Members of the travelling community with jobs?

Oranage2

Now I dont want this to be a hate thread so no traveller bashing1

But has anybody ever see a traveller with a propper tax paying job?

I did once - lovely fella, he was a gay hairdresser and did loads of charity work with a suicide charity cause, i didnt know but there is a high suicide rate amongst gay men in the travelling community.

So have you ever walked into a shop or other places of employment and seen a traveller?

flutterflye

How would I know?

Would they be wearing a sign around their neck that reads "I am a traveler"?

Assassin saphir

yes, i used to work with a girl who is from the travelling community...hardest working person i ever met.

Soups123

I'm sure there are plenty working and paying tax, maybe not in city centre dublin but around the country. There are plenty I'm sure not like there are in the settled community

Dan133269

No. Never.

FatherLen

this is going to become a traveller bashing thread. it is inevitable.

Soups123

flutterflye wrote: »

How would I know?

Would they be wearing a sign around their neck that reads "I am a traveler"?

Nope probably just a sign saying 'this is not a tax paying job'

Jumpy

Thank god this thread isnt one of those usual ones tarring their driveways with the same brush.




fnarr

Wantobe

flutterflye wrote: »

Would they be wearing a sign around their neck that reads "I am a traveler"?

Yeah, think that is an actual H&S requirement.:rolleyes:

But yes, I have known members of the travelling community who in normal jobs. Two that I can think of straight away, maybe more.

Soups123

FatherLen wrote: »

this is going to become a traveller bashing thread. it is inevitable.

Agree. I'm dropping out of this one before they come in to defend!

robman60

I've seen a few, but I mean very few. The government benefits are too appealing to people who couldn't be arsed to work, I think.

flutterflye

Wantobe wrote: »

Yeah, think that is an actual H&S requirement.:rolleyes:

But yes, I have known members of the travelling community who in normal jobs. Two that I can think of straight away, maybe more.

Obviously I mean- how do you tell if someone is a traveler?

Anyone could be a traveler, and you might never know unless it came up in conversation.

Jumpy

Ah wasnt dat Einstein fella a pavee?

Someone said he wuz a hell of a tinker.

Oranage2

Actually i know another guy who was a traveler and joined the army when he was young - he now runs a succesful security company - lovely lad too would do anything for you

Dan133269

robman60 wrote: »

I've seen a few, but I mean very few. The government benefits are too appealing to people who couldn't be arsed to work, I think.

I doubt that the package of social benefits is the reason to influence their lack of a work ethic!

Wantobe

flutterflye wrote: »

how do you tell if someone is a traveler?

Small towns know everyone and everything. Could tell you what they had for breakfast if you really wanted to know.;)

Cat Melodeon

I've worked with plenty of Travellers down the years, mostly women, mostly in community or educational settings (the areas I work in). I also know a lad working for a plumbing firm and a guy working down in the creamery. I'm sure there are more but it's not as if I ask everyone I meet whether they are a Traveller or not. Nor can I say whether they are fully tax compliant, it's not the kind of thing that crops up in conversation, and I do live in Lowryland so most folks hereabouts avoid that topic altogether.

lonsdale

Jumpy wrote: »

Thank god this thread isnt one of those usual ones tarring their driveways with the same brush.




fnarr

Take a bow son, very amusing.

bnt

If you aren't traveling, are you still a Traveler? I'm not being (totally) facetious, it's a serious question from a foreigner. Just what defines someone as a Traveler, if not the itinerant lifestyle? Race? Tribe? Language?

AudreyHepburn

I never have but this does not mean none of them work. I'm sure more of them would like to work, but lets face it, few employers would be willing to hire them.

Which is wrong in my book. If they are willing to work, let them do so.

iPlop

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I never have but this does not mean none of them work. I'm sure more of them would like to work, but lets face it, few employers would be willing to hire them.

Which is wrong in my book. If they are willing to work, let them do so.

I used to work with a very talented electronics engineer that came from a traveller backround, her mother and father settled about 35 years ago and as a result herself and her brothers went to school and successfully integrated into society.Now she's a highly paid engineer in a large multinational.

Kevin Duffy

Yes, quite a few and I wouldn't be well up on the subject so I'd imagine I'm on the low side.

the_syco

bnt wrote: »

If you aren't traveling, are you still a Traveler? I'm not being (totally) facetious, it's a serious question from a foreigner. Just what defines someone as a Traveler, if not the itinerant lifestyle? Race? Tribe? Language?

Most "Travellers" live in a mobile home that has no wheels, on land they don't own (sometimes owned by the local County Council, sometimes not), and they don't travel.

rossc007

This was discussed in a thread in Politics the other day:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=2056302017

Someone quoted, un-sourced, that 14% of the travelling community are in taxable jobs.

iPlop

the_syco wrote: »

Most "Travellers" live in a mobile home that has no wheels, on land they don't own (sometimes owned by the local County Council, sometimes not), and they don't travel.

I think they want wheels on their caravans.


"What de fcuk do I want a caravan if it's got no fcukin' wheels?" -Mickey, Snatch.

prinz

Sink The Banana wrote: »

..her mother and father settled about 35 years ago and as a result herself and her brothers went to school and successfully integrated into society..

