Half-baked Republican Presidential Fruitcakes (and fellow confections)

recedite

This thread is getting very quiet
No need to stop just because The Donald is getting his gropey hands on the nuclear codes.

The latest fun;

"We are going to appoint 'Mad Dog' Mattis as our secretary of defence," Mr Trump told a large crowd in Cincinnati, Ohio...

But its always useful bear in mind Mad Dog's quote;

"Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet."

Notice how The Donald stands slightly behind Mad Dog Matty, just like the instructor at a gun range does after he hands you a loaded assault rifle (don't ask :pac:)

I'm just hoping now that Crazy Joe McLoon will be picked for the Treasury Dept.

recedite

BTW is that the "Royal We" in "We are going to appoint..."
And its not even January yet.

oscarBravo

recedite wrote: »

BTW is that the "Royal We" in "We are going to appoint..."

I assumed it was himself and his children.

silverharp

recedite wrote: »

This thread is getting very quiet
No need to stop just because The Donald is getting his gropey hands on the nuclear codes.

The latest fun;
But its always useful bear in mind Mad Dog's quote;Notice how The Donald stands slightly behind Mad Dog Matty, just like the instructor at a gun range does after he hands you a loaded assault rifle (don't ask :pac:)

I'm just hoping now that Crazy Joe McLoon will be picked for the Treasury Dept.

I dont know if you saw the original of this , it had the Polish Defense minister as the scary one at the end :pac:

Qs

This pizzagate stuff really shows how mental this new right wing, post fact crowd are. This is what happens when you come to the conclusion that most of the media are in on some sort of massive liberal conspiracy.

PopePalpatine

If the Comet Pizzeria was totally cleared of any links, no matter how flimsy, to a Washington Elite paedophile ring, Trump's fanboys would still try to justify it as "clearing out [4channese for "race traitors"]".

robindch

Qs wrote: »

This is what happens when you come to the conclusion that most of the media are in on some sort of massive liberal conspiracy.

Or indeed, the notion that all media organizations are run according to "agendas" - a word, which like "ethos" - should be inexcusable in polite conversation. This view, that all media organizations are equally untrustworthy and that one is therefore free to pick whatever news outlet one wants to and expect to be taken seriously, is one of the foundational myths of the post-fact world.

It's probably superfluous to point out that this is intentional blurring of fact with fiction and the consequent demotion of honesty or accuracy to opinion, is heavily promoted by the current Russian government and has been written about well by a few people - Peter Pomerantsev, Anne Applebaum and Timothy Snyder spring to mind.

https://granta.com/why-were-post-fact/
https://www.amazon.com/Nothing-True-Everything-Possible-Surreal/dp/1610396006

The aim seems to be to put so much crazy stuff out there that the only reasonable response of well-meaning people is to disengage, and to leave the field to nutters.

That seems to have happened even in this thread - where there were more posts during the Obama/Romney election in 2012, than there were in this, much crazier, one.

robindch

Qs wrote: »

This pizzagate stuff really shows how mental this new right wing, post fact crowd are.

Just for the record, here's a report on the gunman who showed up at the pizzeria "to investigate":

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/pizzagate-gunman-surrendered-after-finding-no-evidence-fake-conspiracy-court-n692321

And here's the BBC on how the false news story got going:

http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-38156985

recedite

So a guy hears a rumour that paedophiles are operating out of a particular premises, decides to do the vigilante superhero thing and investigate. Finding no evidence there, he gives himself up to police, probably feeling rather foolish. At least he cared enough about "bad things happening" to get up and do something, even if he was misguided.

It hardly compares to actual mass shootings/stabbings, lorry crushings etc. carried out by Islamicists who need no evidence whatsoever before choosing their victims, other than the mere fact that they are "westerners" living in "the west". And those who sit back and say we'll all just have to get used to that sort of thing.

Peregrinus

recedite wrote: »

So a guy hears a rumour that paedophiles are operating out of a particular premises, decides to do the vigilante superhero thing and investigate. Finding no evidence there, he gives himself up to police, probably feeling rather foolish. At least he cared enough about "bad things happening" to get up and do something, even if he was misguided.

