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Chris Brown at the Grammys
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Em...NO!! That's exactly what I'm NOT saying!!
I'll try to be clearer:
1) When I object to the triumphant return of Chris Brown, people respond by saying that he has paid the price, done his time, everyone deserves a second chance, don't I believe in rehabilitation.
2) Hmmmm....I don't think people believe in rehabilitation and second chances across the board. To verify this, I mention Gary Glitter
3) Confirmed. People don't believe in rehabilitation or second chances across the board because (quite rightly), what Gary Glitter did was disgusting and despicable
4) OK Can we now move on from a blanket argument that people who have done a crime have the right to rehabilitation, and move on to discussing the nature of what he actually did, and why the public's response to that (even three years later) is actually important and sends a clear message to women about what happens to abusers. (i.e. we're still pretty much OK with them)
Your logic is flawed. You can't treat all crimes the same. If we stick with Chris Brown for a minute- this is his first and only crime/conviction. yes, it was a despicable act. Nobody here is denying that. However, there is always the possibility that he snapped-- this happens, both to men AND women. Women snap too, and attack men, quite viciously. However, this seems to have been a one-time act, which he admitted to, was charged with, and has appeared to rehabilitate himself from. This was not a premeditated attack (like rape), nor a sustained set of behaviours like child abuse.0 -
Actually no, it's not about what I want to see done to him. In fact, it's not really about him personally at all.
I'm just baffled by the public's response to him. The industry's response to him. This sends a very powerful message about how we see a man who beats up a woman.
Would everyone be so OK with a hero's welcome for the return of Gary Glitter?
if you were to villify every actor or musician who does something stupid or illegal in their past there'd be a long waiting list, not condoning what Brown did at all, he's a scumbag, but the public do tend to let stuff be forgotten, hey Ozzy Osbourne nearly murdered Sharon once, now he's seen as a loveable scatterbrained rocker. Sean Connery did an infamous interview where if advocated slapping a woman if "she deserved it" Cheryl Cole racially abused and assaulted a toilet attendant yet is seen as some sort of English rose despite being a complete knacker. Celebrities are people, they do stupid things at times same as anyone else just their transgressions are public knowledge. People tend to let celebrities off the hook faster than "normal" people due to being in the public eye.0 -
I'm trying to point out that there is a tendency to minimise gendered crimes against women. This thread is demonstrating it very well actually.
It was just a punch or two
It was his first offence
There are other celebrities who've done bad things.
Why is it so hard to just condemn what he did without qualification?
And why am I being shouted down by men in the Ladies Lounge???0 -
I'm trying to point out that there is a tendency to minimise gendered crimes against women. This thread is demonstrating it very well actually.
Well no. All this thread is doing is showing your ignorance to the actual reaction that Chris Brown received at the time and up until now. It seems you weren't paying attention.
it's also showing your hard-headedness in not realising that everybody is agreeing with you, it was a terrible thing that he did. But it is YOU who is MAXIMISING the crime rather than us minimising it!It was just a punch or two
Yes. A less serious crime than Child Molestation, which you brought up!It was his first offence
This is true, is it not?There are other celebrities who've done bad things.
Indeed. WHere were you when Cheryl Cole had a No.1 hit after being convicted of GBH?Why is it so hard to just condemn what he did without qualification?
It's funny how you think us thinking about the situation and considering the circumstance, and you blindly saying HANG HIM!!! is a failure on our part!And why am I being shouted down by men in the Ladies Lounge???
It's called discussion. You wanted just women's opinions was it? Really shows the strength of your convicitons TBH! This is not a discussion where there is a woman's POV and a man's POV.0 -
I'm trying to point out that there is a tendency to minimise gendered crimes against women. This thread is demonstrating it very well actually.
It was just a punch or two
It was his first offence
There are other celebrities who've done bad things.
Why is it so hard to just condemn what he did without qualification?
And why am I being shouted down by men in the Ladies Lounge???
nobodies condoning what he did at all, so I dunno where you're getting that from, and nobodies shouting you down either, once again:In 2008, Brown's musical setbacks were partially attributed to a domestic assault. He turned himself in to the Los Angeles Police Department's Wilshire station on February 8, 2009, and was booked on suspicion of making criminal threats, while under investigation for domestic violence charges, following an argument with an unidentified woman (Rihanna). Following his arrest, several of his commercial ads were suspended, his music was withdrawn from multiple radio stations, and he withdrew from public appearances, including one at the 2009 Grammy Awards.
