Johnson resigns as England manager

TheJims

http://www.espnscrum.com/england/rugby/story/154360.html

Martin Johnson has resigned as England team manager in the aftermath of the disappointing World Cup campaign.
More to follow...

Is this the final twist in England's disappointing World Cup drama?? i highly doubt it!

I don't know if iv ever seen a Squad/Management get so many bad headlines in the space of 4 months!

From the great six nations they had, which was only faltered by an Irish win in Dublin, (;)) to a demoralized team that's fell apart over the time in New Zealand, how do you think all this will affect their 6 nations in 2012?

swordofislam

TheJims wrote: »

Is this the final twist in England's disappointing World Cup drama?? i highly doubt it!

Cue Graham Henry's return to the Northern Hemisphere. He would be able to impose any structure he likes on the English game.

john kinsella

Good riddance!

A good player in the 90's and early 00's but a piss poor manager and a terrible attitude.
Delighted to see the back of him

CatFromHue

He shouldn't have been appointed in the first place.

If your employer picked a guy from the factory floor who was excellent at his job and then put him in charge of the whole factory what do you think would happen? Things would go badly.

This reflects badly on the whole RFU.

pajunior

swordofislam wrote: »

Cue Graham Henry's return to the Northern Hemisphere. He would be able to impose any structure he likes on the English game.

I'd like that, would be nice to have a strong English team in the 6 nations again. Last year was certainly more interesting because of it.
Also a nice big paycheck for Henry before retiring.

GerM

Tony McGahan's contract is up in the summer. Johnson is unemployed.

Just saying.

thomond2006

No top coach would want the England job, too many "superstar" players and lots of media bull**** to deal with.

geekington

I can easily see Nick Mallet slipping in here! Would be interesting to see how he would get on, would he continue Johnson approach of beefing up the pack or would he add som variety??

CatFromHue

thomond2006 wrote: »

No top coach would want the England job, too many "superstar" players and lots of media bull**** to deal with.

I was thinking that too but then the structure is a bigger problem, it's one of the worst if not the worst in the top 9 teams in the world.

They've stated that they won't pick players not playing in England from now on and I remember Will Greenwood saying Ollie Barkley couldn't be picked last season as he wasn't in the elite squad. Assuming what Greenwood is saying correct it means you have to pick your England squad at the start of the season before a ball is kicked.

I wouldn't say there is that many superstars compared to other international teams now that I think of it.

thomond2006

GerM wrote: »

Tony McGahan's contract is up in the summer. Johnson is unemployed.

Just saying.

TheJims

geekington wrote: »

I can easily see Nick Mallet slipping in here!

Apparently hes the front runner for the position! ESPNScrum

i can see the whole backroom staff getting shaken up when a new manager arrives, the RFU have to wash their hads of that World Cup in order to move forward!

Teferi

This is a shame.

I enjoyed watching us beat them every year.

Batsy

TheJims wrote: »

Is this the final twist in England's disappointing World Cup drama?? i highly doubt it!

That's only because the world press unfairly picked on England and their players. To heap loads of bile and abuse on a few England players just for going out for a few drinks - and ignoring all those times that there must have been when players from the other teams at the World Cup went out for a few drinks, too - is simply sickening.

The England players received a load of abuse from the media when - shock, horror - they did a bit of bungee jumping one day. However, when the Wales team went out one day and did some whitewater rafting the media had nothing but praise for them for the way they get on as a group of players between games.

And all the abuse that Tindall has received from the media over the last few weeks has been over-the-top, too.

England were picked on simply because they are England.

Also, bear in mind that England got as far in the World Cup as Ireland did.

Robbo

thomond2006 wrote: »

No top coach would want the England job, too many "superstar" players and lots of media bull**** to deal with.

Isn't that exactly the same reason why the English football team are condemned to Quarter Final exits for ever more? There must be something in the national psyche and the Sky Sports Hype-Bust Cycle never helps.

Batsy

Robbo wrote: »

Isn't that exactly the same reason why the English football team are condemned to Quarter Final exits for ever more? There must be something in the national psyche and the Sky Sports Hype-Bust Cycle never helps.

Is that the same England football team which has Fabio Capello as their manager?

28064212

Batsy wrote: »

That's only because the world press unfairly picked on England and their players.

World? Ahahahahahahhahaahahahahahahaahahahahhahahahaha

I think you mean the English press

OldRio

Batsy wrote: »

That's only because the world press unfairly picked on England and their players. To heap loads of bile and abuse on a few England players just for going out for a few drinks - and ignoring all those times that there must have been when players from the other teams at the World Cup went out for a few drinks, too - is simply sickening.