Walking into the place and shooting a rifle is "investigating", is it? It's "getting up and doing something"?

recedite wrote: »

It hardly compares to actual mass shootings/stabbings, lorry crushings etc. carried out by Islamicists who need no evidence whatsoever before choosing their victims, other than the mere fact that they are "westerners" living in "the west". And those who sit back and say we'll all just have to get used to that sort of thing.

"The alt-right: not as bad as ISIS." It's not much of a vindication, is it?

silverharp

recedite wrote: »

So a guy hears a rumour that paedophiles are operating out of a particular premises, decides to do the vigilante superhero thing and investigate. Finding no evidence there, he gives himself up to police, probably feeling rather foolish. At least he cared enough about "bad things happening" to get up and do something, even if he was misguided.

It hardly compares to actual mass disturbances and violence by Clinton supporters both during and after the election http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3925124/You-voted-Trump-Beat-Video-claims-man-beaten-voted-Donald.html

let me help you out there FYP

FA Hayek

Peregrinus wrote: »

"The alt-right: not as bad as ISIS." It's not much of a vindication, is it?

Do we have any proof that this guy was a member of the alt-right or is the term used whereby anyone how commits an act like this must be a member.

It gets close to the whole, all Muslims are Terrorists.

oscarBravo

FA Hayek wrote: »

Do we have any proof that this guy was a member of the alt-right or is the term used whereby anyone how commits an act like this must be a member.

Got to love the false dichotomies.

How about another possibility: it's not unreasonable to assume that someone who bought wholeheartedly into a conspiracy theory that was propagated almost entirely on alt-right websites and subreddits - to the extent of opening fire in a pizza restaurant - has alt-right sympathies.

On the other hand, if you have reason to believe he was a SJW leftie cuck libtard who happened to be utterly taken in by dangerous alt-right fiction, perhaps you could share it.

Occam's Razor: not just for shaving!

robindch

oscarBravo wrote: »

Got to love the false dichotomies.

It's the equivalent of the common religious argument - you can't prove that there isn't a god, therefore it's reasonable to believe that there is one. Or Russian media's "OK, our government might tell lies, but your government tell lies too, so you're a hypocrite if you criticize us."

It's like probabilities and scale didn't exist - a simple-minded, counter-factual division of the world into black and white. Literally, in many cases.

Christy42

FA Hayek wrote: »

Do we have any proof that this guy was a member of the alt-right or is the term used whereby anyone how commits an act like this must be a member.

It gets close to the whole, all Muslims are Terrorists.

No it doesn't. What would be the same would be saying all alt right people are like him. If someone launches an attack after watching ISIS propoganda they were probably a Muslim. This does not mean that the vast majority of Muslims are terrorists. It means this guy was.

Similarly if someone carries out an attack on the basis of alt right propoganda. Likely from the alt right- does not mean they all are about to shoot up places.

FA Hayek

oscarBravo wrote: »

Got to love the false dichotomies.

How about another possibility: it's not unreasonable to assume that someone who bought wholeheartedly into a conspiracy theory that was propagated almost entirely on alt-right websites and subreddits - to the extent of opening fire in a pizza restaurant - has alt-right sympathies.

On the other hand, if you have reason to believe he was a SJW leftie cuck libtard who happened to be utterly taken in by dangerous alt-right fiction, perhaps you could share it.

Occam's Razor: not just for shaving!

Ah, so no actual proof then. It is therefore your belief then that he was a member of the alt-right, whatever the alt right actually is.

You should know better then to believe something without proof in an Atheist forum. Just saying

FA Hayek

robindch wrote: »

It's like probabilities and scale didn't exist - a simple-minded, counter-factual division of the world into black and white. Literally, in many cases.

Find this highly ironic given that you are a self proclaimed skeptic. Guy reads random **** on the net, shots up a pizza bar. Blame the right or the new scape goat of progressivism, the alt-right. Nothing black and white about that, no sir'ee.

Did it ever cross your mind that the guy might be a little tapped? Does that scale exist in your world or is it simply, the right is all bad, everything else is good?

He could have read a piece on the net from PETA and puppy farms, then went on to shot up a dog kennel. Would you be blaming progressivism?

