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Atheism causes creationism
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I know that's how you'd like it to be, as it fits the comfortable notions you have about people who have faith.
But the truth is far more plain. I get out of bed just the same way, and far from being a 'crutch', it simply enhances what I do, supports it and guides it.
The funny thing is, my day-to-day life hasn't changed all that much in practical terms
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I know that's how you'd like it to be, as it fits the comfortable notions you have about people who have faith.
But the truth is far more plain. I get out of bed just the same way, and far from being a 'crutch', it simply enhances what I do, supports it and guides it.
The funny thing is, my day-to-day life hasn't changed all that much in practical terms
like a crutch
If you can read this, you're too close!
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Again you're using your subjective, relative human standard of 'justice'. He is perfectly just in all his judgments, as He is conforming to what He said He would do.
He is "perfectly just" according to your subjective, relative human standard of justiceBut acting in accordance with the terms you laid out is seen as just and fair in daily life.
According to your subjective relative human standard of 'justice'God does not have standards that we hold Him to account on. His standard is described above - infinite mercy, infinite justice. He has standards for us, which also - funnily enough - correspond very closely to what even the most secular of people would hold as their own values.
Er, except that is nonsense. The whole point is that if you look at what God actually does you find he is anything but just by human standards, making people suffer for no reason, executing people at the drop of a hat for things you wouldn't even go to jail for these days, punishing people with eternal suffering for the sins they carry out in this finite life.
You wish that away by saying that we can't judge God, and then turn around and say you judge God to be infinitely just based on your notions of justice. Which smacks more of your messed up notions of justice than anything else.Don't murder, don't fool around with someone else's wife, don't steal, etc...
Execute your wife if she is not a virgin on your wedding day, kill all the men women and children of any city you take over, stone homosexuals to death, stone people to death for working on the Sabbath
Let me guess, we can't understand why God commanded all those things so we can't judge them. :rolleyes:0 -
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He is "perfectly just" according to your subjective, relative human standard of justice
According to your subjective relative human standard of 'justice'
Er, except that is nonsense. The whole point is that if you look at what God actually does you find he is anything but just by human standards, making people suffer for no reason, executing people at the drop of a hat for things you wouldn't even go to jail for these days, punishing people with eternal suffering for the sins they carry out in this finite life.
You wish that away by saying that we can't judge God, and then turn around and say you judge God to be infinitely just based on your notions of justice. Which smacks more of your messed up notions of justice than anything else.
Execute your wife if she is not a virgin on your wedding day, kill all the men women and children of any city you take over, stone homosexuals to death, stone people to death for working on the Sabbath
Let me guess, we can't understand why God commanded all those things so we can't judge them. :rolleyes:He is "perfectly just" according to your subjective, relative human standard of justice
How? How?
He is just according to the central theme of His book, the Bible, where He says He will 'shew His wrath' on those workers of iniquity? So where's the relativity?Er, except that is nonsense. The whole point is that if you look at what God actually does you find he is anything but just by human standards, making people suffer for no reason, executing people at the drop of a hat for things you wouldn't even go to jail for these days, punishing people with eternal suffering for the sins they carry out in this finite life.
Er, if it seems like nonsense, it's because you are again twisting my words! I never said that God is just by human standards! I said He is 'infinitely just' in his judgments. He lays out the terms of play, and then follows through with His judgments as described.
If you re-read, what I actually said was that His standards happen to closely correlate with secular human standards.You wish that away by saying that we can't judge God, and then turn around and say you judge God to be infinitely just based on your notions of justice. Which smacks more of your messed up notions of justice than anything else.
I don't judge God. As with everything else, I simply point to the words of the Bible, where He lays out the terms. Not my interpretation, just the plain words that anyone can read, including yourself, who appear to be well versed on Scripture. So they are not my notions.Execute your wife if she is not a virgin on your wedding day, kill all the men women and children of any city you take over, stone homosexuals to death, stone people to death for working on the Sabbath
Let me guess, we can't understand why God commanded all those things so we can't judge them. :rolleyes:
Rolling your eyes doesn't mean you are right, and I am oh so wrong It just highlights the fact that when you tiresomely bang on about Old Testament law (which btw was absolved when Christ came on earth - He came to free us from the Law) - it just reinforces and highlights your prejudices, rather than adding anything to the discussion.
Face it - your distaste is down to the fact that you can't bear the notion of a a God who is perfect and just in following through on His word - maybe due to the fact that for someone living by their own standard, everything is relative and how dare anyone subject me to any standard which doesn't fit in with what I want to do and how I feel.
Would you not also be up in arms over murderers who get off scot-free in court? Or would you 'relativise' that way as well?0 -
How? How?
He is just according to the central theme of His book, the Bible, where He says He will 'shew His wrath' on those workers of iniquity? So where's the relativity?
