Hornady super performance 150g SST.

Mauser 308

Guys I was planning on using the Hornady superperformance in my 308 this coming deer season. Taking some good advise (Tack) I tried them out on some foxes. They work great but my concern is that they made sh**e of the fox. The exit wound was huge and they they turned the amimal's insides to jelly. My concern is what damage they will do to the deer carcase. The fox would offer much less resistance to the bullet than a deer, so I can only assume that when they hit deer they will expand even quicker. If the fox is anything to go by the deer carcase will be in total sh**e. What experience has anyone of the damage these rounds do to the carcase. I totaly want to put the animal down asap but also want to minimise the meat damage as much as possible.

Cass

I've said on another thread that the Superperformance are a good round but they are a little over rated for my liking. While i appreciate that you may only fire one or possibly two rounds at a time, going on their performance out of 3 different make/model/twist rate rifles they have a habit of "climbing" with continued use. As said though this may not be a major concern/factor as you will possibly only fire a max of 2 shots in any sort of string.

They are a good hitting round, but after chrono-ing them they are doing in excess of 400fps more than the rest of the .308 hunting family. They are running around 3180 compared to the 2750 average of most other rounds. Now to achieve 3180 from a 24" barrelled rifle is some result. I know from reloading my target ammo what it takes to get my target rounds to do that speed out of a 30" select barrel.

I've used them on foxes only (so far) and they were devastating on them. I'm more "aware" or concerned about backstops than normal when using them as they have a nasty habit of p**sing straight through foxes. I've used the last of what i had and decided for peace of mind to go back to a slower round. Personal choice.

Some other options for you to consider that would work a treat would be Hornady 150gr, TAP in either 150 or 168gr or lastly the Nosler 150gr BT. All run at 2750 - 2810 and groups of 5 are all one holeing. Faster does not necessarily make a round better.

poulo6.5

Mauser 308 wrote: »

Guys I was planning on using the Hornady superperformance in my 308 this coming deer season. Taking some good advise (Tack) I tried them out on some foxes. They work great but my concern is that they made sh**e of the fox. The exit wound was huge and they they turned the amimal's insides to jelly. My concern is what damage they will do to the deer carcase. The fox would offer much less resistance to the bullet than a deer, so I can only assume that when they hit deer they will expand even quicker. If the fox is anything to go by the deer carcase will be in total sh**e. What experience has anyone of the damage these rounds do to the carcase. I totaly want to put the animal down asap but also want to minimise the meat damage as much as possible.

hi mouser i used 150gr sst at the start of last season and then moved onto the 150gr sst superformance shortly after that.

both worked extreamly well for me.

this is a 180y neck shot


this lad got it at around 100y in the chest with no considerable meet damage


and this doe got hit at 312y and fell on the spot.
 
i shot a good few deer with the superformance stuff and had no complaint yet:D.
in short they are an excellent round;)

FISMA

Mauser 308 wrote: »

Guys I was planning on using the Hornady superperformance in my 308 this coming deer season...

Mauser,
I'm using the SuperFormance stuff in 30-06 in 180 and have not had much wasted meat when shots are properly placed.

The occasional loss of a few ribs is the most I would expect. But I would consider most meat damage my fault in shot placement. I have not yet felt that the round was to blame for wasted meat.

What do you eat on the deer? Do you eat the heart, lungs, liver, or what?

Are you just questioning the meat as opposed to the internals?

There's a butcher in my neck of the woods (about 3000 miles west of Schull) that will cut and package a cleaned deer for you. All he wants is the heart.

Fair deal for me!

Mauser 308

FISMA wrote: »

Mauser,
I'm using the SuperFormance stuff in 30-06 in 180 and have not had much wasted meat when shots are properly placed.

The occasional loss of a few ribs is the most I would expect. But I would consider most meat damage my fault in shot placement. I have not yet felt that the round was to blame for wasted meat.

What do you eat on the deer? Do you eat the heart, lungs, liver, or what?

Are you just questioning the meat as opposed to the internals?

There's a butcher in my neck of the woods (about 3000 miles west of Schull) that will cut and package a cleaned deer for you. All he wants is the heart.

Fair deal for me!

