Surprised by Enda Kenny?

darkman2

I have been fairly impressed with Enda Kenny since he became Taoiseach. I did not think he would be good at all before he got the job and like many thought FG should have got rid of him before the last election.

How wrong I was to think that now. He has proven to be able to represent us very well abroad and I am really surprised at that. He has a fantastic energy and drive about him. I was just looking at some tweet from a couple of traders on the wall street trading floor who seemed pretty impressed and he seems to be handling interviews very well. And he LOOKS the part. And that is something we have not been use to for a VERY long time. It's refreshing to see our leader even dressed properly.

What i'm wondering here is is my reassessment of Enda Kenny fair OR has it to do with getting over the shock of Cowen of Taoiseach rather then Enda's abilities (let's face it the smurfs would have given us more credibility then Cowen)?

And is my reassessment shared? I think he is doing quite well and deserves a bit of credit.

_Gawd_

What have you to be impressed about?

You're easily pleased. This is the same man that sat on his hole for years and never once refused a pay rise even when the country was going down the ****ter. He knows nothing about economics, just another career politician. Never forget that FG voted for the bailouts and people thought Kenny had the stomach to reform politics in Ireland - this from a man that is the oldest serving member of that House. :rolleyes: We were conned again, plain and simple.

charlemont

Have to agree with most of the post.

Kurz

If this was a movie then I completely agree with your sentiment. Looks better than Cowen, is well liked abroad etc... Fits the part better than I thought he would. In terms of his job he is spineless, sneaky and incompetent.

Looking good in the job and doing the job well aren't the same thing by any means.

darkman2

_Gawd_ wrote: »

What have you to be impressed about?

You're easily pleased. This is the same man that sat on his hole for years and never once refused a pay rise even when the country was going down the ****ter. He knows nothing about economics, just another career politician. Never forget that FG voted for the bailouts and people thought Kenny had the stomach to reform politics in Ireland - this from a man that is the oldest serving member of that House. :rolleyes: We were conned again, plain and simple.

Conned by who? Ourselves? We vote them in. And I could not disagree more with you except on the point on economics. Is Gerry Adams good on economics? Is Joe Higgins good on economics? They have not an economic braincell between them.

Enda Kenny may not be "good" at economics but he seems sensible to me, is trying his best to help this horrible situation and is well briefed and to me is very good at getting the message across abroad which is vital.

tayto lover

darkman2 wrote: »

Conned by who? Ourselves? We vote them in. And I could not disagree more with you except on the point on economics. Is Gerry Adams good on economics? Is Joe Higgins good on economics? They have not an economic braincell between them.

Enda Kenny may not be "good" at economics but he seems sensible to me, is trying his best to help this horrible situation and is well briefed and to me is very good at getting the message across abroad which is vital.

He is a big lick ass. All the time kowtowing to the likes of Sarcozy and Merkel. Embarrassing.

darkman2

Kurz wrote: »

Looking good in the job and doing the job well aren't the same thing by any means.

Is he not doing his job He is out of the country every week trying tbh. It's not easy. The dynamic of our situation suggests to me that is most important right now if we want to win back investor confidence in our bonds and expell the IMF/ECB. He cannot come out and talk tough on the promissory notes or anything like that in public. That will only piss off our lenders of last resort. He has to be careful handling that publicly. What more do we want? He is not perfect but he is doing well so far IMO.

And to be fair we have decoupled ourselves thankfully from Portugal and Greece in the bond market. That is a good achievement within one year. Our yields have halved since last July. Their's have doubled.

Sierra Oscar

In terms of his appearance and handling of events, he did not have much to live up to following on from Cowen . . .

darkman2

tayto lover wrote: »

He is a big lick ass. All the time kowtowing to the likes of Sarcozy and Merkel. Embarrassing.

German and French money is paying for a good chunk of our services now. Any Taoiseach would have to do the same. The idea is to get out of the bailout so they won't have to do that. Make no mistake about who are paymasters are. If you are suggesting Kenny should go to Europe and tell them to stuff themselves and we will do what we like......i'd suggest that would be a very dangerous thing to do in our fragile situation.


