Is Derry or Antrim as Irish as Cork ?

gigino

Martin McGuinnes said last night on Frontline that it (Derry ) was as Irish as Cork. Nobody really pulled him up on that. I know both are on the island of Ireland, and people in N. Ireland can choose to have either an Irish or a UK passport ( more than half choose the UK passport ). On the other hand, people in N. Ireland use a different currency - not even the euro, they use different laws and their taxes and social welfare etc are from / to Britain. People from N. Ireland cannot vote in our Irish elections, and they do not pay their taxes to support our Irish state......so is where they live as Irish as we are? Surely its more accurate to say they are a special case - Northern Irish ? Geographically they are all Irish. ...even if many choose to have passports of the "UK of Britain + Northern Ireland". The stamps they buy are British. If where they live is accurately ( eg for revenue / tax purposes ) described as being part of the UK, can it be as Irish as Cork or Clare?

hondasam

I don't think he meant it the way you are saying he did. His take is it is part of Ireland the same as Cork is but that is where the similarities end.

overshoot

are you going to tell a man from the bogside or the falls that his irish passport doesnt make him as irish as someone else? would you rather the 900000 or so irish passport holders in NI emmigrate down south?
and Derry has a slight Nationalist majority, as does fermanagh, but it was believed 4 counties wouldnt be a viable entity. Also the river foyle was traditional divider between donegal and derry and there was a land grab there too.
how would you feel if hypothetically it was roles reversed and you held a irish passport in the north?

holystungun9

You mean like a republic?

Gee Bag

Tell you what, go up to the bogside and start debating with the locals about how they're not really Irish. You'll soon get your answer.

tonycascarino

Yes, of course Derry is as Irish as Cork, Armagh as Irish as Dublin and so on and so forth. That girl posing the question on the Frontline last night was an ignoramus of the highest calibre.

ejmaztec

Cork is Corkish, not Irish.

Bobby Baccala

Volkswagen.

MagicMarker

Don't know, never been to Derry or Antrim.

hardCopy

I agree, we should make Cork part of the UK

minidazzler

Gee Bag wrote: »

Tell you what, go up to the bogside and start debating with the locals about how they're not really Irish. You'll soon get your answer.

No, that wouldn't give him a correct answer just an opinion of a few people. As Irish as Cork? Nah, they're a much more angry lot really. Most Irish people are pretty placid as can be seen by how we let our government work. They tend to be less so for a lot of them.

staker

Are Derry or Antrim as Irish as Cork?
Couldn't give a fiddlers.

cailinardthair

waiting for Keith...

Mike 1972

overshoot wrote: »

are you going to tell a man from the bogside or the falls that his irish passport doesnt make him as irish as someone else? would you rather the 900000 or so emmigrate down south?

Are there 900,000 men in the bogside and falls ? Must be pretty crowded ! I wonder if they can fit any women in there too ?

overshoot wrote: »

how would you feel if hypothetically it was roles reversed and you held a irish passport in the north?

Im just fine thank you

Cee-Jay-Cee

No theyre not....just like New Mexicans are not Mexicans. Theyre two different countries. People from Derry/belfast are Northern Irish.

pragmatic1

Easily. Nationalists in the north also tend to have a much better appreciation for their own culture too and dont look down their noses at it as if its inferior.

admiralofthefleet

are there langers in derry?

cosanostra

It was ok for people living in cork to class themselves as Irish in the 1901 census

Gee Bag

minidazzler wrote: »

they're a much more angry lot really. Most Irish people are pretty placid QUOTE]

Your ability to use sweeping generalisations about people could make you an honourary Nordie!

Mike 1972

pragmatic1 wrote: »

Nationalists in the north also tend to have a much better appreciation for their own culture too.

Surely Nationalists anywhere do that ?

Theyd hardly be Nationalists otherwise.

jimmycrackcorm

The woman asking McGuinness that question was a Sinn Fein plant.

FloatingVoter

Well, I'm part of the secretive and mysterious D4 brigade (as identified by Dana) and I feel we are all Yorkshiremen. Our day will come.