Qs

FA Hayek wrote: »

Find this highly ironic given that you are a self proclaimed skeptic. Guy reads random **** on the net, shots up a pizza bar. Blame the right or the new scape goat of progressivism, the alt-right. Nothing black and white about that, no sir'ee.

Did it ever cross your mind that the guy might be a little tapped? Does that scale exist in your world or is it simply, the right is all bad, everything else is good?

He could have read a piece on the net from PETA and puppy farms, then went on to shot up a dog kennel. Would you be blaming progressivism?

He's not the only one to believe this crap though. There are many crazies on the right pushing this conspiracy theory that Podesta and Clintons among others are part of a paedophile ring. When this sort of barmy stuff gets normalised don't be surprised if someone takes it too seriously and goes off the rails.

Qs

A response to more post-fact news, this time its Brietbart pushing the fiction.

Christy42

Qs wrote: »

He's not the only one to believe this crap though. There are many crazies on the right pushing this conspiracy theory that Podesta and Clintons among others are part of a paedophile ring. When this sort of barmy stuff gets normalised don't be surprised if someone takes it too seriously and goes off the rails.

And let's be fair, while he wasn't involved with this story Trump has more than encouraged post fact news. It isn't like there are only a few people stories similar to the above. People in positions of serious power do it. When called their only response is to shift the burden of proof.

robindch

Qs wrote: »

A response to more post-fact news, this time its Brietbart pushing the fiction.

The only positive to come out of this entire mess so far is that the fact-based community has realized that it has to come together and start issuing public, shaming comments like the one from weather.com. Simply relying on peoples' honesty in a post-fact/liars' world isn't going to work - for obvious reasons.

It remains to be seen whether it'll have any effect or not.

oscarBravo

FA Hayek wrote: »

Ah, so no actual proof then. It is therefore your belief then that he was a member of the alt-right...

What I actually said was that it's reasonable to believe that he has alt-right sympathies. If you don't think it's reasonable to believe that, feel free to advance a reasoned argument for that position rather than smugly telling me what my beliefs are.

robindch

FA Hayek wrote: »

Did it ever cross your mind that the guy might be a little tapped?

Rest assured that wherever the alt-right is concerned, worries about lunacy never lag far behind!

PopePalpatine

The Dunnes Stores own-brand version of Breitbart, TheLiberal.ie, has gone offline after CCC Nuacht launched a lawsuit against them for plagiarism.

recedite

That story they were reporting on is an interesting new social phenomenon.
Here's the Indo's take on it.

robindch

An alleged leaked intelligence report suggests that DJT has brought new meaning to "Watergate" - paragraph 3, page 2:

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3259984/Trump-Intelligence-Allegations.pdf

Oopssssss.

silverharp

robindch wrote: »

An alleged leaked intelligence report suggests that DJT has brought new meaning to "Watergate" - paragraph 3, page 2:

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3259984/Trump-Intelligence-Allegations.pdf

Oopssssss.

Fake news?

robindch

silverharp wrote: »

Fake news?

Quite possibly - that's why the word "alleged" is in there

Still, I'm sure the CIA will repudiate the report as soon as possible if its false.

Christy42

robindch wrote: »

An alleged leaked intelligence report suggests that DJT has brought new meaning to "Watergate" - paragraph 3, page 2:

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3259984/Trump-Intelligence-Allegations.pdf

Oopssssss.

While it is amusing I would prefer to focus on the treason allegations contained within. The sex scandal is a side show and discussion about Trump get brought off the rails too often onto unimportant things (Hamilton etc.)

robindch

Christy42 wrote: »

While it is amusing I would prefer to focus on the treason allegations contained within.

There's so much in there, and so much wrong elsewhere, that it's hard to know where to start addressing DJT's multiple, massive problems.

Certainly, allegations that DJT hired Russian prostitutes to urinate on the bed occupied by the Obamas while DJT looked on, suggest that either DJT is either massively naive about how the Kremlin operates, or else, that somebody in Fake News decided to pull a pizzagate on DJT for the hell of it. Or quite possibly, both.

As above, next steps are probably with the CIA or the outgoing administration and whether or the report will be repudiated, partially or fully.