Hellboy 3/reboot

TherapyBoy

Dtp1979 wrote: »

Hold on, there's a Hellboy 2???

Yup!
I think they even shot a (very small) part of it in Northern Ireland.

Slydice

You haven't seen Hellboy 2!??!?

Oh, enjoy that!

pixelburp

Well, that's that then. 100% not happening, at least not by Guillermo Del Toro anyway.


https://twitter.com/RealGDT/status/834057572550324227

Nervous Wreck

I wonder what went wrong...

AMKC

TherapyBoy wrote: »

Yup!
I think they even shot a (very small) part of it in Northern Ireland.

They did indeed.

A pity there is not going to be a Hellboy 3 film would have went to the cinema to see that.

pixelburp

Actual Hellboy update! There's no 3rd instalment coming out, but there's a R-rated reboot in the works; Neil Marshall is assigned to direct, with David Harbour apparently in line to play Red himself.

Not sure what to make of this: 'R-rated' sometimes seems like code for a creative crutch that sacrifices actual craft for some F-bombs or extra buckets of corn syrup. Plus the absence of DelToro is a definite minus; Marshall's a fine genre director no doubt, but DelToro's imagination really added an extra layer to those existing Hellboy films.

http://www.avclub.com/article/hellboy-reboot-works-david-harbour-and-director-ne-254982

nix

pixelburp wrote: »

Actual Hellboy update! There's no 3rd instalment coming out, but there's a R-rated reboot in the works; Neil Marshall is assigned to direct, with David Harbour apparently in line to play Red himself.

Not sure what to make of this: 'R-rated' sometimes seems like code for a creative crutch that sacrifices actual craft for some F-bombs or extra buckets of corn syrup. Plus the absence of DelToro is a definite minus; Marshall's a fine genre director no doubt, but DelToro's imagination really added an extra layer to those existing Hellboy films.

http://www.avclub.com/article/hellboy-reboot-works-david-harbour-and-director-ne-254982

Interesting, some nice talent involved. But still, Id rather they done something else, something new. Pain in my hoop with reboots on hardly aged movies :mad:

Marty McFly

Mixed emotions about this one on the one hand be nice to have more Hellboy in some shape or form.

But a large part of me really wanted a Del Toro third instalment it was his style that made it what it was and a beautiful film style wise to watch.

McLoughlin

Del Toro wanted far too much money for his vision/version of Hellboy 3 and the film won't have made any profit judging on past box office receipts for the first two films.

I'm glad that the studio still want a He'll boy film and are moving on as far the R rating well that's probably influenced by Deadpool and Logan success and the important realisation that some comic book adaptions need a R rating.

pixelburp

I'm not that familiar with the Hellboy comics beyond the bullet points, but does it need the R-rating? Hellboy 2 was a bit goofy sure, but it's not like the first film lacked a dark, macabre & creepy tone. I wasn't watching either of them thinking 'what this film needs is more gore'.

Mickeroo

pixelburp wrote: »

I'm not that familiar with the Hellboy comics beyond the bullet points, but does it need the R-rating? Hellboy 2 was a bit goofy sure, but it's not like the first film lacked a dark, macabre & creepy tone. I wasn't watching either of them thinking 'what this film needs is more gore'.

There are violent bits in the comics but no I don't think it needs an R rating. The 2 Del Toro films had it about right.

I don't think those tooth fairies would have been any more creepy if there was geysers of blood squirting around the place.

Agent Coulson

Ian McShane joins the reboot cast as Professor Broom.

Agent Coulson

https://twitter.com/edskrein/status/902244967296491520

Agent Coulson

Agent Coulson wrote: »

https://twitter.com/edskrein/status/902244967296491520

Reading that last night and it is a nonsense storm in a teacup. The kind of SJW tosh that has become more and more prominent of late. I don't think the race of an actor cast in a role matters one bit if they are the best person for the role.

Granted there are exceptions when race is pivotal to a role but much like with say 30 Days of Night or the recent Death Note it has no real impact in this. People need to understand that when adapting something changes will be made and it's not offensive to hire an actor of a different race to play a character.

There are plenty of examples of traditionally white characters being played by non whites and no one gave a damn, Denzel Washington in The Manchurian Candidate, Michael Clarke Duncan as the Kingpin, Will Smith in I am legend, Morgan Freeman as and Irish character caleld Red in Shawshank Redemption and even in comic book films you have Jackson in The Avengers film, Elba in Thor.