On August 25, Brown was sentenced to five years of probation, one year of domestic violence counseling, and six months of community service; the judge retained a five-year restraining order on Brown, which requires him to remain 50 yards away from Rihanna, 10 yards at public events.
In June 2010, Brown's application for a visa to enter the UK was refused on the grounds of him "being guilty of a serious criminal offence."[95] Brown had been planning to do a tour of British cities as part of a European tour but Sony stated that due to "issues surrounding his work visa" the tour was to be postponed. The British Home Office confirmed that Brown was refused permission on the grounds of being guilty of a serious criminal offence – his assault on ex-girlfriend Rihanna.
all seems like fair justice for a singular domestic violence charge (as far as I know, not sure if it was an ongoing thing or the one incident), what exactly do you want? if it was Rihanna who assaulted him and she got the same punishment i'd be saying the exact same thing.0 -
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I'm trying to point out that there is a tendency to minimise gendered crimes against women. This thread is demonstrating it very well actually.
It was just a punch or two
It was his first offence
There are other celebrities who've done bad things.
Why is it so hard to just condemn what he did without qualification?
And why am I being shouted down by men in the Ladies Lounge???
MrStuffins and others have pointed out with their example of Cheryl Cole having a conviction for GBH, which is probably just one example of that, the same thing happened- she was given a sentence, she served it, and was allowed rehabilitate herself and given another chance. I'm sure if Chris brown or Cheryl Cole were to offend in a same manner again, they'd be ostracised- because it becomes clear their crimes are a long standing problem behaviour.
I do condemn what he did. Violence is a despicable thing. Pretty much everyone here agrees with that. but like I would say for pretty much any crime, that people who have served their time, shown remorse and genuinely rehabilitated themselves in the eyes of the law should be given a second chance. From murder, to rape, to domestic abuse to theft; i don't believe in demonising anyone, male or female for a crime they have committed once they use the time of their incarceration/ parole to work on themsleves and change.
Also: I am female. Just for the record.0 -
I brought up Gary Glitter to show that people only believe in second chances and rehabilitation when it suits them. I wasn't comparing the two crimes myself, or trying to make any judgements on greater or lesser crimes (although I was assuming others would). I generally don't see the value in saying 'well this crime isn't so bad because this OTHER crime is worse'. So that's not what I was trying to do. Apologies if it came off that I was (despite repeatedly trying to explain that I wasn't...)
So I do find it a bit weird to compare Chris Brown beating up his girlfriend with Cheryl Cole assaulting someone in a nightclub. Does no one else see them as different? That to me would be more worrying...
And anyway, the reason I brought this to the Ladies Lounge rather than AH or anywhere else, is because I am looking at the gender issues at play in this situation (and these don't apply in Cheryl's situation).
It's the same with Mike Tyson's getting a 'hilarious' cameo in one of the most successful movies of the last decade. He is a rapist and I found it uncomfortable that he was given such a high profile role, and yet the same actors wouldn't work with Mel Gibson.
It's not about the specifics of the case itself and what exact punishment Chris Brown got. For me it's about how the culture we live in deals with and talks about men who commit gendered violence (and further to that rape and sexual assault). All these things commit to a rape culture and are worth discussing IMO.
p.s. I don't see how I could possibly be 'maximising' the crime. I do think it's a pretty huge deal what he did, and I don't think I'm overstating it.0 -
If that Brown lad did that to my sister or daughter he would'nt be able to talk never mind sing.Did you see the pictures of Rihanna after it.. black and blue she was.0
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saintsaltynuts wrote: »If that Brown lad did that to my sister or daughter he would'nt be able to talk never mind sing.Did you see the pictures of Rihanna after it.. black and blue she was.
Saintsaltynuts, we don't advocate violence in any way on this board. Please don't post in this style again, thanks.0 -
I brought up Gary Glitter to show that people only believe in second chances and rehabilitation when it suits them.
Well you have, again, failed to understand the points of others. it's nothing to do with "when it suits them". It's about taking things on their merits. You did yourself nothing but a disservice by bringing Gary Glitter into this!I wasn't comparing the two crimes myself, or trying to make any judgements on greater or lesser crimes (although I was assuming others would). I generally don't see the value in saying 'well this crime isn't so bad because this OTHER crime is worse'. So that's not what I was trying to do. Apologies if it came off that I was (despite repeatedly trying to explain that I wasn't...)