Hi Fishma, no I just eat the meat ie shoulders, fillets and legs etc.
Thanks to everyone for the feed back on the meat damage. My concern was that if the fox was anything to go by even a well placed heart/lung shot would result in a lot of brusing of the front quater. But it looks like you guys have used them on deer with no problems. So roll on the 1st....

kieran1141

would not use anything else on deer 150 gr sst's, have shot a few deer on section 42's already this year and a lot of deer last year all with sst,s, have shot prickets this year at 60yards, 216 yards and 306 yards, no damage if heart and lung shot, and never had one to run more than 10 yards, was using remington core-lockt early last year and were destroying deer. use 95gr sst,s in 243 aswell and same result, my shooting partner uses nothing onely 117gr sst,s in 25.06. and will shoot them a lot further than me, and must say thanks to tack for putting me on to them last year..

Mauser 308

Cheers Guys. Zeroed in and ready to go. Will let you know how I find them also on this thread. Though depends when I drop a deer......:rolleyes: Hopefully over the next 2 or 3 days...
Following Ezridax advise I also got a box of 150g TAP to try on a fox. Have to say also an excellent round, droped on the spot. Mind you it is a 308 and I am behind it :P;)

Tackleberrywho

I chrono'ed 150grain SST's superformance out of my 20" barrel and I was getting an average of 2870fps against Hornady's claimed 2997fps.
Now saying that I did get one that chroned 2930 and I averaged from a 3 shot string.

I've minced foxes with the .223 when hit correctly.
I shot foxes with the .308 and the fox actually looked in better condition after impact

Cass

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I chrono'ed 150grain SST's superformance out of my 20" barrel and I was getting an average of 2870fps against Hornady's claimed 2997fps.

Hornady, like most manufacturers, base all their speeds on a 24" barreled rifle. The majority of the time a longer barrel will produce better velocities and if the round is designed to be fired from a 24" barrel then a shorter barrel will not accomodate the powder charge. Meaning you may/will have unburnt propellant exiting the barrel and hence not getting the full effect of the charge.

When i chrono'd them i was getting amazing speeds. Averaging 3170fps with a peak at 3208fps. I thought it a fluke so fired a few more then tried them out of two other 24" barreled rifle. To test the chrono i tried some target round from my target rifle with know speeds and it was right on the money. Unbelievable speeds from a hunting round.

Mauser 308

Guys just to give you an update on hoe the super performance in 150g-308 is going. I personaly am finding that they dont drop sika as quick as I would like with Heart/Lung shots. I have had some well placed shots result in the deer moving off quite a disance well into cover and being quite hard to find. As a result I am now only necking the deer. But I am new to Sika so maybe its that they are much tougher as guys have said.
But shot my first fallow buck there this evening I would say only 2 years old, maybe into his third season and he was shot in the heart/lung area but droped like a sack of s***e on the spot.
To be honest it was exactly the same shot placment as the sika but very
different results. Is it that the Sika are really that tough?????
Up to this season I have only been shooting Fallow.

tomcat220t

What way is the bullet performing on the heart lung shot ?Sika is tough but the 308 150 superformance should be well up to the task If your having to neck you game you might as well have a .22-250 ,imo.Any photos ?

poulo6.5

you cant draw conclusions on just one or two shots. i have shot plenty of sika in the past couple of years and fallow.
shot placement is important but every shot will be different some will drop on the spot some will run 100y and others will stumble and fall get up then stumble and fall and so on

i shoot with 4 gun a lot and he uses soft points and i use sst both 150gr .308.

when we do our postmortem and find similar entry and exit wounds there can be very different shot reactions, ie one could have ran a bit one could have dropped on the spot.

what i am trying to say is there is no magic potion that will guarantee a deer to drop on the spot.

although the more experience you get you will find less and less runners. but just when you think you have cracked it there will be one that will leave you wondering what happened there.

if every shot was the same the fun would soon be gone out of it

happy hunting

PippaSpaniel

Those Sika are much tougher than any other irish deer they are an amazing animal i personal go for a neck shot ninety percent of the time.I use a 243 and find the superperformance good. Also with the neck shots less meat damage.

Tackleberrywho

PippaSpaniel wrote: »

Those Sika are much tougher than any other irish deer they are an amazing animal i personal go for a neck shot ninety percent of the time.I use a 243 and find the superperformance good. Also with the neck shots less meat damage.

My favourite shot is Head neck, when I get a chance I always take one.
I have only shot "1" Sika to date, but it dropped like a bag of spuds with a neck shot.

I had a fallow run 45 yards ish with the heart in bits and lungs out through the rib cage.
I have shot a lot of fallow over the years and I always take neck if I have a chance to take careful aim

Mauser 308

Guys I suppose my experience has been that fallow dont travel so far when shot right and with a good cal and bullet. But sika seem to move off and well off into cover if heart/lung shot IMO. I am finding necking is a safer bet and that begs the question why do I need a expencive premium bullet if I am necking the deer.

