Is 250tf or 76.2m achievable from a 1 joule sniper rifle??

dinnybyrne

T4RGET wrote: »

dinnybyrne wrote: »

personally i dont think id even be able to SEE a bb at 75meters let alone shoot it!

.. a real gun can shoot 400-800 metres for an AR, people can't see that far either or am I missing something?

a real gun has an effect on the T4RGET.Where as with a bb your looking to see when the little 6mm bb drops

thermo

dinnybyrne wrote: »

personally i dont think id even be able to SEE a bb at 75meters let alone shoot it!

i dont shoot at bb's, i shoot at other players................. much easier to see

dinnybyrne wrote: »

a real gun has an effect on the T4RGET.Where as with a bb your looking to see when the little 6mm bb drops

if you are familiar with the aeg you will know how it performs, set your sights and use experience to make adjustments. not everybody has to walk their bb's in to a target.
i generally use black or dark green bb's anyway and they are extremely hard to see after 20m anyways.

dinnybyrne

thermo wrote: »

dinnybyrne wrote: »

personally i dont think id even be able to SEE a bb at 75meters let alone shoot it!

i dont shoot at bb's, i shoot at other players................. much easier to see

dinnybyrne wrote: »

a real gun has an effect on the T4RGET.Where as with a bb your looking to see when the little 6mm bb drops

if you are familiar with the aeg you will know how it performs, set your sights and use experience to make adjustments. not everybody has to walk their bb's in to a target.
i generally use black or dark green bb's anyway and they are extremely hard to see after 20m anyways.

thermo what hop up setup would you use/recommend to get 75 metres?

miske

I seems that the thread about the 75m plus M700 has been closed. Apparently the buyer was making unreasonable requests such as asking the seller to prove the stated 75m plus range!!! And guys please only post if you have a sub joule 75m rifle or aeg and are interested in demoing it. Don't want the thread to degrade into arguement. Cheers

thermo

dinnybyrne wrote: »

thermo what hop up setup would you use/recommend to get 75 metres?

for what gun? the thing with tuning is its trial and error and results that work with one aeg may not be optimum in another.
the above question is on par with asking "whats the best gun"? in order to get a better answer you need to supply more information.
feel free to me me.

LAPUA

I've my current AEG tuned for 130ft (Give or take 10ft due to weather conditions) after painstakingly playing with the hop settings while on holidays in the west of Ireland. I was accurately hitting a man sized target at that range. I was on the aeg, and one friend spotted via binoculars while another stood next to the target and marked off each hit. We tuned each airsoft device lying prone with a very light wind.

We also used a Tokyo Marui L96 with a twist barrel and could almost replicate the shots, although things were a little inconsistent at best and the AEG out performed it. We then set a G&G SCAR and a G&G GR16 Raider Long for the same 130ft range.

Anything further out than 130ft was chaos. The BBs were arcing and accuracy was becoming a huge problem. I could imagine with upgrades you could make 150/160ft accurately but I cannot fathom how anyone would hit 200 ft, let alone the 250ft claims from an AEG, GBB or Spring rifle within Ireland's 1J limit. The internet is a great place for these magical claims, and I still have my AEG(s) set for this 130ft, so I can show anyone if we meet on site. Until someone shows me, in person, a sub 1J AEG/GBB/Springer hitting a target accurately at 250ft I'm not believing it.

The biggest problem with hitting anything at extreme range using the 1J limit is it is very hard to actually notice the hit. We were shooting each other in the back (wearing a t-shirt, not even a tac vest) and you could barely notice the hit. Further back again and the BB would just fall off you.

CaptainPrice

LAPUA wrote: »

I've my current AEG tuned for 130ft (Give or take 10ft due to weather conditions) after painstakingly playing with the hop settings while on holidays in the west of Ireland. I was accurately hitting a man sized target at that range. I was on the aeg, and one friend spotted via binoculars while another stood next to the target and marked off each hit. We tuned each airsoft device lying prone with a very light wind.

We also used a Tokyo Marui L96 with a twist barrel and could almost replicate the shots, although things were a little inconsistent at best and the AEG out performed it. We then set a G&G SCAR and a G&G GR16 Raider Long for the same 130ft range.

Anything further out than 130ft was chaos. The BBs were arcing and accuracy was becoming a huge problem. I could imagine with upgrades you could make 150/160ft accurately but I cannot fathom how anyone would hit 200 ft, let alone the 250ft claims from an AEG, GBB or Spring rifle within Ireland's 1J limit. The internet is a great place for these magical claims, and I still have my AEG(s) set for this 130ft, so I can show anyone if we meet on site. Until someone shows me, in person, a sub 1J AEG/GBB/Springer hitting a target accurately at 250ft I'm not believing it.

