Metal...hasn't really gone anywhere in 20 years.

buck65

Just looking at boards metal page got me thinking.
Today alone the majority of threads are about bands that have existed in some form for the past 25 odd years and most have not been relevant in at least 10 years.
Anthrax, Danzig, Chris Cornell, Warrior Soul, The Almighty, Def Leppard etc. today, maybe Rush, GnR, Slayer or someone else tomorrow. I know alot of the interest in these bands is from younger listeners just getting into the older music and sparking up threads about classic albums and lineups.
Every time I check in here I notice the popular threads are Metallica and Pearl Jam. Again arguably 2 bands who's best days are well behind them.
I think boards.ie is a good yardstick to judge this country by.
Don't get me wrong I love metal music and have been into it since the mid 80s but if you were to ask me to name decent music that is relevant now, I would struggle to name a metal act who are doing something new and original.
Unlike say alternative/indie or experimental music where there seems to be a lot of good and original stuff out there.
Am I missing something? if so why are the aforementioned still popular here despite not contributing anything decent in years?

Shreddingblood

That's why I listen to modern bands as well.

Links234

is it a bad thing that those bands have longevity? I don't think that Rush being popular is an indication that nothing good has come out recently.

Mastodon are doing great things and they've been around how long?

JBnaglfar

That's an interesting observation. While the front page is mainly threads about older bands, I can't fully agree that contemporary bands are either not relevant or doing something new. If you go back another page or two, there are threads discussing Mastodon, Opeth, Dream Theater, Rammstein and Alestorm who are all in their own ways relevant and producing interesting stuff. I've also seen plenty of discussion of bands like Gojira and Amon Amarth over previous months. While some of these bands have been knocking around since the 90's and may not be the best examples of new/innovative metal they are different from say Metallica or Slayer because they are making interesting and fresh material.

Has metal gone anywhere in 20/25 years? I would argue that it has, but this has not yet had the same impact as classic metal bands from the 70's and 80's. Folk metal which really began to emerge in the 90s (discounting folk influences in bands like Led Zep) has really surged over the last decade. Prog and extreme metal (particularly black and death) have been combined to an increasing extent over recent years. If you consider early black metal acts such as Mayhem or Bathory and compare it to Ishahn's recent albums there is an undoubted evolution in the genre. There was also a thread on here a while ago talking about Djent metal. I actually hadn't heard the term before, and its not really my style of metal, but at least it is moving on from the metal of the past and generating some discussion.

In my opinion, there are bands who are producing fresh and interesting metal but how relevant is it? Honestly, I don't think many contemporary bands (even many of my favourites) can have the same sort of impact on metal as bands like Sabbath, Maiden, etc. Such bands are the pillars of metal, the groups who founded metal as a genre. Their importance to the genre cannot be doubted and as such, they will always be discussed for as long as there are metal fans.
In my opinion metal has become much more fragmented today, with a gazillion subgenres, and I see few bands who can generate the same kind of mass appeal as that of the classic bands. This is not necessarily a bad thing, as it shows that metal is healthy as it diversifies. While contemporary bands may not be as relevant to metal as a whole like Sabbath or Maiden were/are, they are relevant to me and many others.

This was longer than I expected it to be.
tl:dr I believe contemporary metal is still innovative, but more fragmented. Classic metal bands were/are relevant on a more mass/general scale, and that's why they are discussed so much.

buck65

Thanks for that response. There are some bands you have mentioned that are trying new things, I have an album by Gojira and I have seen Mastodon live as well. (Nothing to quicken the pulse in the same way when I saw Sepultura or Pantera for the first time though.)
Opeth I like I must say, are definitely trying to plough their own furrow in music.