Tackleberrywho

Mauser 308 wrote: »

Guys I suppose my experience has been that fallow dont travel so far when shot right and with a good cal and bullet. But sika seem to move off and well off into cover if heart/lung shot IMO. I am finding necking is a safer bet and that begs the question why do I need a expencive premium bullet if I am necking the deer.

Neck smaller target prone to more movement, thus you need a very accurate round in my humble opinion

Mauser 308

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Neck smaller target prone to more movement, thus you need a very accurate round in my humble opinion

Agreed Tack, but all hunting rounds avalable are fine for 1/4" groups at 100y so long as the shooter is good enough, and they suit the gun.

Tackleberrywho

Mauser 308 wrote: »

Agreed Tack, but all hunting rounds avalable are fine for 1/4" groups at 100y so long as the shooter is good enough, and they suit the gun.

Chrono your rounds and pick the rounds with the smallest variation.

you could fire 5 rounds and they all hit in 1/4 but then you get one 2.5 inches low or high.
if you chron'ed these rounds you would discover that they were the very slow or fast rounds that were not in "the sweet spot" for stability of traj.

The cheaper the ammo the more velocity spread you will have

tomcat220t

If you hit your game high in the shoulder you will have the same effect as a neck shot .They will drop on the spot ;)Heart /lung shots are fine but would not be my first choice on bullet placement .Different strokes ,i guess!

Mauser 308

tomcat220t wrote: »

If you hit your game high in the shoulder you will have the same affect as a neck shot .They will drop on the spot ;)Heart /lung shots are fine but would not be my first choice on bullet placement .Different strokes ,i guess!

Hi Tomcat, how high? just above the shoulder is it? and straight above the shoulder? thanks for the feed back.

Tackleberrywho

Mauser 308 wrote: »

Hi Tomcat, how high? just above the shoulder is it? and straight above the shoulder? thanks for the feed back.

No man or beast can walk without its central nervous system, brain or neck broken

tomcat220t

Mauser 308 wrote: »

Hi Tomcat, how high? just above the shoulder is it? and straight above the shoulder? thanks for the feed back.

Hit them where the back bone is between the shoulder blades ......Two things happen ,break the shoulders(front axle)and smash the back bone .That shot ,taken right will stop any deer ..inc the hardy sika in their tracks .Them 150gr should be great for that shot

clivej

tomcat220t wrote: »

Hit them where the back bone is between the shoulder blades ......Two things happen ,break the shoulders(front axle)and smash the back bone .That shot ,taken right will stop any deer ..inc the hardy sika in their tracks .Them 150gr should be great for that shot

I'm going to try that shot on the next Fallow I get (hopefully in the morning)

Here's that same Skeleton now showing the vitals. And the spinal cord, its quite low at the base of the neck.

tomcat220t

Yea ,it around the lower end of the top 1 third of a sika .Hard to explain well , but your body diagram shows the spinal cord sandwiched between the lower shoulder blade .Works well with my xc so id say the heavier 308 round should be even better .Keep us posted on your results and best of luck with the stalk;)

landkeeper

if you hit too high though you'll never find it though it'll go for two counties before it stops , don't take that as an uphill shot either

tomcat220t

landkeeper wrote: »

if you hit too high though you'll never find it though it'll go for two counties before it stops , don't take that as an uphill shot either

Should never use an animal as your back shot weather you hit high or low .

landkeeper

lost me there !!!!!

tomcat220t

landkeeper wrote: »

if you hit too high though you'll never find it though it'll go for two counties before it stops , don't take that as an uphill shot either

Sorry ,my bad.Taught you were refairing to the bullet going 2 counties .Im guessing you were talking about deer ?But ,you right ...deer have to be shot with a good degree of precision for a successful outcome on a high shoulder shot !Best suited as a broadside .And on spine and or no front axle = NO tracking

landkeeper

no what i meant was if you hit high you will clip the top of the spine and not do sufficient damage to prevent it legging it , the same if you try to take that shot if the beast is on higher ground than you the bullet will clip the shoulder blade and not catch the spinal column same result a beast heading for the horizon
however the opposite is the case if you are above it a downward shot through the shoulder blade will at least clip a lung

tomcat220t

landkeeper wrote: »

no what i meant was if you hit high you will clip the top of the spine and not do sufficient damage to prevent it legging it , the same if you try to take that shot if the beast is on higher ground than you the bullet will clip the shoulder blade and not catch the spinal column same result a beast heading for the horizon
however the opposite is the case if you are above it a downward shot through the shoulder blade will at least clip a lung