It often amazes me how Irish people over estimate our place and influence in the world. We have none. We are a tiny island of malcontents on the edge of the Atlantic. If I was Merkel I would not give a damn about us either. We are actually irrelevant even in an EU context similar to a fly on the windowsill. They can live without us, we can't live without them. Many people in this country still need to get real about how desperate our situation is. We have no leverage anymore. Beggars can't be choosers.

Enda Kenny is doing the only thing he can do which is trying to keep a straight face when he meets these people due to the embarrasingly dire situation we find ourselves.

baldbear

I'm surprised he was with that dodgey o'brien today.

Sierra Oscar

baldbear wrote: »

I'm surprised he was with that dodgey o'brien today.

I am surprised the media did not comment on that much, considering we are not even a year since the publication of the Moriarty Tribunal or the likes. I guess they wanted to keep the positive atmosphere going.

darkman2

baldbear wrote: »

I'm surprised he was with that dodgey o'brien today.

To be fair Enda Kenny cannot dictate who the NYSE invites to such events. Maybe he would have been happier had he not been there. But he cannot do much about it.

King of Kings

impressed by his being sarkozy's house cat?

his submissive attitude was embarassing.

Would sarkozy have behaved like that with Cameron - maybe - but cameron would have biten his hand off and he'd never do it again

bbam

Well, I'm not impressed..
He's wooden, lacks personality and in general seems to struggle to genuinely have any rapport with Joe public.. I constantly get the feeling that he's in over his head and still can't seem to believe he made it into the job..

I just can't see him being taken seriously at any form of high level EU meetings..
We just don't seem to be able to produce genuine charismatic, capable leaders in our political system... It doesn't look good for the future either...

Manach

Given the anger over the Property tax and Mr Kenny's reliance on Minister Hogan to act as his pitbull I would say he lacks the touch that makes people accept him as a leader, analogous to a middle level project manager, out of his depth.

RealExpert

You must be easily impressed.They are the opposite to robin hood,they rob the poor to make the rich even richer.Dont forget about all his empty promises and all the jobs he has created since getting into office (I cant find the figures anywhere why? cos there are none) Bunch of wasters all of them feather your own nest and **** everyone else is the mentality of those people.They havent a clue what its like to be on the poverty line.The cost of the St Patricks day trips abroad at the taxpayers expense if there are any left is probably twice the money that Im going to get this year.I dont get free travel or wined and dined why should they in times like this.Its not FG fault its the Irish people for sitting back and allow themselves to be trampled on.I hope the majority of them has the guts to stick by their guns and not pay the household tax or septic tank tax either and thats just to start.

darkman2

RealExpert wrote: »

I dont get free travel or wined and dined why should they

Should have gone to college, worked hard and got a better job then shouldn't you?

southsiderosie

RealExpert wrote: »

You must be easily impressed.They are the opposite to robin hood,they rob the poor to make the rich even richer.Dont forget about all his empty promises and all the jobs he has created since getting into office (I cant find the figures anywhere why? cos there are none) Bunch of wasters all of them feather your own nest and **** everyone else is the mentality of those people.They havent a clue what its like to be on the poverty line.The cost of the St Patricks day trips abroad at the taxpayers expense if there are any left is probably twice the money that Im going to get this year.I dont get free travel or wined and dined why should they in times like this.Its not FG fault its the Irish people for sitting back and allow themselves to be trampled on.I hope the majority of them has the guts to stick by their guns and not pay the household tax or septic tank tax either and thats just to start.

darkman2 wrote: »

Should have gone to college, worked hard and got a better job then shouldn't you?

MOD NOTE:

Tone it down, please. The former is veering into ranty-land, and the latter is overly personal.

darkman2

southsiderosie wrote: »

MOD NOTE:

Tone it down, please. The former is veering into ranty-land, and the latter is overly personal.

Sorry, just thought it was a good way to stress the point that begrudgery is still alive and well in our society, more so then most.

