Calls for a tougher Budget

mkdon05

I read this morning that there are calls for a tougher budget as growth figures have been downcasted. So what these morons think, is that, our economy is not growing as predicted, so lets take more money out of the peoples pocket to fix it.

We could increase the higher rate of tax (to 46%) and decrease the lower rate (to 15%). My take on this, is that people on the higher rate would be on at least €32800 and are likely to have some disposable income (I understand this may not apply in all cases) but people on the lower rate would in turn then have some disposable income that in all likelyhood be spent in the local economy. (Im assuming that there are more people paying tax at the standard rate than the higher rate these days, so tax intake would be down this year but if the economy got a boost this would be offset by revenue generated from businesses in there tax returns.)

Seedy Arling

Zzzzzzzzzzzzz

sfwcork

I take it you earn under 32800 then?

Where To

I'm not a mentalist but I can deduct that the OP isn't in the higher tax band.

R0ot

To be perfectly honest we do need a tougher budget. Most of the time we skirt around the major cash cows, but first we need to actually cut some of the expenditure accounts of politicians/public servants that are ancient and serve no purpose anymore.


I would love to see the government step in and go *yoink* to all the Oil and Gas fields when they are developed, or in some other legal way like increasing the taxes the firms pay.

mkdon05

What I earn is irrelevant.

OldNotWIse

Why dont we just hand out gold bars to all those on "low incomes" and have public floggings of those with the cheek to earn more than the industrial average?

A bit extreme, I know but I'm soooooo tired of this resentment towards high earners. (btw I am not a high earner...yet!! lol):)

TwoShedsJackson

Are people on the higher rate not spending their money in the local economy then?

Red_Wake

Cuts all sides is all I ask for.

R0ot

mkdon05 wrote: »

What I earn is irrelevant.

It's pretty relevant to the topic mate.

sfwcork

Can somebody open a book on whether OP earns less than 32800?

Im betting 1/3 Yes

7/4 No

Tabnabs

R0ot wrote: »

I would love to see the government step in and go *yoink* to all the Oil and Gas fields when they are developed, or in some other legal way like increasing the taxes the firms pay.

Post of the day IMHO :pac:

Wacker The Attacker

g'wan the tougher budget

Where To

mkdon05 wrote: »

What I earn is irrelevant.

It is very very very very relevant. So relevant, in fact, that is the most relevant point in the thread.

SEPT 23 1989

Yes lets take more money out of the real economy

that will lead to more growth won't it:rolleyes:

R0ot

Tabnabs wrote: »

Post of the day IMHO :pac:

heh, yeah I do wish we'd just go the way of Norway with regards to this stuff.... but oh well.

StephenHendry

mkdon05 wrote: »

I read this morning that there are calls for a tougher budget as growth figures have been downcasted. So what these morons think, is that, our economy is not growing as predicted, so lets take more money out of the peoples pocket to fix it.

We could increase the higher rate of tax (to 46%) and decrease the lower rate (to 15%). My take on this, is that people on the higher rate would be on at least €32800 and are likely to have some disposable income (I understand this may not apply in all cases) but people on the lower rate would in turn then have some disposable income that in all likelyhood be spent in the local economy. (Im assuming that there are more people paying tax at the standard rate than the higher rate these days, so tax intake would be down this year but if the economy got a boost this would be offset by revenue generated from businesses in there tax returns.)

we need three tax bands (for low, middle and high incomes) which no government has the balls to introduce imo, i earn circa 40k so i would not be happy with paying 46% tax , anyway i have very little disposable income left over most times as it is

mkdon05

TwoShedsJackson wrote: »

Are people on the higher rate not spending their money in the local economy then?

Yes they are
If you read my full post you will see that I am saying that there are more people on the lower rate and this would free up more money for the local economy. People on the higher rate are still going to be able to contribute to the local economy. Now we have both sets spending some money in suffering businesses.
Its about trying to grow the economy organically.

(For anyone saying I have something against high earners, I pay tax at the higher rate myself. Its not all about me though, Its about fixing our country.
All too often its a case of 'Im alright Jack so F**K you)

Where To

mkdon05 wrote: »

Yes they are
If you read my full post you will see that I am saying that there are more people on the lower rate and this would free up more money for the local economy. People on the higher rate are still going to be able to contribute to the local economy. Now we have both sets spending some money in suffering businesses.
Its about trying to grow the economy organically.

