eircom phonewatch & upc

schmegeggin

hi all

we currently have a wireless eircom phonewatch alarm with fixed phone line and looking at getting tv/broadband/phone package with upc, which would mean the fixed phone line would be dropped. so what i need to figure out is how do i connect upc phone to eircom panel without needing to involve eircom or do i have to get them involved or what is the best way to go about this?

is another option to go with a different monitoring company?

apologies if this has been asked before.
thanks

KoolKid

Eircom won't do it for you.
They will try & tell you it doesn't work so they can either keep your landline business or try to sell you a GSM dialler insted (Without informing you how easy it can be jammed)

Heres how you can do it yourself .


Get one double RJ 11 socket.


1 RJ 11 to RJ11 lead


At the rear of the socket wire red/black from socket 1 to line in on the dialler & blue/yellow from socket 2 to line out of the digi.

Connect RJ11 patch lead from Ph1 of the modem to socket 1 & plug the phone into socket 2. If there are other phone connections around the house these can also be connected to socket 2.
If you are patching in existing phone sockets around the house make sure you disconnect the external line coming into the house first.
Remember if the power goes off the line is dead. You can put a back up power supply or a UPS onto the modem, however if there is a power cut in the area there is a good chance UPC will be down anyway.

And yes any licenced company can take over the monitoring of your alarm. Possibly at a better price as well so shop around.

altor

schmegeggin wrote: »

hi all

we currently have a wireless eircom phonewatch alarm with fixed phone line and looking at getting tv/broadband/phone package with upc, which would mean the fixed phone line would be dropped. so what i need to figure out is how do i connect upc phone to eircom panel without needing to involve eircom or do i have to get them involved or what is the best way to go about this?

is another option to go with a different monitoring company?

apologies if this has been asked before.
thanks

If you ring P.W they will tell you it wont work and wont monitor the alarm using UPC. They will try sell you a GSM, unless they can poll this forget about that option. A lot of people just get it changed and P.W still monitor the alarm with no problems. Strange enough as they say it does not work :rolleyes:

legalizblack

altor wrote: »

schmegeggin wrote: »

hi all

we currently have a wireless eircom phonewatch alarm with fixed phone line and looking at getting tv/broadband/phone package with upc, which would mean the fixed phone line would be dropped. so what i need to figure out is how do i connect upc phone to eircom panel without needing to involve eircom or do i have to get them involved or what is the best way to go about this?

is another option to go with a different monitoring company?

apologies if this has been asked before.
thanks

If you ring P.W they will tell you it wont work and wont monitor the alarm using UPC. They will try sell you a GSM, unless they can poll this forget about that option. A lot of people just get it changed and P.W still monitor the alarm with no problems. Strange enough as they say it does not work :rolleyes:

GSM unit is really good.it's not that easy to jamm. €149 covers the gsm and you don't have to top it up like others. Cheaper than paying line rental.

altor

legalizblack wrote: »

GSM unit is really good.it's not that easy to jamm. €149 covers the gsm and you don't have to top it up like others. Cheaper than paying line rental.

Another lie. Why do you keep posting they are not easy to jam ?
What is you technical background to back up your claim ?

KoolKid

legalizblack wrote: »

GSM unit is really good.it's not that easy to jamm. €149 covers the gsm and you don't have to top it up like others. Cheaper than paying line rental.

I have seen numerous devices tested, they are extreemly easy to jam. Jamming devices are very cheep as well, So much so burglars leave them behind to prevent digis dialling out once they have gone.
If you are going to make such claims please back it up with some knowledge of their workings.

legalizblack

KoolKid wrote: »

legalizblack wrote: »

GSM unit is really good.it's not that easy to jamm. €149 covers the gsm and you don't have to top it up like others. Cheaper than paying line rental.

I have seen numerous devices tested, they are extreemly east to jam. Jamming devices are very cheep as well, So much so burglars leave them behind to prevent digis dialling out once they have gone.
If you are going to make such claims please back it up with some knowledge of their workings.

