What would happen if a Unionist ran for the Irish Presidency?

paky

And got elected? Afterall, they are entitled to run for the presidency arent they?

mike65

Obviously they are, if a gay can....it would be interesting to see who was subject to greater bigotry

ItsAWindUp

Not many would vote for them.

spider guardian

What kind of Unionist? One who wants Northern Ireland kept in the union or one who wants the entire island back in the union? Either way if there was a revolution and a bill to unite the two jurisdictions passed through the Dail there would be a lot of referrals to the Supreme Court I'd imagine. As well as the continuation of loyalist tea parties at the Aras

copacetic

mike65 wrote: »

Obviously they are, if a gay can....it would be interesting to see who was subject to greater bigotry

The unionist would probably subject the homosexual to a fair bit alright.

What 'gay' got to run for president anyway?

Wolfe Tone

They wouldn't get elected

Temptamperu

is there unionists in the republic

paky

all the irish do gooders would vote for them

is it not natural that they would eventually get involved in southern politics?

mike65

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

They wouldn't get elected

That wasn't the question was it?

DecentBee

copacetic wrote: »

What 'gay' got to run for president anyway?

Mitchell.

HavingCrack

They wouldn't win I presume?

Temptamperu wrote: »

is there unionists in the republic

There used to be quite a lot in the early days of the Free State actually, particularly in the border counties and in Cork and South Dublin (mainly the Rathmines area). By the 1930's most of them had emigrated to England or Northern Ireland however. Trinity College was also well known as a Unionist stronghold until well into the 1950's.

I presume there are still a few knocking about in the area's mentioned above but probably not very many.

Phill Ewinn

I'd vote for him/her just to see the cnut stand for the national anthem at the football finals.

RMD

paky wrote: »

all the irish do gooders would vote for them

is it not natural that they would eventually get involved in southern politics?

I'd say very few people would vote for them simply because the candidate is Unionist, even the "do gooder". If people were to vote for them, it would be down to suitability quite likely.

I doubt they'll get involved in Irish politics, they'll have no support and no group of people to appeal too. Sinn Fein is still a minority party here, imagine how it would be if the Unionists tried. They'd be laughed out of the polling station.

mike65

Donegal has an Orange Order parade every 12th. (of July obviously)

paky

how would you know that no one would vote for them? i'd imagine if sinn fein become stronger down south the unionists will eventually have to field candidates in the south because if they didnt sinn fein would have the upper hand in bargaining if the shinners ever ceased power in the south

would it not be hypocritical of anyone who supported the united ireland concept to not see this as a natural development in irish politics?

KeithAFC

DUP over Fianna Fail? Don't think so.

Icaras

it depends what kind of lies they are peddling, if they have a lot of easy solutions, a catchy slogan and blame all the problems on Bertie, civil service, gaurds, U2 not payng taxes then I'd say they have a pretty good chance.

mikeyboy

Given that their belief system is inherently monarchist and indeed Unionist could a Unionist in good conscience run for the office of President of the Republic?

paky

mikeyboy wrote: »

Given that their belief system is inherently monarchist and indeed Unionist could a Unionist in good conscience run for the office of President of the Republic?

if he had the best interests of irish unionists in mind i suppose he could

Capt'n Midnight

Here's a clue, Douglas Hyde and Erskine Childers were both Protestants.

mike65

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Here's a clue, Douglas Hyde and Erskine Childers were both Protestants.

and? Wolfe Tone was Protestant

Scealta_saol

Hey, it could be worse... It could be this guy:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/features/2011/0914/1224304072689.html

wolfpawnat

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Here's a clue, Douglas Hyde and Erskine Childers were both Protestants.

mike65 wrote: »

and? Wolfe Tone was Protestant

Indeed many of Irelands greatest republicans were, hell Sam MaGuire got a cup named after him and he was Protestant!

Protestant does not always suggest Unionist, nor does Catholic always suggest Nationalist

HavingCrack

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Here's a clue, Douglas Hyde and Erskine Childers were both Protestants.