Lots of if this and if that .Lets assume one is capable of putting the bullet where it is intended to go and if not ....take up something more suitable like golf,sorry !Ive seen clive j shoot and am quite sure hes very capable of taking a well placed shot as should anyone who shoot game .....Shooting from an elevated position or the opposite will have a different poa from when your rifle was set in a horizontal setting.Most every hunting shot is different and requires best suitable bullet placement per scenario and in some cases game to be left along for another day.Your chat about game (legging it) could be said for any badly placed shot .

landkeeper

were you allways such a belligerent fella or do you have to work hard to be like that
yes i'm sure there are lots of lads here who can know exactly where the bullet from their setup will hit at exactly what range and be able to tell to within the nearest metre how far uphill or down dale they are from their quarry
the point being what you are telling folk is a great shot isn't !

tomcat220t

landkeeper wrote: »

were you allways such a belligerent fella or do you have to work hard to be like that
yes i'm sure there are lots of lads here who can know exactly where the bullet from their setup will hit at exactly what range and be able to tell to within the nearest metre how far uphill or down dale they are from their quarry
the point being what you are telling folk is a great shot isn't !

BELLIGERENT:rolleyes::rolleyes:.Gone from what ifs, to name calling now ......you make it too easy .Back on topic...Despite you opinions on shot placement or lack of:rolleyes: ,high shoulder shots taken correctly in the right circumstances work ...end of !Notthing new or magic about this type of bullet placement .Its just one of many shots for game .OP was having some issues with runoff and i gave my opinion on what works for me .Why do you find this so hard to understand ?Its becoming very obvious your problem is more with me than bullet placement:o:o

Mauser 308

Dont fall out boys. I see what you both are saying. Tomcat is passing on advise based on his experience that a high shoulder shot will drop the dear on the spot - thus fixing the issue I am having.
Landkeeper if I am correct you are pointing out that if not done correctly or allowing for the difference in poa with distance and elevation etc that the shot can be a tricky one. So you are both correct in what you are saying. Thankfully I am capable of the shot in most cases so am going to give it a try. But yes landceaper if its carried out incorectly the deer will run off. But the issue I have been having is that well placed heart/lung shots they are definatley running, so a shot that drops them quicker is the way I need to go. I also plan to get a deer dog, as there is no worse feeling than knowing you have well hit an animal and not finding it. Part of my problem is a lot of my shooting is in the evenings, and I loose the light which makes it all the harder to find them if they move off. Also the problem seems to have become much more of an issue since I moved to sika from fallow.

landkeeper

i was taught by an old school hill stalker in the Hebrides who killed more deer than most of us have hot dinners he always said' take the shot that will kill the beast not the shot that might'
if you hit it through the heart lungs it will die it might take you a while to find it if it runs, but it will be dead, if you take the shot that might kill it it also might not then you have a wounded deer to find or not as the case may be

tomcat220t

Look landkeeper ,I could say i forgot more about shooting deer than you know but that would be unbecoming of me !If you or your old friend find a deer running around with broken shoulders and a severed spine take a picture ,quick :rolleyes:.One could be doing something all their life .....doesent say they know or have it all figured out!Its beyond me why you think this way !Why do you judge some people by your standards .Who to say your heart /lung shot will kill???Your basing that on the fact your hitting where you aimed ....But saying there is a chance shot on a high shoulder shot will miss ?

clivej

Get the handbags out lads ;)

I'm just off now and hopefully get that shoulder shot in.

I was taken head and neck shots all last season so I can hit the spot, except for the one I missed completely :eek:

Tackleberrywho

poulo6.5 wrote: »

hi mouser i used 150gr sst at the start of last season and then moved onto the 150gr sst superformance shortly after that.

both worked extreamly well for me.

this is a 180y neck shot (My personal favourite)


this lad got it at around 100y in the chest with no considerable meet damage
(a fine Buck)


and this doe got hit at 312y and fell on the spot. Great energy retention down range
 
i shot a good few deer with the superformance stuff and had no complaint yet:D.
in short they are an excellent round;)

I have to say the above pics clearly show that SuperFormance work on Deer, and thanks Paulo for going to the bother of posting the pics.

I'm out after deer this afternoon with some Superformance so I'll try and get a few more pics

Glensman

What's the difference between Superperformance and normal SSTs?

Tackleberrywho

Glensman wrote: »

What's the difference between Superperformance and normal SSTs?

Faster, harder hitting and less hold over

Glensman

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Faster, harder hitting and less hold over

Are they more streamlined Tack? Or what is the difference in design/composition?

