Lack of trophies/achievements turn off gamers from games ?

richymcdermott

Fellow psn minis developer talking on the matter

http://ie.ign.com/articles/2012/06/11/does-a-lack-of-trophies-turn-playstation-gamers-off

Anybody who turned off from a game from a lack of trophies/acievements support deserves a smack across the head ...

PseudoFamous

I'd love an option where I could turn that stupid achievement flag off in steam. It always manages to get in the way of my ammocount or something and distract me.

CrazyRabbit

I am not a console owner. I do not require achievements to make me feel like I am good at the games.

Gunmonkey

Seen it far too much in the PS3 community sadly.

For about a year after it was released, there was almost a weekly petition or "player outrage" for trophy support in MGS4. Every time Konami was going to announce something, it was immediately earmarked as trophies for MGS4. Konami announcement for a new game in another series....what about MGS4 trophies?? Konami announces quarterly sales figures.....wheres the MGS4 trophies?? Konami employees seen eating at a restraunt...you can eat at a restraunt with knife & fork which can be made from silver which is a type of PS3 trophy....confirmation of MGS4 trophies??


The worst I saw was when there was a big VC community push to get people to buy Valkyria Chronicles a few months after release due to its initial low sales figures. 9/10 responses I saw online were "Well if it had trophies I would get it/ if they add trophies I might get it". One of the best games this generation (and my favourite from the whole PS3 library) and you wont buy it due to the lack of some f***ing imaginary pixel art and a lines of text



Most recently, kinda related. Friend of mine loved Warhawk but hated the massive grind to get max level and the higher up trophies. So he played the beta for Starhawk and loved it even more. So I found the trophy list a few weeks before it was released and he went "Meh...easy" for almost all of them. But two, "Finish a CTF match with no deaths and highest score" and "Finish a TD match with no deaths and highest score"....he starts ranting about how they are impossible and would "......cost him his Platinum". He didnt buy it after

CastorTroy

I don't have any Platinums on my PS3, yet oddly I don't have sleepless nights and feel my life is incomplete. At least not for that reason.

But trophies, combined with loads of hidden objects, etc that mean your game doesn't display 100% after you finish it, seem to me to be lazy ways of trying to get people to play your game longer than they need to. If they want people to play a game longer, they should make the main game longer.

Temptamperu

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

I am not a console owner. I do not require achievements to make me feel like I am good at the games.

Wow aren't you amazing? may I bask in your self inflated sense of pride perchance?

I dont mind achievements much either way, I only ever get the ones handed to you for playing the game and I never go out of my way to find them.

Captain Chaos

CastorTroy wrote: »

If they want people to play a game longer, they should make the main game longer.

I don't agree with that idea at all. Why put a load of filler levels/missions in a game thats not needed that will most likely take from the overall game experience.

I think trophies and achievements are a greet idea, as they make you do some things in some games that you wouldn't normally do and can add alot of replay value. They can ruin multiplayer games though, there should not be multiplayer chevos of trophies.

They are also a good scam for the industry as some people buy games they normally would not just for them, which is sad imo.

Trophies and achievements can work, if they're used correctly. Look at the likes of the Batman: Arkham series, where you're awarded for being diligent through solving puzzles/riddles or by finding objects, thus making the game longer for those that like going off finding/doing these things. Then there's also Bulletstorm, where you're rewarded for being creative with your kills. Unfortunately, it's getting to the point where the games that are doing it right are overshadowed the ones where they're thrown in just for the sake of having them there.

calex71

Love achievements, would it stop me playing a game if there were none or they were too difficult ??? No and if you don't like them disable the notifications simple as, but not sure if thats possible on stream or ps3? It is on xbox.

Much as I love them what annoys me most is if they are linked to public multiplayer matches, this can dramatically alter how some people play if they are trying to boost them in a public lobby.

2nd most hated are difficulty setting related ones that do not stack for example you play on expert/insane from the outset and you do not get ones for playing on easy / medium / hard :mad:

cloud493

Well when most of the first year of the PS3's back catalogue didn't get patched for it :mad: the only one off the top of my head that did is the first uncharted, and stardust actually.