Carlos_Ray

Frankly I think the man is a disgrace. He's merely continuing the style of government that preceded him. Keep your cronies sweet and to hell with the plebians. He's still the highest paid leader in Western Europe, backed by some of the highest paid politicians who are forcing through draconian fiscal measures on a country devastated by recession. Its disgusting. The gap between the rich and poor is increasing at an accelerated rate, and the poor man is footing the bill for mistakes made by the rich. He has done nothing for the average person and he has failed to pursue and charge any of the people responsible for the mess we're in. He's even on record, blaming the the average Irish person for the recession, when he was trying to cosy up with the Europeans. He's cowardly, shallow, greedy, and ineffectual. So when alls said and done, he's right up their with all the other leaders of the last thirty years.

darkman2

Carlos_Ray wrote: »

blaming the the average Irish person for the recession

Sorry to burst the bubble but the average Irish person is partly to blame for this mess. That's a fact. No gun was put to the head of "average" Irish people that went mad on credit which was a darn large percentage of "average" Irish people. People choose to live beyond their means. Now they get the swing of it and must take responsibility for their failings in financial discipline.

_Gawd_

darkman2 wrote: »

Sorry to burst the bubble but the average Irish person is partly to blame for this mess. That's a fact. No gun was put to the head of "average" Irish people that went mad on credit which was a darn large percentage of "average" Irish people. People choose to live beyond their means. Now they get the swing of it and must take responsibility for their failings in financial discipline.

The people are not to blame - every Tom, Dick and Harry went into AIB and came out with a loan. Why wouldn't they? It was up to the banks to say "hang on here, we're running a business and if we're not careful we could go bust"...but why should they? The EU's expansion of easy credit into the Eurozone flooded Ireland with cheap money encouraging malinvestments...why do you think people took out loans? Most probably to buy houses and that's where the lot of it ended up, the property bubbles.

In fact, Ireland is a textbook case of the Austrian Business Cycle Theory. If you think Enda Kenny has anything to contribute to this country or it's people, then you're kidding yourself because these people are well off the mark in their worldview of basic economics. It was FG that agreed to the bailouts....is there anything wrong you see in that?!?!? It's pathetic.

V_Moth

darkman2 wrote: »

Sorry to burst the bubble but the average Irish person is partly to blame for this mess. That's a fact. No gun was put to the head of "average" Irish people that went mad on credit which was a darn large percentage of "average" Irish people. People choose to live beyond their means. Now they get the swing of it and must take responsibility for their failings in financial discipline.

Why won't this canard of borrowers being to blame die? Ultimately it was the responsibility of the lender to ensure that the person getting the loan can repay it. They failed this responsibility in the search for short-term profits.

darkman2

_Gawd_ wrote: »

The people are not to blame - every Tom, Dick and Harry went into AIB and came out with a loan. Why wouldn't they? It was up to the banks to say "hang on here, we're running a business and if we're not careful we could go bust"...but why should they? The EU's expansion of easy credit into the Eurozone flooded Ireland with cheap money encouraging malinvestments...why do you think people took out loans? Most probably to buy houses and that's where the lot of it ended up, the property bubbles.

In fact, Ireland is a textbook case of the Austrian Business Cycle Theory. If you think Enda Kenny has anything to contribute to this country or it's people, then you're kidding yourself because these people are well off the mark in their worldview of basic economics. It was FG that agreed to the bailouts....is there anything wrong you see in that?!?!? It's pathetic.

Firstly - I didn't live far beyond my means. So your theory ends there. I and a good minority of the population were sensible. Why should I have any sympathy for the greedy part of our "average" population (not only bankers and speculators) that behaved so recklessly with their personal finances? Why? Can you answer that? I watched clowns in my own area - taxi drivers - driving brand new mercs every couple of years (2 on my street alone), holidays every few months - a fcuking window cleaner getting big extensions on his very modest house, the holidays, the cars everything else recklessly knowingly beyond their means on credit. Why should those of us who were sensible have to put up with this idea of having to bail these "average" people out? They fecked up along with the banks and politicians. They should take the consequences of their actions. They had a good time. I was restrained, I didn't. The people who were restrained through the boom are the ones who really should be protected in all this.

Secondly don't start about the bailout. It's simple. As a country we had no choice. It was live or die - take it or don't take it. Anyone who claims this country had any leverage at all over that is dangerously deluded IMO. The likes of Joe Higgins and that can talk all the nonsense they want, they will never be in Government. The Government has to behave sensibly and delicately because the stakes for us as a country cannot be higher.

