing, that is the judges job, so unless you want to p!ss him off and get a severe sentense for a client, that is left to the judge.

So that mean there is none of this: this subject had a very difficult and traumatic upbringing and should therefore get a suspended jail term.

B.A._Baracus

... and this is another example about how life is not fair.

If i go and rob and shop. I'd get sent down for 14 years or something.

MagicMarker

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

If i go and rob and shop. I'd get sent down for 14 years or something.

I highly doubt that.

Odysseus

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

... and this is another example about how life is not fair.

If i go and rob and shop. I'd get sent down for 14 years or something.

I doubt it, how would you rob the shop? Would you use violence? As that will impact on the charge. If you had a firearm, would you discharge it? This would also change things. See how things can be different.

DazMarz

I work in An Post, and I know what the auditors that come and screen office procedures are like. That they let this happen means that they should all be shown the door, heads should roll in a major way and there should be a complete overhaul in the overseeing of offices. Especially major ones in bigger towns where cash reserves can be massive.

As for him being a victim? No. He's an addict and deserves help, but he is in no way a victim.

Paddy Power are a bookmaker. They take money from gamblers. Do you really think they were going to kill the goose that laid the golden eggs here and stop O'Reilly from betting? He simply would have taken his business to Ladbrokes, William Hill, Victor Chandler, Betfair, Bet365, SkyBet, Toolans, etc. ad nauseum. It would be different if Paddy Power were the only bookies he could have bet with. But the fact of the matter is, that if Paddy Power had called a halt to all of this, O'Reilly would simply have spread his betting across the plethora of other outlets for gaming and gambling that exist. This would have happened regardless of the actions Paddy Power took.

B.A._Baracus

Odysseus wrote: »

I doubt it, how would you rob the shop? Would you use violence? As that will impact on the charge. If you had a firearm, would you discharge it? This would also change things. See how things can be different.

So ... if I were to rob a shop with a hammer. Which is using the threat of violence as you say. But i'd only steal, what €1000 from the tills. I'd get a more hefty sentence that someone who steals 1.75 million?

I know what you are saying. Violence carries more of a sentence. But we're talking 1.75 million here.

So what is it? white collar crime isn't as bad in the eyes of the law?

humbert

There should be a few more sacked over this. Nobody do accounts at the end of the year?

Makes you wonder what else is going on at the hands of more astute thieves in their employ.

Corkbah

humbert wrote: »

There should be a few more sacked over this. Nobody do accounts at the end of the year?

Makes you wonder what else is going on at the hands of more astute thieves in their employ.

I think there was a part in the story ... where during an audit a receipt was taken ...bit of tippex (who uses tippex anymore??) ... receipt was changed from 90Kish to 390Kish .... which was close enough to balance to not notice the missing 300kish amount.

Stheno

Criminal, I do hope he gets treatment for his addiction though

Odysseus

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

So ... if I were to rob a shop with a hammer. Which is using the threat of violence as you say. But i'd only steal, what €1000 from the tills. I'd get a more hefty sentence that someone who steals 1.75 million?

I know what you are saying. Violence carries more of a sentence. But we're talking 1.75 million here.

So what is it? white collar crime isn't as bad in the eyes of the law?

Each case of robbery is so different I don't know what to say. I have some knowledge of the courts through work and stuff but I'm not legally trained.

The use of violence will always carry a more severe charge [in my understanding], by adding the weapon there is another charge on top of the theft, this is how people can rack up loads of convictions, for one event there could be one, two...five, six different charges/convictions.

Boombastic

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

So ... if I were to rob a shop with a hammer. Which is using the threat of violence as you say. But i'd only steal, what €1000 from the tills. I'd get a more hefty sentence that someone who steals 1.75 million?

I know what you are saying. Violence carries more of a sentence. But we're talking 1.75 million here.

So what is it? white collar crime isn't as bad in the eyes of the law?

Do you come from a disadvantaged background? Are you on cough medicine or other drugs?