(For anyone saying I have something against high earners, I pay tax at the higher rate myself. Its not all about me though, Its about fixing our country.
All too often its a case of 'Im alright Jack so F**K you)

There's nothing stopping you paying more tax if you want.

awec

mkdon05 wrote: »

I read this morning that there are calls for a tougher budget as growth figures have been downcasted. So what these morons think, is that, our economy is not growing as predicted, so lets take more money out of the peoples pocket to fix it.

We could increase the higher rate of tax (to 46%) and decrease the lower rate (to 15%). My take on this, is that people on the higher rate would be on at least €32800 and are likely to have some disposable income (I understand this may not apply in all cases) but people on the lower rate would in turn then have some disposable income that in all likelyhood be spent in the local economy. (Im assuming that there are more people paying tax at the standard rate than the higher rate these days, so tax intake would be down this year but if the economy got a boost this would be offset by revenue generated from businesses in there tax returns.)

:pac:

15%, away and take your head for a sh!te.

How about we lower the higher band and let the people who earn more money spend more money?

It's the average / mid range earners who are shafted by the current system. Not the low earners or the super rich.

franktheplank

I know it's been covered before but they really gotta start tackling the public service. I know there's some lower paid roles but in general public service salaries are ludicrous in this country.

This government has cosied up to the public service in the same way the last crowd did to the property developers and bankers. Not giving a ****e what state it leaves the country in so long as it keeps them in power.

Sure, ul have people on saying they took a five or ten percent cut. Big whoopie. Private sectors earnings have plummeted in the same time. I was listening to a radio show a few months back and they were on about lecturers salaries in this country and yes there huge but when i did a google search, college librarians are on the same rates 130k per year or so for a librarian!? Wtf?

And then we're paying ex-public servants huge pensions and in some cases paying them off early so they stop working. What a scam.

Tazz T

All we hear is cut, cut, cut. We have fragile recovery with growth forecast. Enough cutting. How about generating generating cash? Create employment by building thousands of wave generators round the coast, become energy self-sufficient and sell off the surplus to the brits.

Only that's too intelligent for the teachers, farmers and publicans we have in government.

Anyone

mkdon05 wrote: »

What I earn is irrelevant.

Its relevant if you want anybody to take your post with any seriousness.

kraggy

1. Dole should be cut drastically but gradually. I.e 10 euro per week now. Then 5 euro per week in 3 months and then 5 euro per week in 6 months.

2. The savings should be used to decrease taxes and levies that people on lower incomes pay to increase the gap between minimum wage and the top level of the dole.

3. People on the dole more than 6 years should have their dole reduced more severely. There are about 150,000 of them. They didn't work during the period of "full employment" because they didn't want to or because they had a job off the books and used the dole as an extra income.

The above wouldn't take any money out of the economy. It would however make the prospect of work more enticing.

Spiritual

For a country that is broke we sure seem to be able to piss money away.

mkdon05

Anyone wrote: »

Its relevant if you want anybody to take your post with any seriousness.

And answered 10 minutes ago.

franktheplank

There should be a descending scale of cuts in public service wages, starting at 70-80% for some of the highest earners.

Of course that won't happen with the shower we have in power now, we'll just keep building more and more and more debt. Far more dept know on government spending than even the bank bailout. We're being scammed all over again.

Anyone

What we should do is import 10,000 tonnes of sand from Iraq. We then place the sand somewhere and dig for oil.

dvpower

mkdon05 wrote: »

What I earn is irrelevant.

That little?

We don't need more taxes, we need less spending on pure sh!te

sfwcork

So just to help me grasp this

You think the way forward is just to flog the high earners.Aybody earning over 33k because they have more reddies?

Spiritual

These calls for a tougher budget are just smoke and mirrors so that when the actual budget is announced you won't feel like you have been hit as hard as you could have been.

Where To

bluewolf wrote: »

We don't need more taxes, we need less spending on pure sh!te

Not true!

Pure sh!te is a magnificent and versatile resource. . .

Drivel on the other hand. . .

dvpower

Tazz T wrote: »

Create employment by building thousands of wave generators round the coast, become energy self-sufficient and sell off the surplus to the brits.

Who will pay for this investment - and what's currently stopping them from making the investment?

CruelCoin

mkdon05 wrote: »

What I earn is irrelevant.

Not really, you show obvious bias, hence relevant.

mkdon05

dvpower wrote: »

That little?