Whiskeyjack

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eljjOJwlDY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qii59-7JAM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JP4-1_Bop4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc98u-eGzlc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkVwA__Fk9g

You just need to know where to look

Whiskeyjack

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7BoKOscMrY

one more

Jemmaa

buck65 wrote: »

Just looking at boards metal page got me thinking.
Today alone the majority of threads are about bands that have existed in some form for the past 25 odd years and most have not been relevant in at least 10 years.
Anthrax, Danzig, Chris Cornell, Warrior Soul, The Almighty, Def Leppard etc. today, maybe Rush, GnR, Slayer or someone else tomorrow. I know alot of the interest in these bands is from younger listeners just getting into the older music and sparking up threads about classic albums and lineups.
Every time I check in here I notice the popular threads are Metallica and Pearl Jam. Again arguably 2 bands who's best days are well behind them.
I think boards.ie is a good yardstick to judge this country by.
Don't get me wrong I love metal music and have been into it since the mid 80s but if you were to ask me to name decent music that is relevant now, I would struggle to name a metal act who are doing something new and original.
Unlike say alternative/indie or experimental music where there seems to be a lot of good and original stuff out there.
Am I missing something? if so why are the aforementioned still popular here despite not contributing anything decent in years?

I don't think metal is so very dead as you can imagine while searching this forum, it's just that people who are interested in more modern music not posting here.

nyarlothothep

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMeTSyUprhw

I quite like this tune, its not highly original or innovative but the musicianship and classical/folk influences are deftly intertwined, its brings up images of the 18th century, pistols duels and the scarlet pimpernell for some reason. In other words the ambiance generated is nice to my mind.

I think the argument is half right, a lot of metal bands use the semi tonal progression in their riffs which isn't always objectionable but so many metal riffs sound interchangeable. 99% of the bands on kerrang/scuzz/propeller are forgettable. I can listen to about the first 5 seconds and think yes...boring metal riff which has been used 7 million times, typical metallrrhh guitar sound, blast beats check, screaming vocals from the "hardcore" singer (yawn). Its the same old sh1t.

On the other hand there are innovative bands in metal, although some wouldn't consider them metal, I think they are more or less in and around the set of metal/rock as opposed to indie or alternative. Moreover I find that there is a complete lack of originality since the 00s in indie with the proto punk 80s revivalists and coldplay lite arena rock anthems.

The fragmentation point is a good one though, there will always be pockets of originality, however I think the music industry is indifferent to bands/artists who don't conform to current trends which is perhaps why there isn't a huge gamut of new innovative bands out there in the public eye. Or maybe most people just don't care much for originality/attitude/musicality and would rather bop along to simple straightfoward sentimental vomit like Mumford and Sons. Frank Zappa made a good point about the industry being populated with taste makers who select which bands to sign on the basis of what's "cool." There needs to be a culture which rewards thinking independently and not hopping on the bandwagon which I think this starts from the ground up, at the level where people start to form bands. As much as I find Phil Anselmo a bit dodgy with some of his opinions I do think he was onto something when he stated that bands nowadays have only one influence which they imitate perfectly whereas back in his day a band would have 10 or more influences and while they may not have sounded as good as any one of them they derived their own sound from this combination. Although it is a bit ironic considering Pantera perfectly replicated Exhorder's sound ha!

ThunderApple

I don't think that metal music is dead. There are lots of new bands coming to the stage, young people can make really good music.
I'm not talking about the metalcore and other-core movements. It has nothing to do with metal, in my opinion.

it's just... heavy metal is heavy metal and however you play it it's always going to sound like Iron Maiden-tribute.

Do you know Airbourne? These guys are very young and famous in the whole world. They play quite classical mixture of Motorhead and AC/DC but in a fresh new interpretation.

Maybe you feel like that because you don't look for new bands? I had such a period and I also thought that metal was dying but there is the whole big world out there.

seachto7

ThunderApple wrote: »

Do you know Airbourne?

This is the problem with metal. These guys are a total nostalgia trip for people who didn't get to experience AC/DC the first time around or for people who want to have a bit of a laugh. They are very very unoriginal in my opinion, and I would rather just listen to AC DC than a band who sound like AC DC. Airbourne are an example of a band who have no claim to be progressing hard rock or metal. They are a step backwards if anything, a classic rock nostalgic step backwards......
Wolfmother could be lumped into the same category as Airbourne......

RayCon

Depends on what you classify as Metal (for instance I don't think Rush are metal and I suspect neither do they - although the are appreciated by metal fans).

Are Porcupine Tree metal ? .... are Anathema or Opeth's latest offerings metal ?

If yes, then yes there are "metal" bands moving things along ...