Well you shouldn't have said things like:We should only give second chances and warm comeback welcomes to people who have commited 'less serious' offences. Like, you know, beating up women.So I do find it a bit weird to compare Chris Brown beating up his girlfriend with Cheryl Cole assaulting someone in a nightclub. Does no one else see them as different? That to me would be more worrying...
I find it hilarious that your own argument is now turning on you and you're now becoming one of the people you are complaining about in the thread.And anyway, the reason I brought this to the Ladies Lounge rather than AH or anywhere else, is because I am looking at the gender issues at play in this situation (and these don't apply in Cheryl's situation).
Ah well that makes it ok for the world to forgive Cole, because her assault was only race-related! :rolleyes:
Also, gender issues go both ways.It's not about the specifics of the case itself and what exact punishment Chris Brown got. For me it's about how the culture we live in deals with and talks about men who commit gendered violence (and further to that rape and sexual assault). All these things commit to a rape culture and are worth discussing IMO.
Whoa whoa! What the hell has rape got to do with any of this? I think you're really scraping the barrell now!p.s. I don't see how I could possibly be 'maximising' the crime. I do think it's a pretty huge deal what he did, and I don't think I'm overstating it.
No, but what you're doing is saying the man shouldn't be allowed get on with his life after what he did. Despite the fact he has been through the processes he has been through and has been vilified the way he has for the amount of time he has!
You keep saying things like "he has not been demoted, marginalised or ostracised in ANY way for this". This is just plain wrong!
You said "But not by the people in power, the people with influence." too but when I asked what should happen to him you won't answer.
Again, it seems you are misinformed about what has actually gone on here! For some reason you think he assaulted Rihanna and everyone just said "meh".
This was not the case! If you think he hasn't been vilified for this you've had your head in the sand. If you don't think what has went on with him is enough, please make it clear what exactly should be done?0 -
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I actually have very little interest in having to defend, point-by-point, why the celebration of a woman-abuser makes me uncomfortable.
I have no idea why people want to prove me wrong that this shouldn't make me uncomfortable or angry.
So while it might suit you that I quote your post line by line and dissect each part and look for holes in logic or inconsistencies, and in other arguments I am very willing to do this, it just misses the entire issue for me at the moment.
I do think there are a lot of women out there who are really angry when someone who beats women or someone who abuses women in other ways is celebrated in the media. And we don't think it's no big deal or something we should get over.
but I'd be more worried of the effect it has on other women - to silence them. As Sasha Pasulka put it better than me in that article I linked to:
"We – the grown-up influencers in this country, the people with platforms and with educations and with power — are allowing a clear message to be sent to women: We will easily forgive a person who victimizes you. We are able to look beyond the fact that you were treated as less than human, that a bigger, stronger person decided to resolve a conflict with you through violence. We know it happened, but it’s just not that big of a deal to us."0 -
I actually have very little interest in having to defend, point-by-point, why the celebration of a woman-abuser makes me uncomfortable.
Then don't start a thread on the subject!I have no idea why people want to prove me wrong that this shouldn't make me uncomfortable or angry.
it's not about proving you wrong. This isn't a black & White subject (unlike Cheryl Cole's one :P )So while it might suit you that I quote your post line by line and dissect each part and look for holes in logic or inconsistencies, and in other arguments I am very willing to do this, it just misses the entire issue for me at the moment.
Yes i'm not surprised by this. You haven't really backed up anything you've said. You haven't really put forward any kind of argument except for seeing to say this man should be crucified for the rest of his life.I do think there are a lot of women out there who are really angry when someone who beats women or someone who abuses women in other ways is celebrated in the media. And we don't think it's no big deal or something we should get over.
Well that's their problem. I, for one, think that everyone makes mistakes and does bad things. And there should come a point when, depending on the offence, the person should be allowed to get back to living their life.but I'd be more worried of the effect it has on other women - to silence them. As Sasha Pasulka put it better than me in that article I linked to:
"We – the grown-up influencers in this country, the people with platforms and with educations and with power — are allowing a clear message to be sent to women: We will easily forgive a person who victimizes you. We are able to look beyond the fact that you were treated as less than human, that a bigger, stronger person decided to resolve a conflict with you through violence. We know it happened, but it’s just not that big of a deal to us."
