why are macs so ****ing expensive

nesf

Thor wrote: »

But to me, If you have a decent pc, Then you can run both Windows and Mac OSX

You can do the exact same on any modern Intel Mac running Leopard or above iirc. A Windows partition for gaming is pretty much par for the course many Mac people like myself.

Chris Hansen

I shall end this debate once and for all.

PC: Used by astronauts aboard the ISS

MAC: Used by Perez Hilton, notorious blogger, gossip columnist, fagghot

PC Wins

Thor

nesf wrote: »

You can do the exact same on any modern Intel Mac running Leopard or above iirc. A Windows partition for gaming is pretty much par for the course many Mac people like myself.

This is true, But to be fair, Running OSX on Windows it alot easier to do using say vmware then running Windows on a Mac. While i have never used a Mac with Windows before, I do hear alot of issues from people who have done so.

Also, Buying a decent pc is alot cheaper than buying a mac! which in turn lets you run both!

Also, Windows runs (alot more)games, For those that don't have the ability to
run Windows on the Mac are **** out of luck.

That being said, I particularly like the slickness of mac and how well it runs! These points cannot be said for Windows!

Chris Hansen

My real reply to this debate would be linux, but here goes:

Apple products have a hint of elitism about them and i hate that, especially when i think back 15 years ago all i ever had (and deemed myself lucky to have) were hand me down pcs from bygone eras, but the opened up a new world to me as a kid, the world of computing. However, by pricing themselves high, macs are out of reach of younger generations, and those that cant afford them.


Am i right or am i right?

papu

nesf wrote: »

Doesn't matter if there's a vulnerability if no one is trying to exploit it. Mac OSX benefits from the same thing Linux benefits from, just being economically very unattractive to hackers. Both are exploitable, it just isn't worth the time and effort when you could be exploiting Windows machines instead.

Thats not much of an arguement tbh , its like not locking your door because you live in the countryside and sure not many robberies happen there , well the one time somthing does come out for a mac everyones gonna be F*cked , there was already an exploit shown a few weeks ago that if someone wanted to they could hack into the battery of the new mac laptops cause them the be irrepairably damaged or even explode..

...Its so expensive because you dont need antivirus
But the Vunerabilities are only slightly behind that of Windows machines
yeah but nobody wants to hack macs cause dey iz all cool and hip n shiz :rolleyes:

paying more for something thats less secure... only apple could get away with that;)

nesf

Thor wrote: »

This is true, But to be fair, Running OSX on Windows it alot easier to do using say vmware then running Windows on a Mac. While i have never used a Mac with Windows before, I do hear alot of issues from people who have done so.

Also, Buying a decent pc is alot cheaper than buying a mac! which in turn lets you run both!

Also, Windows runs (alot more)games, For those that don't have the ability to
run Windows on the Mac are **** out of luck.

That being said, I particularly like the slickness of mac and how well it runs! These points cannot be said for Windows!

I'm posting off the Win 7 partition on my Mac right now and honestly having run dual booting computers for years before getting a Mac it was idiot proof getting this set up going. Apple have Bootcamp which partitions the drive for you, starts the Windows installation and then afterwards downloads all the specific drivers for your machine. The only machines you can't do this on are old PowerPC based ones. Honestly I've done this on two Macs now and haven't had a single issue with either hardware wise.

Partitioning a drive on OSX is simple and you can't **** up your machine doing it. This really can't be said for Windows. If I was telling a non-techie to get a dual booting OSX/Windows set up going I'd tell them to go the OSX first route every time.

nesf

papu wrote: »

Thats not much of an arguement tbh , its like not locking your door because you live in the countryside and sure not many robberies happen there , well the one time somthing does come out for a mac everyones gonna be F*cked , there was already an exploit shown a few weeks ago that if someone wanted to they could hack into the battery of the new mac laptops cause them the be irrepairably damaged or even explode..

