Sunday Times Poll 18 Nov

COYW

WileyCoyote wrote: »

You are seriously suggesting that there will be no SF members of the next Dail, none?
Much as I despise them even I dont see that happening!

Sorry, I meant government not Dail.

3ndahalfof6 wrote: »

I will just say, you mention the others have bugger all to offer, the main three parties you purpose also have bugger all to offer, they actually seem to be the kings of bugger all to offer,

but as you say the people do not help themselves, while it would be better for a one party rule, the things that are wrong at the moment might have a better chance of being righted (which I don't think will happen no matter who rules) if it is a mishmash, it might keep those with the majority on their toes.

For the record, (dreamland) I would like to see a U.S.E. (United States of Europe), where we are controlled by Brussels. I think this would serve us best.

3ndahalfof6

COYW wrote: »

Sorry, I meant government not Dail.



For the record, (dreamland) I would like to see a U.S.E. (United States of Europe), where we are controlled by Brussels. I think this would serve us best.

I agree, it would just be a case of where we would be positioned in it.

tayto lover

raymon wrote: »

This is a very sad state of affairs for Ireland that any person would vote for the party that bankrupted us and gave away our sovereignty.

I could not vote for a party which still contains members from the last time they were in power. Unless there is a complete change in their membership they won't be getting my vote. As long as one remains then no vote.

the groutch

COYW wrote: »

For the record, (dreamland) I would like to see a U.S.E. (United States of Europe), where we are controlled by Brussels. I think this would serve us best.

at least they would hve the balls to make the so called "hard decisions".

Dob74

the groutch wrote: »

at least they would hve the balls to make the so called "hard decisions".

No they wouldn't.
Can't even make up there minds on the European budget, debt, Greece lleaving the euro etc.
Strong local government ( like most western countries). Directly elected dpp who is answerable to the public. Not the minister.

Nodin

Dirk Gently wrote: »

looks like the FF strategy of "Let's go to the Winchester, have a pint, and wait for this to blow over" is predictably paying dividends.
Disappointed to see them gain ground in Dublin, I was genuinely proud that the capital was FF free.

Horrifying prospect, if you saw him on VB last night.

crusher000

The rise of FF tells us more about how devoid our Country is of political options when it comes down to it. Voters rally back to the old rhetoric as they don't see any strenght or policies that other parties offer. Does this mean that we are a country made up of middle class and anything below this are so dis jointed from our political system that they're not even bothered ?. Out of the list of our parties it is hard to find someone that relates to the real Ireland and what's going on at the moment. Suits and ties that's all we have to vote for. What party does the ordinary working man and woman look to as our representatives and reflect the position we're in at the moment ?

Dirk Gently

Nodin wrote: »

Horrifying prospect, if you saw him on VB last night.

Yeah I saw him. Martin is very well coached in PR and media so I can see him getting a lot of support from people who frankly don't know any better. Vin B hardly landed a glove on him all night. It's scary when you look at FF and the complete lack of talent anywhere in the party, (with the exception of Martin whose talent is PR and spin) yet we're looking at them possibly being back in a coalition government only one term after bankrupting the country and losing our soverignty.

Shea O'Meara

raymon wrote: »

This is a very sad state of affairs for Ireland that any person would vote for the party that bankrupted us and gave away our sovereignty.

One must understand, FFail are not a political party. It is a collection of connected people looking out for each other supported in the main by misguided lackeys who believe they are being patriotic and loyal to their great grandfathers.
Regardless of what they do to the others in this country the 'party' faithful know they look out for the greater, collective No. 1, regardless of the Irish peoples best interest.
The only solution would be for us all to sign up to FFail...but I guess they'd only go form some Original Gangster splinter group

Hidalgo

raymon wrote: »

This is a very sad state of affairs for Ireland that any person would vote for the party that bankrupted us and gave away our sovereignty.

Gave away our sovereignty..

If you want to argue that line, Ireland should never have joined the EEC in the first place, that started the process of transfer of power.

People are p*ssed off because they have less money in their pocket, not because politicians 'gave away our sovereignty' IMO

FFs recent rise highlights that for many, there is little to no alternative.

Mr.Micro

Hidalgo wrote: »

Gave away our sovereignty..

If you want to argue that line, Ireland should never have joined the EEC in the first place, that started the process of transfer of power.

People are p*ssed off because they have less money in their pocket, not because politicians 'gave away our sovereignty' IMO

FFs recent rise highlights that for many, there is little to no alternative.

We joined the EEC out of choice, and have benefitted hugely as a result. Our Sovereignty was given away without the consensus of the people. There is an alternative for those disaffected with FG/Lab, do not support any party just for the sake of it, especially a party that has a proven track record.

Hidalgo

Mr.Micro wrote: »

We joined the EEC out of choice, and have benefitted hugely as a result. Our Sovereignty was given away without the consensus of the people. There is an alternative for those disaffected with FG/Lab, do not support any party just for the sake of it, especially a party that has a proven track record.

People are throwing around this sovereifnty like its 1916 and the GPO.

Was the country really that proud of our economic sovereignty before the current mess??