The England players received a load of abuse from the media when - shock, horror - they did a bit of bungee jumping one day. However, when the Wales team went out one day and did some whitewater rafting the media had nothing but praise for them for the way they get on as a group of players between games.

And all the abuse that Tindall has received from the media over the last few weeks has been over-the-top, too.

England were picked on simply because they are England.

Also, bear in mind that England got as far in the World Cup as Ireland did.

You forgot to mention the ball tampering, the abuse a maid recieved in a hotel and the lies told to Johnson by his own players.

thomond2006

28064212 wrote: »

World? Ahahahahahahhahaahahahahahahaahahahahhahahahaha

I think you mean the English press

Nah, world press. I mean come on, what country actually likes England? They're enemy/rival number no.1 with most rugby playing countries: Ireland, Wales, Scotland, France and arguably Argentina and Australia. So the media in these countries will usually tend to have a negative slant towards England.

28064212

thomond2006 wrote: »

Nah, world press. I mean come on, what country actually likes England? They're enemy/rival number no.1 with most rugby playing countries: Ireland, Wales, Scotland, France and arguably Argentina and Australia. So the media in these countries will usually tend to have a negative slant towards England.

True, but none of the English players or staff are going to give two ****s what's in an Irish newspaper. It's the English ones that matter to them, and they were even more negative than the "world" press

Batsy

28064212 wrote: »

World? Ahahahahahahhahaahahahahahahaahahahahhahahahaha

I think you mean the English press

The world press, including the English press.

As Johnson said: "Rugby players drink beer. Big deal."

Batsy

OldRio wrote: »

You forgot to mention the ball tampering, the abuse a maid recieved in a hotel and the lies told to Johnson by his own players.

I wouldn't believe everything you read in the papers.

Anyway, I'd bet £10 that if Irish players or French players or New Zealand players or any other players did the same thing we would never have heard about it.

Batsy

thomond2006 wrote: »

Nah, world press. I mean come on, what country actually likes England? They're enemy/rival number no.1 with most rugby playing countries: Ireland, Wales, Scotland, France and arguably Argentina and Australia. So the media in these countries will usually tend to have a negative slant towards England.

That's just bigotry.

"Nobody likes the English but everybody loves us jolly little Irish!"

What nonsense.

OldRio

Batsy wrote: »

I wouldn't believe everything you read in the papers.

Anyway, I'd bet £10 that if Irish players or French players or New Zealand players or any other players did the same thing we would never have heard about it.

So are you saying his players did not lie to him ????

So are you saying the switching of the balls never happened ???

Are you saying the players did not have to apologise to a maid?????

justsomebloke

Ok lads a gentle reminder to keep things civil.

who the fug

Andrew needs to follow ASAP, how he survives is a complete mystery

The whole setup is a shambles and needs to be overhauled from the top down.

Robbo

Batsy wrote: »

Is that the same England football team which has Fabio Capello as their manager?

It really doesn't matter that the manager isn't English; same as Sven, he'll be undone by pampered millionaires who can't behave themselves and a press that thinks that an easy qualifying group (Euros, the last World Cup group stage) coupled with the odd outlier result (Spain last week, say) entitle them to unjustified success.

If it weren't for the obscene wages that they've managed to extract, it would be the ultimate fools errand.

SuprSi

Batsy wrote: »

I wouldn't believe everything you read in the papers.

Anyway, I'd bet £10 that if Irish players or French players or New Zealand players or any other players did the same thing we would never have heard about it.

This is very true. Gatland even came out during the tournament and said his players are hardly whiter than white, but you just don't get the media bandwagon following them around, hoping they make some sort of mistake.

It started way back with the English football team, and now it's the rugby. I cannot understand why the press take so much joy in seeing their national teams suffering at their hands. It's as if catching them out and making them look bad is better than them actually winning something!!

GerM

Batsy wrote: »

That's just bigotry.

"Nobody likes the English but everybody loves us jolly little Irish!"

What nonsense.

No, it's not bigotry and shouldn't be interpreted as such. How many countries have a major rivalry with England when it comes to playing them? France, Australia, Ireland, Scotland and Argentina. It comes with the territory of being an old world power. That's just via historical reasons and it gets made out as the game against the old enemy every time. Nobody is being bigoted. It's just how things are played out in the media. You're trying to be offended by a very minor and generally accurate comment.

