Signaling Systems in Ireland

mk6705

So my idea of an axle counter is wrong then. Fair enough. I was under the impression for some reason that the mini-CTC lines used track circuits. Must have been reading mis-information I guess.

Judgement Day

Before the Cavan & Leitrim Railway at Dromod became defunct, for the second time, we operated either the 'one engine in steam' (diesel) system on quiet days and a fairly unique 'Wise's' staff system using a replica of the original staff system that was was used when the line first opened. The system is very good when worked by diligent, properly supervised staff but on the original C&L it was abused and when the equipment needed renewing it was dispensed with altogether. The North Wales Narrow Gauge Railway Company also used the Wise staff system see pic below.



Devised by a good Wexford man, Berkeley Deane Wise from New Ross, who went onto to achieve great things on the BNCR in Northern Ireland. More here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Deane_Wise

Heisenberg1

Our man in Havana wrote: »

What do the letters on signal posts mean? CY, RL, WL etc?

They are the Signal prefix for the intrelockings CY= Connolly DL= Dun Laoghaire
CW= Connolly West and so on.

Heisenberg1

Hilly Bill wrote: »

CY is Connolly Yard. Rl Rosslare? Where have you seen WL?

Bl is Belfast, Cl is Clonsilla.

WL is the Waterford Line Prefix.

Heisenberg1

kc56 wrote: »

HN= Heuston
HK= Heuston-Kildare

Before the upgrade to HK, Kildare route used to be CY - Conolly CTC or Cherryville?

Yes the Signal Prefix for that section of line was CY for Cherryville.

Heisenberg1

Adro947 wrote: »

I would have thought mini-CTC lines used track circuits (Judging mainly from Mallow - Tralee here.) . In fact I'd be pretty sure of that. Any British trains I've been on made that loud, distinctive noise when going over axle counters, this is rarely heard in Ireland except at special locations. The reason they don't have CAWS is much more to do with cost I reckon. Correct me if I'm wrong of course.

Mini CTC areas of control have mixture of Track Circuits and Axle Counters.

csd

luzon wrote: »

Yes the Signal Prefix for that section of line was CY for Cherryville.

According to Doyle & Hirsch's book, the CY stands for Connolly, the "controlling box" for the original 1976 CTC scheme.

/csd

csd

luzon wrote: »

Mini CTC areas of control have mixture of Track Circuits and Axle Counters.

The earlier mini-CTC schemes used track circuits in station areas, and axle counters for the sections between stations. The later schemes used axle counters throughout, as do the new Heuston - Kildare and Portarlington schemes.

/csd

csd

Folks,

There's a good wiki article on CAWS here.

In axle counter areas where CAWS is in operation, the CAWS signal is transmitted using a wire clipped to the rail rather than the rail itself.

/csd

Our man in Havana

csd wrote: »

Folks,

There's a good wiki article on CAWS here.

In axle counter areas where CAWS is in operation, the CAWS signal is transmitted using a wire clipped to the rail rather than the rail itself.

/csd

That would make sense.

Mycroft H

Is their some sort of SPAD system here?

BX 19

BX 19 wrote: »

Is their some sort of SPAD system here?

Yes but only on the DART. The ATP system on the DART will stop the train in the event of a SPAD. CAWS will only stop the train if the driver fails to acknowledge an audible warning.

kc56

csd wrote: »

Folks,

There's a good wiki article on CAWS here.

In axle counter areas where CAWS is in operation, the CAWS signal is transmitted using a wire clipped to the rail rather than the rail itself.

/csd

I don't think they use a cable clipped to the rails. On the 4 track section axle counter are used. There are insulated blocks inserted into the rails at every signal. If the used wire clipped to the rails, and I have never seen any evidence of such a wire, why would the need the insulated blocks? I think they send the CAWS signals down the rails as in track circuit areas.

Not everything on Wikipedia is authoritive.

Captain Chaos

You can see a small cable clipped to the inside of the rails at Howth Junction, Clongriffin and Killester stations. And in other areas they are just the one that stand out at me day to day

csd

kc56 wrote: »

I don't think they use a cable clipped to the rails. On the 4 track section axle counter are used. There are insulated blocks inserted into the rails at every signal. If the used wire clipped to the rails, and I have never seen any evidence of such a wire, why would the need the insulated blocks? I think they send the CAWS signals down the rails as in track circuit areas.

Not everything on Wikipedia is authoritive.

Cable vs rail discussion on IRN here.

/csd

Losty Dublin

Karsini wrote: »

CAWS will only stop the train if the driver fails to acknowledge an audible warning.

