Deferring Gradmed

Bjarne3000

Hello All.
Just a quick question Englishdoc, what was that thing about the number of people who failed 1st year studies at UI? Any EU students managed to secure bank loans for any bank in Ireland?

Bjarne3000

Hello EngDoc.
In the same situation as you mate. Have you managed to get the loans from UB with English garantees?

EngDoc

boynesider wrote: »

However i have been told that deferrals for GradMed in UCD are extremely hard to get. Can anyone shed some light on this please? Is it even worth my while trying to get one? I think my reason is pretty valid and honest, but I'm sure they've heard it a hundred times before and probably wouldn't bat an eyelid at it.

The 'list' is full I'm afraid. I was told they're allowing twice the normal number to defer this year, i.e four instead of two. When I called up asking about it I was told to just accept the offer and if I need to pull out, let them know before the 29th.

Sorry...

EngDoc

Bjarne3000 wrote: »

Hello EngDoc.
In the same situation as you mate. Have you managed to get the loans from UB with English garantees?

The Eng doesn't actually stand for England/English...Irish guy here.

I was referring to a few posts made by others a while back about a high number of UL guys failing their first year exams, some students having to repeat etc.

Bjarne3000

Ok sorry about that. Thanks for the info.

Lady Jane!

DeadEight wrote: »

The banks lending silly money to people who are not able to repay is the reason for the financial **** hole we're in. Offering €100k loans, unsecured, to students whose earning potential is dropping rapidly is a really bad idea.

I would advocate a complete overhaul of the funding model for third level in Ireland, but I am probably in the minority who say that students should pay a lot more for their education, but be able to borrow from a state funded student loan company. That is not going to happen soon, and for our situation a far simpler approach should be taken.

If GEM students are still being supported by their wealthy parents then they should pay. This is what happens right now, so no change is needed. The remainder, the independent students, should be treated like other undergraduate students, and be eligible for standard government financial supports. This would reduce the financial burden on the student. Once the burden is reduced GEM students can avail of loans from the banks just like normal students.

Its such a bad system. I really feel like we are being punished because those eejits in the banks were literally THROWING money at people a few years back. They messed it all up for themselves and now, 1st off, our tax is bailing them out and then they won't give any loans of any sort to people who, in fairness, are the future of the bloody economy!!!!!! They are guarenteed the money back. I had my parents act as guarantors, they were not good enough. Then my Nana tried. Even though she owns her house outright, no loans or anything, NOPE SHE'S TOO OLD!! My loan was turned down because I had a year out between degrees and yeah ok I overspent, I went out alot, didn't pay all my bills exactly on time but everything got paid in the end. I was earning minimum wage, living away from home with rent, bills, phone etc....... at 23 years of age. I have worked since I was 16 and put myself through my 1st degree. I can't put GEM off till next year and try get my bank account looking better because I have to use my GAMSAT score this year. I quit my job last week and moved out of my house in Dublin. Back with my parents now for what I thought was a week or so until I could move down to UL. Its an absolutely disgraceful situation for the banks to have the power to dictate my future career. I honestly have no clue what to do now. I'm appealing the decision and talking to my local TD. If I can get some sort of structure on my arguement Joe Duffy may be getting a call on Monday. Its double standards because we all know right well that if the man making the loan decisions child wanted this they would get it in a heart beat...................

Wow I'm on a serious rant now, just really really upset and angry. I was always told I could do whatever I wanted with my life, but I don't come from a privliged family with a sliver spoon stuck in my gob so I guess I gotta stay in my "class"...................

lelouchan

Lady Jane! wrote: »

[

Its such a bad system. I really feel like we are being punished because those eejits in the banks were literally THROWING money at people a few years back. They messed it all up for themselves and now, 1st off, our tax is bailing them out and then they won't give any loans of any sort to people who, in fairness, are the future of the bloody economy!!!!!! They are guarenteed the money back. I had my parents act as guarantors, they were not good enough. Then my Nana tried. Even though she owns her house outright, no loans or anything, NOPE SHE'S TOO OLD!! My loan was turned down because I had a year out between degrees and yeah ok I overspent, I went out alot, didn't pay all my bills exactly on time but everything got paid in the end. I was earning minimum wage, living away from home with rent, bills, phone etc....... at 23 years of age. I have worked since I was 16 and put myself through my 1st degree. I can't put GEM off till next year and try get my bank account looking better because I have to use my GAMSAT score this year. I quit my job last week and moved out of my house in Dublin. Back with my parents now for what I thought was a week or so until I could move down to UL. Its an absolutely disgraceful situation for the banks to have the power to dictate my future career. I honestly have no clue what to do now. I'm appealing the decision and talking to my local TD. If I can get some sort of structure on my arguement Joe Duffy may be getting a call on Monday. Its double standards because we all know right well that if the man making the loan decisions child wanted this they would get it in a heart beat...................