Yeah, it's all well and good to quote others but not actually contribute yourself.
Nobody has silenced Riahnna in this case by the way. In fact, I can't put on the f*ckin radio without hearing the woman!0 -
OK folks, can we dial it back a bit please - telling female posters what they should or should not post in a forum dedicated to them is not on.
Please respect that the OP posted in the Ladies Lounge over any other discussion forum and was interested in hearing ladies opinions - in line with the charter and purpose of this forum.
Cheers0 -
I shouldn't start a thread about a subject if I'm not willing to defend, point-by-point, how something makes me FEEL??
There's no other way to discuss something?
Seriously??
And I can't quote someone else (who expresses how I feel better than I can) because that means I have nothing to say myself? Did you even read her article?
Just because I don't want someone lauded and glorified, does not mean I want them crucified. Didn't YOU say this isn't black and white?0 -
"We – the grown-up influencers in this country, the people with platforms and with educations and with power — are allowing a clear message to be sent to women: We will easily forgive a person who victimizes you. We are able to look beyond the fact that you were treated as less than human, that a bigger, stronger person decided to resolve a conflict with you through violence. We know it happened, but it’s just not that big of a deal to us."
Nonsense.
How was Rihanna treated as less than human? Violence is wrong. Everyone thus far on the thread has agreed.
But you seem to want to put male on female violence into some special category where it is never forgiven. Ever. All violence is wrong, whether it's male on male, female on female, female on male or male on female. It's you who seems to have the double standard whereby it's ok to forgive cheryl Cole for assaulting another female, but Chris Brown can never be allowed to move on.0 -
To be honest I have to agree with MrStuffins on this, I do understand your frustration to a point Kooli, but your attitude seems so rigid and you have contradicted yourself when you first say that it is a gender issue, which is fine, but then you say
'So I do find it a bit weird to compare Chris Brown beating up his girlfriend with Cheryl Cole assaulting someone in a nightclub. Does no one else see them as different? That to me would be more worrying... '
As MrStuffins rightly said, gender issues go both way. So you are expecting me as a woman to get in line behind you simply because this was male on female violence, while dismissing female on female violence as unimportant and not in the same league. To me 'beating up' and 'assaulting' are pretty much the same thing and I feel that yes, he committed a terrible act, but that yes, he has served his time so to speak.
And the fact that you think just because its a ladies forum that all women will row in behind you and have a good old rant about how all men are b@stards is more than a bit patronisinig.0 -
To be honest I have to agree with MrStuffins on this, I do understand your frustration to a point Kooli, but your attitude seems so rigid and you have contradicted yourself when you first say that it is a gender issue, which is fine, but then you say
'So I do find it a bit weird to compare Chris Brown beating up his girlfriend with Cheryl Cole assaulting someone in a nightclub. Does no one else see them as different? That to me would be more worrying... '
As MrStuffins rightly said, gender issues go both way. So you are expecting me as a woman to get in line behind you simply because this was male on female violence, while dismissing female on female violence as unimportant and not in the same league. To me 'beating up' and 'assaulting' are pretty much the same thing and I feel that yes, he committed a terrible act, but that yes, he has served his time so to speak.
And the fact that you think just because its a ladies forum that all women will row in behind you and have a good old rant about how all men are b@stards is more than a bit patronisinig.
No of course I don't expect women to agree with me, but I don't expect to have to argue against men telling me repeatedly I'm wrong, and repeatedly claiming I'm saying something different to what I'm actually saying.
I think all violence is wrong. You can quote me on that.
But this thread is about domestic violence. Violence between intimate partners. This is a gendered crime - the vast majority is committed by one gender against the other. And I'm talking about the gender issues at play. I'm happy to talk about Cheryl Cole's assault in another thread if it's relevant, but her conviction didn't really touch off these same gender issues, so I'd prefer to leave it aside.
The fact is misogyny and sexism are genuine issues that affect millions of women, and when a man in the public eye viciously assaults a woman in the public eye - like beats her up. Hits her in the face repeatedly until she needs medical attention - it's important how the media and the industry react to that. That's what I'm discussing, so forgive me if I find it difficult to get derailed into discussions about general assault between two people of the same gender. Yes, it's terrible. But it doesn't affect gender issues, discrimination or power dynamics (although admittedly there may have been race issues involved, I don't remember the story that well, and if there were great let's talk about that some other time!)