Sarky

The achievements I like are rewards for getting good at a game. You get that perfect freeflow combo in Arkham city, you deserve a little prize. You kill a Hunter in HL2 with its own flechettes, that takes skill and you should get a little acknowledgement for being able to do it.

But those "collect all 50,000 completely irrelevant objects hidden in obscure corners of the map" achievements can f*ck right off. Alan Wake's coffee flasks, Assassin's Creed's flags, Enslaved's bloody tech orbs and masks, a whole bunch of Riddler trophies from the Batman games. All pointless space fillers. They add nothing at all to the game. The type of person who NEEDS to collect all of those things shouldn't be encouraged.

deathrider

I loves me a good achievement and will work my ass of for it. It may be "artificially" dragging out a game's life-span, but the fact that it's optional makes all the difference. You don't want to give the game another playthrough for an extra few Gs? That's grand. Nodoby's going to twist your arm. However, for me, I'd happily replay a good game. The achievements give me a reason for attempt stuff that I might not normally attempt. Obvious ones like "hard mode" is as good an excuse as any to replay a good game. Sure, if it's good you'd want to replay it anyways, but at least you have a little more to show for it with achievements.

The argument that usually arises about this is that some games cough them up for nothing, therefore they don't really mean jack. This can be through. One of the Simpsons jobs is famous for giving an achievement for pressing start, for example. But achievements are what you make of them. Nothing more, nothing less. I enjoy the challenge of them (I'm currently attempting Dead Space 2 on hardcore mode), and if I've coughed up 50quid for a game, at least this way I may get my full money's worth.

Would a game without achievements turn me off playing it? Feck no! Over the last few months I've clocked up a combined time of 100+ hours between Pokémon White and Pokémon Diamond on DS, and there's still more time to sink into them yet. Not an achievement to be seen, but more enjoyment that I've gotten from many of the games that I've scored 1000Gs from.

johnny_ultimate

Any game that (ahem) 'rewards' pointless collecting should be taken out the back and shot. Arkham Asylum got the balance perfect, but City was so scattered with utterly pointless trophies it actually detracted from the game.

I have no beef with achievements, but only where they're well designed (the delayed notification should be implemented by all games reliant on atmosphere) and they should suit the game in question. Journey needs no trophies, for example, but Sony make it mandatory.

Still, their biggest strength to me is to hint at the secrets the game has to offer, and convince you to seek them out. They can also act as training - Bayonetta's achievements are amongst my favourites, because they force you to learn techniques that help you genuinely improve at the game.

sarumite

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

I am not a console owner. I do not require achievements to make me feel like I am good at the games.

Your second sentence is a non-sequitur. I am a console owner and it says nothing about my requirement or lack thereof for achievements/trophies in games.

Burning Eclipse

Gunmonkey wrote: »

The worst I saw was when there was a big VC community push to get people to buy Valkyria Chronicles a few months after release due to its initial low sales figures. 9/10 responses I saw online were "Well if it had trophies I would get it/ if they add trophies I might get it". One of the best games this generation (and my favourite from the whole PS3 library) and you wont buy it due to the lack of some f***ing imaginary pixel art and a lines of text

Most recently, kinda related. Friend of mine loved Warhawk but hated the massive grind to get max level and the higher up trophies. So he played the beta for Starhawk and loved it even more. So I found the trophy list a few weeks before it was released and he went "Meh...easy" for almost all of them. But two, "Finish a CTF match with no deaths and highest score" and "Finish a TD match with no deaths and highest score"....he starts ranting about how they are impossible and would "......cost him his Platinum". He didnt buy it after

I like achievements and trophies but they don't appeal to me as much as they used to if I'm being honest, just not that interested in them any more.

Your post makes me very sad. Valkyria Chronicles is one of my favourite games this generation of consoles (ever to be honest). If someone doesn't want to play it because it doesn't have trophies, then they're an idiot who doesn't deserve to experience the game. Also, your Starhawk playing mate sounds like a fool for trophies.