Wow I'm on a serious rant now, just really really upset and angry. I was always told I could do whatever I wanted with my life, but I don't come from a privliged family with a sliver spoon stuck in my gob so I guess I gotta stay in my "class"...................

Hey I'm sorry to hear that. The fact is BOI know that 90% of people are applying to them for the GEM loans so they really don't care about saying no because the ball is in their court.
But what about ulster? You said you also applied to them?
I have yet to hear back myself so I'm trying to be optimistic but I don't know.
Maybe also the credit union? They normally like you to have saved with them for a while but you can still get a sizeable amount with a guarantor. Although I suppose it's a bit risky as you wouldn't have all the fees for the 4 years but at least for 2?
It's a crappy system because they have made the course less about merits and more about who can afford it.

bill buchanan

Lady Jane! wrote: »

Its such a bad system. I really feel like we are being punished because those eejits in the banks were literally THROWING money at people a few years back. They messed it all up for themselves and now, 1st off, our tax is bailing them out and then they won't give any loans of any sort to people who, in fairness, are the future of the bloody economy!!!!!! They are guarenteed the money back. I had my parents act as guarantors, they were not good enough. Then my Nana tried. Even though she owns her house outright, no loans or anything, NOPE SHE'S TOO OLD!! My loan was turned down because I had a year out between degrees and yeah ok I overspent, I went out alot, didn't pay all my bills exactly on time but everything got paid in the end. I was earning minimum wage, living away from home with rent, bills, phone etc....... at 23 years of age. I have worked since I was 16 and put myself through my 1st degree. I can't put GEM off till next year and try get my bank account looking better because I have to use my GAMSAT score this year. I quit my job last week and moved out of my house in Dublin. Back with my parents now for what I thought was a week or so until I could move down to UL. Its an absolutely disgraceful situation for the banks to have the power to dictate my future career. I honestly have no clue what to do now. I'm appealing the decision and talking to my local TD. If I can get some sort of structure on my arguement Joe Duffy may be getting a call on Monday. Its double standards because we all know right well that if the man making the loan decisions child wanted this they would get it in a heart beat...................

Wow I'm on a serious rant now, just really really upset and angry. I was always told I could do whatever I wanted with my life, but I don't come from a privliged family with a sliver spoon stuck in my gob so I guess I gotta stay in my "class"...................

I guess their argument is that they have to be sure you can pay it back. if they don't think your parents can pay back a loan like that, then they shoudln't accept them as guarantors. I wouldn't have been able to pay back that kind of loan as a junior doc, and people are defaulting now.

I know there's a bizarre discrepancy between giving it to people in UL and not giving it to others. I think that's unfair. I don't think GEM is sustainable and i feel very sorry for the applicants. But from a purely banking point of view (and I'm far from an expert on this) it just doesn't seem to make sense to give huge loans like these.

paintedlady

Lady Jane! wrote: »

Its such a bad system. I really feel like we are being punished because those eejits in the banks were literally THROWING money at people a few years back. They messed it all up for themselves and now, 1st off, our tax is bailing them out and then they won't give any loans of any sort to people who, in fairness, are the future of the bloody economy!!!!!! They are guarenteed the money back. I had my parents act as guarantors, they were not good enough. Then my Nana tried. Even though she owns her house outright, no loans or anything, NOPE SHE'S TOO OLD!! My loan was turned down because I had a year out between degrees and yeah ok I overspent, I went out alot, didn't pay all my bills exactly on time but everything got paid in the end. I was earning minimum wage, living away from home with rent, bills, phone etc....... at 23 years of age. I have worked since I was 16 and put myself through my 1st degree. I can't put GEM off till next year and try get my bank account looking better because I have to use my GAMSAT score this year. I quit my job last week and moved out of my house in Dublin. Back with my parents now for what I thought was a week or so until I could move down to UL. Its an absolutely disgraceful situation for the banks to have the power to dictate my future career. I honestly have no clue what to do now. I'm appealing the decision and talking to my local TD. If I can get some sort of structure on my arguement Joe Duffy may be getting a call on Monday. Its double standards because we all know right well that if the man making the loan decisions child wanted this they would get it in a heart beat...................