So female on female violence is not unimportant. It's just not what I'm talking about here. If you think it's relevant to discuss the media's portrayal of girl on girl violence, I'd love to discuss it.
I don't expect you to get in line with me because you're female. Every female is entitled to have their own opinion. Sure go to his concerts and buy his albums if you like, that's your choice. But I would like to hear your perspective as a woman - how you feel about Chris Brown's triumphant return to public adulation, two years before his probation is even up. And don't let your dislike for my 'rigid' attitude colour your own opinion on the subject.
But I'm discussing my perspective which is specifically gendered, and for that reason I don't like men telling me I've no right to feel that way.
Tell me you disagree, fine. Ask me more about it, great. Try to understand how a situation like MIGHT make women feel uncomfortable, angry, oppressed - wonderful!
But tell me my feelings are wrong and that the issue is not an issue - nope, I'm not really OK with that.
I'm not speaking on behalf of all women. But I am, very much, speaking as a woman.0 -
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Point of order K. Up to 40% of domestic violence is committed by women upon men. http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/sep/05/men-victims-domestic-violenceBut this thread is about domestic violence. Violence between intimate partners. This is a gendered crime - the vast majority is committed by one gender against the other.
For the mobile users;
"Data from Home Office statistical bulletins and the British Crime Survey show that men made up about 40% of domestic violence victims each year between 2004-05 and 2008-09, the last year for which figures are available. In 2006-07 men made up 43.4% of all those who had suffered partner abuse in the previous year, which rose to 45.5% in 2007-08 but fell to 37.7% in 2008-09."
It's anything but a "vast majority"
While I actually take many of your points on board re this Brown person, I state this Kooli simply because we don't like to see any blanket gender stereotyping in here, regardless of said gender.Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.
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Point of order K. Up to 40% of domestic violence is committed by women upon men.
OK, point taken.
It's still a gendered crime in that it affects women more than men, I retract the word 'vastly'.
I really disagree with gender stereotyping, so I hate to think it was interpreted as such.
But that doesn't mean it's not a gender issue. As I said, we live in a culture where sexism and misogyny are rife, and systems of oppression are still in operation, so it's important how the media and industries respond to an incident where a man beats the sh*t out of a woman, his partner.
(if a high profile woman beat up a high profile man, it would also be really important and sensitive how it was handled to in order not to diminish the crime or make light of it)0 -
I don't know whether he should be completely demonised career-wise as a result of something that happened in his private life (if very public an incident) but it was a fair bit more than a mistake...MrStuffins wrote: »I'm horrified that people still give a f*ck!
Yeah, he hit a woman. But that was so long ago. WHatever happened to forgive and forget? I hate this modern culture of "Wow, someone made a mistake, let's crucify them for th rest of their lives!!"
As if nobody else has ever done something they shouldn't have.
Domestic abuse is a very bad thing and he shouldn't have done what he did, but let the lad be!0 -
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His comeback has sickened me, truth be told. At the time, I really thought his career was over. Here's a great article about the whole thing.“We’re glad to have him back,” said executive producer Ken Ehrlich. “I think people deserve a second chance, you know. If you’ll note, he has not been on the Grammys for the past few years and it may have taken us a while to kind of get over the fact that we were the victim of what happened.”
Read that quote again. Think hard about what is being said. Here is what this quote says to any woman who’s ever been abused:- By blacklisting Chris Brown from the Grammys for a “few” years (actually, a grand total of TWO Grammy Awards), the Grammys have gone above and beyond expectations for the social exile of an adult man who hit his girlfriend so hard she went to the hospital, and honestly it was really, really hard for them to show even that much support for victims of domestic violence worldwide.
- It was rather thoughtless of Rihanna to go and get herself hit in the face by her boyfriend, because it’s put such a burden on the Grammys. Maybe if she hadn’t made such a big fuss out of it, things could have been easier for everyone.
- The Grammys think that they were the victim of Chris Brown hitting Rihanna in the face.
- The Grammys. Think. That they. Were the victim. Of Chris Brown. Hitting. Rihanna. In the face.