Protestant does not equate to Unionist. There's lots of Irish people whom are Protestant who aren't Unionists.

Indeed prior to the 1916 Rising many Southern Catholics were staunch loyalists.

Dionysus

Surely if a unionist, as opposed to a Protestant, stood for election to the presidency they'd be standing for the end of their potential job and for Ireland to be under the rule of the Saxe-Coburg and Gotha monarchy once again?

I don't think you've thought this one through.

On the other hand, if somebody like Gordon Wilson, ar dheis Dé go raibh a anam dílis, stood he would stand a good chance of being elected.

KeithAFC

What would be the point anyway? It would be like a cat jumping into the bath and not out. Would be pointless.

paky

KeithAFC wrote: »

What would be the point anyway? It would be like a cat jumping into the bath and not out. Would be pointless.

if unionists wanted to protect their interests against an all island party like sinn fein, it would be advisable for them to play the same game as sinn fein

Dionysus

Temptamperu wrote: »

is there unionists in the republic

Yes. Robin Bury, Ruth Dudley Edwards, Ian Cox, Derek Simpson, and the motley crew of nutjobs in the Reform Movement are where it's at. You'll find them in the Dublin Conservative Club lamenting the decline of the Realm in Ireland and across the world and the sorry state of her loyal lieges in the "second capital" of the Empire, Dublin.

They seem to be rather pissed off that they can't be guaranteed jobs for their children in all the insurance companies, banks, breweries, distilleries and The Irish Times by virtue of their being Protestant. From being rulers of all Ireland, it's shocking how their lot has declined, as they've argued.

Next they'll have to fill out application forms without stating that they come from "good Protestant stock" (and its variants). This is what democracy has done to the last remnants of the British colonial community in Ireland. Discrimination! :rolleyes:

KeithAFC

paky wrote: »

if unionists wanted to protect their interests against an all island party like sinn fein, it would be advisable for them to play the same game as sinn fein

I suppose but they would need to get elected to make some difference. Donegal and Dublin would be your best bet for some votes. Possibly Cork as we know they like to be rebels.

Mark200

Nothing would happen. The Presidency wouldn't give them power of any kind that would be related to their goals.

paky

KeithAFC wrote: »

I suppose but they would need to get elected to make some difference. Donegal and Dublin would be your best bet for some votes. Possibly Cork as we know they like to be rebels.

funny enough, there are many protestants in cork even around clonalkilty of all places! still, just because they are protestants does not mean they would vote unionist.
many people oppose a united ireland due to the perceived negative economic consequences it would bring so whoes to say that irish people would not vote for a unionist party who put forward a solid economic plan that appeals to everyone and not just idealists?

Mark200 wrote: »

Nothing would happen. The Presidency wouldn't give them power of any kind that would be related to their goals.

perhaps not but it would certainly set a historical precendence

whubee

a kick in the balls/flaps is what would happen.

steddyeddy

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Here's a clue, Douglas Hyde and Erskine Childers were both Protestants.

Protestent =/= unionist though

NSNO

I suppose it would depend on the type of Unionist. A Union Flag-waving Orangeman would be laughed out of whatever room he first broached the idea in.

However, if David Norris' letter to the Israeli judge had never come to light then he would've stood a very good chance of being elected. As someone in favour of at the very least looking at the issue of Commonwealth membership, combined with his accent and his Anglicanism, he might be the closest thing to a 'unionist' that would stand a chance at becoming President.

steddyeddy

wolfpawnat wrote: »

Indeed many of Irelands greatest republicans were, hell Sam MaGuire got a cup named after him and he was Protestant!

Protestant does not always suggest Unionist, nor does Catholic always suggest Nationalist

Indeed particularly in the south of ireland were we lack the degree of sectarianism.

headmaster

A protestant has already held the office, or am I mistaken? Oops, i've gone back over the posts and had my query answered. Anyway, it would be great to see it happen as they would be under OUR RULE AND WOULD DO OUR BIDDING. Now, that would be worth it, hell yeah.;)

steddyeddy

headmaster wrote: »

A prodestant has already held the office, or am I mistaken?