As an aside, have you played Skies of Arcadia??

Zero-Cool

Aw man, I love getting trophies and then posting them to my facebook and then people 'like' it. Makes me feel f*cking awesome!

GavRedKing

I only go looking for trophies if I've completed the game and thats on the off chance that I actually want to look for them.

Its fun to get trophies for something and you have no idea what you've done and you have to look at your list, that how I usually approach games.

I've got two games on PS3 that I've nearly got platinum, Assains Creed II and Skyrim, to complete both platinum trophies would require time I'm not willing to put into the games at the moment.

Sarky

I know people who actually examine the achievement list before playing the game and then spend ages working out the most efficient way to achieve them. It's like enjoying the game itself doesn't matter any more as long as something goes "bleep bloop!" and tells you what a good boy you are.

It's depressing as hell.

Gunmonkey

Burning Eclipse wrote: »

As an aside, have you played Skies of Arcadia??

Played a friends copy of the Dreamcast original and then bought the GC version a few years later.

cloud493

I love earning trophies :rolleyes: not to the extent where I'd buy/wouldn't a buy game based on them mind, but still. 2 platinums, got 3 games where I'm only a few trophies off it too.

ShadowHearth

I know a fella, who bought new Xbox ( something wrong with his old one ) and made new account too. So he bought few easy ****y games just to have his achiever score bigger as fast as possible.

What a fecking tool...

ScumLord

richymcdermott wrote: »

Anybody who turned off from a game from a lack of trophies/acievements support deserves a smack across the head ...

And a kick up the hole.

I find them pretty annoying at times. Playing a game like F1 2011 requires complete concentration you don't need stupid achievements affecting your concentration telling you something stupid like you've won an achievement for driving in a straight line for 2 seconds.

It can be interesting once you stop playing a game to look over stats and achievements but that's as far as my interest in them goes.

CrazyRabbit

sarumite wrote: »

Your second sentence is a non-sequitur. I am a console owner and it says nothing about my requirement or lack thereof for achievements/trophies in games.

Temptamperu wrote: »

Wow aren't you amazing? may I bask in your self inflated sense of pride perchance?

I dont mind achievements much either way, I only ever get the ones handed to you for playing the game and I never go out of my way to find them.

I was taking the piss out of console owners.

You're not getting your 'Obscure Humour' achievement now.

hooradiation

People won't play certain games for a variety of strange nonsensical reasons, this isn't really any worse than any of the others.

Shiminay

http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/achievements

Says it all really.

Morag

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFM4eIAou5M

CastorTroy

I'll admit I don't mind getting them sometimes. But basing how you play the game on looking at available trophies is another thing. Like in Trine 2 I got a trophy after solving a puzzle and the trophy was something like "You're not meant to do it that way" for not solving it the way it was planned.

I do notice in some games that the game freezes for a split second before the message appears. So now it's like advance warning sign that I got a trophy.

Zillah

One part of me says "there are different types of gamers and we all get something different out of games", but the rest of me says "anyone who takes arbitrary achievements like that seriously or puts any effort into them makes me feel sad". I play for the experience of it; story, character, gameplay, atmosphere - actual content. Gimicky achievements, especially if they feel like something randomly tacked on to an already finished game, can fu*k right off. And they can burn in hell if they pop up midgame and distract me.

Captain Chaos

ShadowHearth wrote: »

I know a fella, who bought new Xbox ( something wrong with his old one ) and made new account too. So he bought few easy ****y games just to have his achiever score bigger as fast as possible.

What a fecking tool...

Like that Simpsons game, just pressing start to play the game pops a chevo.:D

I love when I get them by accident like that one on Fez I can't remember now for pressing a certain button combination.

Some games have a running joke. Like killing 53,553+ zombies in Dead Rising in one play through because that was the towns population. Left 4 Dead came out and had an achievement for killing 53,554 zombies, then Prototype had a follow on one.

The one in Deus Ex: HR had one for completing the game fully stealth, called Foxiest of the Hounds with reference to Metal Gear Solid. I love stuff like that.