Shreddingblood

Whiskeyjack wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7BoKOscMrY

one more

I could not love that band more. If you're into Sikth you should check out Protest the Hero. I think they are better musicians but the vocalist isn't for everyone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKZ-eKBJ9dw

Malice

Nicely provocative thread title should ensure plenty of discussion . I completely disagree with this assertion but I've got to go and get dinner. I will come back with a more substantial rebuttal later hopefully.

Metal...hasn't really gone anywhere in 20 years.

Joe_Dull

Shreddingblood wrote: »

I could not love that band more. If you're into Sikth you should check out Protest the Hero. I think they are better musicians but the vocalist isn't for everyone.

Quite liked that tune. Further listening required, thanks.

Say Your Number

seachto7 wrote: »

Airbourne are an example of a band who have no claim to be progressing hard rock or metal.

I don't think they're claiming to be saviours of metal or anything. tbh honest I'm not a fan of imitator bands but Airbourne are so good at it that I can't help but like them, although I would like to see them deviate from aping AC/DC

seachto7

you worded it better for me. I just can't stand imitator bands.....

viadah

I think record labels have been sitting tight on everything since Nirvana - regardless of what anyone thinks of them they ****ed up hair metal and as a result labels lost money. So innovation is stifled by monetary interest, this can be partly blamed for a lack of progress. I know this doesn't apply for every label and genre so to speak, but you know Jon Bon Jovi was bricking it in the early to mid '90s.

buck65

I'll grant that there is alot of bands and music out there making good music but where are they in the metal mainstream? Alot of the vids posted here are by pretty cultish bands that I never heard of.
The forum is still dominated by the old school bands who are still releasing (dodgy) albums and still selling out stadiums.
Where are the newer bands in all this? Still playing small venues and clubs, perhaps supporting the big 4 etc.
My point is that back in he 80s and 90s the bands that were breaking new ground were also widely accessible in the sense that they were in the Point depot or similar large venue.
Has contemporary metal just gone underground?

Jelle1880

Depends what you're interested in.

For example, thrash is having a huge revival at the moment with tons of new bands coming out with great stuff.
Evile, Warbringer, Gama Bomb, Municipal Waste, Violator,...

GhostInTheRuins

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Depends what you're interested in.

For example, thrash is having a huge revival at the moment with tons of new bands coming out with great stuff.
Evile, Warbringer, Gama Bomb, Municipal Waste, Violator,...

I wouldn't really have classed any of them as "new" bands exactly.

Parsley

seachto7 wrote: »

This is the problem with metal. These guys are a total nostalgia trip for people who didn't get to experience AC/DC the first time around or for people who want to have a bit of a laugh. They are very very unoriginal in my opinion, and I would rather just listen to AC DC than a band who sound like AC DC. Airbourne are an example of a band who have no claim to be progressing hard rock or metal. They are a step backwards if anything, a classic rock nostalgic step backwards......
Wolfmother could be lumped into the same category as Airbourne......

not all music has to progress and be 'new'. music is about evoking emotion, and it's perfectly legitimate for a band such as airborne to evoke nostalgia in their fans. if you want to listen to prog, listen to prog. I have never heard Airbourne so I don't know if their music in any good, but just reading from your post i think you're looking at it the wrong way.

jpm4

Metal is heading into middle age or old age maybe, how many variants on the same formula can a band pull off? It really depends on your age as to whether you think there is much fresh and original out there. Whatever you might think, it's unlikely we'll ever see stadium fillers like Metallica, Iron Maiden and AC/DC again.

seachto7

jpm4 wrote: »

Metal is heading into middle age or old age maybe, how many variants on the same formula can a band pull off? It really depends on your age as to whether you think there is much fresh and original out there. Whatever you might think, it's unlikely we'll ever see stadium fillers like Metallica, Iron Maiden and AC/DC again.

slipknot?

Riddle101

I've always considered the last 10 years to be the worst period for both Rock and Metal. I can't find a band that has had as much success in the last ten years that bands like Metallica and Slayer had in the 80's or Alice in Chains and Pearl Jam in the 90's. It seems like it's become a dying breed now. All I hear nowadays are crappy christian rock bands and emo bands. Not much Hardrock out there or Heavy Metal. I don't know maybe i'm not looking as hard as I should be.