Chuck Stone

Those who consider themselves Irish in Derry or Antrim are as Irish as those who consider themselves Irish in Cork.

I'm Corkaderryian.

The Internet Explorer

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

are there langers in derry?

Yes. But they are probably called something else. This leads me to the conclusion that those from Northeren Ireland who identify themselves as Irish are indeed just as Irish as somebody from Cork.

Senna

Last time i was in Derry i seen a lot more Tricolours than when i was last in Cork.

My name is URL

It depends on the individual. I know many people in the North, some proudly consider themselves to be 'Irish' citizens.. they hold Irish passports and have a great interest in Irish culture, and some consider themselves to be British. It's too simplistic a question to ask people, especially in the South, whether or not Derry is as Irish as Kerry. That's the problem I think.. those in the South have an overly simplistic view on what 'Irish' actually means.

KeithAFC

Depends what parts of Londonderry you are talking about.

Mike 1972

Senna wrote: »

Last time i was in Derry i seen a lot more Tricolours than when i was last in Cork.

But people in Cork can actually pronounce the word "tricolour"

biko

KeithAFC wrote: »

Depends what parts of Londonderry you are talking about.

He means Free Derry I think.

KeithAFC

biko wrote: »

He means Free Derry I think.

That could be the case.

bayern282

who would you consider more Irish

someone born and reared in the UK, Irish parentage and passport, considers themselves Irish and one generation removed

or

Ultra loyalist Ulster Prod, UK passport, considers themselves British albeit hundreds of years since the plantation.

just throwing one out there

Liam Byrne

Given SF's "West Brit" opinion of those who welcomed the Queen of England, and the fact that Cork didn't need the barriers to keep back the protestors, then - to paraphrase MMG - "if they'd describe it as that, then I wouldn't disagree, but you'd have to look at it in context....."

John Doe1

Well im 5 miles over the border in Donegal and Derry people are if anything more proud of their irish identity than many in the south, they celebrate irishness not bowing to the anglophilic tendencies of many down here.

Mike 1972

Are people in Wroclow/Breslau Polish or German ?

SmartHass

When you have to fight to preserve your culture you tend to appreciate it more, Derry is more Irish than anywhere on the Island.

Mike 1972

SmartHass wrote: »

Derry is more Irish than anywhere on the Island.

Nonsense

Barack Obama isint from there :pac:

minidazzler

bayern282 wrote: »

who would you consider more Irish

someone born and reared in the UK, Irish parentage and passport, considers themselves Irish and one generation removed

or

Ultra loyalist Ulster Prod, UK passport, considers themselves British albeit hundreds of years since the plantation.

just throwing one out there

Consider themselves British really? I would have thought they thought their citizenship was Northern Irish given the title of where they are from is the "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland".

SmartHass wrote: »

When you have to fight to preserve your culture you tend to appreciate it more, Derry is more Irish than anywhere on the Island.

What is Irish nowadays? Given that culture changes alot and quite dramatically.

gerry adams

the best way to maintain peace ive always maintained is to get a lump of semtex and blow the northern part of ireland into the atlantic,we wouldnt have to listen to them brits anymore,because thats all they are up there

Gee Bag

gerry adams wrote: »

the best way to maintain peace ive always maintained is to get a lump of semtex and blow the northern part of ireland into the atlantic,we wouldnt have to listen to them brits anymore,because thats all they are up there

You've changed your tune Gerry!

The_Kew_Tour

gerry adams wrote: »

the best way to maintain peace ive always maintained is to get a lump of semtex and blow the northern part of ireland into the atlantic,we wouldnt have to listen to them brits anymore,because thats all they are up there

What about the Nationalists Gerry?

gigino

SmartHass wrote: »

When you have to fight to preserve your culture you tend to appreciate it more, Derry is more Irish than anywhere on the Island.

Being devils advocate, its then fair to say " When you have to fight to preserve your culture you tend to appreciate it more, more than 50% of Northern Irish people have more allegiance to the UK than anywhere else in the UK." And boy, over 30 years did they have to fight.

starbelgrade

John Doe1 wrote: »

Well im 5 miles over the border in Donegal and Derry people are if anything more proud of their irish identity than many in the south, they celebrate irishness not bowing to the anglophilic tendencies of many down here.