The consequence of this is that we now live in a country that no one will lend to. To be honest Ireland's people have shown themselves incapable of self governance. That's the be all and end all of it. Hence our sovereignty has been removed.

_Gawd_

darkman2 wrote: »

Firstly - I didn't live far beyond my means. So your theory ends there. I and a good minority of the population were sensible. Why should I have any sympathy for the greedy part of our "average" population (not only bankers and speculators) that behaved so recklessly with their personal finances? Why? Can you answer that? I watched clowns in my own area - taxi drivers - driving brand new mercs every couple of years (2 on my street alone), holidays every few months - a fcuking window cleaner getting big extensions on his very modest house, the holidays, the cars everything else recklessly knowingly beyond their means on credit. Why should those of us who were sensible have to put up with this idea of having to bail these "average" people out? They fecked up along with the banks and politicians. They should take the consequences of their actions. They had a good time. I was restrained, I didn't. The people who were restrained through the boom are the ones who really should be protected in all this.

Secondly don't start about the bailout. It's simple. As a country we had no choice. It was live or die - take it or don't take it. Anyone who claims this country had any leverage at all over that is dangerously deluded IMO. The like of Joe Higgins and that can talk all the nonsense they want, they will never be in Government. The Government has to behave sensible and delicately because the stakes for us as a country cannot be higher.

Well, first of all I'm no Joe Higgins fan. I'm a Capitalist which is more than I can say for Kenny and Co. The mere fact that you claim we had no choice - it was do or die just confirms your grasp of the situation, i.e - a lack thereof. I'm not trying to attack you, but you have to realise that there were options. The simplest one to follow would be to acknowledge the principle foundation of the capitalistic system - bad companies die.

I don't know what you're talking about in your first paragraph, you seem to have gone on some rant about not being greedy etc. It's human nature, my friend. Human Action is called praxeology - we act because we WANT. And we want because we hope to be better in the future. I don't blame the taxi driver that took out a loan and couldn't pay it back. It was his risk and I feel no sympathy for him. Nor do I feel sympathy for the banks that never operated under Capitalistic principles when they knew Big Brother down on Kildare Street would happily bailout their corporate friends. Did I mention FG supported bailing out the wealthy corporatists?!?

Those banks should of fell and their assets bought up on the market for buttons. The problem is that we have a very dodgy banking system, not because there are a lack of regulations - but because a cartel exists. A cartel with a monopoly. There are a lot of things more sinister than you'd like to imagine at work here. It's not as clear cut as you'd like to suggest. Of course, we had choices. The choice being that private risk is NOT public debt. This is not a looney lefty/socialist view, this is also a capitalist view.

The manifesto this government, as well as the gombeens that preceded them are working from is your typical fascist playbook.

Bullseye1

darkman2 wrote: »

. I was restrained, I didn't. The people who were restrained through the boom are the ones who really should be protected.

How exactly are you being protected? We have signed up to a bank guarantee that will be an anchor around our necks for generations. That does not sound like protection. The bravado shown by FG before they got into power was there for everyone to see. They lied.

darkman2

I agree 2 of the banks should have been let fail (Not all of them though for the simple reason we don't run our own central bank). However my fundamental point is that other countries like Finland that have had a crises as bad as this in the past learned from it, their population accepted and adapted their bahaviour generally away from their mistakes and they make bloody well sure it never ever happens again. It frightened them to correct their own ways as a society. Here, because so many seem to not accept the joint culpability of a good portion of our average population it looks to me like that lesson is not going to be learned. I am doubtful that we will ever regain economic sovereignty even when the crises is over but if we do we could end up in the same situation 20, 30, 40 years down the road again. Irish attitudes to finance generally have to change. There has to be discipline imposed from the top and solid barriers to excessive lending put in place. We may not see another boom but at least we will be solid and more protected.

_Gawd_

darkman2 wrote: »

I agree 2 of the banks should have been let fail (Not all of them though for the simple reason we don't run our own central bank). However my fundamental point is that other countries like Finland that have had a crises as bad as this in the past learned from it, their population accepted and adapted their bahaviour generally away from their mistakes and they make bloody well sure it never ever happens again. It frightened them to correct their own ways as a society. Here, because so many seem to not accept the joint culpability of a good portion of our average population it looks to me like that lesson is not going to be learned. I am doubtful that we will ever regain economic sovereignty even when the crises is over but if we do we could end up in the same situation 20, 30, 40 years down the road again. Irish attitudes to finance generally have to change. There has to be discipline imposed from the top and solid barriers to excessive lending put in place. We may not see another boom but at least we will be solid and more protected.

