Garda wearing tactical vest in Slane Castle

Manic Moran

How often do you see a garda in court wearing the battle dress? Or at the public counter for that matter.

In my opinion, the current uniform should be kept for court / station duties and the combats & polo shirt for patrolling.

And here's me thinking the Gardai were trying to promote a non-violent and approachable image, part of the reason they won't carry sidearms. Well, if you must bring a stick to a battle...

NTM

Locust

999nobody wrote: »

Gardai don't get attacked in the station or court ????

By and large no they don't, its fairly rare. I'm not saying stuff doesn't happen, but I don't think things are that bad (thank God) that we have to wear stab vests and tacticool/practical gear to the public counter or to court.

audidiesel

its a sad state of affairs when the postmen have a uniform more suited to policing than the guards. ditch the tie, give us navy combats and a slightly modified stab vest would be perfect for operational duty

the current uniform could be for indoor/court duty then with no major problems.

hi-vis and stab/ballistic vest is a seriously warm combination over the summer.

goldie fish

It is amazing that in this day and age there is no way a garda can be in uniform without wearing a tie.
Granted there are places, such as court where shirt and tie would be expected, but chasing drunk teenagers through fields at 4am is really not a place where tidy appearance is important.

pah

No and it's generally restrictive when worn with the vest. I often leave the tie off with the fleece zipped up to the top and vest over that. Now that it's getting warmer though it'll be shirts and while u could get away with no tie on nights, u won't on the hot summer days. It's a pain in the neck:D

Eru

999nobody wrote: »

Gardai don't get attacked in the station or court ????

It depends on what duty your on. I think any duty with the public should mean carrying gear and wearing the 'battle' uniform as someone else called it.

Manic Moran wrote: »

It is important to note that just because you are wearing a vest, it is not mandatory for it to be the outermost garment if its primary purpose is protection. Which, I would have thought to be the point: Surely police cannot be so heavily equipped that they need the extra real estate that won't fit on a duty belt? I would routinely wear a jacket over by body armour, it just made me look a little bulkier (and I like to think meaner). Stab plates are routinely worn by USian cops under short sleeve shirts.

NTM

Its more comfortable over clothing which is why most military and police forces are adopting or changing to that style of vest. National Guard wear external body armour do they not?

As for the belt, horses for courses of course but minimum 1 pair of cuffs, radio, medical kit, search gloves, torch, baton, pepper spray and notebook holder all takes a lot of space and some of it must end up at the back which is bad when sitting in a car. Also lets not forget that terrible case of a cop in the states pulling his sidearm by mistake as it was right beside his tazer.

Rialtas wrote: »

I'd much prefer to deal with a Garda in a conventional uniform rather than someone kitted out in specialist gear.

Im not saying I disagree with you but would it not be fairer to allow the people wearing it for 40 hours a week decide? I certainly dont think my mechanic looks very smart but I doubt he would be comfortable in a shirt and tie.

Rialtas wrote: »

Not everyone the Gardai deal with on a daily basis is out to do damage.

True but on that basis we shouldnt carry pepper spray or batons unless we know were going to a fight. Not everyone is looking to cause damage but its awful hard to seperate them from the bad guys who arent wearing striped jumpers and carrying a bag of swag.

Manic Moran

National Guard wear external body armour do they not?

Yes, at least in warm weather, but the coverage is also substantially higher than you would expect police to deal with. Given the limits imposed on mobility, I'm not sure that front, back and side Level IVA protection, complete with groin and collar fragmentation protection are entirely suitable for police work. Actually, I think it's too much for the Army as well.

Best pic I can find offhand, but I am wearing full bullet-proof body armour under my jacket here.
http://data.primeportal.net/iraq/NTMTCBasr.JPG. You probably wouldn't know it without looking closely.

You will note that police organisations in fairly warm climes such as LAPD or Florida State Troopers wear their armour under their shirts, but the armour is more of a Level III plate carrier than full torso protection.