Celebrating "Irishness" doesn't make you any more or less Irish than those who "bow to anglopholic tendencies".

Being Irish is not a state of mind - it's simply a geographical accident. And how you choose to live your life after that really makes little difference as to how Irish you are.

You could argue that the people in the South are actually more Irish because they have evolved with modern Irish culture, including it's anglo influences. And you could argue that those in the North are less Irish because they cling to a past that simply doesn't exist anymore.

You could argue those things. But of course, ultimately it would prove nothing & would be utterly pointless.

gerry adams

nationalists or prods,all the 1 in my eyes,bunch of ****,wish the north didnt exist

The_Kew_Tour

gerry adams wrote: »

nationalists or prods,all the 1 in my eyes,bunch of ****,wish the north didnt exist

What happened Gerry? Tell us?

gigino

minidazzler wrote: »

I would have thought they thought their citizenship was Northern Irish given the title of where they are from is the "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland".

They often call themselves "northern Irish" or even " British" for short, rather than United Kingdomers.
Same as people from Hawaii call themselves Americans if they go to the far side of the world. And people from the Cararies are Spanish. And people from Sicily are Italian.

starbelgrade

gigino wrote: »

They often call themselves "northern Irish" or even " British" for short, rather than United Kingdomers.
Same as people from Hawaii call themselves Americans if they go to the far side of the world. And people from the Cararies are Spanish. And people from Sicily are Italian.

Never call a Sicilian "Italian".

My name is URL

gigino wrote: »

They often call themselves "northern Irish" or even " British" for short, rather than United Kingdomers.
Same as people from Hawaii call themselves Americans if they go to the far side of the world. And people from the Cararies are Spanish. And people from Sicily are Italian.

I've never heard a Sicilian identify themselves as Italian, or a Hawaiian as American. I think you're talking through your hat

Mike 1972

gerry adams wrote: »

nationalists or prods

FAIL!

Stinicker

I'm from Kerry, in recent years I have made several trips to Northern Ireland and I consider a Protestant Unionist from North Antrim to be as Irish as myself, there is the Union of Northern Ireland with the United Kingdom; however Ireland is an island and those of us living on it are Irish.

The people of Northern Ireland are free from tyranny now thanks to the IRA and the men who were brave and stand up against British forces, I don't blame Ulster Protestants for what happened, I blame the British Government and their insane policy of preserving empire in the North despite it costing them billions and saw their citizens blown to atoms by Irish Freedom Fighters in the struggle for civil rights, liberty and representation.

As long as the majority of people in Northern Ireland want to remain a part of the United Kingdom then I will respect that, however I would never tolerate a situation where a minority were treated as second class citizens due to their religion or political situation. People must remember that Catholics were treated like dirt up there and they had no rights or means to resolve it through peaceful political means; they resorted to violence and took on the British Army and various Loyalist paramilitary organizations who were equipped and trained by various British intelligence agencies and the RUC.

Britain was at fault but the IRA fought them and created peace, the Irish Government stood idly by while our people were slaughtered in Northern Ireland when the Government should have declared war on Northern Ireland at the time and sent the Irish Army up into Northern Ireland to protect our people from British forces, it would have thrown the gauntlet down to the International Community an Irish America's influence would ensure a quick peace and a withdrawal east of Lough Neagh.

So to summarise, The North is Irish, all of its people are Irish, Sinn Fein are now the only republican party and you can't count Fianna Fail criminals as but what they are but Criminal Scum.

KeithAFC

John Doe1 wrote: »

Well im 5 miles over the border in Donegal and Derry people are if anything more proud of their irish identity than many in the south, they celebrate irishness not bowing to the anglophilic tendencies of many down here.

They lack national pride. Same with a lot of English people in England.

mise_me_fein3

staker wrote: »

Are Derry or Antrim as Irish as Cork?
Couldn't give a fiddlers.

Ha, but you cared enough to write it