Robbo

who the fug wrote: »

Andrew needs to follow ASAP, how he survives is a complete mystery

The whole setup is a shambles and needs to be overhauled from the top down.

Andrew is the only thing that would survive a nuclear bomb dropped on Twickenham, he'll come out smiling at the other side with another grandiose job title and a vague brief to make all the nice things better.

who the fug

SuprSi wrote: »

This is very true. Gatland even came out during the tournament and said his players are hardly whiter than white, but you just don't get the media bandwagon following them around, hoping they make some sort of mistake.

It started way back with the English football team, and now it's the rugby. I cannot understand why the press take so much joy in seeing their national teams suffering at their hands. It's as if catching them out and making them look bad is better than them actually winning something!!

Because the press are fed up with the shambles that is Twickers and complete inabilty of the 57 farts to build on the 2003 sucess.

the professional game limps from season to season in a downward spiral.

who the fug

Robbo wrote: »

Andrew is the only thing that would survive a nuclear bomb dropped on Twickenham, he'll come out smiling at the other side with another grandiose job title and a vague brief to make all the nice things better.

Sure his parents were Australian Rugby league supporters

GerM

SuprSi wrote: »

This is very true. Gatland even came out during the tournament and said his players are hardly whiter than white, but you just don't get the media bandwagon following them around, hoping they make some sort of mistake.

Welsh players have taken more flak than any from the media for drunken antics. There was a well publicised ban on alcohol within the Welsh camp in the build up to the WC. Any professional, high profile player will come under scrutiny if they mess up. Don't give the media reason to jump on them. Zac Guildford has been hammered and he's a Kiwi. Same with Chris Masoe. Quade Cooper and Matt Henjak, Wallabies that were hammered in the media for off the field behaviour. It happens. England get more focus as they have the most vicious media but they don't help themselves.

irishbucsfan

The Irish players DID go out on the beer during the world cup.

Remember after the USA game on of the tabloids tried to make a big deal out of Ferris doing something on a night out? The difference is that noone here is dumb enough to care.

CatFromHue

GerM wrote: »

Welsh players have taken more flak than any from the media for drunken antics. There was a well publicised ban on alcohol within the Welsh camp in the build up to the WC.

I think it was more that they banned going out on benders, a few pints were ok.

The more I think about the whole Tindall incident the stupider it gets. The owner of the bar came out and said they were well behaved, the girl who Tindall was with was an ex of his, and the RFU put on a tab for the players.

England won all their group games playing pretty much the same as they'd been for nearly the previous year. So the "boozing" can't have effected them that much either.

Warren Gatland in his post match interview after beating Ireland nearly listed all the wines he was going to drink that night, which was actually very funny I thought. Also Lievremont wanted his players to out for a few drinks as a bonding session after the loss to Tonga. The idea that England did anything boozing wise that other teams didn't do I think is wrong. Look at the attached pic of ROG and Bowe that never made it into any Irish papers (that I know of anyway).

I would be of the opinion that the media in England wants the team to bad a lot more than good, bad news sells better after all, so went looking for story's.

pajunior

ROG always manages to look extremely drunk no matter what state he's in.

wixfjord

England got as far as we did in the WC, and won the last 6N.
I wonder if Deccie wasn't such a lovely chap and the IRFU weren't so understanding, would he be out on his ear too?

pajunior

wixfjord wrote: »

England got as far as we did in the WC, and won the last 6N.
I wonder if Deccie wasn't such a lovely chap and the IRFU weren't so understanding, would he be out on his ear too?

I don't think Johnson had another two years on his contract. That normally helps with these kind of things.

TheJims

i think his contract was up for review in december?

GerM

I hope he limits his involvement within rugby now. Perhaps a managerial role with the Tigers or some such. He was one of the all time greatest players/captains and I don't want to see him damage his legacy further. Relax, Johnno. Get yourself on the after dinner circuit and some motivational speaking and rake in the money for an easy life. As a WC and Lions series winning captain he would command silly money for appearances.

jasper11

andrews is been described on talk sport radio now as mr teflon . bit like old bertie.

they have good radio show for 2hrs on a sunday nite to at 8pm for anyone interested. i only listen to it wen internationals are on or HC cos of irish interest. otherwise its all guinness premiership.

laugh

dun dun dun "O'Sullivan packs in Eagles job"

Batsy

OldRio wrote: »

So are you saying his players did not lie to him ????

So are you saying the switching of the balls never happened ???

Are you saying the players did not have to apologise to a maid?????