Booms should not exist - they're not a part of capitalism just like a total widespread busts. These recessions, Tigers and depressions are a cause of the ECB counterfeiting money (quantitative easing). They flood the economy with fiat currency and then wonder why they're getting malinvestments. What we need is stable growth over a long period, real growth with plenty of saved capital. This cannot be the case now because the very people you're defending are introducing new taxes which will take more money out of the economy. You can't tax your way out of recession.

And I disagree, ALL banks should of failed - forget about central banks. Central banks are the enemy of the people. If you want a system of capitalism, you cannot have a central bank with the power to increase the money supply, period. And you'll never change the attitudes to finance because we're human..we make mistakes and it won't be the last time. The only thing you can do which I'm sure your friends are certainly not in favour of being the scumbags that they are is to insert a balance budget amendment into the Constitution so that these cretins never borrow beyond their means again and then have us foot the bill when the wolves are at the door.

Take it from me, Enda Kenny is NOT the answer to our problems. He never was and he never will be because the man is exactly the same as FF...a fascist.

southsiderosie

tayto lover wrote: »

Oh are your feathers getting ruffled just like Enda's hair ?

mikom wrote: »

The must have been big fans of thunderbirds in their youth.

maddragon wrote: »

Is that you Fionnuala.

MOD NOTE:

Folks, this kind of posting is better suited to the Politics Cafe or AH.

Off-topic posts deleted, although I would refer the "Thunderbirds" poster to the "Political lookalikes" thread in the Cafe.

Let's get back on track here, thanks.

View

_Gawd_ wrote: »

Take it from me, Enda Kenny is NOT the answer to our problems. He never was and he never will be because the man is exactly the same as FF...a fascist.

Just because Enda K doesn't agree with your political opinions doesn't make him a facist.

jank

_Gawd_ wrote: »

The people are not to blame - every Tom, Dick and Harry went into AIB and came out with a loan. Why wouldn't they? .

Serious? I am flabbergasted at this statement.

You absolve responsibility of the people, yet claim everyone walked into a bank out of their own free will to get a loan, yet are not to blame for a property bubble. Serious identity issues there.

"I didnt kill the man Garda, the gun did"

jank

View wrote: »

Just because Enda K doesn't agree with your political opinions doesn't make him a facist.

Agreed, otherwise prove to us what his facist tendancys are?
Is he trying to ban other political parties for example? Or passing legislation that will discriminate on the basis of sex/religion/race etc.?

jank

On Enda, I agree he is doing better than allot of people are giving him credit for and I knew he would surprise people. The media don't hold people from rural Ireland with much light. If your a minister or a leader who is not from Dublin, you are going to get more stick. thats a given.

At least he has a strategic plan in place to get Ireland out of the mire they were in. All you have to do is go back 12-18 months and look at the state of the country then under FF and Cowen and co. The country was in a perpetual crisis and there was no knowing how bad it was going to get. There was times where you actually feared for the future viability of the state.

At least now we have a bit of stability. Bond yields have halved. Negotiations under way on the promissory notes that will hopefully ease the debt burden. Greek debt is now isolated to a certain extent so a more open and liberal deal on Ireland is still possible. There is talk of entering the bond market sometime next year which would be great news.

On the home front, Croke Park is still there but that is Labours baby and I believe that when/if the "reforms" promised by the unions fail to materialise then Enda and FG will take out the axe and start chopping. They are playing the long game here.

I would like more though on the political reforms front and I understand the constitutional convention is due to be held later in the year. I also understand that the eyes of the government are probably on other things like the EU treaty, promissory notes etc so they cant do everything you want in one year. Hopefully though they will get their asses in gear on this sooner rather than latter.


On a side note, it is natural to think that your own leaders and politicans are the worst in the world and they bring a certain shame onto the country. OK, Cowen was pretty bad alright in appearance and ability.