The key to breaking the cycle.

Freddie59

rossc007 wrote: »

This was discussed in a thread in Politics the other day:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=2056302017

Someone quoted, un-sourced, that 14% of the travelling community are in taxable jobs.

How are all those vans and 4x4s funded theN? Hmm. Interesting to say the least. On another note, why is it that everone fears 'traveller-bashing' in a thread? Are they beyond discussing? There seems to be no issue with discussing dole cheats and tax evaders - but you cannot discuss travellers who may fall into these categories. WTF?:eek:

Oranage2

Freddie59 wrote: »

How are all those vans and 4x4s funded theN? Hmm. Interesting to say the least. On another note, why is it that everone fears 'traveller-bashing' in a thread? Are they beyond discussing? There seems to be no issue with discussing dole cheats and tax evaders - but you cannot discuss travellers who may fall into these categories. WTF?:eek:

Im all for a good traveller bashing thread but theres so many and i just wanted to find out how wide spread traveller occupation is in the work place.

this thread was actually stemmed from "my big fat gypsie wedding" and one of the girls left her job as a secretary and i thought it was very unusual for a traveller to have a job in the first place. And by this thread its still a very unusual thing to see a traveller in the work place.

Cat Melodeon

bnt wrote: »

If you aren't traveling, are you still a Traveler? I'm not being (totally) facetious, it's a serious question from a foreigner. Just what defines someone as a Traveler, if not the itinerant lifestyle? Race? Tribe? Language?

No doubt you'll get some pretty facetious answers, but most people (Travellers, academics and the unbigoted) base membership of the Travelling community as stemming from certain cultural traits. These are things like language (Cant & Gammon are Traveller languages/dialects), customs and traditions, religiousity, ancestry, kinship, etc. The UN regularly criticises the Irish state for not recognising Travellers as an ethnic group as do the various EU bodies (RAXEN etc). And no, Travellers don't have to travel to be Travellers. Many were forced to settle during the 60s/70s, so they can no longer be defined by nomadism.

Cat Melodeon

Oranage2 wrote: »

And by this thread its still a very unusual thing to see a traveller in the work place.

Surely that depends on where you look?

Travellers are less likely to be employed than the settled population though, that is true. Many work as traders, in construction etc - do self-employed people appear in employment stats (genuine Q)? A family near us have run a flooring company for about 40 years, going from selling carpet out of the back of a van to having a fairly substantial warehouse/showroom that employs around 10 people (all Travellers). I'm sure they do pretty well for themselves, they have a modest but immaculate house and a couple of newish vans. I've never read any reports of them being done for tax fraud. And as for the stereotype of the tarmac spreaders etc, unless you've inspected their affairs you can hardly accuse them of tax evasion, no more than you can any self-employed person. Unless of course they are complete cowboys unregistered for VAT etc, but you get them amongst settled folks too.

Rabidlamb

I've bought a mobile home with one & spent half a day with him getting it onto the site.
Nicer fella you wouldn't meet.

Seen plenty of the bad side too, they're a mixed bag.

Joesh82

The problem travellers have is that they have no skills or education to give them a chance of being employable. This along with their reputation for not being trust worthy at a time where jobs are scarce means they would only be able to get ****ty jobs which they wont do.

deisedave

Yes actually a few, but funnily enough the ones I knew with jobs were gay and their community would'nt be really accepting of that lifestyle, so they would'nt associate much with the traveller community anymore.

tayto lover

Joesh82 wrote: »

The problem travellers have is that they have no skills or education to give them a chance of being employable. This along with their reputation for not being trust worthy at a time where jobs are scarce means they would only be able to get ****ty jobs which they wont do.

The Traveller workshops (education centres) are being closed all around the country to save money. This will be a big blow to these adults who were seeking education in the hope of getting proper work. It was also an outlet and a social venue for traveller women who otherwise would rarely leave their homes or halting sites. A mistake i think.

Joesh82

tayto lover wrote: »

The Traveller workshops (education centres) are being closed all around the country to save money. This will be a big blow to these adults who were seeking education in the hope of getting proper work. It was also an outlet and a social venue for traveller women who otherwise would rarely leave their homes or halting sites. A mistake i think.

Definately, but hopefully what has been done so far will show them the importance of integration. Travellers are very protective about their way of life but they must realise that there are huge flaws with it. There isnt big funds for these projects anymore so a lot of the changes needed are going to have to come from travellers themselves and especially their approach to education.

policarp

Was'nt there an itinerant actor who played Blackie Connors in Glenroe...?

Uncle Mclovin

policarp wrote: »

Was'nt there an itinerant actor who played Blackie Connors in Glenroe...?

Yes Blackie is a traveller in real life. His brother Johnny isn't.


He's the only traveller I've ever known to have a tax paying job besides the few who work for Pavee Point.

Bloody Nipples

http://www.paveepoint.ie/pdf/SocialInclusion.pdf

Here we go , scroll down to page 13 for employment statistics. 73% of men and 63% of women are apparently unemployed.

