Rogue US soldier went on rampage in Afghanistan, 10 civilians dead, five wounded!

RichieC

uncle_sam_ie wrote: »

That's why US military and Washington are pushing the lone gun man theory. They 're trying to cover this up just like they did at My Lai http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Lai_Massacre

Three US servicemen who had tried to halt the massacre and protect the wounded were later denounced by several US Congressmen. They received hate mail and death threats and found mutilated animals on their doorsteps.[7] It was 30 years before they were honored for their efforts

the fug did I just read..

wes

The witnesses reports conflicting with the official reports isn't surprising, as the US is hardly known for telling the truth. I hope there is more investigation into what actually happened by someone other than the US army.

Manic Moran

The witnesses reports conflicting with the official reports isn't surprising, as the US is hardly known for telling the truth.

Afghans not being entirely truthful are not entirely unusual either. You'd be amazed how many sheep we killed with observed indirect fire...

For now, there's no reason to believe the lone actor story is not correct and frankly, it's far more reasonable than thinking that a group of troops in a more remote location had a low enough priority on staying alive that they'd get drunk. Besides, aren't some of the witnesses Afghan forces claiming to have seen the guy leave the base on his own?

As soon as he did leave the base he became a tourist.

Doesn't work that way. He would either be covered under SOFA or a form of diplomatic immunity. When Irish soldiers in Eritrea were up on charges of sex with an underage Eritrean, similar circumstances of unauthorised actions off-base applied, they were charged under the Irish military judicial system, not the Eritrean one.

the soldier's killing spree could have a devastating affect on the conflict, leading to countless retaliatory and counter-retaliatory deaths

Perhaps surprisingly to Western thinking, the reaction in Afghanistan to this is rather less than that of the accidental burning of the Korans a couple of weeks ago.

NTM

scudzilla

My son is 4 weeks away from completing his 6 month tour of Afghan, i spoke to him last night and he said you can cut the atmosphere wit a knife over there.

Normally on his FOB (Forward Operating Base) it's pretty secure and they can walk around normally, since this happened they're under instructions to take there loaded gun with them EVERYWHERE, to the bog, to bed, to eat etc.

Same happened around a month ago when some dumbass Yanks decided to burn a load of Koran's.

The Afghans/Taliban ain't distinguishing between Brit/American/other forces, they just see them as the same and want revenge for these actions.

Stupid yanks honestly don't see the bigger picture at all

MyKeyG

Ghandee wrote: »

I'd have imagined the compounds would have their own fully self sufficient bars no?
(genuine question)

No it's a Muslim country alcohol is prohibited. Even the occupying force has to obey the law. That merely means it can't be acquired publicly. While there are no bars I'm sure there's plenty of bootleg and black market grog available. Soldiers in the first gulf war used to have their families send liquor in shampoo bottles.

scudzilla

scudzilla wrote: »

Same happened around a month ago when some dumbass Yanks decided to burn a load of Koran's.

The Afghans/Taliban ain't distinguishing between Brit/American/other forces, they just see them as the same and want revenge for these actions.

Stupid yanks honestly don't see the bigger picture at all

no what is dumbass stupid is wishing to murder people over a book.

Wattle

Deleted User wrote: »

no what is dumbass stupid is wishing to murder people over a book.

It is stupid but how about avoiding that scenario by not burning the book in the first place?

RichieC

Manic Moran wrote: »

Afghans not being entirely truthful are not entirely unusual either. You'd be amazed how many sheep we killed with observed indirect fire...

That's it, Manic, appeal to our racism. The Afghanis are untrustworthy and why would the pentagon cover it up if it was indeed a group of drunk asshole soldiers?

How would one soldier kill 16 people, burn all the bodies and then get away?

It doesn't add up.

It wasn't me!

RichieC wrote: »

That's it, Manic, appeal to our racism.

Seriously? That's a bit tenuous. He's got personal experience of horseshít claims for non-existent dead sheep, hence his questioning of the assumption that the Afghans are automatically telling the truth.

dlofnep

Manic Moran wrote: »

Afghans not being entirely truthful are not entirely unusual either. You'd be amazed how many sheep we killed with observed indirect fire...

For now, there's no reason to believe the lone actor story is not correct and frankly, it's far more reasonable than thinking that a group of troops in a more remote location had a low enough priority on staying alive that they'd get drunk.