Lol, your argument is that God is infinitely just because he says he is?
Er, he could be lying, you understand that right?
Let me guess, you judge that he isn't ... :rolleyes:Er, if it seems like nonsense, it's because you are again twisting my words! I never said that God is just by human standards! I said He is 'infinitely just' in his judgments. He lays out the terms of play, and then follows through with His judgments as described.
And you claimed that this makes him just.
Except they don't, as already documented. Saying oh well that was just the Old Testament that doesn't count is a non-answer. It is still the commandments of God. Your 'just' God ordered these things. You can ignore that all you like, it is still what is written in your Bible no matter how much you don't like that.If you re-read, what I actually said was that His standards happen to closely correlate with secular human standards.I don't judge God. As with everything else, I simply point to the words of the Bible, where He lays out the terms. Not my interpretation, just the plain words that anyone can read, including yourself, who appear to be well versed on Scripture. So they are not my notions.
They are your notions that saying you are just makes you just, or holding to what you said you would do makes you just.Rolling your eyes doesn't mean you are right, and I am oh so wrong It just highlights the fact that when you tiresomely bang on about Old Testament law (which btw was absolved when Christ came on earth - He came to free us from the Law)
The law was spoken by God. It is his law. If it is unjust he is unjust, a point you conveniently ignore.Face it - your distaste is down to the fact that you can't bear the notion of a a God who is perfect and just in following through on His word
I can't bear the notion of someone telling me a god who commands that women be executed if they are not virgins on their wedding night, or commands that homosexuals be stoned to death, is 'perfect'
You have quite a stupid notion of what perfect means.- maybe due to the fact that for someone living by their own standard, everything is relative and how dare anyone subject me to any standard which doesn't fit in with what I want to do and how I feel.
My notion doesn't involve stoning people to death for the most trivial of things, so yes excuse me for not thinking your god is all that greatWould you not also be up in arms over murderers who get off scot-free in court? Or would you 'relativise' that way as well?
Murderers? Try women who are raped in a town. Yes your 'perfect' God said that they should be executed by stoning because will they should have called out shouldn't they?
The 'perfection' is just over following from these passages Newsite :rolleyes:0 -
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And one of the "etc" rules here on boards.ie is Thou Shalt Not Sock-Puppet.
Your account "Ch3t Z@r" -- an interesting nick for somebody who claims to be christian -- has been banned from A+A, and it may receive a sitewide ban shortly. Several other suspicious accounts exist and each of these will be investigated too.
I am not deceiving anyone. I have more than one account for various reasons, none of which are any of your business Plus it is not an offence to have multiple accounts on boards, far as I know. 0 -
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I am not deceiving anyone. I have two accounts for various reasons, none of which are any of your business Plus it is not an offence to have multiple account on boards.
No doubt you have been looking for a reason to silence me, and it will suit you to do so. But I'm sure it will be seen for what it is
The people in charge said over a year ago that multiple accounts aren't allowed unless approved by the Admins/Comm Manager.If you can read this, you're too close!
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The topic's been passed up to senior managers and no doubt you'll hear back from them in due course.Fair enough [...] That was the understanding I was operating under.
You can rest assured, though, that your case will be dealt with fairly, and not with the "infinite justice" of the savage, retributive kind documented ad meam nauseam in the bible 0 -
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Multiple accounts can be sanctioned under certain circumstances, but never to be used in the same forum and certainly not the same thread.
At any rate this was clearly a mistake, but at least you still have your primary A&A username with which to post.
Nothing to see here. 0 -
The topic's been passed up to senior managers and no doubt you'll hear back from them in due course.
You can rest assured, though, that your case will be dealt with fairly, and not with the "infinite justice" of the savage, retributive kind documented ad meam nauseam in the bible
Fairly - in the sense that the terms of use are laid out by management, and that everyone is treated in accordance with those terms? 0 -
Fairly - in the sense that the terms of use are laid out by management, and that everyone is treated in accordance with those terms?
Yes. The real benefit though, is we can actually talk to the management and get a response. They don't ask us to kill our loved ones as a test. Their site and how it works is not in conflict with everything we know about science and how the universe works. And we can ask the management why they do things, rather than watch them do things and think to ourselves "The Boards.ie Management works in mysterious ways"0 -
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Yes. The real benefit though, is we can actually talk to the management and get a response. They don't ask us to kill our loved ones as a test. Their site and how it works is not in conflict with everything we know about science and how the universe works. And we can ask the management why they do things, rather than watch them do things and think to ourselves "The Boards.ie Management works in mysterious ways"
Your assertion would be valid if you put moral man on the same level as God, who created you, the universe, and everything in it, and who exists infinitely through space and time.
Which, even to an atheist, might seem unreasonable 0 -
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