How much do you earn and in what sector?

Spiritual

dvpower wrote: »

Who will pay for this investment - and what's currently stopping them from making the investment?

They are waiting on a decision from the Credit Union about the loan. Angela and Enda have a joint account.

mkdon05

sfwcork wrote: »

So just to help me grasp this

You think the way forward is just to flog the high earners.Aybody earning over 33k because they have more reddies?

Yes

Red_Wake

Anyone wrote: »

What we should do is import 10,000 tonnes of sand from Iraq. We then place the sand somewhere and dig for oil.

More intelligent than most of the suggestions in this thread.

dvpower

mkdon05 wrote: »

How much do you earn and in what sector?

Why do you ask?

CruelCoin

mkdon05 wrote: »

I read this morning that there are calls for a tougher budget as growth figures have been downcasted. So what these morons think, is that, our economy is not growing as predicted, so lets take more money out of the peoples pocket to fix it.

We could increase the higher rate of tax (to 46%) and decrease the lower rate (to 15%). My take on this, is that people on the higher rate would be on at least €32800 and are likely to have some disposable income (I understand this may not apply in all cases) but people on the lower rate would in turn then have some disposable income that in all likelyhood be spent in the local economy. (Im assuming that there are more people paying tax at the standard rate than the higher rate these days, so tax intake would be down this year but if the economy got a boost this would be offset by revenue generated from businesses in there tax returns.)

A tougher budget has nothing to do with trying to fix the economy. It is all about balancing the budget.

It is not in the nature of the lower paid to be spendthrift when they have a short term windfall. It gets squirreled away for the next rainy day.

We have a deficit NOW. An unlikely boost in next years returns helps us now in what way exactly?

mkdon05

dvpower wrote: »

Why do you ask?

Im curious.

Spiritual

mkdon05 wrote: »

Yes

I hope you aren't an accountant, economist or even working on a till.

The premise of your proposal is sound in theory as long as everyone earning 33K is living in a bush and can sustain life by just breathing.

dvpower

mkdon05 wrote: »

Im curious.

Mind your own business so.

CruelCoin

mkdon05 wrote: »

Yes they are
If you read my full post you will see that I am saying that there are more people on the lower rate and this would free up more money for the local economy. People on the higher rate are still going to be able to contribute to the local economy. Now we have both sets spending some money in suffering businesses.

You would see us reduce the income of the wealthy to increase the income of the poor?

http://www.shmoop.com/images/economics/taxes/5-price-vs-quantity-graph.png

Mathmathical proof such a system causes a loss to the economy.

Thanks for playing.

sfwcork

so are high earners not already being flleced?

paying excess fuel costs,car tax,services overpriced,products overpriced

so they just have money to throw away "For the craic" or for the cause

do you live in the banana reublic?

donegal_road

so long as they keep paying the Anglo executives, thats the main thing

CruelCoin

Tazz T wrote: »

All we hear is cut, cut, cut. We have fragile recovery with growth forecast. Enough cutting. How about generating generating cash? Create employment by building thousands of wave generators round the coast, become energy self-sufficient and sell off the surplus to the brits.

Only that's too intelligent for the teachers, farmers and publicans we have in government.

Have you any idea how many decades it would take for those to pay off? Or how about the cork sized island of those things we'd need to make enough energy to be self sufficient?
Or maybe the ma-hoos-ive upfront cost to doing so, when we can afford bugger all else?

UCDVet

To be perfectly honest - I hope they do raise income taxes. Not because it's best for the country, but because it would make my life easier.

mkdon05

CruelCoin wrote: »

A tougher budget has nothing to do with trying to fix the economy. It is all about balancing the budget.

It is not in the nature of the lower paid to be spendthrift when they have a short term windfall. It gets squirreled away for the next rainy day.

We have a deficit NOW. An unlikely boost in next years returns helps us now in what way exactly?

Do you think the budget deficit has to be corrected this year? Its a process over the next few years.

You have to fix the economy to be able to balance the budget. In the current scenario balancing the economy is never going to happen because if you squeez the money out of the economy, there will be a need for tougher budgets year on year.

Put initiatives in place to grow the economy, and the balancing of the budget becomes an easier task.

UCDVet

Also - is it really fair to call anyone over 33k or whatever it is a 'high earner'?

Maybe it depends where you live, but if you're making 33k in Dublin - you'd probably feel like money was tight.