US Republican Presidential Candidate claims Palestinians are Invented People

Warper

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The Palestinian premier on Saturday slammed US presidential hopeful Newt Gingrich for belittling the Palestinians as an "invented" people and demanded an apology.

Gingrich, leading in some national polls for the Republican party nomination, made the comments in a Friday interview to be aired with the Jewish Channel satellite television.

Prime minister Salam Fayyad called on Gingrich to apologise for his "vulgar, hurtful and ridiculous remarks", during a meeting with journalists in the West Bank town of Ramallah.

Gingrich's characterisation "constituted a totally unacceptable distortion of historical truth", he said, stressing that in Israel "even the most extremist settlers don't dare to speak in such a ridiculous manner."

Fayyad, whose people have controversially applied for UN recognition as a state, insisted: "Our people has been on this land from the beginning. And it is determined to stay until the end."

In the interview, Gingrich, a former House speaker who has surged in public opinion polls, said: "We've had an invented Palestinian people, who are in fact Arabs, and were historically part of the Arab community."

"And they had a chance to go many places. And for a variety of political reasons we have sustained this war against Israel now since the 1940's, and I think it's tragic."

Gingrich also declared his world view was "pretty close" to that of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and vowed to take "a much more tougher-minded, and much more honest approach to the Middle East" if elected.
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He would make another great US President alright

eth0

He's right, sure I made a killing off the patents for them

Zebra3

The irony of it all.

It's actually the other way around.

questionmark?

Best thing since sliced bread. /thread

headmaster

It would probably be a crime to say the Israeli's were an invented species. Great gas, isn't it :rolleyes:

RichieC

It's not a rare opinion in Zionist circles. seen the argument used here by some clown too.

It's a race to the bottom between the republican candidates. none of them have a hope of unseating Obama.

dlofnep

He's just playing to the crowd. Conservative America loves anything that is pro-Israel and anti-Palestinian. If he became president (which he won't), he'd quickly have to face up to the reality of how immature these comments are.

The Palestinians have been there for centuries - the majority of Israelis for a handful of decades. To put it mildly, Palestinians have been in Palestine at a time when the United States consisted of solely native Americans. Newt (Such an apt name) would want to sort out his history.

Zebra3

headmaster wrote: »

It would probably be a crime to say the Israeli's were an invented species.

No, it would be the truth.

They are an invented species from a European colonial project.

charlemont

Fairly pathetic alright.

Hande hoche!

Gingrich really is a piece of work. Pathetic to see the standard of some of the Republicans candidates.

ILikeBananas

It's like a race to the bottom with those Republican candidates

Chuck Stone

AIPAC appeasement.

woodoo

What is it with US republicans and being dumb as posts. US republicans are a danger to the world. No knowledge of the outside world and love to start wars.

What the fuck is up with the American Presidential Candidates? They all seem like absolute tools. First you've got Rick Perry, who is a fucking racist, homophobic cuntwipe and now this guy.

I worry for the future of that country.

Fishooks12

Deleted User wrote: »

What the fuck is up with the American Presidential Candidates? They all seem like absolute tools. First you've got Rick Perry, who is a fucking racist, homophobic cuntwipe and now this guy.

I worry for the future of that country.

They're all Republican my dear boy, and it pays to be a god fearing gay chaser in that party

Biggins

Are the Republicans in general, trying to destroy their own chances?

goose2005

He means that the idea of a "Palestinian" people separate from the general Arab population is a recent idea.

Zuheir Mohsen, a PLO leader, 1977 wrote:

The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism.
For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan.

They are an invented species from a European colonial project.

Except that Jewish settlers came from all over Europe, Asia, North Africa and the Americas.

SamHarris

Zebra3 wrote: »

No, it would be the truth.

They are an invented species from a European colonial project.

Israeli is a species now and not a nationality? Wow :rolleyes: You better hit Nature up with your new idea. It's BIG. If you are implying that jews are another species, you would probably be better off in the CT forum, or maybe on Stormfront. They like those ideas.