So what would it take for you to believe the eye witness reports from the Afghanis out of curiosity, or are their testimonies irrelevant? I'm not saying there wasn't a lone gunman - I've no knowledge on the incident. But if there are claims from witnesses who stated that other soldiers were present, then why would you casually disregard it?

wes

Manic Moran wrote: »

Afghans not being entirely truthful are not entirely unusual either.

I was talking abou tthe US government and military, both have been known to be less than truthfully.

You are talking about individuals, none of whom we can establish any kind of history of not being truthful. Hardly a fair comparison. Now if were talkng about the Afghan government, then fair enought, but individual eye witnesses is another story.

KeithAFC

There should be a UN investigation into this. The legacy of Presidents from the past is still carving a large shadow over the Yankee Army.

Zebra3

Nobody has any reason to believe anything the US military and political establishment say.

The reasons they gave for their violent attacks and occupations of Iraq and Afghanistan were both lies.

Everyone with half a brain knows they invaded those countries for their natural energy resources.

If they are prepared to lie over the reasons for causing the deaths of >100,000 people, they won't think twice about lying over the murder of sixteen.

RichieC

It wasn't me! wrote: »

Seriously? That's a bit tenuous. He's got personal experience of horseshít claims for non-existent dead sheep, hence his questioning of the assumption that the Afghans are automatically telling the truth.

Dead sheep they are trying to extort money. do these people get more compo if it was a group of soldiers over a single gunman?

Manic Moran

RichieC wrote: »

Dead sheep they are trying to extort money. do these people get more compo if it was a group of soldiers over a single gunman?

If they're getting paid money to say things? Sure. The opposition are not stupid, they know that the single largest vulnerability of ISAF is popular opinion in the West, and $10 will get you a long way over there. Throw around a few dollars here or there, and they get great value for money. If the going rate for emptying a magazine of AK at Americans, which is a fairly hazardous thing to do, is $20, I can't imagine that saying things, not particularly hazardous, is particularly pricey. Isn't it a great story? Not only do they get to sow seeds of conspiracy, better yet they get an extra un-Islamic offence in there as well, that of drinking.

Fairly detailed description of an eyewitness here http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2113973/US-soldier-fallen-blind-rage-rampage-killed-16-Afghan-civilians.html, as opposed to an ear-witness.

He said: 'I heard a gunshot. When I came out of my room, somebody entered our house. He was in a NATO forces uniform. I didn't see his face because it was dark.'
He said he quickly went into another room in the house, where animals were penned. He added: 'After that, I saw him moving to different areas of the house - like he was searching.'
His father, unarmed, then took a few steps out of his bedroom door. 'He was not holding anything - not even a cup of tea,' Zahir said. The soldier then shot his father. My mother was pulling my father into the room. I put a cloth on his wound

No indication of multiples here.

So what would it take for you to believe the eye witness reports from the Afghanis out of curiosity, or are their testimonies irrelevant?

The more fantastical they are, the less likely I'm inclined to give them much credence. Even Calley wasn't drunk. For those calling 'coverup', there are several significant issues to address. Firstly, the counter-accounts of only one person being involved. Secondly, how and why this one person ended up being selected as the fall guy. Thirdly, why any group of soldiers out in an outpost would get drunk in the first place: It tends to reduce your ability to shoot at people if they choose to attack you. Fourthly, what chances there are of 'the truth' coming out later, especially if this chap comes to trial and may be willing to say anything to share the blame and reduce his own sentence.

My son is 4 weeks away from completing his 6 month tour of Afghan, i spoke to him last night and he said you can cut the atmosphere wit a knife over there.

Normally on his FOB (Forward Operating Base) it's pretty secure and they can walk around normally, since this happened they're under instructions to take there loaded gun with them EVERYWHERE, to the bog, to bed, to eat etc.

No disrespect to my colleagues in (presumably) the British Army, but wandering around a war zone voluntarily leaving your rifle behind is a very odd concept to me, no matter how safe the base is supposed to be. Only showers and PT would be excused.

NTM

sxt

"Us Army seeking death penalty" for Soldier who killed 16 Afghan civilians

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/ap-newsalert-222

Seaneh

He should be tried in Afghanistan, under Afghani law and receive Afghani punishment if found guilty.

MadsL

Temptamperu wrote: »

well, thats what happens when you train people to kill people.

The IDF are only trained to advanced 'chinese burns' then are they. Absurd post.