...Its so expensive because you dont need antivirus
But the Vunerabilities are only slightly behind that of Windows machines
yeah but nobody wants to hack macs cause dey iz all cool and hip n shiz :rolleyes:

paying more for something thats less secure... only apple could get away with that;)

It's a perfectly good argument and works for Linux and Unix too. Hackers are a problem in Windows not because of the vulnerabilities but because of the OS's popularity. If Windows machines only made up 10% of the market they too would benefit from not being a target of viruses.

Security matters **** all if no one is trying to put a virus on your machine. If Macs become substantially popular they'll be facing the exact same problems as Windows machines face right now. Any operating system that you pick would have the same problems so long as the user can have root access.

There is absolutely nothing intrinsic to OSX that makes it more secure. Nothing. All that matters is that only a very small fraction of PCs out there in the wild are running it. The only people wittering on about Macs being more secure are people who don't understand computers very well.

marco_polo

nesf wrote: »

Doesn't matter if there's a vulnerability if no one is trying to exploit it. Mac OSX benefits from the same thing Linux benefits from, just being economically very unattractive to hackers. Both are exploitable, it just isn't worth the time and effort when you could be exploiting Windows machines instead.

The world has moved on a bit from traditional self spreading viruses like the good old days anyway where thousands of Windows PCs all running the same Outlook and IE versions could get infected in a few days often just by some hacker for the hell of it. Nowadays most attention is drawn towards all sorts of elaborate phishing scams, trojans, keyloggers all with the criminal intent aim of getting peoples CC details.

challengemaster

marco_polo wrote: »

The world has moved on a bit from traditional self spreading viruses like the good old days anyway where thousands of Windows PCs all running the same Outlook and IE versions could get infected in a few days often just by some hacker for the hell of it. Nowadays most attention is drawn towards all sorts of elaborate phishing scams, trojans, keyloggers all with the criminal intent aim of getting peoples CC details.

So the main issue is PEBKAC... :pac:

nesf

marco_polo wrote: »

The world has moved on a bit from traditional self spreading viruses like the good old days anyway where thousands of Windows PCs all running the same Outlook and IE versions could get infected in a few days often just by some hacker for the hell of it. Nowadays most attention is drawn towards all sorts of elaborate phishing scams, trojans, keyloggers all with the criminal intent aim of getting peoples CC details.

Sure but trojans and keyloggers for both OSX and Linux are rare as hen's teeth. If you were writing either you'd make far more money writing a Windows one. Very occasionally you'll see malware of some sort crop up for one of the smaller OSs but it's bloody rare. Now that we have iOS and Android as targets the chance of someone bothering to write something targeting OSX or Linux has dropped even further.

marco_polo

challengemaster wrote: »

So the main issue is PEBKAC... :pac:

Wasn't it always though , even those large scale self replicating attacks of the past were probably started most of the time by one person running a attachment called pleaseclickme.exe

marco_polo

nesf wrote: »

Sure but trojans and keyloggers for both OSX and Linux are rare as hen's teeth. If you were writing either you'd make far more money writing a Windows one. Very occasionally you'll see malware of some sort crop up for one of the smaller OSs but it's bloody rare. Now that we have iOS and Android as targets the chance of someone bothering to write something targeting OSX or Linux has dropped even further.

Oh I agree I am not disputing that at all, there is no doubt that OSX is the safer place to be currently (I'd be inclinded to agree with you on the the reason why). It does require a bit of extra knowledge and effort to stay safe with Win 7.

If nothing else is certain, it is that IT diversity (OS, browsers, email etc) is good for users of every system.

Chris Hansen

I think if you buy a Mac you are likely to be in the have Starbucks crowd

nesf

marco_polo wrote: »

Oh I agree I am not disputing that at all, there is no doubt that OSX is the safer place to be currently (I'd be inclinded to agree with you on the the reason why). It does require a bit of extra knowledge and effort to stay safe with Win 7.

If nothing else is certain, it is that IT diversity (OS, browsers, email etc) is good for users of every system.

IT diversity is good, but like many things you're forced into using the dominant OS/whatever if you want to do certain things. Like how every office suite needs to be able to open Office files and so on.