The biggest problem with hitting anything at extreme range using the 1J limit is it is very hard to actually notice the hit. We were shooting each other in the back (wearing a t-shirt, not even a tac vest) and you could barely notice the hit. Further back again and the BB would just fall off you.

dinnybyrne

thermo wrote: »

dinnybyrne wrote: »

thermo what hop up setup would you use/recommend to get 75 metres?

for what gun? the thing with tuning is its trial and error and results that work with one aeg may not be optimum in another.
the above question is on par with asking "whats the best gun"? in order to get a better answer you need to supply more information.
feel free to me me.

cheers thermo

dinnybyrne

LAPUA wrote: »

I've my current AEG tuned for 130ft (Give or take 10ft due to weather conditions) after painstakingly playing with the hop settings while on holidays in the west of Ireland. I was accurately hitting a man sized target at that range. I was on the aeg, and one friend spotted via binoculars while another stood next to the target and marked off each hit. We tuned each airsoft device lying prone with a very light wind.

We also used a Tokyo Marui L96 with a twist barrel and could almost replicate the shots, although things were a little inconsistent at best and the AEG out performed it. We then set a G&G SCAR and a G&G GR16 Raider Long for the same 130ft range.

Anything further out than 130ft was chaos. The BBs were arcing and accuracy was becoming a huge problem. I could imagine with upgrades you could make 150/160ft accurately but I cannot fathom how anyone would hit 200 ft, let alone the 250ft claims from an AEG, GBB or Spring rifle within Ireland's 1J limit. The internet is a great place for these magical claims, and I still have my AEG(s) set for this 130ft, so I can show anyone if we meet on site. Until someone shows me, in person, a sub 1J AEG/GBB/Springer hitting a target accurately at 250ft I'm not believing it.

The biggest problem with hitting anything at extreme range using the 1J limit is it is very hard to actually notice the hit. We were shooting each other in the back (wearing a t-shirt, not even a tac vest) and you could barely notice the hit. Further back again and the BB would just fall off you.

what weight bbs did you use?

LAPUA

0.20g King Arms 6mm BBs bought from Hobby Airsofter in Rathcoole.

dinnybyrne

LAPUA wrote: »

0.20g King Arms 6mm BBs bought from Hobby Airsofter in Rathcoole.

cheers for the detailed description

CaptainPrice

dinnybyrne wrote: »

cheers for the detailed description

Not to be confused with those "Patriot Low Velocity Spherical Missile" (PLVSM) BBs that lock onto their targets up to and over 250 feet away.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvQJh-nS9TI

jayod30

CaptainPrice wrote: »

Not to be confused with those "Patriot Low Velocity Spherical Missile" (PLVSM) BBs that lock onto their targets up to and over 250 feet away.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvQJh-nS9TI

Now that's the best comment I've seen here so far lol:D

sliabh

LAPUA wrote: »

I've my current AEG tuned for 130ft (Give or take 10ft due to weather conditions) after painstakingly playing with the hop settings while on holidays in the west of Ireland. I was accurately hitting a man sized target at that range. I was on the aeg, and one friend spotted via binoculars while another stood next to the target and marked off each hit. We tuned each airsoft device lying prone with a very light wind.

Em, that isn't even 40m. I can hit a half man size target consistently with my stock JG G36K at that distance. I have wooden target silhouettes and can hear the bbs strike.

With just a red dot I could get first shot hits at 50m 3 out of 5 times with the same G36, and I could manage at least one hit from a short 5-8 BB burst at 60m.

I won't make any comment on the OPs 75m, but I would say that the flight time for such a shot is probably 2-3 seconds. Which means that even if your gun is tuned to manage that distance, and you can allow for wind, hitting anything other than a stationary target will be quite a feat of skill.

LAPUA

Firstly, It is 39.6m, which rounded up is 40m. Secondly, I'm sorry you have to use a G36c.

In regards to my 40m shooting, that was me hitting with every shot, not the 60% chance on hitting the target you displayed with your AEG at a 10m increase. When I shoot, I want to know I'm going to hit the target (assuming I'm aiming correctly) with the first BB, not have to hope that 60% swings in my favour. The only factor in hitting the target should be me, not the AEG hop combo, in my opinion.

I imagine I could have gone further, but accurately hitting my target was what mattered to me, and so far I've yet to really engage anyone at 40+m in anyway, so it seems to be an ideal spot for my AEG.

As for the BBs striking the wooden target, of course they'll make a sound buddy- It's plastic on wood/paper! The impact is not felt distinctly though- Especially if the user is wearing any form of heavy clothing which is often the case in the Sunday skirmish and winters gaming. Having been shot in the back at 40m, I can safely say it would be hit and miss whether you'd feel the hit in order to take it. Either that, or I'm just an absolute tank.

