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London granny killed by pet dogs. Family agonizing whether to put them down or not

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    #32
    seven_eleven
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,558 ✭✭✭seven_eleven


    opinion guy wrote: »
    she died from blood loss due to her wounds according to the post-mortem

    Which brought on cardiac arrest. I suppose it boils down how you want to define "heart attack" which lead to the cardiac arrest.


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    #33
    Emeraldy Pebbles
    Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭Emeraldy Pebbles


    opinion guy wrote: »
    I think the facts that she was crying for help whilst being attacked and the reports that she died from bleeding from her wounds kind of answer these questions. No ?

    Honestly - do you people even read links ? I seriously doubt she was crying for help after she died anyhow. Unless .....did she live next door to a necromancer ??

    Yes, I can read links, I was addressing Irishchick's point.


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    #34
    Emeraldy Pebbles
    Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭Emeraldy Pebbles


    seamus wrote: »
    Pathologists can produce an educated opinion. They can and do frequently get it wrong.

    Of course they can get it wrong. But seeing as their opinion is educated, they'd more likely get it right. They can never be 100% sure, that would be impossible.


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    #35
    Heroditas
    Registered Users Posts: 9,455 ✭✭✭Heroditas


    At least it wasn't her granddaughter's toddler who was savaged.


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    #36
    IvySlayer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,187 ✭✭✭✭IvySlayer


    There was a case in America where an elderly woman was found dead and had bite marks all over her body from her pet Rottweiler. The dog was destroyed but the autopsy revealed she suffered a stroke and died and her dog was trying to drag her outside.

    It's still is not clear what happened here though. Imagine coming into a house and 5 dogs greeting you!! One snaps and all hell breaks lose. It could have been food aggression, one dog nipped and she died due to a heart attack, I don't think it is as clear cut as 5 dogs just mauled someone.


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    #37
    MatthewWC
    Registered Users Posts: 14 ✭MatthewWC


    If the dogs attacked, the have to go, if they killed her then the authorities will make the decision for them by destruction

    RIP


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    #38
    Nulty
    Registered Users Posts: 7,838 ✭✭✭Nulty


    Irishchick wrote: »
    T hats a complete myth.

    Everyone is jumping to conclusions when we dont really know what happened. She could have had a heart problem and collapsed. We don't know if the injuries occurred before or after death.

    I've also read articles on the case that say the dogs were being mistreated but No one knows if that's true either.

    You realise that is what the internet is all about? The internet wouldn't exist if no one did that.


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    #39
    Nulty
    Registered Users Posts: 7,838 ✭✭✭Nulty


    Gongoozler wrote: »
    These threads in AH always go the same way. Don't know why anybody would bother posting a thread on it, it's all going to be put the dogs down etc etc.

    She died of a heart attack, read the story.

    Maybe she died of a heart attack because she was being attacked by two huge dogs?


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    #40
    BrokenArrows
    Registered Users Posts: 7,500 ✭✭✭BrokenArrows


    Only if they actually attacked. As in they bit and tore flesh.

    Not just knocked over and licked and she happened to panic and have a heart attack.


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    #41
    Da Shins Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,048 ✭✭✭Da Shins Kelly


    Do the dogs have a history of aggression? Was it a pack mentality thing? Maybe they need to be separated from each other and put in different homes (if anyone's willing to take them).


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    #42
    opinion guy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,001 ✭✭✭✭opinion guy


    Emeraldy Pebbles wrote: »
    Yes, I can read links, I was addressing Irishchick's point.

    Sorry wasn't really directed at you it was just part of the relevant chat.
    BrokenArrows wrote: »
    Only if they actually attacked. As in they bit and tore flesh.

    Not just knocked over and licked and she happened to panic and have a heart attack.
    Nulty wrote: »
    Maybe she died of a heart attack because she was being attacked by two huge dogs?

    We've just been discussing this on the previous page. Christ read the thread. Read the links. She died of shock brought on by blood loss from her bite wounds according to the post morten as reported by the daily fail.


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    #43
    woodoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,219 ✭✭✭woodoo


    opinion guy wrote: »
    S
    We've just been discussing this on the previous page. Christ read the thread. Read the links. She died of shock brought on by blood loss from her bite wounds according to the post morten as reported by the daily fail.

    So she was attacked quite badly then. The dogs have to go.


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    #44
    Zer0
    Site Banned Posts: 71 ✭✭Zer0


    Anything could of happened. This particular breed of dog are well known fighting dogs. The article states that she poor woman died of a heart attack after being mauled by the animals. It doesn't mean they greeted her it means they mauled her, tore flesh whatever. If it is the case that these animals took this womans life then I should believe that the grand daughter must cast her emotional ties towards the animals aside and and for a second think of her emotional ties she had towards the poor relative that died!

    When these things happen whos to say it won't happen again. Sure you can train an animal etc, but anything could've caused it. Maybe they were hungry, bored, mistreated or even a fit of springer rage. I've no idea, this isn't just the case of the stray dog down the road that bit a poor kid. It's the case of five huge dogs who posess fighting spirits in their genetic make up that mauled the womans great grand mother to death. Jesus, is it not a bit of a no brainer at the end of the day? Some peoples lack of common sense still suprises me to this day...


