Capcoms (Rumoured) System to combat used games sales

NTMK

I'm all for the online pass system but this takes the cake

One NeoGAF member has discovered that Resident Evil: The Mercenaries 3D for Nintendo's new 3DS handheld contains a unique feature that has the press giving Capcom an evil eye. This feature reportedly resides in the European, Japanese and North American versions of the new 3DS game.
According to the Mercenaries 3D manual, saved data cannot be reset – meaning that users can't delete the data that's saved directly on the cartridge. Now imagine what will happen when all saved game slots are used, and the player decides to trade it in at GameStop for something new. For those wanting to purchase the Resident Evil game used, this particular copy would essentially be worthless, as the buyer couldn't start the game from the beginning or re-unlock all the bonus features.
There's speculation that Capcom deliberately made it impossible to delete user data in order to discourage used game sales. We already know that the industry frowns on its consumers who choose not to purchase games at full price; in fact, most publishers and developers claim that it's hurting the overall industry revenue, that used games sales does more damage than piracy. After all, said parties aren't making money off used game sales.
Shortly after the limitation became known, EB Games Australia said that it pulled Resident Evil: The Mercenaries 3D from the shelves just before the game officially went live. So far EB Games parent GameStop here in North America to pull the game thus far, stating that "we've heard nothing down the line" and that "anything you hear otherwise, I'd say they're rumors put out by our competitors."
Eurogamer eventually contacted the UK arm of Capcom to find out if the limitation was indeed a deliberate plot to thwart second-hand sales. "The game's value at second-hand in the UK is not affected by whether or not the game can have its data reset," a Capcom spokesperson said. "Customers in the UK will not experience a reduced second-hand value should they wish to trade in their purchase."
But the statement doesn't seem valid, and now Resident Evil: The Mercenaries 3D as "Not Rentable" due to the restrictions. Obviously the restriction will have an impact somewhere, whether it's the rental sector, the used games sector or even full-blown retail sales.
Publishers have recently tried to scale back used game sales by including one-time-use codes in the pricier, new copies. These codes usually offer certain content and in some cases unlocks the online portion of the game only once. Several publishers are now offering subscriptions to the online component in order to reel in some of the revenue lost with pre-owned sales.
This isn't the first time Capcom has come under fire in regards to DRM. Street Fighter IV, Resident Evil 5 and a few other titles lock their save game data directly to the PlayStation 3 console rather than linking them to the users PSN ID, thus leaving consumers without their current progress if the console crashes or they've bought a new model. Several Capcom titles also require an Internet connection in order to play, and thus left legit Capcom customers without anything to play when the network went down for weeks.
But while Capcom may or may not have been deliberately thwarting used game sales with the save game limitation, the move may have opened the door for other publishers to do the same. For all we know, this may be something Nintendo is enforcing, and that we'll see similar limitations in its cartridge-based games from here on out.
Capcom's Resident Evil: The Mercenaries 3D is shipping to store shelves nationwide starting today.

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/3DS-Resident-Evil-Mercenaries-DRM-save-game,news-11674.html

Gandalph

Well thats sly, I dont trade in many games at all but having data that cant be deleted is rediculous. If you liked the game enough you are only given a certain amount of times to complete it and then have to buy a new copy?!

chin_grin

This guy didn't like it at all! :pac:

http://www.destructoid.com/respectfully-not-buying-resident-evil-the-mercs-3d-204798.phtml

Resident Evil: The Mercenaries 3D is out in stores today and I was quite looking forward to buying it. My 3DS is finally getting some attention after a post-launch release drought and I was hoping to keep up the momentum started by Ocarina of Time 3D with Capcom's debut offering.

However, the news that it will contain persistent save data that cannot be reset has caused me to rethink my purchasing decision. After talking to gamers, GameStop, Capcom, and weighing my options, I have decided to keep my cash and wait for something else.

I will respectfully abstain from purchasing The Mercenaries 3D.



The driving factor of my decision is that I feel I would be supporting a cause I have staunchly opposed for many years -- the fight against used games. I support the secondhand game market because I believe it is ultimately beneficial to the games industry -- I think it helps poorer gamers afford brand new titles with trade-in credit, and I believe it generates greater exposure to an intellectual property, in that those who buy a game used are more likely to buy the sequel brand new if they enjoyed it.