But here's another thing. Not one single Rock or Metal band in the last 10 years has produced an album or song that has been a huge success or critcally aclaimed. Most bands of the past have at least one album or song that defines them. Metallica have Black Album, Guns n Roses have Appetite for Destruction, Nirvana has Nevermind, Alice in Chains has Dirt, Pearl Jam has Ten etc. But you never hear about any bands today turning out a hugely succesful album or a song that becomes a huge hit.

Maybe Kings Of Leon or Alter-Bridge but some people have never even heard of the latter.

Personally I blame it all on the fact that, the music industry is predominetly all about current trends in pop or hip hop music today, all this churned out processed music that has warped the minds of people who spend a lot of time watching MTV and listening to music from so called artists such as Will.I.Am etc. Support for Rock and Metal has gone down hill an awful lot, and that's another reason why it hasn't gone anywhere.

NIBBS

Riddle101 wrote: »

I don't know maybe i'm not looking as hard as I should be.

But you never hear about any bands today turning out a hugely succesful album or a song that becomes a huge hit.

Maybe Kings Of Leon or Alter-Bridge but some people have never even heard of the latter.

Personally I blame it all on the fact that, the music industry is predominetly all about current trends in pop or hip hop music today, all this churned out processed music that has warped the minds of people who spend a lot of time watching MTV and listening to music from so called artists such as Will.I.Am etc. Support for Rock and Metal has gone down hill an awful lot, and that's another reason why it hasn't gone anywhere.

I take your point, but seriously there's lots of good new metal/hard-rock/glam bands out there and I really think people just aren't bothered looking for stuff anymore, people tend to want music handed to them on a plate......

the industrys setup and operation now isn't helping anyone except large touring machines.....

you still have bands like Machine Head with The Blackening being a landmark album for them, again getting critical acclaim and garnering 3yrs of touring off the back of it, the current cycle is to make an album and tour it to death.........money is in ticket sales so that's where we stand right now.....

I'd also disagree with the OP's references to other Musical Genres being any different - Indie is the very same, older bands are the ones being talked about, releasing weak albums and back in the touring scene.......if Experimental music isn't original it's not experimental, so most scenes are stagnant at the top levels, dominated monetarily by the bigger bands, you get some bands breaking through every now and then (I guess you could add Kings Of Leon in that) but they tend not to last........and the follow up to a big album is usually very disappointing.....

I've found a lot of new releases by old bands have been really excellent over the last few years.........but maybe that's just me......I don't think Boards is a good meter of what Metal Fans are into in Ireland at the moment, a lot of good metal music is still underground/unfashionable......and to be honest there's nothing wrong with that.....I'd prefer not to see mid range bands in huge venues just because it's fashionable...

viadah

Metal has always been underground/unfashionable, by and large, and isn't that the way we always liked it?

Jelle1880

GhostInTheRuins wrote: »

I wouldn't really have classed any of them as "new" bands exactly.

Evile: Formed in 2000, debut album 2007
Warbringer: Formed in 2004, debut album in 2008
Gama Bomb: Formed in 2002, debut album in 2005
Municipal Waste: Formed in 2001, debut album in 2003
Violator: Formed in 2002, debut album in 2006

Pretty new imo, compared to others.

jpm4

seachto7 wrote: »

slipknot?

Huh? You're suggesting that Slipknot are a stadium band??

Irish Halo

Riddle101 wrote: »

I've always considered the last 10 years to be the worst period for both Rock and Metal. I can't find a band that has had as much success in the last ten years

Mainstream success/selling records is not the same as a "good period" for music just a good time for the big three labels who milk artists in that genre.

Your examples are exceptions, good bands who have had commercial success/made money, a band selling 1 million records does not make them good/great and not selling any doesn't make you bad.

I honestly couldn't give a flying monkeys if bands I like are being known by the general public. Do they make good music? Do I get to hear said music? Do I get to see them play live? Being well known makes the 2nd two easier (not impossible especially with PledgeMusic and Kickstarter style things) but has absolutely no bearing on the first.

Metal has moved on in the last 20 years and there are great bands out there doing doing stuff, if you are taking your lead from mainstream press then you are **** out of luck, just scratch the surface, go to a local show, look on the internet (here or MetalIreland being good starting points IMO), you will find stuff.