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His career should be non-existent anyway due to the fact that his music's sh*t.0
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I think that its so sad to see all the young girls tweeting and putting up Facebook status saying they would let Chris Brown beat them
I work in Domestic Violence services and as part of my work I go out to schools educating teenagers about healthy and unhealthy relationships, young impressionable girls are going to listen more to peers on social media than anything I would have to say
Truth of the matter is:
Teenage Girls face relationship violence 3 times more than adult women.
One in three teenagers have experienced violence in a dating relationship source: www.acadv.org
From both the groups I have run and Teenagers I have encountered, it has been my experience that like statistics on adult Domestic Abuse those statistics ring true for Ireland too.
It is sad to think Domestic Violence is going through a cool stage, doing so much damage to young adults way of thinking0 -
If people brought up my past everyday I'd feel I wouldn't be able to try fix things or make something of myself. He's gonna live with what he did for the rest of his life.
Yeah he beat up Rihanna, i'm sure he regrets and it was a mistake. I've made a million billion trillion mistakes, and if people brought them up every time I stepped outside my door, I wouldn't have done some of the things that i'm proud of because people would be focusing on the things I should be ashamed of. People make mistakes, life goes on.0 -
I think that its so sad to see all the young girls tweeting and putting up Facebook status saying they would let Chris Brown beat them
I work in Domestic Violence services and as part of my work I go out to schools educating teenagers about healthy and unhealthy relationships, young impressionable girls are going to listen more to peers on social media than anything I would have to say
Truth of the matter is:
Teenage Girls face relationship violence 3 times more than adult women.
One in three teenagers have experienced violence in a dating relationship source: www.acadv.org
From both the groups I have run and Teenagers I have encountered, it has been my experience that like statistics on adult Domestic Abuse those statistics ring true for Ireland too.
It is sad to think Domestic Violence is going through a cool stage, doing so much damage to young adults way of thinking
I disagree. I was in an abusive relationship for 18months and I didn't just take it because it was 'cool' and it would make me 'cool'? I took it because I was trapped and scared. I don't know anybody who thinks getting beaten up is in anyway cool. Just because people don't report it doesn't mean that they like what's happening to them,I think it's because they'e afraid.
I'm 19, my friends are around the same age and we've had a discussion about domestic violence on many occasions. We have the code words to use when we need help and can't ask for it out straight.We have plans that we're going to use in case we ever find ourselves in a relationship that turns into a violent or abusive one in anyway. In case we need to get out and run away.
IMO, there's not enough information available for victims of Domestic Violence, I had no idea (still don't tbh) of any numbers I could call or any place I could go to if I needed help.
Domestic violence is not going through a cool phase in my opinion, it never will. People are just so uneducated and unaware about it.
I do honestly think you're a fantastic person for what you do. To go around schools and raise awareness, inform people that it's not right. Fair play and you should be proud of yourself. Because I wish somebody told me, and you're helping a lot of people.0 -
It's not about crucifying him for his whole life. I don't think he has been crucified by anyone. At all. For ANY length of time.
He was never villified for this! OK yes he was by lots of strangers on the internet, great. But not by the people in power, the people with influence.
First you say this. And then when someone points out that he was dealt with by authorities (people in power), you say this:I'm not that bothered about how much punishment he gets from the legal system in America.
And then you ask afterwards again, having acknowledged the post on his sentence:What price did he pay for it?So I do find it a bit weird to compare Chris Brown beating up his girlfriend with Cheryl Cole assaulting someone in a nightclub. Does no one else see them as different? That to me would be more worrying...
And anyway, the reason I brought this to the Ladies Lounge rather than AH or anywhere else, is because I am looking at the gender issues at play in this situation (and these don't apply in Cheryl's situation).
I'm curious as to how you view the Chris Brown and Ceryl Cole incidences as different? Is it based only on the fact that he's a guy who hit a women?
The two crimes are alike imo. Person hits person.
Both have done very well to come back from their mistakes. I'm not a fan of either but I don't see the point in vilifying them forever over one mistake.
It was a stupid thing to do on both their behalf but they have paid the price deemed acceptable to the authorities.
The one thing that I remember, and I'm open to correction here, is that Chris Brown seemed to face his crime and was willing to do what was asked in his sentence. He didn't hide away from the fact of try and make it less of a big deal.