James Howlett

It's all good fun until someone gets hurt:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfzcTi52dvU

Zero-Cool

Haha even the horse exploded!

J. Marston

Strangely enough, the only game where I went to the bother of finishing it completely was MGS4. I got every single emblem, I wasn't bothered that there was no trophies though. The Big Boss emblem run drove me to the brink of insanity though.

JohnMarston

J. Marston wrote: »

Strangely enough, the only game where I went to the bother of finishing it completely was MGS4. I got every single emblem, I wasn't bothered that there was no trophies though. The Big Boss emblem run drove me to the brink of insanity though.

I hear ya Mr.Marston

Potential-Monke

I like achievements/trophies, as long as they're not going to drive me crazy.
I've got a Platinum for inFamous 1 and nearly had it for inFamous 2 but i apparently didn't have the hard mode activated before starting a new game and didn't get the final trophy because i only selected Hard when it prompted me to... :mad: But i enjoyed getting them, as they were great games and didn't have an annoying trophy like "Finish the game on stupidly-hard mode", a little niggle i have like Calex above.

I also have all achievements in Lego Harry Potter (years 1-4) and Beyond Good and Evil HD, but again because i enjoyed going through them to get them all (unlike Lego Star Wars:TCS, grrrr....)

Then, some games, like NFS: Most Wanted gave you everything for just completing the game. And there should be no such thing as MP trohpies/achievements, they ruin MP and are put in to get more people to play online in the initial first few weeks to make the game appear better than it is/have better online than it has.

But they wouldn't stop me buying a game/not buying a game.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

the only achievement I can remember caring about in recent years was deus ex HR pacifist achievement but because of some bug with the tranq darts on a particular mission I didn't get the achievement in the end. I dont care all that much because I finished the game without killing anybody (except those god damn bosses) and that's what I was trying to do.

BranDEAD

well nowadays nearly eevery game has them , but ti is a pain sometimes when u buy an older ish ps3 game and it has none, like the other day i got Rainbow 6 vegas 2 , and it had no trophies , thats why on xbox everysingle game has achevments to please everone

Nickco

No I don't have this problem with achievments, I don't care for them that much. But I do know a friend that is the biggest trophy wh*re in the world, buys games just for trophies(even if the games crap) then trades them in

johnny_ultimate

OMG got my first platinum last night. It was in Sly Cooper and was about as challenging as a mildly reluctant fart.

BranDEAD

Ahh king Kong on the 360 was alright i enjoyed it at the time but the achevments did help my GS

maximoose

Captain Chaos wrote: »

The one in Deus Ex: HR had one for completing the game fully stealth, called Foxiest of the Hounds with reference to Metal Gear Solid. I love stuff like that.

Lego Harry Potter had an achievement called "Solid Snape" for hiding in a barrel while you were playing as Professor Snape.

That gave me a good oul giggle :pac:

I like achievements. Can be fun earning them and a sense of eh, achievement, if you get a particularly difficult one. Don't take any sense of pride in gamerscore though or look down on people with low score or trophies, that's just sad.

Achievements/trophies should be SP based only though. The MP ones always create endless tools dicking about in online play.

BranDEAD

Yeah i hate idiots running around trying to mele kill ppl or camping just to get a bunch of MP trophies

JohnMarston

maximoose wrote: »

I like achievements. Can be fun earning them and a sense of eh, achievement, if you get a particularly difficult one. Don't take any sense of pride in gamerscore though or look down on people with low score or trophies, that's just sad.

Achievements/trophies should be SP based only though. The MP ones always create endless tools dicking about in online play.

My thoughts exactly. Especially with regard to the multiplayer. Or what they should do is make them so they do not affect your getting a platinum. Just have them as additional trophies.

Btw i must get my hands on some of the lego games, i've heard good things about them

krudler

not arsed about them, wish I could turn them off for every game, I play the game for the story and gameplay not collecting sh1te like in the Assassins Creed games, its filler and nothing more.

calex71

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

the only achievement I can remember caring about in recent years was deus ex HR pacifist achievement but because of some bug with the tranq darts on a particular mission I didn't get the achievement in the end. I dont care all that much because I finished the game without killing anybody (except those god damn bosses) and that's what I was trying to do.