Wow I'm on a serious rant now, just really really upset and angry. I was always told I could do whatever I wanted with my life, but I don't come from a privliged family with a sliver spoon stuck in my gob so I guess I gotta stay in my "class"...................

I may have missed some of this discussion so excuse me if this is a silly question. Why do u need a guarantor if you're going to ul? Ulster bank don't require one I thought..

paintedlady

Sorry I think I understand now, did you get refused because of previously unpaid bills?

Lady Jane!

paintedlady wrote: »

Sorry I think I understand now, did you get refused because of previously unpaid bills?

On 2 occasions in the past 6months my phone bill didn't come out of my account. But it was paid cash in the Post Office everytime............everything was paid.

lelouchan

Lady Jane! wrote: »

paintedlady wrote: »

Sorry I think I understand now, did you get refused because of previously unpaid bills?

On 2 occasions in the past 6months my phone bill didn't come out of my account. But it was paid cash in the Post Office everytime............everything was paid.

If that's the reason you were refused, it mightn't hurt to talk to the manager and explain your situation?

bohemian2010

At the risk of repeating other posters on this forum figured I'd row in with my two cents based on what I see on the ground, I work with, and am good friends with other NCHDs who came through the GEM programs and what I see is not pretty. These are dedicated highly trained professionals who are essentially working to pay back the banks, they started the GEM programs in their mid-late twenties, graduated in their early 30's and are now facing the next decade of their careers/lives living like cash strapped students, not being able to take out car loans, choosing to take posts outside of cities where the large university hospitals are as they can't afford the rent (thus affecting their training) and not even considering taking out mortgages until their 40's
The GEM programmes are being likened to the property bubble of the previous decade, people taking out unsustainable loans for a product that is rapidly decreasing in value ( progressively dwindling salaries), the original idea for GEM was believed to be sustainable as when it was conceived NCHDs were earning multiples of their basic salary through overtime payments,and if this was still the case then the loan repayments would be feasible, unfortunately the times have changed and it is now dawning on people that the concept is not feasible. Already the banks are copping onto this fact,and I beleive its only a matter of time before the universities start closing the programme, I would ask all prospective GEM students who plan on financing their studies themselves to strongly consider whether working as a serf to the banks for the next decade/ not being able to apply for mortgages / not being able to lead a normal life is a just price for the privelege of being an NCHD in Ireland

EngDoc

bohemian2010 wrote: »

At the risk of repeating other posters on this forum figured I'd row in with my two cents based on what I see on the ground, I work with, and am good friends with other NCHDs who came through the GEM programs and what I see is not pretty. These are dedicated highly trained professionals who are essentially working to pay back the banks, they started the GEM programs in their mid-late twenties, graduated in their early 30's and are now facing the next decade of their careers/lives living like cash strapped students, not being able to take out car loans, choosing to take posts outside of cities where the large university hospitals are as they can't afford the rent (thus affecting their training) and not even considering taking out mortgages until their 40's
The GEM programmes are being likened to the property bubble of the previous decade, people taking out unsustainable loans for a product that is rapidly decreasing in value ( progressively dwindling salaries), the original idea for GEM was believed to be sustainable as when it was conceived NCHDs were earning multiples of their basic salary through overtime payments,and if this was still the case then the loan repayments would be feasible, unfortunately the times have changed and it is now dawning on people that the concept is not feasible. Already the banks are copping onto this fact,and I beleive its only a matter of time before the universities start closing the programme, I would ask all prospective GEM students who plan on financing their studies themselves to strongly consider whether working as a serf to the banks for the next decade/ not being able to apply for mortgages / not being able to lead a normal life is a just price for the privelege of being an NCHD in Ireland

Really appreciate your info! There are not many grads who have come through the system, the more information we have about the realities of life on the other side, the better! Do you think any of these NCHD mates of yours who have gone through the GEM system would consider posting their opinion on boards?