Post the Celtic Tiger economic exclusion amongst Travellers persists and contrasts
starkly with other sectors of Irish society. The 2002 census highlighted that 73% of
Traveller men are unemployed in comparison to a national male figure of 9%; while
63% of Traveller women are unemployed in comparison to a national figure of 8%.
The range of employment that Travellers are engaged in fits into the ‘first in, first out’
category so that even for Travellers who have secured employment very few are in
sustainable /career building type jobs.
The only other group whose unemployment rates are comparable to the Traveller
community are disabled people. Targets set within the National Anti-Poverty Strategy
to reduce long-term unemployment amongst vulnerable groups down to the national
average will not be met by 2007 for Travellers.
Pavee Point welcomes the Special Initiative for Travellers which is being organised
through FÁS. The focus of SIT is the Traveller economy and other employment
initiatives for Travellers within four pilot areas (Dublin, Galway, Clare and Cork) and
up to Є0.5m should be spent by the end of this year. However, a lack of
understanding of cultural diversity and the impact of inequality on a community may
hamper the potential of this development.
There are particular issues that face Traveller women in the labour market and that
greatly restrict their progression options. For example, the income an adult dependent
can earn is calculated on the basis of a daily rate worked out on the basis of a 7 day
week. So any adult who is the dependent adult in social welfare terms can only work a
few hours a day (or else a lot less than the minimum wage hourly rate) if they do not
wish to interfere with the family’s overall income. This has particular implications for
women including Traveller women. It can also impact on Traveller women’s ability to
access a greater variety of training as the allowable income does not always keep pace
with the FÁS training allowance and FÁS is the main provider / funder of Traveller
women’s training opportunities.

Apologies about the state of the copy/paste, but I couldn't be arsed fixing it :cool:

strobe

Back in the silly times I had three traveller lads working for me. All above board, paying tax etc. Knew one of them from when we were kids, we used to play pool together every Saturday morning for a few years. When work increased to the point I needed to take another worker on he suggested his brother, who I knew from back in the day as well. Then a couple of months later another job came up and I took a cousin of theirs on. Never any problems and they let me know that if I needed anyone else they knew plenty of lads looking for work. I reckon if I had of had the work available I could have had a work force of 20 guys they knew show up for work on a Monday morning with a days notice.

rossc007

tayto lover wrote: »

The Traveller workshops (education centres) are being closed all around the country to save money. This will be a big blow to these adults who were seeking education in the hope of getting proper work. It was also an outlet and a social venue for traveller women who otherwise would rarely leave their homes or halting sites. A mistake i think.

Surely they are entitled to go to national school like everyone else?

mikemac

rossc007 wrote: »

Surely they are entitled to go to national school like everyone else?

You want adults to go to national school?

Cat Melodeon

Joesh82 wrote: »

Definately, but hopefully what has been done so far will show them the importance of integration. Travellers are very protective about their way of life but they must realise that there are huge flaws with it. There isnt big funds for these projects anymore so a lot of the changes needed are going to have to come from travellers themselves and especially their approach to education.

Integration should be a two-way street. There are huge flaws in many people's ways of life, what you might consider to be normal many might see as unattainable/weird/downright wrong. Who decides what is normal? Integration has to involve the majority making some concessions and accommodations as well, and welcoming those aspects of the minority group (be they Travellers or immigrants or whatever) that can enrichen society. People who claim Traveller culture has nothing to offer and that THEY must integrate into US mustn't have any real contact with Travellers.

arybvtcw0eolkf

I've worked with a few in the defence forces.

slum dog

seems like more and more of these threads popping up to undermine the travelling community since the recession. i wonder why?

mikemac

You're here from 2010, there were just as many of these threads before the recession

Cat Melodeon

rossc007 wrote: »

Surely they are entitled to go to national school like everyone else?

National school is not an appropriate educational setting for adults. Travellers, particularly those who attended school before the improvements of the 1990s and 2000s, often experienced patchy education, were automatically placed in 'remedial' units regardless of need and were often segregated completely. Most left school early. Those Travellers who are nomadic often experience problems with literacy and numeracy. Older Travellers who had bad experiences in schools may not place value on education for their own kids and the cycle can go on repeat. That's why it is important to have resources like the Education Centres to provide training and assistance to those people who want to improve their lot. Telling a 45 year old woman to go back to primary school isn't very helpful.

Cat Melodeon

mikemac wrote: »

You're here from 2010, there were just as many of these threads before the recession

Yep, Traveller-bashing never goes out of fashion.

arybvtcw0eolkf

slum dog wrote: »

seems like more and more of these threads popping up to undermine the travelling community since the recession. i wonder why?

mikemac wrote: »

You're here from 2010, there were just as many of these threads before the recession

Maybe a re-reg!.

slum dog

mikemac wrote: »

You're here from 2010, there were just as many of these threads before the recession

have you got statistics to back that up?

tayto lover

slum dog wrote: »

seems like more and more of these threads popping up to undermine the travelling community since the recession. i wonder why?

I saw very few posts undermining them in fairness. The Government seem to be undermining them though by closing their education centres which i believe is a mistake.

slum dog

i think some people are looking for scapegoats to make their lives on the dole less painful