These are long-term benefits to the used games industry, but unfortunately, publishers only ever think of childish, short-term gratification. They want their cash now, and they feel entitled to that cash even after they made an initial sale. Features such as online passes -- that hold content to ransom unless users input a purchasable code -- inconvenience new and used consumers alike, and eventually devalue used games, which could have long-term ramifications on the market. As someone who cares about the future of this industry, as well as consumer rights, I cannot in good faith support any move that fights used games in a direct and potentially damaging way.





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Capcom has stated that the used market was not a factor. I can't say I am wholly inclined to believe it because ... what other factors could there be? I'd love for Capcom to set my mind at rest by explaining what DID factor into the decision, but the truth is -- it hasn't. I asked a very direct question while chatting with the publisher -- what influenced its decision to stop consumers erasing save data? My conversation with Capcom ended there. No answer was given.

Regardless of Capcom's justifications, however, the fact is that The Mercenaries 3D does represent harm to the used game market. Reports of GameStop's refusal to accept trade-ins for the game are increasing, and store managers have personally told me that their computers outright block the game from being processed. In essence, this has quite smartly locked The Mercenaries out of the used game market, and could easily inspire other 3DS game publishers to pull the same stunt.

It's not hard to imagine those publishers already fighting used games -- the likes of Electronic Arts and THQ -- are salivating at the prospect of games that are effectively immune to used sales.

Some will argue that, due to the non-linear nature of the game, this won't effect anybody. However, a used consumer will potentially risk buying a game that has all content unlocked, and a range of user-inputted high scores rather than scores set by the game itself. Some of you might not like unlockables, but I know I'm not alone when I say that the appeal of a non-linear, arena-based game like this personally lies in the discovery of new skills and fresh stages, a gradual release of content that keeps me invested in playing, rather than a complete explosion of gameplay with total access from the outset. Some of you might be fine with having all the content and somebody else's high scores -- I am not.



Even outside of that, I know of gamers who like resetting their data. Ars Technica's Ben Kuchera stated today that he regularly starts all types of handheld games again from scratch.

"I wasn't sent a review copy, was going to go out and buy it, but MAN that's just a direct attack on your customers. I can't support it," he Tweeted. "I really like wiping my save game files on portable games to start from scratch. Do it all the time. That makes this a **** deal for me."

I'm not a big data-eraser myself, but I understand why some like to do it, and I totally agree that Ben has a right to be perturbed by this. It's yet another instance of control being taken away from gamers -- a worrying theme of this generation.

Not to mention, Capcom's decision will inevitably lead to an increase in hacking. When you tell gamers they cannot do something, a certain subset of them will invariably take that as a challenge. Every time a company claims that its hardware is impossible to hack, the hackers rise to the challenge and prove them wrong. Capcom blocking the erasure of saved data is akin to painting a great big bullseye on every copy in stores. People will find the exploits that allow them to wipe data, and that could easily open the doors to other types of exploits that publishers won't like.



Ultimately, I'm not outraged by any of this, but after rationally examining the situation, I feel that I would be undermining my own principals if I gave monetary support to a game that directly conflicts with something I unequivocally, proudly believe in -- the importance and value of the secondhand game market. Whether Capcom truly did this to fight used games isn't the issue. The fact is that Resident Evil: The Mercenaries 3D does have an impact on the ongoing conflict, and as such, I abstain.

I've got too much respect for this industry and its consumers to support something that represents a direct assault on used games.

It is a very stupid idea by Capcom all right just to ensure they have good first hand sales.

cherryghost

Its not a rumour, its completely true. I dont mind tbh as I don't bother trading in my games

super_furry

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-06-29-game-will-accept-resi-evil-3d-trade-ins

HMV won't be accepting it for trade-in.

To be honest the only thing this decision has achieved with me is convinced me not to buy the game. I was going to pick it up, despite my reservations about it being a slightly fleshed out version of a Resident Evil 5 bonus game, but to know that I’m stuck with it once I’m done, means that I now won’t be buying it.

o1s1n

Any one know what kind of save feature is in a 3DS cartridge?

I wonder would it just be a case of reseating something to reset the save.

Retr0gamer

pretty sure it's rewriteable flash memory so it's not like the volatile memory of old games where you can take the battery out.

Overheal

cherryghost wrote: »

Its not a rumour, its completely true. I dont mind tbh as I don't bother trading in my games

Nevermind that, I still have a copies of my old SNES games here. What would be the fun of hanging onto Super Mario World if you couldn't reset one of the save slots and start fresh once every 5-10 years? What if Starfox only allowed you a handful of playthroughs? Might seem like a little thing but essentially this means the cartridge eventually becomes junk, even to the original purchaser. I suppose unopened cartridge would be worth a killing though.