Same thing happened me

maximoose

JohnMarston wrote: »

Btw i must get my hands on some of the lego games, i've heard good things about them

They are surprisingly fun, especially if you're a fan of Indiana/Star Wars/HP etc!

Burning Eclipse

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

OMG got my first platinum last night. It was in Sly Cooper and was about as challenging as a mildly reluctant fart.

I picked up that collection for €13.99 (afaik) on PSN a few months back. Really great deal for a series I knew nothing about until last year. Have since sub'd to PS+, and suddenly I'm doing way more gaming on PS3 than on 360... how times have changed. I have no platinum trophies though

Captain Chaos

BranDEAD wrote: »

well nowadays nearly eevery game has them , but ti is a pain sometimes when u buy an older ish ps3 game and it has none, like the other day i got Rainbow 6 vegas 2 , and it had no trophies , thats why on xbox everysingle game has achevments to please everone

The thing is that MS came up with the system. Sony saw it was a good way to add gameplay to games and increase game sales so they added it later. MS PC games for Windows, WP7 games and some Steam titles now have achievements now.

For old cross platform games on the 360 and PS3 where the PS3 does not have any it is easy enough to patch the PS3 game with them if they wanted. I like the pic art on some achievement lists. Some are just plain lazy though. I like the MGS HD trophy pic art. Dragon Age 2 would be a lazy example.

Oh yeah, just remembered. The Dead Space 2 achievement reference to Jurassic Park was pure class. I was even thinking of the Raptors in JP from the noises the enemies were making while fighting them and when the chevo popped with the description....it was a class moment in gaming for me.

Techniques07

They should spend less time on putting pointless achievements into games before they come out and more time into bug fixing, instead of always having to updates games on release.

Achievements add up to nothing, just kids who think it's awesome to have more gamerscore than you... I'm aware it's in the likes of Xbox to hopefully stop people from hacking meaning account banned = Lost all your score, but still pointless imo.

deathrider

Techniques07 wrote: »

They should spend less time on putting pointless achievements into games before they come out and more time into bug fixing, instead of always having to updates games on release.

Achievements add up to nothing, just kids who think it's awesome to have more gamerscore than you... I'm aware it's in the likes of Xbox to hopefully stop people from hacking meaning account banned = Lost all your score, but still pointless imo.

I wouldn't imagine adding achievements takes any real time at all. I'd say it's a swift and simple job (though I don't actually know for sure).

I disagree that achievements add up to nothing. They mean simialr things to High Scores back in the day. With a twist of course, since they are all combined, but it can still present the same things- A great sense of pride when you unlock the on one you've been fighting hard for, they add gameplay were their may not have been gameplay before with allows the game a longer lifespan, and they add challenge... sometimes feck all, but other times buckets full of it.

J. Marston

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

OMG got my first platinum last night. It was in Sly Cooper and was about as challenging as a mildly reluctant fart.

That was my first and only platinum trophy too .

CastorTroy

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Oh yeah, just remembered. The Dead Space 2 achievement reference to Jurassic Park was pure class. I was even thinking of the Raptors in JP from the noises the enemies were making while fighting them and when the chevo popped with the description....it was a class moment in gaming for me.

Ah yeah, I liked that "Clever girl" trophy as well. Those kind of ones do make me smile.

J. Marston wrote: »

That was my first and only platinum trophy too .

Interesting. I have that game as well, so maybe I'll get my first with it.

I do check my trophy list on occasion and if there are any games where I'm near enough the platinum, I do think of trying it. Think Infamous and Prince of Persia are 2 I could probably get if I tried.
Infamous 2 was a prospect as well but, as someone else said, I had to play in hard mode but had to play from the beginning in Hard and not from the point where it offers to change. So since I didn't find that out until I finished the game the second time, I didn't bother with it.