Cultural representation in cinema is an important thing and you have to be careful with how you represent a culture or race but this is not one of those times. Would anyone have any issue if say a white character in the comic book was played by an Asian actor?

Gingervitis

Deleted User wrote: »

Reading that last night and it is a nonsense storm in a teacup. The kind of SJW tosh that has become more and more prominent of late. I don't think the race of an actor cast in a role matters one bit if they are the best person for the role.

Granted there are exceptions when race is pivotal to a role but much like with say 30 Days of Night or the recent Death Note it has no real impact in this. People need to understand that when adapting something changes will be made and it's not offensive to hire an actor of a different race to play a character.

There are plenty of examples of traditionally white characters being played by non whites and no one gave a damn, Denzel Washington in The Manchurian Candidate, Michael Clarke Duncan as the Kingpin, Will Smith in I am legend, Morgan Freeman as and Irish character caleld Red in Shawshank Redemption and even in comic book films you have Jackson in The Avengers film, Elba in Thor.

Cultural representation in cinema is an important thing and you have to be careful with how you represent a culture or race but this is not one of those times. Would anyone have any issue if say a white character in the comic book was played by an Asian actor?

Not to mention, the character Alice Monaghan in Hellboy 3, an Irish redhead, is being played by Sasha Lane, seen in American Honey last year. What's the opposite of ginger-washing? (Iris & Wally West in the CW Flash, Jimmy Olsen in Supergirl, Mary Jane in Spiderman Homecoming)

pixelburp

Deleted User wrote: »

Reading that last night and it is a nonsense storm in a teacup. The kind of SJW tosh that has become more and more prominent of late. I don't think the race of an actor cast in a role matters one bit if they are the best person for the role.

[...]

Cultural representation in cinema is an important thing and you have to be careful with how you represent a culture or race but this is not one of those times. Would anyone have any issue if say a white character in the comic book was played by an Asian actor?

There's a bit more context to this than simply dismissing it as 'SJW tosh'; I don't pretend to be aware - or invested tbh - in the issue of Hollywood & Asian casting, but in light of the Ghost in the Shell remake it has reopened the question of why recasting Asian characters or films is still the ... I dunno, acceptable form of ethnic recasting. And if it's not recasting, there's still the lingering Fu Machu style tropes of "Asia" as the mysterious continent of all things mystical or spiritual. The Marvel Netflix series have dabbled with that & the antagonist group The Hand.

The Ghost in the Shell remake was a big eye-roll for people, and having seen the film it was remarkable that in a clumsy attempt to split the difference, it managed to only double down on the accusations of white-washing (in that

its main character was revealed to be a Japanese girl conveniently turned into a caucasian robot

). There was even a rumour for a while that the studio played with the idea of using CGI to make Scarlet Johannson look 'more asian', though the FX studio supposedly hired have denied they were ever involved.

Mostly I'm just glad Ed Skrein isn't involved because he's a bland, charismaless actor & no great loss to any production IMO.

Deleted User wrote: »

There are plenty of examples of traditionally white characters being played by non whites and no one gave a damn, Denzel Washington in The Manchurian Candidate, Michael Clarke Duncan as the Kingpin, Will Smith in I am legend, Morgan Freeman as and Irish character caleld Red in Shawshank Redemption and even in comic book films you have Jackson in The Avengers film, Elba in Thor.

Just to be pedantic, but Sam Jackson's Nick Fury was based off an already race-swapped version of the comics' Nick Fury, who was in turn intentionally modelled off Samuel L. Jackson: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimate_Nick_Fury

pixelburp

pixelburp wrote: »

There's a bit more context to this than simply dismissing it as 'SJW tosh'; I don't pretend to be aware - or invested tbh - in the issue of Hollywood & Asian casting, but in light of the Ghost in the Shell remake it has reopened the question of why recasting Asian characters or films is still the ... I dunno, acceptable form of ethnic recasting. And if it's not recasting, there's still the lingering Fu Machu style tropes of "Asia" as the mysterious continent of all things mystical or spiritual. The Marvel Netflix series have dabbled with that & the antagonist group The Hand.