CORaven

cherryghost wrote: »

I dont mind tbh as I don't bother trading in my games

Surely when buying a game you subconsciously recognise that you have have at least the option of trading it in at some point if you needed to. Or that you could give a lend of it to someone in the future. That extra factor can be a deciding factor between a purchase and a miss.

o1s1n

Overheal wrote: »

Nevermind that, I still have a copies of my old SNES games here. What would be the fun of hanging onto Super Mario World if you couldn't reset one of the save slots and start fresh once every 5-10 years? What if Starfox only allowed you a handful of playthroughs? Might seem like a little thing but essentially this means the cartridge eventually becomes junk, even to the original purchaser. I suppose unopened cartridge would be worth a killing though.

Well that's the point. Nintendo don't want you playing your original Super Mario World cart as they get no money from that. They want you rebuying it every time they release a new system.

This is nothing new to Capcom. Go back to their CPS1 and CPS2 boards. They had suicide batteries. When the battery died, the encryption was lost and the game wouldn't work anymore. To get it working again you'd have to send it back to them to have the roms rewritten.

Varik

CORaven wrote: »

Surely when buying a game you subconsciously recognise that you have have at least the option of trading it in at some point if you needed to. Or that you could give a lend of it to someone in the future. That extra factor can be a deciding factor between a purchase and a miss.

Capcom probably spend some time working out how many sales of new copies they would loose with this and compared it to the extra new game sales.

Potential-Monke

Something like this would completely turn me off buying the game, after paying up to €60 for a game i'm entitled to do whatever i want with it. It's a bully tactic and it's going to negatively effect Capcom in the long run. I won't buy a Capcom game if it has this feature.

Sticky_Fingers

from Chin Grins destrucoid article:

Not to mention, Capcom's decision will inevitably lead to an increase in hacking. When you tell gamers they cannot do something, a certain subset of them will invariably take that as a challenge. Every time a company claims that its hardware is impossible to hack, the hackers rise to the challenge and prove them wrong. Capcom blocking the erasure of saved data is akin to painting a great big bullseye on every copy in stores. People will find the exploits that allow them to wipe data, and that could easily open the doors to other types of exploits that publishers won't like.

This is a very good point, it's probably only a matter of time before a 3DS R4 card is developed and the game is hacked to overwrite save games. I for one have no sympathy for Capcom if this does indeed happen (I might crack a little smile myself as their smug sh1t eating grin is wiped from their faces), they have brought it upon themselves by withholding basic functionality and crippling any replay value the game may have.

deathrider

Overheal wrote: »

Nevermind that, I still have a copies of my old SNES games here. What would be the fun of hanging onto Super Mario World if you couldn't reset one of the save slots and start fresh once every 5-10 years? What if Starfox only allowed you a handful of playthroughs? Might seem like a little thing but essentially this means the cartridge eventually becomes junk, even to the original purchaser. I suppose unopened cartridge would be worth a killing though.

This. And the fact that even on the first playthrough this would always be at the back of your mind. Seriously, how much fun can a game be when you're contantly thinking that after a few playthroughs all, you can never start over?

o1s1n wrote: »

Well that's the point. Nintendo don't want you playing your original Super Mario World cart as they get no money from that. They want you rebuying it every time they release a new system.

This is nothing new to Capcom. Go back to their CPS1 and CPS2 boards. They had suicide batteries. When the battery died, the encryption was lost and the game wouldn't work anymore. To get it working again you'd have to send it back to them to have the roms rewritten.

As much as this is more than likely their thinking, it's still a serious kick in the teeth for the owners of the game. As soon as I hand over 50quid to the guy in Gamestop (or wherever), that game becomes mine! And I want to be able to play that game whenever ever I like; wheather it be tomorrow or ten years later, regardless of how many new version or re-releases there may have been in the meantime.

Me personally, I'm not into trading games, because I'm a collector. But I see no point in collecting one that's got an imminent expiration date. Traders can't trade it, and collector won't want to collect it (the last part of that line mightn't be true), so what next?

Overheal

o1s1n wrote: »

Well that's the point. Nintendo don't want you playing your original Super Mario World cart as they get no money from that. They want you rebuying it every time they release a new system.

Which is bogus. It takes away something special from the old stuff. It takes away some of the appeal of the games industry itself. If they want to rerelease a title do it right. Ocarina of Time 3D: OK. Hi Res remake of ZOE2: OK. Buying Mario RPG in the Wii Store because my old cartridge runs out of save files: NOT COOL.