It's a downgrade in signal aspect that sets off the audible alarm. If the driver fails to acknowledge the alarm, the train brakes are applied for 60 seconds and a red aspect is automatically give. The driver then has to ring CTC to upgrade the signal and for permission to move off again

wilsonsamuel

Our man in Havana wrote: »

What do the letters on signal posts mean? CY, RL, WL etc?

WL = Whistle, Level Crossing ahead.

Not sure about the others..

Heisenberg1

wilsonsamuel wrote: »

WL = Whistle, Level Crossing ahead.

Not sure about the others..

The WL is for Waterford Line, whitsle boards are in place before farmers xings.

wilsonsamuel

ahh.. thanks for the info.

I have seen on other rail systems as WL for Whistle...

Btw, I have really enjoyed my trips on Dublin < > Sligo Commuter between Sligo < > Mullingar.

Dublin Spotter

WL = Whistle, Level Crossing ahead.

The WL is for Waterford Line, whitsle boards are in place before farmers xings.

why are they only on the waterford line?

Dublin Spotter

Dublin Spotter wrote: »

why are they only on the waterford line?

It doesn't mean whistle. It means Waterford Line. Whistle boards are black and amber stripes on IE. On NIR they're circular W boards.

Heisenberg1

Dublin Spotter wrote: »

why are they only on the waterford line?

No signal prefixes are on all interlockings CY=Connolly, SL=Sligo Line and so on.

demanufactured

How often do irish train drivers have to sound the horn..i now before the train moves away they sound it

demanufactured

demanufactured wrote: »

How often do irish train drivers have to sound the horn..i now before the train moves away they sound it

Drivers need to sound the horn before level crossings and accommodation crossings. At certain points on the line there may be whistle boards. These are normally marked by a signpost with black and amber stripes on it and instruct the driver to sound the horn at that point. They also do so as a warning to passengers when passing through stations without stopping.

Sounding the horn through certain areas at night is forbidden, such as near residential areas. I also see drivers sounding the horn when passing another train on a double track line, but I think this is done as a greeting to the other driver.

flyingsnail

Karsini wrote: »

I also see drivers sounding the horn when passing another train on a double track line, but I think this is done as a greeting to the other driver.

This also serves as a warning to people on the track who’s view of the second train may be obscured by the first.
Also when approaching workers on the track.

101sean

I sometimes wonder whether the drivers age affects the horn sounding! Near me around MP95 D-C there's a couple of accommodation crossings that were removed years ago but some drivers still blow the horn approaching where they were. I assume younger drivers wouldn't remember them but it's a habit with the older ones?

Markcheese

I'm often stopped at a level crossing near midleton, and when I here the train whistle
I think if u were on the track or crossing u'd just about have enough time to lift yr head and see the train piough into you..
Must be a pain for the houses along side....

flyingsnail

Markcheese wrote: »

I'm often stopped at a level crossing near midleton, and when I here the train whistle
I think if u were on the track or crossing u'd just about have enough time to lift yr head and see the train piough into you..
Must be a pain for the houses along side....

I live very close to a LC and you would be surprised how very little you actually notice unless you are listening for it.

Jamie2k9

There is also a sign on the WL line mainly between Cherryville-Kilkenny and its a while circle with a black V in the middle. What are they for?

Jamie2k9

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

There is also a sign on the WL line mainly between Cherryville-Kilkenny and its a while circle with a black V in the middle. What are they for?

Hmm, you've got me on that one. Here's the ones I do know.

RAD CH x (yellow border): Tune train radio to channel x. I think there's four different channels.
CAWS C1 or CAWS C2 (blue border). Set CAWS ADU to specified carrier. C2 on lines in and around the DART system, C1 elsewhere.
ETS: Start point of mechanical signalling
NO EMU TRAINS (amber border): Means what it says, no electric trains beyond this point, Used on the extremities of the DART system and the non-electrified junctions around Connolly.
White circle with black W in middle: Whistle board (NIR only)
Black and amber stripes: Whistle board (IE only)

The CAWS, RAD and ETS boards also have versions with a diagonal red line through them, indicating that CAWS, radio coverage or ETS is unavailable beyond that point.

Speed limits:
Permanent speed restrictions (PSRs) are indicated by a number contained within an octagon.

Temporary speed restrictions (TSRs) use four different signs:
The first is a triangle with blinking light and speed indication underneath. This is an advance warning board.
The second is the letter C with the TSR underneath (the commencement board)
The third is the letter R in a circle. This is a Reminder board. Not all TSRs will use this one, it's generally used at stations to remind the driver to stick to the TSR after departing the station.
The final one is the letter T. This is the termination board, marking the end of the TSR.

Here's a photo of the TSR boards (excluding the R board).


I know too much pointless information. I guess it wouldn't be pointless if I were a driver but I'm not.