Palestinians are about as "invented" as nearly any other people - its never been an easy thing to define but by and large if a group considers themselves seperate and subscribe to the idea that they are part of a group then they meet the standards required to be considered a "people". A shared history and culture (which the Palestinians have) is usually also cited as a requirment. It doesnt have to be. Arguably one of the most successful "people" of all time, the US/Americans, is predicated on this idea, tied together more with ideology and common beliefs than any other ethnic or historical roots.


Im pretty sure he ment that because they have the same ethnicity, language and large cultural/ historical links with other Arabs that "Palestinian Arab" as a unique entity did not exist, and therefore the unique requirment of a homeland did not either. Pan-Arab nationalism may be anachronistic, but it certainly is not a new idea.

It was Woodrow Wilson that pushed the moderen idea that a state should have a "nationality" and that the two ideas are seperate to an enormous degree - by almost any definition the Palestian people meet those requirements. Plenty of other groups are in a similiar situation, and would rarely if ever be considered an "invented" people. Kurds, Tamils and Tibetans all jump to mind.

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

Warper wrote: »

In the interview, Gingrich, a former House speaker who has surged in public opinion polls, said: "We've had an invented Palestinian people, who are in fact Arabs, and were historically part of the Arab community."

By his logic 300 million people in every country from Morocco to Iraq should unite as one enormous nation.

I can't imagine Newt would like that.

SamHarris

goose2005 wrote: »

He means that the idea of a "Palestinian" people separate from the general Arab population is a recent idea.

It is, but then so are alot of national identities.

Killer Pigeon

In before The Israeli.

SamHarris

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

By his logic 300 million people in every country from Morocco to Iraq should unite as one enormous nation.

I can't imagine Newt would like that.

EVen combined the Arab world would be a fraction of the power and wealth of the states. Indeed the US pushed for the Ottomon empire not to be dismantled after WW 1 partly because they forsaw the massive problems that would arise from yet more artificial borders created ina regaion, a la Africa.

Again, its called Pan Arabism and was very popular in the 60's. The defeat of 100's of millions of Arabs by a few million Israelis during the period broke the idea. It still hasnt recovered.

SamHarris

Biggins wrote: »

Are the Republicans in general, trying to destroy their own chances?

Doubt to many people care to a great extent about his opinions of the Palestinians or even Israelis. You probably wouldnt either if you thought one candidate was better for the economy (and therefore you and your family) but still held views you disagreed with on the distant Middle East.

Caring about stuff like this in an American presidential candidate is the reserve of those that dont live there - we can dismiss domestic politics as peripheral. They cannot.

Biggins

SamHarris wrote: »

Doubt to many people care to a great extent about his opinions of the Palestinians or even Israelis. You probably wouldnt either if you thought one candidate was better for the economy (and therefore you and your family) but still held views you disagreed with on the distant Middle East.

Caring about stuff like this in an American presidential candidate is the reserve of those that dont live there - we can dismiss domestic politics as peripheral. They cannot.

They just seem to be doing themselves no favours and keep selecting plonkers to stand for themselves in the presidential races.

Wertz

What the hell kind of name is Newt anyways? and his wife is called Callista...and he's going on about made up nationalities?

Siuin

headmaster wrote: »

It would probably be a crime to say the Israeli's were an invented species. Great gas, isn't it :rolleyes:

Actually there's a really good book about it :P
It comes highly recommended- and written by a Jewish Israeli nonetheless
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Invention_of_the_Jewish_People

RichieC wrote: »

It's not a rare opinion in Zionist circles. seen the argument used here by some clown too.

Yep, I hear it all the time. Of course, the irony is that the main people propagating this view, ie the Jews, came together as a nation chosen by a man in the sky. Go figure.

HavingCrack

Biggins wrote: »

Are the Republicans in general, trying to destroy their own chances?

To be honest pretty much. The Republican Party in the US have been destroying their traditional values ever since the election of Reagan. They've allowed themselves to become the party of the South and destroyed their New England and California bases, both traditional Republican strongholds. If you compare the foreign and domestic policies of the likes of Barry Goldwater, Richard Nixon or Gerald Ford there's no comparison to today. The party needs to be completely re built from the bottom up if they want to make themselves relevant to more than the Christian and neo-conservatives.

Zebra3

goose2005 wrote: »

Except that Jewish settlers came from all over Europe, Asia, North Africa and the Americas.