Raze_them_all

Seriously, you can see this as a sure fire way no to sell games.

Sticky_Fingers

Raze_them_all wrote: »

Seriously, you can see this as a sure fire way no to sell games.

That the sad thing, everyone will piss and moan about it but in 2 years time it will become the norm and people will just accept it. Capcom are'nt going to suffer over this, there are too many fanboys that will hand over cash for any old turd with the Resi name attached to it, RE5 being a prime example.

Stercus Accidit

Easy, just start calling them Crapcom and they will have to cop on, with a derisive nickname that catchy, they will have to cave.

o1s1n

Overheal wrote: »

Which is bogus. It takes away something special from the old stuff. It takes away some of the appeal of the games industry itself. If they want to rerelease a title do it right. Ocarina of Time 3D: OK. Hi Res remake of ZOE2: OK. Buying Mario RPG in the Wii Store because my old cartridge runs out of save files: NOT COOL.

As someone who spends most of his free time and money collecting old games and consoles, I completely agree with you

Unfortunately though, when it comes down to business, money is king.

ShadowHearth

As much as I hated online pass thing, I can see it quite fair now ( after good few debates with boards.ie lads ), but capcom took the **** storm in to the new level.

Gamers hAve to take a stand now or newer, because if capcom will get away with it, we will have very sad future for gamers. Soon we will be paying full price for games we just rent and newer own.

Imagine oblivion fallout or witcher series with same save system? You play once, see one ending then you buy anather game for full price or buy some ****y dlc to clear your saves and see second ending?!

Raze_them_all

ShadowHearth wrote: »

As much as I hated online pass thing, I can see it quite fair now ( after good few debates with boards.ie lads ), but capcom took the **** storm in to the new level.

Gamers hAve to take a stand now or newer, because if capcom will get away with it, we will have very sad future for gamers. Soon we will be paying full price for games we just rent and newer own.

Imagine oblivion fallout or witcher series with same save system? You play once, see one ending then you buy anather game for full price or buy some ****y dlc to clear your saves and see second ending?!

I actually have no problem at all with the one time use codes. I think it's as fair a system as we'll see. The only thing this has convinced me to do is not pick up any capcom games until I see that this isn't becoming there thing.

ShadowHearth

Raze_them_all wrote: »

I actually have no problem at all with the one time use codes. I think it's as fair a system as we'll see. The only thing this has convinced me to do is not pick up any capcom games until I see that this isn't becoming there thing.

Are you okay with online passes like shift 2 or VIP code in bc2 or this bull**** that crapcom came up with?

Raze_them_all

ShadowHearth wrote: »

Are you okay with online passes like shift 2 or VIP code in bc2 or this bull**** that crapcom came up with?

VIP passes

ShadowHearth

Raze_them_all wrote: »

VIP passes

Ah grand so lol. I thought you okay with that **** that capcom came up. I was against VIP passes, but they are fair when you think of it.

Still don't like pre release dlcs as extras thought...

Krusader

What's the odds that Anonymous or Lulzsec hack the Capcom's sites for doing this

jaykhunter

Crosáidí wrote: »

What's the odds that Anonymous or Lulzsec hack the Capcom's sites for doing this

I'm in general very against hacking etc but Capcom made a massive dick move to combat Gamestop by screwing over the customers - could be the start of a horrible trend in gaming; so I wouldn't be unhappy if they did.

I'm fine with if only the new copies of games had a key so you could start games over again or something...but this....that's it for me buying Capcom games until this shít is reversed. Guess I'm not getting Revelations after all...

K.O.Kiki

You can't overwrite the save data, AT ALL? As in you can't save in "save slot 1" twice?

Or is it that you can't reset certain features (like unlocks)?

Because if the former, that sounds like a deliberate bad bug.

Retr0gamer

Capcom, redefining your definition of 'dick move'.

Keith186

Can't believe they're going this far.
If I bought the game I own it surely I can start it again if I want.

All shops selling second hand games should refuse to sell this tripe, its the equivalent of suicide for them if they let this become the norm.

Mr E

My understanding is that the game consists of a bunch of challenge levels, and doing well in those levels unlocks stuff. You can start from the first level all over again, but everything that has been unlocked stays unlocked (so there are no rewards for those who buy the a totally unlocked 2nd hand game)

Retr0gamer

You also level up abilities and gain experience which you can't reset. It would be like getting to prestige on CoD and not being able to start again.