I'm not saying they can't be jammed. Seen them tested aswell.you have to be really close to the control panel to make sure it works.doesn't really work from outside unless you have a pretty big one which doesn't really happen on a domestic break in.how many examples can someone give of an Epw jammed? Same system( Simon xt made by GE) is used in US aswell and I think they are more advanced in jammers and stuff.unless you are ready to spend about 3-4k on some better security system then ePW it's the best one out there at an affordable price

legalizblack

legalizblack wrote: »

KoolKid wrote: »

legalizblack wrote: »

GSM unit is really good.it's not that easy to jamm. €149 covers the gsm and you don't have to top it up like others. Cheaper than paying line rental.

I have seen numerous devices tested, they are extreemly east to jam. Jamming devices are very cheep as well, So much so burglars leave them behind to prevent digis dialling out once they have gone.
If you are going to make such claims please back it up with some knowledge of their workings.

I'm not saying they can't be jammed. Seen them tested aswell.you have to be really close to the control panel to make sure it works.doesn't really work from outside unless you have a pretty big one which doesn't really happen on a domestic break in.how many examples can someone give of an Epw jammed? Same system( Simon xt made by GE) is used in US aswell and I think they are more advanced in jammers and stuff.unless you are ready to spend about 3-4k on some better security system then ePW it's the best one out there at an affordable price

I think the fact that more than 130k people are covered by ePW says a lot.

KoolKid

legalizblack wrote: »

I'm not saying they can't be jammed. Seen them tested aswell.you have to be really close to the control panel to make sure it works.doesn't really work from outside unless you have a pretty big one

I don't know what your backround is or what you tested but here's my experience.
We tested one from inside a monitoring station. I'll let you look up the specs. It wasn't a big unit & it wasn't expensive .
The unit blocked signals in the entire building & across the car park. Its also worth noting that when a signal is jammed your phone will still show a full signal untill you try to make a call.

legalizblack wrote: »

Unless you are ready to spend about 3-4k on some better security system then ePW it's the best one out there at an affordable price. This would include an external bell as well. How much do Eircom charge for that Optional Extra again??:rolleyes:

Again, I don't know what you are comparing against. You could get a system for well less that 1 k that would be a way higher spec than Eircoms panel. I would suggest you look up prices for HKC Quantum 70.
Also look at the specs & ask me how that compares to Eircoms Simon.

legalizblack wrote: »

I think the fact that more than 130k people are covered by ePW says a lot.

I says that marketing which involves reps who know nothing about alarms & will tell you anything for a sale works.

KoolKid

Hmmm.. Just noticed this on another thread

legalizblack wrote: »

at the moment I'm a sales rep for eircom phonewatch

An important bit of information , people should be aware of when judging what you are saying here.
So , speaking as an Eircom rep,can you tell me does Alarm Monitoring work over UPC?

legalizblack

KoolKid wrote: »

Hmmm.. Just noticed this on another thread

legalizblack wrote: »

at the moment I'm a sales rep for eircom phonewatch

An important bit of information , people should be aware of when judging what you are saying here.
So , speaking as an Eircom rep,can you tell me does Alarm Monitoring work over UPC?

No, because it's a digital line

KoolKid

Another eircom rep and another lie.
It does work. Please get some technical information before lying to people here.
I think you will find users on boards less prone to your tales than the OAPs you are used to telling these lies to.

legalizblack

KoolKid wrote: »

Another eircom rep and another lie.
It does work. Please get some technical information before lying to people here.
I think you will find users on boards less prone to your tales than the OAPs you are used to telling these lies to.