I'm saying don't believe everything you read in the press, which can't wait to attack any English sporting team at the first opportunity when it also ignores the misdemeanours committed by other nations' players.

Batsy

Robbo wrote: »

It really doesn't matter that the manager isn't English; same as Sven, he'll be undone by pampered millionaires who can't behave themselves and a press that thinks that an easy qualifying group (Euros, the last World Cup group stage) coupled with the odd outlier result (Spain last week, say) entitle them to unjustified success.

If it weren't for the obscene wages that they've managed to extract, it would be the ultimate fools errand.

Come back when you win a World Cup in either football, rugby union or rugby league.

Batsy

GerM wrote: »

No, it's not bigotry and shouldn't be interpreted as such. How many countries have a major rivalry with England when it comes to playing them? France, Australia, Ireland, Scotland and Argentina. It comes with the territory of being an old world power. That's just via historical reasons and it gets made out as the game against the old enemy every time. Nobody is being bigoted. It's just how things are played out in the media. You're trying to be offended by a very minor and generally accurate comment.

If England is an old world power than so are Scotland and Ireland - one a part of the UK like England and the other a former part of the UK.

France is also a former world power, too.

Batsy

SuprSi wrote: »

This is very true. Gatland even came out during the tournament and said his players are hardly whiter than white, but you just don't get the media bandwagon following them around, hoping they make some sort of mistake.

It started way back with the English football team, and now it's the rugby. I cannot understand why the press take so much joy in seeing their national teams suffering at their hands. It's as if catching them out and making them look bad is better than them actually winning something!!

A great example is the slating from the press and other people that the England players received when they went whitewater rafting.

But when the Irish rugby players went whitewater rafting on the Tongariro River not a peep was heard from anybody.

sock puppet

Batsy wrote: »

I'm saying don't believe everything you read in the press, which can't wait to attack any English sporting team at the first opportunity when it also ignores the misdemeanours committed by other nations' players.

If only they could get an easy ride from their press like the French and Welsh do.

OldRio

w

Batsy wrote: »

I'm saying don't believe everything you read in the press, which can't wait to attack any English sporting team at the first opportunity when it also ignores the misdemeanours committed by other nations' players.

So you agree with me that the points I made are correct and you 'forgot' about them because it did not fit your agenda

GerM

Batsy wrote: »

Come back when you win a World Cup in either football, rugby union or rugby league.

I was going to bother explaining the inaccuracies of your other post but there's no point if this is indicative of the mind I'm dealing with.

OldRio

s

Batsy wrote: »

Come back when you win a World Cup in either football, rugby union or rugby league.

Deary deary me. Sad. Agree with Ger. Out of this

.ak

Batsy wrote: »

If England is an old world power than so are Scotland and Ireland - one a part of the UK like England and the other a former part of the UK.

France is also a former world power, too.

.. So wait, I'm confused. Do you actually think most countries don't rate England's sporting persona as 'Public Enemy No. 1'? Are you that naive? If so, fair enough, enjoy your bubble or rock or wherever you live under.

If you are interested in being a little open minded then you may inquire as to why they are considered the 'old enemy'. Whilst there is a deep seeded feeling of history in Irish culture against the British (the world power that enslaved our country), I wouldn't put it down to this. Most of us have gotten over this, as most of us would generally admit we're fond enough of English people in the 21st century. History is history, and whilst it may be used as a tongue-in-cheek way to stir up old rivalries I don't think we can pin the dislike for English teams down to this.

We love to beat England. They're our favorite team we love to hate. It's the same for Scotland, Wales, and France. Why? Because of their sporting persona. This is just one small, small example, but it sums it up perfectly...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BdsTh2oP6o

If you don't believe me, then all you need to do is look towards Marc Livremont's comments prior to their 6N match up with England....

Marc Livremont wrote:

We appreciate our Italian cousins with whom we share the same quality of life, we appreciate the Celts and their conviviality … and among all these nations we have one huge thing in common: we don't like the English.

See, it's collective. Don't get me wrong. I have plenty of English mates, and we discuss Rugby on a regular basis, I had great time after the Leinster v Northampton final with some Saints fans, I regularly meet up with a Leicester season ticket holder and I'd imagine the after match banter with the Irish and English players is great...

But it doesn't change the fact - We all love to hate the English team (and this applies to most sports). No hard feelings.

.ak

Back on topic though.... So, can we assess that Martin Johnson's reign at Head Coach a failure apart from the success in the 6N? If so, does that mean ...

BOD was right?! :eek:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpLd-Vi8qZA