The Ghost in the Shell remake was a big eye-roll for people, and having seen the film it was remarkable that in a clumsy attempt to split the difference, it managed to only double down on the accusations of white-washing (in that

its main character was revealed to be a Japanese girl conveniently turned into a caucasian robot

). There was even a rumour for a while that the studio played with the idea of using CGI to make Scarlet Johannson look 'more asian', though the FX studio supposedly hired have denied they were ever involved.

Mostly I'm just glad Ed Skrein isn't involved because he's a bland, charismaless actor & no great loss to any production IMO

I think that the issue you have here is that not an eye brow is raised when it comes to casting traditionally white characters with nonwhite actors. It's a double standard that in this day and age really doesn't have to exist. The white washing stuff around Death Note at the weekend was puzzling given that from what I saw of it Willem Dafoe was perfect in the role of the demon. I'd happily watch him redub the existing live action film.

Personally, as long as they cast the best person for the role, that is all that matters in my eyes. I'd happily watch a nonwhite actor play Batman or Superman if they delivered a good performance.

The Ghost in the Shell whitewashing thing was nonsense. Yes, the let's use CGI to make them more Asian thing was a complete wtf moment but no one can confirm if this even happened. The reaction surrounding the main casting was overblown. Mamoru Oshii who directed the anime had no problem with her casting. He stated “What issue could there possibly be with casting her? The Major is a cyborg and her physical form is an entirely assumed one. The name ‘Motoko Kusanagi’ and her current body are not her original name and body, so there is no basis for saying that an Asian actress must portray her. Even if her original body (presuming such a thing existed) were a Japanese one, that would still apply.” ”

Whenever whitewashing is brought up people always bring up Mickey Rooney of Fu Manchu and yes they are offensive portrayels of Asian people but they belong to a time that has long passed. Society has moved on and sure, if they had planned to Fu Manchu up Skerin then it would have been offensive but it's not offensive the manner in which they intended. And I agree that he's a bad actor, he can play a convincing scumbag but not a lot else.

pixelburp wrote: »

Just to be pedantic, but Sam Jackson's Nick Fury was based off an already race-swapped version of the comics' Nick Fury, who was in turn intentionally modelled off Samuel L. Jackson: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimate_Nick_Fury

I'm familiar with that, just that the character was always traditionally a white man.

Sonics2k

Deleted User wrote: »

Personally, as long as they cast the best person for the role, that is all that matters in my eyes. I'd happily watch a nonwhite actor play Batman or Superman if they delivered a good performance.

Now, I want to make it clear that I'm split on this, and do quite agree with you, to a point.

Let's keep in mind that Ed Skrein has quit himself. He has made the choice and agrees with the people upset by this.

And let's not forget that people had an absolute fit at the thought of Idris Elba playing James Bond. Absolute pandemonium about a woman playing The Doctor and an all-female cast in Ghostbusters.


If we're brutally honest, Hollywood does have a bit of a history of hiring white actors to play non-white roles, but it's far more rare for it to be the other way around.

Typically speaking, I don't really care what actor is hired if they're good for the role, but the exception should not be made when the characters race plays an integral part in backstory of the character. The like of Sam Jackson as Nick Fury does not impact the characters background as his race is never an issue in the Marvel universe.

Sonics2k

Sonics2k wrote: »

Now, I want to make it clear that I'm split on this, and do quite agree with you, to a point.

Let's keep in mind that Ed Skrein has quit himself. He has made the choice and agrees with the people upset by this.

And let's not forget that people had an absolute fit at the thought of Idris Elba playing James Bond. Absolute pandemonium about a woman playing The Doctor and an all-female cast in Ghostbusters.


If we're brutally honest, Hollywood does have a bit of a history of hiring white actors to play non-white roles, but it's far more rare for it to be the other way around.

Typically speaking, I don't really care what actor is hired if they're good for the role, but the exception should not be made when the characters race plays an integral part in backstory of the character. The like of Sam Jackson as Nick Fury does not impact the characters background as his race is never an issue in the Marvel universe.

No one is denying that it happens, there are loads of examples of white actors cast as black characters and vice versa. It's like Elba being cast as Roland in the Dark Tower, not who I would have picked but he was great in the role even if having a black actor in the role means that some of the books most shocking moments will not work as well as they did on the page.

The reaction to things like Elba being Bond or a female Doctor Who comes from narrow-minded scumbags. Most people could not care less about a black Bond or female Doctor. That said that arguments are mostly the same and both groups are wrong, though in the case of a white person complaining about a black Bond they are branded a racist, whereas an Asian person complaining about the Hellboy thing is considered to be right.