Here in Australia lots of people hate Julia Gillard but what they hated more was Kevin Rudd who was foreign affairs minister. He was seen as aloof, weak and needy. Compared to the strong and steely Chinese, Israelis, Russians. Everyone thinks their own leaders are the worst when in reality other countries don't really care.

Enda carries himself well enough, talks well enough, and plays a good game in drumming up positivity about Ireland. You would swear that some people would want him to talk Ireland down judging by some of the Joe Duffy brigade.

"The country is on its knees, Joe!!!!!, nd there Enda's talking Ireland up to American Businessmen, its a disgrace Joe!!!!!"

Carlos_Ray

darkman2 wrote: »

Sorry to burst the bubble but the average Irish person is partly to blame for this mess. That's a fact. No gun was put to the head of "average" Irish people that went mad on credit which was a darn large percentage of "average" Irish people. People choose to live beyond their means. Now they get the swing of it and must take responsibility for their failings in financial discipline.

The recession wasn't caused by the "average" person though. It was caused by failures and corruption at a much higher level in global financial institutions (including Ireland). The knock on effect in Ireland, uncovered a lot of flaws within Irish society, one of which was people living in houses etc, they couldn't afford. However, as was already mentioned this situation was orchestrated by the banks, who not only advised people to take out loans and buy property etc, but actually scared them into doing so. In the last three years of the boom the message coming out from the majority of government associated economists was " if you don't get on the property ladder now, you'll never be able to afford to get on it." The insane real estate rush in Ireland was great for politicians, banks, and builders, as brown envelopes were thrown around like confetti.Despite this, Enda Kenny (like his predecessors) has refused to take on the big boys who are truly responsible for the disaster, preferring instead to let average Joe take the brunt of blame and cost.

Of course Irish people should honour their debts, however, to blame them for what happened with the economy at best betrays a total lack of understanding of economic affairs, and at worst is a cowardly calculated act designed to divert attention.

southsiderosie

MOD NOTE:

As a reminder, the topic of this thread is Enda Kenny's performance as taoiseach, not the cause(s) of the economic crisis. I know there is a fine line here when discussing how Kenny has led the country in a time of economic crisis, but let's not get bogged down in the 'whose fault is it anyway' debate.

later12

I have two problems with Enda Kenny

(i) I share the growing concern that Enda Kenny doesn't fully engage with economic arguments pertaining to the European debt crisis. That's acceptable when if one thinks that he sees himself more as an executive chairman than a managing director. The awkward truth for Kenny is that when he is sitting at a table in European and Eurogroup summits, his role is as a director. His role is strategy,not oversight. So a lack of understanding of the economic and financial detail is problematic when we are sitting at home expecting him to be making arguments on strategy.

(ii)He appears to have established no policy unit as exists in many other jurisdictions whereby an 'executive chairman' type of leader can oversee the adherence of his Government to established policy direction, and which can evaluate Government performance in meeting targets and deadlines.

All we seem to have gotten so far are vague, qualitative assessments of Ministers' performances based one interview conducted by Kenny himself.

At a time of such crucial structural reforms, Enda Kenny needs a policy unit to alert him to Ministerial progress on an ongoing basis, alerting him to any problems that require immediate attention, and to evaluate performance in line with changes in the national economic outlook. To date, there seems to be no objective basis for this sort of continuous assessment. I find that strange, and slightly worrying.

_Gawd_

View wrote: »

Just because Enda K doesn't agree with your political opinions doesn't make him a facist.

Fascism is state power coupled with corporate power. Almost all western governments across the globe now participate in this little backstratch. The modern word is called corporatism. FG = support bailed out banks = fascists. Or has fascism now become mainstream, does this mean we must tolerate it??

jank wrote: »

Serious? I am flabbergasted at this statement.

You absolve responsibility of the people, yet claim everyone walked into a bank out of their own free will to get a loan, yet are not to blame for a property bubble. Serious identity issues there.

"I didnt kill the man Garda, the gun did"

I don't know what you're talking about. I don't blame the people - I blame the ECB printing money and the banks not operating under business principles. Let the people borrow as much as they want so long as the banks fall - it's their loss for being too stupid to compete in the modern world.

_Gawd_

jank wrote: »

Agreed, otherwise prove to us what his facist tendancys are?
Is he trying to ban other political parties for example? Or passing legislation that will discriminate on the basis of sex/religion/race etc.?