Chris Hansen

Certainly competition between the PC and Mac would be goods for us as consumers?

nesf

Chris Hansen wrote: »

Certainly competition between the PC and Mac would be goods for us as consumers?

Well, choice in itself is good. Linux, OSX and Windows all force each other to innovate and improve and all liberally steal ideas from each other while they're at it. A single OS world would be awful for consumers. Having multiple OS choices for the same hardware offers consumers with a lot of choice as to how they do things though honestly it's hard to move away completely from Windows for many people and a lot of Linux or OSX users maintain a Windows partition or virtual machine for certain tasks.

marco_polo

nesf wrote: »

IT diversity is good, but like many things you're forced into using the dominant OS/whatever if you want to do certain things. Like how every office suite needs to be able to open Office files and so on.

Hopefully one day every office suite will need to be able to open Open Office files

nesf

marco_polo wrote: »

Hopefully one day every office suite will need to be able to open Open Office files

Isn't Libre Office these days that's uber popular?

Chris Hansen

In fairness, the debate is otiose until internet problems like these can be resolved by working together

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=73897595#post73897595

nesf

Chris Hansen wrote: »

In fairness, the debate is otiose until internet problems like these can be resolved by working together

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=73897595#post73897595

Trolls existed long before writing developed and will exist long after we are dead.

Chris Hansen

nesf wrote: »

Trolls existed long before writing developed and will exist long after we are dead.

I assume you mean spammer?

nesf

Chris Hansen wrote: »

I assume you mean spammer?

It's a pretty trollish spam.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Cork24

If you wish you could Install Mac Osx 10.6 onto a PC,

i have a Mac book looking at a Imac but its costing 1400, But i could get Intel i7 with 8Gb of Ram for less and install VmWare and Install a Cracked Version.

maccored

i cant understand the logic of using an OS design for specific hardware on a machine that doesnt have the hardware. its a bit like, again, having a ford focus with a BMW grill on it. its also a bit like how some musicians buy protools software, not realising the protools HD system is made up of extra hardware, not the software alone.

With apple, its the combination of both hardware and software. the last mac I owned that tried going the cheaper, PC hardware route was the 4400 ... and it was a piece of shít.

Ciaran500

maccored wrote: »

i cant understand the logic of using an OS design for specific hardware on a machine that doesnt have the hardware.

Cause most of the hardware you pay a premium for with a Mac are just standard parts that can be bought off the shelf for much cheaper?

challengemaster

Ciaran500 wrote: »

Cause most of the hardware you pay a premium for with a Mac are just standard parts that can be bought off the shelf for much cheaper?

nesf

Ciaran500 wrote: »

Cause most of the hardware you pay a premium for with a Mac are just standard parts that can be bought off the shelf for much cheaper?

You're paying for build quality and design not just the parts inside the machine. The exact same thing applies to many of the high end PCs.

Cork24

nesf wrote: »

You're paying for build quality and design not just the parts inside the machine. The exact same thing applies to many of the high end PCs.

Inside an Imac is just as looking into a Laptop. Same thing what can MAC do different that you cant do with PC hardware.. MAC & PC hardware are more or less the same.

Thor

I have said this before, The argument's are unfair.

Mac's are made by and only by Apple!!

Windows pc are made by everyone but Microsoft, It depends on the brand you pick.

You can buy some pretty nice looking clean laptops and pc's. You can buy all in one pc's with built in touch screen.

The problem is that Apple don't allow third party manufacturing, This does keep there style and reliability, But ultimately cause the cost to be so high.

They aren't available to low end consumers and anyone who can spend that much on a mac, Could easily buy a beast of a pc!! which in turn does alot more in mine opinion, While with mac you get reliability and slickness, With windows you get alot more mainly because alot more people use it.

The same argument is made for Android Vs iPhone, While Android is better, There is so much more content available for iOS, Mainly because more people use it.

Really comes down to preference!!

The old saying is, When it comes to taste, There is no argument!!