The most recent baffling criticism is for Detroit where plenty of people came out to attack the Bigelow for being a white woman and how she should not be telling a black story. It's utter nonsense and the kind of backward thinking that you'd have hoped would have disappeared years ago.

Skerin quit no doubt due to the fact that did he not he'd have to spend the next year minimum defending his casting. he can wrap it up any way he wants but if he was so concerned with playing a character of Asian descent then he shouldn't have signed up in the first place.

Grayditch

I understand his decision and think it's a good thing to do, but his twitter post was long and started to sound really self gratifying.

Erik Shin

With Ed Skrein quitting, Daniel Dae Kim has been selected as Ben Daimio

Slydice

Ladies and Gentlemen...
https://twitter.com/artofmmignola/status/908063506590830597

also:
https://twitter.com/DavidKHarbour/status/908070476475494400

JP Liz V1

Was director Neil Marshall also involved in the script?

pixelburp

Might be just the lighting, but the resemblance is very like Ron Perlman; not sure there's much you can do with the appearance of Hellboy mind you, without deviating so much you'd p*ss off everyone.

Remaining very cautious about this & holding judgement until at least a trailer, and maybe beyond that: I didn't like how one of the first things announced was the R-rating, as if the producers couldn't want to gore up the film.

Bacchus

pixelburp wrote: »

Might be just the lighting, but the resemblance is very like Ron Perlman; not sure there's much you can do with the appearance of Hellboy mind you, without deviating so much you'd p*ss off everyone.

Remaining very cautious about this & holding judgement until at least a trailer, and maybe beyond that: I didn't like how one of the first things announced was the R-rating, as if the producers couldn't want to gore up the film.

As you say, it's kinda hard to deviate from the Ron Perlman look. I think he looks great though (can't remember actors name... the cop from Stranger Things) and had no idea he beefed up so much for this. I saw one comment on the look though highlighting the attention to detail with the lips. It's something so small but they nailed the look from the comics.

Regarding the R rating... I dunno, I think it set expectations a bit for this. There's serious fatigue for PG-13 rated "adult" movies (Total Recall, Terminator: Genisys, Robocop, etc.) that ends up with a movie pulling it's punches and attempting to catch the teen and "adult" markets. Sure this could be a case of the producers cynically jumping on the bandwagon of recent R rated success (Deadpool, Logan) but it's a very small bandwagon and the movie will have to work hard to capture the audience that Deadpool and Logan did to make up for the loss of the PG-13 crowd. So... for me, I think it was a positive statement from the get go that they felt they had a strong story/movie/team on their hands to make it a success as an R rated movie.

Mickeroo

It's just marketing spin, a lot of people automatically (wrongly) assume a film will be better because it's R-rated and the studios know this. Logan and Deadpool have also showed R rated films can sell too.

Hellboy 1 & 2 weren't remotely hindered by their age rating imo.

Bacchus

Mickeroo wrote: »

Hellboy 1 & 2 weren't remotely hindered by their age rating imo.

Partly down to the landscape of the superheros in cinema 10-13 years ago. Partly also down to the (still to this day) unique visual style of those movies (thanks to del Toro). The superhero genre is flooded at the moment though, particularly with watered down teen action movies, and an R rated Neil Marshall take on Hellboy could be what's needed to help it stand out from the MCU/DCEU crowd.

Call it marketing spin if you want but they still need to deliver that end product and I'll buy it... unless it's sh*t

conorhal

Mickeroo wrote: »

It's just marketing spin, a lot of people automatically (wrongly) assume a film will be better because it's R-rated and the studios know this. Logan and Deadpool have also showed R rated films can sell too.

Hellboy 1 & 2 weren't remotely hindered by their age rating imo.

The first two were hindered in their abilty to faithfully translate the comic by their rating though. Having read the comics, an R ratating might have allowed Del Toro to make the films a lot more like Pan's Labyrinth, which would have been a closer translation, then making it a cooky X-Men.

Stone Deaf 4evr

I dunno, if you look back at hellboy 1 and 2, they still stand up remarkably well on their own merits, as opposed to something like xmen which has aged like milk.

Agent Coulson

The film has been delayed till mid 2019 now from it's January release date.