Your first mistake was thinking fascism only came in the form of Hitler. It has many faces.

Godge

darkman2 wrote: »

I have been fairly impressed with Enda Kenny since he became Taoiseach. I did not think he would be good at all before he got the job and like many thought FG should have got rid of him before the last election.

How wrong I was to think that now. He has proven to be able to represent us very well abroad and I am really surprised at that. He has a fantastic energy and drive about him. I was just looking at some tweet from a couple of traders on the wall street trading floor who seemed pretty impressed and he seems to be handling interviews very well. And he LOOKS the part. And that is something we have not been use to for a VERY long time. It's refreshing to see our leader even dressed properly.

What i'm wondering here is is my reassessment of Enda Kenny fair OR has it to do with getting over the shock of Cowen of Taoiseach rather then Enda's abilities (let's face it the smurfs would have given us more credibility then Cowen)?

And is my reassessment shared? I think he is doing quite well and deserves a bit of credit.

Have to agree with your assessment of Kenny.

Some people on this thread need anger management courses.

_Gawd_

Godge wrote: »

Have to agree with your assessment of Kenny.

Some people on this thread need anger management courses.

And some people need educational courses.

southsiderosie

MOD NOTE:

Let's stop the sniping and get back on topic (which is not fascism!).

There will not be any more warnings on this thread.

Godge

_Gawd_ wrote: »

And some people need educational courses.

I couldn't agree with you more:D.

If people were educated enough to understand that the crisis was brought about by a combination of ten years of stupid FF policies on spending and taxation, a poorly regulated banking system, an international downturn, a monumentally stupid decision of the FF government in September 2008 to guarantee the banks and most of all, the stupidity of the Irish electorate both in continually re-electing that FF government and also indulging themselves in an illogical frenzy to become propety owners whatever the price.

That education combined with a course to direct their anger away from the people sorting out the mess (the current government) and to working out the issues rather than casting blame.

The OP is right, Kenny has done well, we are further down the road to recovery than I thought possible when they were elected.

_Gawd_

Godge wrote: »

I couldn't agree with you more:D.

If people were educated enough to understand that the crisis was brought about by a combination of ten years of stupid FF policies on spending and taxation, a poorly regulated banking system, an international downturn, a monumentally stupid decision of the FF government in September 2008 to guarantee the banks and most of all, the stupidity of the Irish electorate both in continually re-electing that FF government and also indulging themselves in an illogical frenzy to become propety owners whatever the price.

That education combined with a course to direct their anger away from the people sorting out the mess (the current government) and to working out the issues rather than casting blame.

The OP is right, Kenny has done well, we are further down the road to recovery than I thought possible when they were elected.

Fianna Fail were stupid, but no more stupid than other governments across the world. The international downturn is not some unexplained phenomena. Austrians have been predicting this for years. It was Ludwig von Mises that predicted the great depression in the 20's. It's not a mystery and it's infuriating the way we see these people on TV looking like nobody knew what happened...it's ludicrous, it just doesn't mathematically add up. You cannot inflate the money supply...period! When will they EVER LEARN????

Regulation does nothing..we don't need more regulation, we need companies to go bust, simple. When there is talk of regulation, who are the first one's to be called? The top dogs in that particular industry getting the bailouts. It was the banks regulating and it will be the banks regulating their own industry again. Is there anything more ridiculous. Forget about regulations...if someone acts the maggot, they go out of business no ifs buts or maybes about it. Then they'll learn...quick.

We're nowhere near recovery because you seem to be forgetting one very important fact. This is not the first recession. There were many before and there will be many to come. Unless the economic system is changed, we'll continue these booms and busts.

JoeGil

Have to agree that Kenny has performed well since coming into government.

He has been very successful in molding the two coalition parties into a cohesive and effective government.

The economy has stabilised and while there is a long hard road ahead people can at least now see light at the end of the tunnel.

Internationally he has strengthened relationships with Europe and US and this will benefit the country in the long run.

kippy

Good points:
Relationships with UK, US, China, India appear to have been strengthened and improved upon.
He is definetly a far better public figure than Cowan and is up there with the best when it comes to delivering a speech.
He appears genuine and has a grasp on many facets of Irish life - he projects an honest image.
Some reputational damage has been reversed to a point.
The apparent change in attitude to the sex scandals that have engulfed the church is welcome.
A lot of what was promised is being delivered, or at least the process has begun.