I have wondered about the next stadium bands a la Metallica et al but then realised I don't care, I'm not fan of those kinds of gigs, metal is for sweaty club shows not the ****ing RDS.

jpm4 wrote: »

Huh? You're suggesting that Slipknot are a stadium band??

To be fair they have headlined the RDS, which is considered a stadium venue

ush

The whole entertainment industry has changed. Everything has been split into sub-genres. Thanks to downloading and people finding music for themselves online, record companies can't find stadium fillers with a broad appeal. This just isn't a metal thing. You'll find there are people whose job it is to book artists to fill stadiums. They're relying on the same bands for donkey's years now. Coldplay were fasttracked. Muse get those kinds of gigs. Even Kings of Leon get stadium gigs. There's a half dozen U2 rip offs jockeying for position.

Getting back to metal. Yeah there's alot of nostalgia. But the slighter older public are the ones with the cash for concert tickets. And how many sources of revenue are there without record sales.

lord lucan

Tbh the only new music i buy is from old artists. The last new band(non-'supergroup') i got into was Machine Head many years ago. I've a mate who constantly bombards me with youtube links to new bands but i just doesn't cut it for me. I'm quite narrow minded when it comes to music and i like what i like. Many new rock & metal bands have come and gone but none have left any sort of lasting impression.

The music business has changed. No longer will bands with glimmers of talent be allowed find their way and grow naturally. It's all about a quick buck and cashing in as quickly as possible.Partly explains the move by labels to picking up one hit wonders from youtube and reality tv shows. Auto tune them to the hilt,market the bejaysus out of them and throw on the trash heap when finished. The days of A&R men trawling the clubs for new bands are gone unfortunately.

Hate to say it but i can see a slow decline in the metal scene over the next 10-20 years. As the Maidens/Metallica's and Megadeths of this world hang up their guitars i don't see anyone to carry the torch of metal in the future.

jpm4

To be fair they have headlined the RDS, which is considered a stadium venue

Indoors at the RDS though right? That's hardly the same thing but whatever. Point is that the time and circumstances in the music industry that would favor another AC/DC or Iron Maiden to come about are long gone - in the age of downloading and X Factor you'd need a miracle for that kind of thing to happen again IMO.

LH Pathe

the past 20yr was somewhat Inevitable as most of the trailblazing was done in the first 20yr prior, maybe? there was still some pioneering to be done but mostly via updated technology. besides they would have had to strive harder to find a distinctly different angle. like Korn the only 'nu-metal' group I'd tolerate to a degree, they did pander to the hip hop adidas thing I could see would become the fabric of today's degenerative society but were the only ones to give it a decent slant; give it some credence. look at the only 20yr rave and hip hop has been in existance in which they somehow only devolved further and melded to give wings to the bizarre capitalist driven morally bereft computer assembled playground hip-pop most kids like today. also the boyband thing stemmed from townie urges; boyzone and the like were ravers. I like being a dying breed amongst these folk, instant sense of superiority and manliness and though they provoke a lot of rage and loathing in me they are born into it now - so sometimes I feel sympathy

but wherever metal is going, whatever new generations insist on claiming to have coined a new sub genre or progression when it's clearly been done before - when the only refreshing output is somehow from revivalists - at least it won't die out. despite hip pop having "changed the world" and having read that it has become bigger than general rock in it's lifespan / entirety instrument wielding folk will always be their enemy but they should feel intimidated by the hardcore bangers as it were in my day. so keep up the fight. and keep it dark/metal. also applies to physical torture but this culture will never die in the face of such adversity. that's the main thing; keep actual music via instrumentation alive - with a bee in yer bonnet and a dark twist preferably... one might argue metal has seen only degression as opposed to progression in recent times but in the face of said adversity never let up with the aggression - that's all.

Irish Halo

jpm4 wrote: »

Indoors at the RDS though right?.

Honestly? I forget it was 6 years ago but now you say it was probably inside, but they are the closest thing to a modern stadium metal band

ThunderZtorm

I'd say Metal is very much alive. It's just that it's divided into lots of minor genres and not so much the general metal giants as the Big 4, Maiden, Priest etc anymore.

I mean, folk metal, my favorite genre, is very much alive with Eluveitie, Moonsorrow, Ensiferum, Amon Amarth, Finntroll and many others - same goes for the more gothic style of Nigthwish and Sirenia..