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    #45
    dodderangler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,204 ✭✭✭dodderangler


    . What's a granny doing feedin 5 dogs two species known for attackin people


    Puttin the dogs down is not the answer someone will take them dogs and someone with experience with these dogs
    If you buy a dog with a reputation for attacks and not have any knowledge then your own fault if you get bitten or attacked
    If you buy let's say a snake and a species that are aggressive don't moan bout it if your attacked
    I've an Akita and knew what they were like before buying mine
    Done all my readin up on them before gettin it


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    #46
    DEFTLEFTHAND
    Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    Dogs's are tricky, some people swear on the wire method but I wouldn't like to see the animal struggle even if it is quick. A bullet down the right side ear from close range would probably the best treatment for those dogs mentioned in the OP.


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    #47
    RoverZT
    Registered Users Posts: 362 ✭✭RoverZT


    Owning multiple dogs over a certain size should require a license, like a gun license.

    It should be very very difficult to get permission to have 3,4,5 huge dogs.

    They are weapons in the wrongs hands.

    Very few people require 5 huge dogs.

    Yet it's common.

    I don't blame the dogs for killing that woman, I blame the law.


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    #48
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    eth0 wrote: »
    There just isn't any need to put them down unless there is nobody who can deal with them at all.

    The local stray cat would eat you as well if he was bigger. Thats just the way things are.

    I feed my stray cats, throw them scraps, even buy food for them.

    When I sit down for my dinner the cats just look at me through the window saying what the feck are you eating my dinner for? Excuse me, you humans are an inconvenience in life.

    Dogs are dumb, but loyal and trusting, they'll sit watching you eat your dinner, waiting for theirs. Always eat first, then feed the dog, they know their position.

    I still like cats but dogs win paws down.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #49
    Plazaman
    Registered Users Posts: 3,012 ✭✭✭Plazaman


    Personally I would put down the dogs. They killed me Ma ffs, every future "woof" would sound like a taunting "yum" in my ears.


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    #50
    caste_in_exile
    Closed Accounts Posts: 135 ✭✭caste_in_exile


    The attack may well have had some foundations in a gang mentality. The more/the dumber, who'd have thought you see this in youths now too; with dogs curiously imbued in their popular culture


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    #51
    blacklilly
    Registered Users Posts: 2,687 ✭✭✭blacklilly


    I'm actually shocked at the amount of posters who are against putting the dogs down and I can't help but think that if these dogs had killed a small child it would be a different story. Maybe you value the lives of the elderly less.
    Also these dogs are huge, plenty of muscle power and aggressive breeding, they should absolutely be put down. I value the life of a human far above that of an animal and I believe the majority would agree.
    I'm 100% against animal crulity but if a dog bites a human (for no reason) then the dog must be put down.


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    #52
    corktina
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    generally I hate other peoples dogs, so I'd say snuff them and all the others...I love our doggies though....


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    #53
    Wibbs
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,112 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    dodderangler wrote: »
    . What's a granny doing feedin 5 dogs two species known for attackin people
    What "species"? As the article says they're not on the dangerous dogs list. Well to be fair the list is daft anyway, both here and in the UK.

    It's odd they turned on her though. Bad breeding(very common) the "pack mentality" bit? I dunno, even wolves will very rarely kill one of their own family. Warning bites yea but not full on lethal attacks. IMH I'd reckon bad breeding/temperament issues with one or more of them and they went postal and pressed the attack when they saw her weakened.

    Normally I'm one who is opposed to the blanket cries of "PUT THEM DOWN" when applied to dogs who have bitten people. Some dogs get killed for a one off warning snap after serious provocation. TBH I'm surprised more people aren't killed by dogs. Cats bite people all the time and no one suggests killing them(rightfully). Shít a parrot could have a finger off and horses can be bloody dangerous. However in this case there's no way in hell I'd trust these dogs. It might have been only one of them that pressed the attack, but which one? So better safe than sorry.

    What I find daft about the "authorities" is that the same authorities in the UK will happily put to sleep dogs on the "dangerous list" that have harmed nobody* on suspicion of their breed yet are wringing their hands when dogs have actively attacked and caused the death of someone and seem to be hesitating because they're not on some list? GTFO.


    *unlikely to either. "Fighting dogs" like pitbulls have been bred to be very human safe. They had to be. How else would the fighting dog handlers separate two dogs when the blood was up. German Shepherd and Dobermans also on these lists are also very human/master focused and the former was the go to dog for guide dogs for the blind for years(until their show inbreeding fooked them up).

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



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    #54
    padi89
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,478 ✭✭✭padi89


    Real nice space to be keeping a number of large breeds. The dogs should be put down to take them out of their misery and the owners prosecuted.

    article-2225758-15C7E437000005DC-112_634x440.jpg


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    #55
    coffee_cake
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Politics Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 81,309 CMod ✭✭✭✭coffee_cake


    Treat dogs cruelly. Dogs snap. Blame the species.


    Sorry she is dead. I have no idea about putting them down or otherwise.


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    #56
    zef
    Closed Accounts Posts: 947 ✭✭✭zef


    Heroditas wrote: »
    At least it wasn't her granddaughter's toddler who was savaged.

    A person is a person, whether they are 2 or 82.


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    #57
    StankyStevie
    Registered Users Posts: 34 ✭StankyStevie


    DOGS always get put down in these cases.
    The owner(s) should be sent down.


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    #58
    Emeraldy Pebbles
    Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭Emeraldy Pebbles


    Wibbs wrote: »
    Some dogs get killed for a one off warning snap after serious provocation. TBH I'm surprised more people aren't killed by dogs. Cats bite people all the time and no one suggests killing them(rightfully). Shít a parrot could have a finger off and horses can be bloody dangerous.

    Cat bites are bloody sore but not particularly dangerous, except if infection develops. Cats just bite to get away or to get you away from them. You simply can't compare to dogs.


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