He did something horrible, acknowledged it, served his sentence and is trying to move on.
If reports are to be believed, Rhianna herself has forgiven him. If the victim can forgive then I see no reason why others can't.
I'm female if it matters to you.0 -
Honestly it disgusted me to see him celebrated. It baffled me that he could do that to Rihanna and then two years later be lauded by his peers.
However that's my emotive reasoning.
Logically, he committed his crime and did his time. The slate has to be wiped clean now.0 -
OkayWhatever wrote: »I disagree. I was in an abusive relationship for 18months and I didn't just take it because it was 'cool' and it would make me 'cool'? I took it because I was trapped and scared. I don't know anybody who thinks getting beaten up is in anyway cool. Just because people don't report it doesn't mean that they like what's happening to them,I think it's because they'e afraid.
I'm 19, my friends are around the same age and we've had a discussion about domestic violence on many occasions. We have the code words to use when we need help and can't ask for it out straight.We have plans that we're going to use in case we ever find ourselves in a relationship that turns into a violent or abusive one in anyway. In case we need to get out and run away.
IMO, there's not enough information available for victims of Domestic Violence, I had no idea (still don't tbh) of any numbers I could call or any place I could go to if I needed help.
Domestic violence is not going through a cool phase in my opinion, it never will. People are just so uneducated and unaware about it.
I do honestly think you're a fantastic person for what you do. To go around schools and raise awareness, inform people that it's not right. Fair play and you should be proud of yourself. Because I wish somebody told me, and you're helping a lot of people.
I think the major problem with it is demonstrated by that link that shows however many teenage girls saying they would be ok with someone like Chris Brown beating them. This shows that in the public eye his actions really have not received enough negative press. While legally he has served his time (well not yet, he is still on probation) but I think it would do the world of good for him to acknowledge the attitudes of these teenagers as wrong. He should be allowed get on with his life but he has chosen a career in the public eye and he should take a little bit more responsibility for the results of his behaviour. And if there was a huge amount of young impressionable girls posting about how committing and racially targeted assault was cool to be like Cheryl Cole, I would have the same opinion on her responsibility to make a public statement that this attitude is not ok.
I understand that Rihanna probably does not want to make her whole career about this, and just forget it like so many other women in her situation. But while releasing songs like 'Love the Way You Lie' and 'S&M', while not really making a statement about how awful his actions were she is sending mixed messages to young impressionable people which I dont think is hugely responsible.0 -
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OkayWhatever wrote: »I disagree. I was in an abusive relationship for 18months and I didn't just take it because it was 'cool' and it would make me 'cool'? I took it because I was trapped and scared. I don't know anybody who thinks getting beaten up is in anyway cool. Just because people don't report it doesn't mean that they like what's happening to them,I think it's because they'e afraid.
Domestic violence is not going through a cool phase in my opinion, it never will. People are just so uneducated and unaware about it.
Apologies firstly if my post came across that I thought people would stay in an abusive relationship because they thought it was cool, I in no way meant that.
I understand there are very complex dynamics to an abusive relationship and that leaving is not an easy option
I agree that majority of people are uneducated and unaware of & about abusive relationships, often even people in abusive relationships are uncertain and doubt themselves about what is happening. Abusers are clever and minimise what they are doing, in order to continue doing it.
I find it really disturbing that things I have heard from some of the students I have encountered since the whole Chris Brown/ Rhiannon thing, things guys have said has been along the lines of well he hit her and she is one of the hottest women so why shouldnt I do it? Girls must like it
Girls have said if even Rhiannon's bf hits her we cant expect our boyfriend to be an angel, you have to put up with some stuff
From what I am seeing in schools a lot of girls now expect to be mistreated in some way and a lot of guys think it ok to be "a bad boy" as they see it. There are people justifying both their actions and their behaviours based on both what was reported about that incident and the hype that has followed.
Rhiannon and Chris Brown are seen as cool figures in the media, if violence towards a partner is part of their lives, sadly some people do see it as made acceptable on a level, and very sadly some abusers are saying that its "hot " and "cool" and "edgy"
There is a certain permissiveness about seeing figures who act that way (Chris Brown) in the spot light,
When I state that violence or abuse towards a partner is never acceptable, some boys have been honest and said they want to push boundaries more because things "arent as black and white as that anymore"0
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