CaptainPrice

Don't get me wrong here, as a guy who likes airsoft sniping more than hipsters love cardigans, I would like nothing more than to have snipers actually be able to attain this range- whatever about who's AEGs range penis is longer (though, I'll throw in that my SCAR is an absolute stallion).
The longest shot I've made is probably in fingal airsoft up at the tree stump. I hit a kid down beside the far tower twice or three times over the attack on the base. Now, the fecker didnt take it making this fact moot and showing me yet again another deficiency in playing sniper. I mustn't have accounted for his Juggernaut perk or something. And I wasn't imagining it because a guy had a go of my rifle and got me down at roughly the same place. And I did know I was hit.
that was a TM L96 springer at one joule. And I should add that I was up a hill by quite a bit to help with distance of the shot.
I have had honest and stand up players say to me they will stay put for a few seconds and wait for a second to fly near/past or overhead again and then take it if they think they are shot. But what is the point if you can be up there with the rest of your team helping out, instead of depending on the enemy to be like the princess and the pea to facilitate you deciding on sniping and being less useful to objectives as a direct result of that decision?
What I'm trying to get at here is that there is no way a 1 Joule piece can hurl a bb with any controllable accuracy to 250 feet. And even if it could, there's no point. With power drop off, even those who bloody know they are hit can play the didn't feel it card. And those problems exist at all long ish ranges.

sliabh

LAPUA wrote: »

Firstly, It is 39.6m, which rounded up is 40m. Secondly, I'm sorry you have to use a G36c.

I do believe I said "not even 40m" and that it's a G36K. Not that I use it as my primary AEG, I have 2 VFCs instead.

But my point is that even with a stock mid/low-end gun you should be able to get first shot hits at 40m.

Leftyflip

Here comes the pettiness train!!

LAPUA

Leftyflip wrote: »

Here comes the pettiness train!!

miske

Mods close this please. Is 250ft accuracy achievable from a subjoule airsoft AEG or Rifle?? Of course it is!!! Can anyone show me in person such a airsoft device??? No!! This answers my question.

CaptainPrice

miske wrote: »

Mods close this please. Is 250ft accuracy achievable from a subjoule airsoft AEG or Rifle?? Of course it is!!! Can anyone show me in person such a airsoft device??? No!! This answers my question.

Surely this would only raise more questions.

Such as:

Where are these devices?
Why haven't people been hit out at that range?
Have I been hit without knowing due to power drop off?
Did/Would I even feel a hit at the range to begin with? Have I been cheating?
How does eat food? What am the sky?
Why has everybody claiming this range sold off the pieces that can shoot them?
Why has everybody on the adverts claiming 250 feet range on 1J airsoft guns been cancelling meet up tests?
Why will nobody actually set up and shoot at the range? Be it on youtube with a chrono present or whatever. If seeing is believing, we have no reason to believe thus far.

Well this mystery is too difficult for me to solve. It looks like we're gonna have to call in the Hardy Boys.

Inari

It's quite simple; maximum range is a very different beast to effective range.

For example, upgrades for maximum range involve larger bore barrels, stronger springs (as there's more air leaking around BB so power will be lower than with a 6.01mm TBB), and softest possible hop up rubbers, using hop up modifications such as Shredders Concave Spacer, or R-Hop (and its derivatives etc). This, plus perfect conditions (such as wind blowing in the right direction) will enable the gun to physically shoot further. Using heavier BB's, over hopping and proper aim will allow your BB's to land physically further. I've hit people well out of range using the wind...it took about 3 minutes of adjusting aim though.

So yes, I would say it is possible but not of any use, as you cannot maintain consistent accuracy at that range. When upgrading for consistency you lower your maximum range in favour of greater effective range.

It's all about knowing what you're doing with upgrades. Personally I'm all about effective range - couldn't care less about maximum

CaptainPrice

Ok. So my original point of it being moot is acceptable then. And the whole point of this thread about wondering if the guy selling the M700 with 250 foot 8/10 hits on mansize target at 1 joule is using an older than dirt tactic to get a sale. Besides, the issue was 250 accuracy in the wording, so I took that as effective range, or getting more than one kill at that range in a skirmish scenario in a time frame that warrants purchasing said rifle, upgrades and bringing it out over another option.

On a practical level, you wouldn't normally spend 3 minutes of a skirmish or thereabouts tuning your hop, taking it off a preset dial just to lob a few bbs at a target and hoping for the best. the same three minutes could run you to your target and back easily.

In my experience for what it's worth, I find the main advantage of a sniper rifle is its low noise level. But that hardly makes it as useful as someone who knows what they are doing with an aeg. Or even a walk on renter that breaks the mould and does what they're supposed to.

But I digress. Surely an effective range is something that translates more or less evenly across 1 joule weapons. Knowing your upgrading will give you an edge over the rest, but only by a few feet realistically.