Bad points.
There have been some complete turnarounds in what was promised versus what has been delivered - some of this can be put down to constraints they are under but they were aware of this at some point.
Still a large amount of political reform required. Still very little accountability, one only has to look at special advisors, the inkgate incident etc.

We are still at the mercy of EU/IMF and will be for a long time to come.
Yet again there is a lot of "turning the corner talk". We wont get close to turning any corners until the final of the "negative" budgets are out of the way. That is, on current policy a least 4 years down the road, and that is very very much dependent on figures which, in my opinion are way off.


There are lots more I could add but they are the main ones.

Bullseye1

This government has done nothing to improve our internal market. So I'll hold off on giving praise until I see some improvement on that front.

K-9

Steadied the ship, no more no less, can't think of any major achievement. Got a few percentage points of the EU money, retained and intensified efforts on getting new employers here, kept to the FF budget targets and well, can't really think of much else.

Never kept the minister report card promise, 100 day review promises, useless PR speak but would have been entertaining if nothing else.

The big challenges are ahead, the first political one is how he handles the Household charge debacle and climbs down with as little egg on his face as possible.

jank

_Gawd_ wrote: »

Fascism is state power coupled with corporate power. Almost all western governments across the globe now participate in this little backstratch. The modern word is called corporatism. FG = support bailed out banks = fascists. Or has fascism now become mainstream, does this mean we must tolerate it??

That is a hilarious statement.

_Gawd_ wrote: »

I don't know what you're talking about. I don't blame the people - I blame the ECB printing money and the banks not operating under business principles. Let the people borrow as much as they want so long as the banks fall - it's their loss for being too stupid to compete in the modern world.

The 2nd part I agree with, the banks should have been let fail, yet to you the people are still free of all blame. By your own simple logic. People want money = banks give them money = banks are corporations = people who borrow money are fascists = em.... New world order? I dont know, insert whatever you want as you sure do know how to make stuff up.

jank

K-9 wrote: »

The big challenges are ahead, the first political one is how he handles the Household charge debacle and climbs down with as little egg on his face as possible.

There can and will be no climb down on this. It simply HAS to happen, otherwise the government will have to give up on introducing new taxes to cut the deficit. The execution of it has not been great but people from the ULA have a lot to answer for IMO. They are fooling people, just as FF fooled them for years. Money grows on trees apparently.

Only in Ireland do people want no tax increases at all, yet want to maintain the level of services while also still running a 16 billion euro deficit.

Anyway, its written into the bailout package so it has to happen.

darkman2

lol - looks like Enda just copied one of O'bama's speeches again at the reception tonight:D

Yes, our challenges are tough. But we meet them head on. And because we know that every nation becomes what it ‘envisions’, we are envisioning success, this time a more authentic success…
Mr President, like you we believe Ireland’ s best days are still ahead. Like you, we believe that our greatest triumphs are still to come. When you came to Ireland, like your predecessor John F Kennedy, you made us dream again.
On these days of St Patrick we hope that you will fulfil his promise, to come home again in the Springtime.

K-9

jank wrote: »

There can and will be no climb down on this. It simply HAS to happen, otherwise the government will have to give up on introducing new taxes to cut the deficit. The execution of it has not been great but people from the ULA have a lot to answer for IMO. They are fooling people, just as FF fooled them for years. Money grows on trees apparently.

Only in Ireland do people want no tax increases at all, yet want to maintain the level of services while also still running a 16 billion euro deficit.

Anyway, its written into the bailout package so it has to happen.

It's gone past the stage of having to happen, speaking as somebody who has advocated it and sees no problem with it. If he carries on with this into the Summer he will look weak and a very poor politician, this €100 charge was badly advised from the start. He, his advisers and Ministers had plenty of time to organise it properly, they didn't.

There is room in the bail out package, especially on €160 Million, I'd worry about the long term effects of an annual charge that could have had an income of a Billion a year being so mishandled, our bail outers could well just give up on it, and find it from somewhere else.