Zionism is a European colonial project.

The takeover of Palestinian land was started by European jews and it is still mainly their descendants who control power in the state of Israel which exists on stolen Palestinian land.

Even a friend of mine from Israel (born to Moroccan parents) complains of this power base all the time.

Gunmonkey

Biggins wrote: »

They just seem to be doing themselves no favours and keep selecting plonkers to stand for themselves in the presidential races.

I think they have relaised how hard its gonna be to depose Obama next year and are just fielding their B team in the run up to 2016 when they might have a shot.

Superbus

Also important to note that his name is Newt.

ejmaztec

Superbus wrote: »

Also important to note that his name is Newt.

As in pissed as a

mikeyboy

Wertz wrote: »

What the hell kind of name is Newt anyways?

Short for Newton Leroy Gingrich

and his wife is called Callista...and he's going on about made up nationalities?

Callista is the feminine Latin version of Callisto the huntress loved by Zeus and means "most beautiful"

Just so everyone knows


He's still a tool though

lcrcboy

Got to say as usual a lot of the Republican candidates seem to be so stupid and conservative, but I reckon Ron Paul would be good to vote for, the guy talks a lot of sense, he is anti-war which is very unusual for a Republican candidate, but I think the republican voters wont vote for him, he is to liberal.

RichieC

lcrcboy wrote: »

he is anti-war which is very unusual for a Republican candidate, but I think the republican voters wont vote for him, he is to liberal.

Liberal in the classic sense. not liberal at all by american standards.

LaFlammeRouge

lcrcboy wrote: »

Got to say as usual a lot of the Republican candidates seem to be so stupid and conservative, but I reckon Ron Paul would be good to vote for, the guy talks a lot of sense, he is anti-war which is very unusual for a Republican candidate, but I think the republican voters wont vote for him, he is to liberal.

I would vote for Gary Johnson. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Gary_Johnson

wes

A US presidential candidate saying something stupid.... Hardly surprising, especially from the Republicans.

smegmar

His name is spelt "Newt", but it's one of those weird names,


It's actually pronounced "JOO"

Mike 1972

Even the Israeli government dont come out with this shyte anymore.

SamHarris wrote: »

Plenty of other groups are in a similiar situation, and would rarely if ever be considered an "invented" people. Kurds, Tamils and Tibetans all jump to mind.

All of the groups you mention are currently or have until fairly recent times been regarded as such by the states under whose juristiction they find themselves inhabiting.

(Northern) Kurds for example were branded as "Mountain Turks" (who had forgotten how to speak Turkish while living in the mountains -I $hit you not)

ascanbe

Your mom's an invented people.

speedboatchase

In before 39 pages of Irish people mistankenly feeling an affinity for the Palestinian people due to British rule and circle-jerking while ignoring vast cultural and societal differences that are typically abhorred by left wingers.

Anywho, Mitt is a fine candidate. I hope Newt fecks off ASAP.

RichieC

speedboatchase wrote: »

In before 39 pages of Irish people mistankenly feeling an affinity for the Palestinian people due to British rule and circle-jerking while ignoring vast cultural and societal differences that are typically abhorred by left wingers.

Key misunderstanding of the entire issue here. look upon it with your own eyes.

Overheal

Amazed people in this thread correctly attributed this stupidity to the GOP and not the USA.

Progress is being made!

OneArt

I'd a second cousin who was a bit invented.

280special

RichieC wrote: »

It's not a rare opinion in Zionist circles. seen the argument used here by some clown too.

It's a race to the bottom between the republican candidates. none of them have a hope of unseating Obama.

That great example of fair and balanced journalism, Bill O'Reilly, had a debate on his Foxnews show about who the democrats wanted as the republican candidate against Obama....in between gagging at his usual stupidity,mindless far-right rants and his account of fending off a protester with his umbrella (and then calling for the "folks" right to defend themselves when being shouted at ) I wasnt surprized to see that he reckoned the Democrats wanted Gingrish to stand as he would be an easier target....

Voodoo_rasher

semblence between Mitt Romney and Mick McCarthy (perhaps a younger looking 'Thick Mick')

biko

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=99