Dude, the fact that you clearly hate eircom and working with some other alarm company doesn't make you the only person that everyone should listen to Eircom is still the biggest one out there PW aswell so it doesn't really matter if monitoring works with UPC when Eircom doesn't do it

KoolKid

i don't hate any company. its the blatent lies that I hate. You come on here trying to promote eircom, but like all other reps you are prepared to lie. 2 Posts ago you said it doesn't work with UPC , now you come back saying it doesn't matter. When someone you are supposed to trust with the security of your home is willing to lie so easily and clearly has no technical knowledge of the system, that is a big concern.
PS Eircom phonewatch will work with UPC if you connect it. More lies!!
please get your facts right before posting such nonsense.

fred funk }{

Outed as an eircom rep Well spotted Koolkid.

Us in the industry have known about the lies eircom have been telling customers for years and finally one of them has been caught out telling porkies on line.

Stoner

legalizblack wrote: »

Dude, the fact that you clearly hate eircom and working with some other alarm company doesn't make you the only person that everyone should listen to Eircom is still the biggest one out there PW aswell so it doesn't really matter if monitoring works with UPC when Eircom doesn't do it

As someone not directly involved in the industry and as the other mod of this forum, legalizblack I assure you that I have no issues with PW and I wish them all the best in the new year.
We do however have an issue with false information being presented on boards for whatever reason, be it pushing a business or simply due to lack of understanding of the issues that are being discussed.
So please note that you are entitled to an opinion and debate is all the rage here but you can't knowingly post inaccurate information on the forum, that behaviour particularly when repeated will result in action from the mods.
I hope you take this post into consideration and continue to post in the forum, happy Christmas.

Thunderbird2

Mod edit.


Thunderbird , thank you for your comments, but note the general boards rules relating to being civil to others and companies.

End of edit.

Thunderbird2

Aww i was just being truthfull!

onlyme23

KoolKid wrote: »

Another eircom rep and another lie.
It does work. Please get some technical information before lying to people here.
I think you will find users on boards less prone to your tales than the OAPs you are used to telling these lies to.

Hi I'm really interested in this conversation, I have a PW Monitored alarm and eircom phone line, strongly considering changing to UPC, so where do I start, UPC have told me to contact phonewatch to get a GSM Unit? PW quoted me approx 200.00 , plus their monthly monitoring cost.

If you could advise on a, what and how to maintain alarm system, and if it can be monitored if I opt for UPC package, phoneline, broadband.

altor

onlyme23 wrote: »

Hi I'm really interested in this conversation, I have a PW Monitored alarm and eircom phone line, strongly considering changing to UPC, so where do I start, UPC have told me to contact phonewatch to get a GSM Unit? PW quoted me approx 200.00 , plus their monthly monitoring cost.

If you could advise on a, what and how to maintain alarm system, and if it can be monitored if I opt for UPC package, phoneline, broadband.

The UPC will give an analog line, this can be used to monitor the system. The down side is no electricity in the house, no line for the alarm to dial out. To get around this a back up power supply can be installed to give the unit power in the event of a power failure.

KoolKid

Eircom are lying to you if they say your UPC line wont work,it will.
They are also giving you very bad advice if they are recommending a GSM unit without inforing you of the risks re jamming.
My advice would be to shop around. Any licenced company can monitor your alarm and probably at a better price as well.

onlyme23

Thanks for your advise, I'll check these out.

KoolKid

Your welcome. Let us know how you get on.

johnfás

KoolKid wrote: »

Eircom won't do it for you.
They will try & tell you it doesn't work so they can either keep your landline business or try to sell you a GSM dialler insted (Without informing you how easy it can be jammed)

Heres how you can do it yourself .


Get one double RJ 11 socket.


1 RJ 11 to RJ11 lead


At the rear of the socket wire red/black from socket 1 to line in on the dialler & blue/yellow from socket 2 to line out of the digi.

Connect RJ11 patch lead from Ph1 of the modem to socket 1 & plug the phone into socket 2. If there are other phone connections around the house these can also be connected to socket 2.
If you are patching in existing phone sockets around the house make sure you disconnect the external line coming into the house first.
Remember if the power goes off the line is dead. You can put a back up power supply or a UPS onto the modem, however if there is a power cut in the area there is a good chance UPC will be down anyway.

And yes any licenced company can take over the monitoring of your alarm. Possibly at a better price as well so shop around.