Whereever economic sovereignty lies, be it Dublin or in the hands of EU masters, IMO there's more important things at stake at the moment like employment, or lack of. Personallu, I'm not overly concerned if jobs in Ireland come from our own politicians or further afield.

raymon

Hidalgo wrote: »

Gave away our sovereignty..

If you want to argue that line, Ireland should never have joined the EEC in the first place, that started the process of transfer of power.

People are p*ssed off because they have less money in their pocket, not because politicians 'gave away our sovereignty' IMO

FFs recent rise highlights that for many, there is little to no alternative.

In my opinion the whole economic mismanagement leading to bankruptcy leading to Fianna Fail giving away our sovereignty was a comprehensive act of treason.

It is all linked .

Terrible to see Michael Martin on Vincent Browne this week pretending that FF were minor players in the savage destruction of our economy.

Mr.Micro

raymon wrote: »

In my opinion the whole economic mismanagement leading to bankruptcy leading to Fianna Fail giving away our sovereignty was a comprehensive act of treason.

It is all linked .

Terrible to see Michael Martin on Vincent Browne this week pretending that FF were minor players in the savage destruction of our economy.

I missed that. Did Browne not enlighten him then? Martin has had his eyes and ears closed for a long time, so if he went with that story of FF being minor players, then a) FF have learned nothing b) are in for another hiding and c) Have nothing new to offer and its the same old party with zero credibility.

The same Browne that championed Mr. Wallace until he refused to come on his show to answer questions re his finances, a big shock to Vinny. I think Browne likes to play devil's advocate and has lost a bit of credibliity IMO.

Death and Taxes

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

One must understand, FFail are not a political party. It is a collection of connected people looking out for each other supported in the main by misguided lackeys who believe they are being patriotic and loyal to their great grandfathers.
Regardless of what they do to the others in this country the 'party' faithful know they look out for the greater, collective No. 1, regardless of the Irish peoples best interest.
The only solution would be for us all to sign up to FFail...but I guess they'd only go form some Original Gangster splinter group

No different than FG or Labour then, look at the amount of Judicial and other appointments made to their friends in the last 18 months. Look at the FG slavering to Denis O'Brien.
Cant stand FF but hate hypocrisy and low standards wherever the reside, and right now thats in FG and Lab.

raymon

Mr.Micro wrote: »

I missed that. Did Browne not enlighten him then? Martin has had his eyes and ears closed for a long time, so if he went with that story of FF being minor players, then a) FF have learned nothing b) are in for another hiding and c) Have nothing new to offer and its the same old party with zero credibility.

The same Browne that championed Mr. Wallace until he refused to come on his show to answer questions re his finances, a big shock to Vinny. I think Browne likes to play devil's advocate and has lost a bit of credibliity IMO.

Sorry you missed it . But VB was disappointingly soft on him.

Vinnie did try to enlighten him by stating that Fianna Fail caused the collapse of our economy, , denied by Martin.

He also reminded Martin that Fianna Fail has been the most corrupt party . Again Martin denied this .

Vincent Browne let him get away with it in the end.

I would love to interview Martin with a lie detector strapped to him.

Judgement Day

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ih9m0WvAwFo

Mr.Micro

raymon wrote: »

Sorry you missed it . But VB was disappointingly soft on him.

Vinnie did try to enlighten him by stating that Fianna Fail caused the collapse of our economy, , denied by Martin.

He also reminded Martin that Fianna Fail has been the most corrupt party . Again Martin denied this .

Vincent Browne let him get away with it in the end.

I would love to interview Martin with a lie detector strapped to him.

As I posted earlier, FF have clearly learned nothing. It also goes to prove that all the posters who have posted over the last year that FF have not changed, appear to be correct ..... and Martin is not the man then to modernize FF?

eigrod

Hidalgo wrote: »

People are throwing around this sovereifnty like its 1916 and the GPO.

Was the country really that proud of our economic sovereignty before the current mess??

Whereever economic sovereignty lies, be it Dublin or in the hands of EU masters, IMO there's more important things at stake at the moment like employment, or lack of. Personallu, I'm not overly concerned if jobs in Ireland come from our own politicians or further afield.

Fianna Fáil's record on job creation was large scale public sector recruitment on a scattergun basis and policies to create thousands of jobs in the building industry. That ended well, didn't it ?

Can't say I ever considered myself as "being proud of our economic sovereignty", but I can say I was never proud of Charlie Haughey, Pee Flynn, Denis Foley, Ray Burke, Liam Lawlor, Beverley Flynn, Bertie Ahern, the Galway Tent, Tribunals, Charvet shirts etc etc. They were rife with criminals, and that's without even considering their policies that ultimately drove us over the cliff.

And I'm not having that the Timmy Dooleys and Billy Kellehers of this world have suddenly, overnight, been cleansed of the ethos that was engrained right through FF.

It will be (another) sad day for this country if FF recover.

raymon

This one is worth watching (3:40)

Fianna fail should stop showing up at rallies .

They caused the mess

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LaQRijv4-U&feature=plcp