Tackleberrywho

Glensman wrote: »

Are they more streamlined Tack? Or what is the difference in design/composition?

Powder charge AFAIK

Glensman

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Powder charge AFAIK

Ah! I'm coming at this from the wrong angle in my head entirely.

They'll basically perform the same as my reloads so. If it's the same head and just a taste more powder...

In which case, I agree. Hornady SST Superperformance are excellent

It wasn't me!

The bullet remains the same one way or another. They've just managed to develop a powder that produces more velocity at similar pressures. It's there if you want it, but there was certainly nothing wrong with a 150gr bullet at 2800, so the extra 200 fps isn't going to be a game-changer. If it is, it just tells you you wanted to buy a .30-06 or a .300 win mag in the first place.

Glensman

It wasn't me! wrote: »

The bullet remains the same one way or another. They've just managed to develop a powder that produces more velocity at similar pressures. It's there if you want it, but there was certainly nothing wrong with a 150gr bullet at 2800, so the extra 200 fps isn't going to be a game-changer. If it is, it just tells you you wanted to buy a .30-06 or a .300 win mag in the first place.

[cough] .270 [cough]

Tackleberrywho

Superformance are in almost all Calibres.
I have .223 and .308.
My mate uses them in his .270

Glensman, they are just taking the Tameness out of the round that reloads do anyway

Glensman

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Superformance are in almost all Calibres.
I have .223 and .308.
My mate uses them in his .270

Glensman, they are just taking the Tameness out of the round that reloads do anyway

Aye so I gather...
In fairness the original .270 were probably going faster than the superperformance.
They slowed the .270 down to tempt people to buy the new magnum rifles they had released...

I haven't Chrono'd but my .270 loads wouldnt be particularly fast...

It wasn't me!

The original .270 load was a 130gr at 3140, reduced to 3060 as a standard (Reports were that it was causing a lot of bruising - you're still going to get plenty of bruising at 3060 so it was just a marketing ploy really) That Superformance stuff is only going 3200 with a 130gr, an increase of 60fps on the original standard, and since most .270s have a 22" barrel, chances are it's not making the original standard anyway. Easy to get hung up on velocity too, obviously. The 6.5x55 and 7x57 have been killing everything on this earth for well over a hundred years each without ever going over 2700fps (And they were the superdedooper lightning zappers of their day). Bell killed 1011 elephants with a 7x57 and a 173gr bullet at 2300 fps. For me, the hierarchy of important things would be as follows:

Rifle fit, comfort and handling
Good bullet performance
Accuracy
Velocity

If I could think of more things you can bet velocity would still be right down there. You can learn drop and wind drift tables and learn to estimate range accurately enough, but the others can't be learnt.

Glensman

It wasn't me! wrote: »

The original .270 load was a 130gr at 3140, reduced to 3060 as a standard (Reports were that it was causing a lot of bruising - you're still going to get plenty of bruising at 3060 so it was just a marketing ploy really) That Superformance stuff is only going 3200 with a 130gr, an increase of 60fps on the original standard, and since most .270s have a 22" barrel, chances are it's not making the original standard anyway. Easy to get hung up on velocity too, obviously. The 6.5x55 and 7x57 have been killing everything on this earth for well over a hundred years each without ever going over 2700fps (And they were the superdedooper lightning zappers of their day). Bell killed 1011 elephants with a 7x57 and a 173gr bullet at 2300 fps. For me, the hierarchy of important things would be as follows:

Rifle fit, comfort and handling
Good bullet performance
Accuracy
Velocity

If I could think of more things you can bet velocity would still be right down there. You can learn drop and wind drift tables and learn to estimate range accurately enough, but the others can't be learnt.

I read an article on the Chuck Hawks site saying that a slightly slower load will almost always be the more accurate.
Hence my load not being particularly fast...

It wasn't me!

Glensman wrote: »

I read an article on the Chuck Hawks site saying that a slightly slower load will almost always be the more accurate.
Hence my load not being particularly fast...

Personally I take everything he says with about a kilo of salt, but yeah, accuracy beats velocity every day, at whatever velocity you find it, and the most accurate rifle is still useless if the bullet doesn't perform well when it gets there, and bullet performance isn't worth a damn if you can't instinctively put it on target, so rifle fit and feel is more important, and so on... Basically, I figure the hunter is always going to be the weakest link in the chain, and the absolute best thing you can do there is make the rifle fit, function and feel perfect so it points like an extension of the mind, then it's easy to get the bullet on target so that it can perform flawlessly.