We have a box like this inside our front door. The black cable leads to the outside world and the white cable leads to our hall phone socket and is then presumably wired up to our alarm and other sockets around the house. Would it be possible to replace the black cable with an rj11 to a UPC box and thus give life to all the sockets in the house and have functioning alarm monitoring? We aren't on phonewatch but rather an older alarm box to a monitoring company.

Cheers!

KoolKid

Replacing the pair on the black cable with a feed from the UPC box will work. The only thing you need to check if its an older digi is that its using DTMF tone dialling & not pulse.

johnfás

KoolKid wrote: »

Replacing the pair on the black cable with a feed from the UPC box will work. The only thing you need to check if its an older digi is that its using DTMF tone dialling & not pulse.

Thanks very much for your help. Do you know how I can find what sort of tone the alarm box is using? The model is called a Vista 5.

So basically I do the following?
1) Buy an RJ11 cable, strip one end of it and use some new of those gel connectors replacing all the wires on that black cable with those going to my RJ11.
2) Connect my RJ11 to my UPC box.
3) Probably buy one of these? http://www.ebay.ie/itm/Belkin-Active-Battery-Backup-400VA-240-Watts-20-Minute-Backup-Time-/110805361413?pt=UK_Computing_PowerSupplies_EH&hash=item19cc83a305#ht_500wt_1156

And then bob's my uncle?

KoolKid

johnfás wrote: »

Thanks very much for your help. Do you know how I can find what sort of tone the alarm box is using? The model is called a Vista 5.

So basically I do the following?
1) Buy an RJ11 cable, strip one end of it and use some new of those gel connectors replacing all the wires on that black cable with those going to my RJ11.

Yes, but it will only be one pair

johnfás wrote: »

2) Connect my RJ11 to my UPC box.
3) Probably buy one of these? http://www.ebay.ie/itm/Belkin-Active-Battery-Backup-400VA-240-Watts-20-Minute-Backup-Time-/110805361413?pt=UK_Computing_PowerSupplies_EH&hash=item19cc83a305#ht_500wt_1156

Yes.
A couple of things on the back up power supply.
Check its capacity against the UPC modem to see how long it will hold up.
Also bear in mind if there is a power cut in the area your UPC line will probably be down anyway.

cord

Sorry...a question on the side, if I may. Will an alarm texter work with upc or do I have to go the go the GSM route?

altor

cord wrote: »

Sorry...a question on the side, if I may. Will an alarm texter work with upc or do I have to go the go the GSM route?

Depends on the system you have installed. What system have you installed?

cord

SecureWatch by HKC...I think

altor

cord wrote: »

SecureWatch by HKC...I think

No, wont work with the HKC, a voice dialer will work in your case.

cord

Do I get the same facilities as texter with voice dialer, like zones that have been activated OR is it just prerecorded voice? GSM then?

altor

cord wrote: »

Do I get the same facilities as texter with voice dialer, like zones that have been activated OR is it just prerecorded voice? GSM then?

It is just a pre recorded message with the voice dialer. If you use the outputs some can give different messages for the different events. A GSM will give more info plus you also will have remote access to the panel. It also has outputs that can be triggered by text to control lights, heat.

cord

Last question and thank you for your help....you are always very helpful Wht would the cheapest gsm texter for alarm cost?

altor

cord wrote: »

Last question and thank you for your help....you are always very helpful Wht would the cheapest gsm texter for alarm cost?

Always happy to help

For your system if it is the 8/12 then €318 to buy in most wholesalers.

cord

More questions! Anyone heard/used a 2T SMS Text Dialler, manufactured in Ireland?

altor

cord wrote: »

More questions! Anyone heard/used a 2T SMS Text Dialler, manufactured in Ireland?