True but as I say were lucky that unlike some places in the north we dont assign political terms to people of a certain religion.

Capt'n Midnight

mike65 wrote: »

Obviously they are, if a gay can....it would be interesting to see who was subject to greater bigotry

A Gay ? There was more than one on the cards. Actually if you think about it the possible candidates include all kinds of everything.

Capt'n Midnight

Hyde was our first president back in 1938. Ireland back then wasn't quite as liberal as it is today. So I reckon it's a fair comparison.


Anyways all anyone has to do to get on the ballot sheet is
http://www.president.ie/index.php?section=15

To be a candidate a citizen must be over 35 years of age and must be nominated either by:

Not less than 20 members of Dáil or Seanad Éireann, or
Not less than 4 administrative counties (including County Boroughs)

Former or retiring Presidents may become candidates on their own nomination.

paky

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Hyde was our first president back in 1938. Ireland back then wasn't quite as liberal as it is today. So I reckon it's a fair comparison.


Anyways all anyone has to do to get on the ballot sheet is
http://www.president.ie/index.php?section=15

all people in the north are entitled to irish citizenship

woodoo

paky wrote: »

funny enough, there are many protestants in cork even around clonalkilty of all places! still, just because they are protestants does not mean they would vote unionist.

The Munster Plantations were quite large too. From 1590 on.

Liam Byrne

mike65 wrote: »

Obviously they are, if a gay can....it would be interesting to see who was subject to greater bigotry

I haven't seen any bigotry towards any gay person......I have however seen rightful contempt for someone who acted inappropriately.

As for a unionist candidate - that aspect of their preferences would mean nothing to me - it would depend on their decency and capability and what they condoned just like any other candidate - which is precisely why a unionist would have a chance of a vote.

paddyandy

A nice gesture to our neighbours if a suitable candidate were found.I don't know who that would be though.

woodoo

paddyandy wrote: »

I don't know who that would be though.

How about old "Never Never Never" himself for the craic.

paky

peter robinson or sammy wilson?

charlemont

The shower of crap that are running at the moment would have some competition.

Celly Smunt

if a unionist was clearly the best person for the job and could take a load of hardship off Ireland,Irish people would still be too stubborn to vote the right person in.

Mike 1972

I wouldnt totally rule out the possibility of a Unionist ever being elected the presidency. For example the Late Gordon Wilson IIRC was a Unionist and was generally well regarded as an Irish senator.Had the opportunity presented itself its not too far out to imagine him being serious contender for the presidency.

paky wrote: »

all people in the north are entitled to irish citizenship

Not quite.

In fact there are even people in the "South" who are not entitled to Irish citizenship.

paky

Mike 1972 wrote: »

I wouldnt totally rule out the possibility of a Unionist ever being elected the presidency. For example the Late Gordon Wilson IIRC was a Unionist and was generally well regarded as an Irish senator.Had the opportunity presented itself its not too far out to imagine him being serious contender for the presidency.



Not quite.

In fact there are even people in the "South" who are not entitled to Irish citizenship

even so, shouldnt unionists be encouraged to run candidates in the general election?

Celly Smunt

paky wrote: »

even so, shouldnt unionists be encouraged to run candidates in the general election?

they don't get much encouragment though do they?

Wolfe Tone

Liam Byrne wrote: »

I haven't seen any bigotry towards any gay person......I have however seen rightful contempt for someone who acted inappropriately.

As for a unionist candidate - that aspect of their preferences would mean nothing to me - it would depend on their decency and capability and what they condoned just like any other candidate - which is precisely why a unionist would have a chance of a vote.

A unionist who would desire the abolition of the state they are running to be head of? Wouldn't have thought you would be a fan of that.