NTM

BrianD

I'm guessing that's neither a white nor a silver Toyota Avenis that you are in. What is it?

sdanseo

foreign wrote: »

Thats a stab vest though, not an equipment rig.

As it should be. I'm sorry, but 2x Handcuffs, ASP, Gloves, Torch and Spray on a belt can't weigh that much. Add a Glock, 3 Mags, a full Radio, rigid baton, and taser and you have what US cops carry every day in addition to the above, and they manage. Tetras already go on the vest.

Eru

sdonn wrote: »

As it should be. I'm sorry, but 2x Handcuffs, ASP, Gloves, Torch and Spray on a belt can't weigh that much. Add a Glock, 3 Mags, a full Radio, rigid baton, and taser and you have what US cops carry every day in addition to the above, and they manage. Tetras already go on the vest.

Your speaking with zero experience though arent you?

US cops dont carry 2 types of batons. They dont carry a medical kit or search gloves as they are permited to wear tactical gloves which double as search gloves. They dont carry notebooks on their belts and they may or may not carry a radio on their belt (Gardai have the same option). You will find many do indeed have pouches on their upper body and some will use in car radio systems only.

They rarely walk the beat daily as well but since when and why is it that the US is the start and finish of how things should be done?

Eru

Manic Moran wrote: »

Yes, at least in warm weather, but the coverage is also substantially higher than you would expect police to deal with. Given the limits imposed on mobility, I'm not sure that front, back and side Level IVA protection, complete with groin and collar fragmentation protection are entirely suitable for police work. Actually, I think it's too much for the Army as well.

Best pic I can find offhand, but I am wearing full bullet-proof body armour under my jacket here.
http://data.primeportal.net/iraq/NTMTCBasr.JPG. You probably wouldn't know it without looking closely.

You will note that police organisations in fairly warm climes such as LAPD or Florida State Troopers wear their armour under their shirts, but the armour is more of a Level III plate carrier than full torso protection.

NTM

Very true but as you say, we need to remain mobile and under shirt body armour is a bitch plain and simple. LAPD, etc wear it underneath an open collar shirt and thats it, big difference between what they wear and what we wear but again, they are in the minority for a reason. Perhaps they would like to change.

d3exile

The uniform definitely needs an overhaul, not a radical one but subtle changes would make a world of difference to day to day policing... The tie should go for operations, keep it for station and court as it does look well but my main issue is the heat a closed shirt with vest will generate, I also heard most uk forces ditched it because in an RTA airbag hits your chest, vest rides up and pushes the metal knot of the tie into your larynx... Not good... thankfully hasn't happened here!

The vest should never be worn over anything but the shirt, it's in the code... Throwing my hands up I usually wear it over the fleece but over the patrol jacket or worse, hi viz is just plain daft looking.

I'd definitely welcome a better vest tho for carrying SOME items, and again, going for the uk/European police look (we don't do American style policing so shouldn't be modelling ourselves on them..) I think some uk police forces have got it spot on, if you ever see those uk cop shows on tv you can tell they put thought and logic into making a uniform that's functional but portrays exactly the right approachable but authorative look...


It's been said to death but the cycle jacket should be general issue... It's perfect

The_Joker

And here we have Garda P.J modelling this seasons anti stab vest with built in anti-roll bars, available in a variety of colours, Navy blue, Blue with navy or just navy

sdanseo

Just to clarify - I don't for a second think that Irish policing should be modelled on the US. Their tactics are brash and incite more violence than they prevent, just like every armed agency over there.

Their unofrms, however, look very well, with the exception that I think vests lok better on the outside to project more authority and make less of a soft target as someone who appears unprotected.

Eru - yes I'm speaking without experience in any ES. I never, ever make a secret of that, but long may it not continue if the DOJ would ever get the finger out

Zambia

Critical Incident response after blowing open a Bikie clubhouse.