Heard but never used them, It would be interesting to see how this is priced compared to the HKC GSM-P although it wont give as much information as the HKC GSM for an activation. I will try find out tomorrow.

cord

Thanks Altor...I am trying to find that out too. the existing texter is very informative in that it texts me what comes up on the panel

altor

cord wrote: »

Thanks Altor...I am trying to find that out too. the existing texter is very informative in that it texts me what comes up on the panel

That will be the same as the HKC GSM. The GSM you linked to will just give alarm activation, Panic depending on the outputs its connected to. Hopefully find out more information from them tomorrow.

altor

The GSM costs €260 to buy. It is connected to the outputs on the control panel to indicate the alarm events. It can also be connected to a zone for turning on and off the alarm.

cord

Thank again Altor...which would you recommend? HKC GSM or the 2T SMS

KoolKid

The HKC would give you more control & would be more straightforward.

cord

Thanks Koolkid. I already have a texter card on my HKC 10/10. Will I need a new texter card or is that included in the GSM-P?

Sorry, I just looked at the alarm panel and I think its a 6 zone expanded to 10. Two zones have ID options. The texter plugs straight on to the board (black 4 lead Ribbon)

altor

cord wrote: »

Thank again Altor...which would you recommend? HKC GSM or the 2T SMS

If the panel was an 8/12 the HKC GSM would be the one to use. As your panel is a 6 zone panel you can not use the HKC GSM-P as it does not work on this panel. The other GSM will work in this case.

cord

Thanks again Altor, you must eat, sleep and work (on)Alarms

altor

cord wrote: »

Thanks again Altor, you must eat, sleep and work (on)Alarms

Your welcome cord, always try my best

bob11

Hi Guys,

Just in the process of transferring from Eircom to UPC and I also have PW, so I need to get my phoneline connected to the UPC modem some way.

I currently have my Eircom broadband modem in my hallway where I have a double RJ45 wall plate as below:




Currently the left port of this wallplate is my incoming phoneline and my PW is connected via a cable at the rear of this wallplate ..( The actual PW box is on a different floor)

The right hand port is a lan connection to my router and I have the LAN port from the adsl modem connected to this point.

Now my problem is that where I am planning to mount my UPC modem, I do not currently have access to the phone line, but it is in the same position as the Router.

I am thinking of using the RJ45 cable (currently carrying LAN from ADSL TO Router) to bring my Phone signal back to this double wallplate .
And then if I just look put a loop cable between ports 1 and 2 on my double wall plate, would this connect my PW to my UPC phone-line ?

Obviously I would need to disconnect the Eircom incoming line from the rear of Port 2, but would this work ?

I know that RJ45 and RJ11 ports / cables seem to be interchangeable some times, but I',m not 100% sure ...
Will an RJ45 connector fit into the analogue line out port on the UPC modem , or is it only RJ11 ?

I hope someone can understand what I'm trying to do :-)\

Thanks for any help ..

Cheers,

Bob

altor

You would need the line from the UPC connected to the point in the hall. The cable you have installed can be used. All you need to do is re-crimp the the cable with RJ11 head, plug into the UPC. Go to the hall and wire it direct onto the line that you will take the main cable off. If the phone has being given priority already all other points in your home will become active with your new line.

KoolKid

Here is a guide I posted previousally.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=76106654&postcount=2
Hope it helps.

bob11

Hi Guys,

Just to follow-up on my previous post ..

My Eircom number was ported to UPC today, so I reconfigured my phone lines in my house, including the Eircom Phonewatch line ..

I then done a Phone communicatons test on my alarm panel (Concord)
8+ sys code + 2 ..
I then rang phonewatch to check if it worked and they confirmed that it did !!

Success !!

Thanks to the posters here for the advice ..


Does anyone know why even UPC are telling people that this doesn't work ?

On the porting form Section No. 3 it states that:
"Certain services such as Monitored alarms will not work with our phone service"

I can see why Eircom would be telling people, But why are UPC claiming that it doesn't work ??

KoolKid

From discussing with both of them it seems they simply don't know how an alarm digi works. What's more disturbing is that they are offering GSM as an alternative without informing the customer about the risks of jamming.