Treatment of homeless people

evercloserunion

Was on the way home from the pub tonight, and we were walking down one of the back streets in Temple Bar behind a group of 4 people (3 guys and a girl), think they were French or something and fairly drunk I guess. There was a homeless guy asleep in a doorway, and the girl stumbled up to him, leaned over and started shouting something I couldn't make out, the others joined in. When the guy woke up and turned around, one of the guys pulled out a camera and took a picture of him, laughing away.

I didn't really know what to do, I just started talking to my girlfriend at a high volume about how it wasn't on, they heard me, threw me a few dirty looks and moved on. I felt ashamed, despite having nothing to do with it.

My girlfriend then told me that when she was getting a taxi the other day, there was a guy on the phone (also drunk I think) at a phone box when a homeless guy came up to ask him for change. The guy on the phone decked him and shouted something at him.

How can someone treat the most vulnerable people in society like this, even when drunk? I was utterly disgusted and ashamed. There was absolutely no threat to any of these people, no reason to act like they did except pure scumbaggery. What kind of person do you have to be to think this kind of behaviour is acceptable or fun?

Naikon

Some people are just utter *****. Best to ignore them and cut the homeless person some slack. Anything really. It's easy to laugh when you aren't living on the street. Hopefully their day will come.

LighterGuy

evercloserunion wrote: »

How can someone treat the most vulnerable people in society like this, even when drunk?

Because your average person is an as*hole when they want to be and dont see anything wrong with it sadly.
See these people you mention... talk to them individually you would most likely think they are decent alright people. Put them together in a group ... different story. Im pretty sure if questioned why they did that they would say "for a laugh" - but more realistically if you asked why they did it they would tell you to f**k off.

later12

It's very wet and windy tonight where I am and I don't care what kind of personal problems an individual has: drugs, alcohol, psychiatric, or financial; there is no excuse for making life more difficult for an individual who is out in this weather, sleeping in a doorway, with nowhere else to turn.

I was sitting in my warm, dry apartment tonight listening to the dulcet Lilian Smith on Radio 1, as always, and she was remarking about how the faces of the homeless change from first you see them, to how you might see them after six months when they become more hopeless, more pale, and more disinterested. There are some desperate faces on the pavement every morning as I make my way to work and it always makes me glad, perhaps even in a selfish way, that I was born into a stable family and had the good fortune to land on my feet in everything I did.

And even when I thought I was getting a bad time of it with losing a job or failing an exam, I have never known that sort of bankrupt destitution, with nobody left who cared about me. That must be an absolutely horrible feeling and those young people tonight, in the sober light of day, should be thankful it is not something they have to live with.

Bit of a cliché, I grant you, but it doesn't hurt to remember that there but for the grace of God go you and I.

pragmatic1

With the amount of ghost estates around the country lying empty, no one should be homeless. People that treat the homeless and other vunerable groups like **** are just plain scum. Tells a lot about a persons character.

JONJO THE MISER

im

Buceph

pragmatic1 wrote: »

With the amount of ghost estates around the country lying empty, no one should be homeless. People that treat the homeless and other vunerable groups like **** are just plain scum. Tells a lot about a persons character.

I've met a fair few homeless people, from either hanging around city centre parks as a teenager, or being brought around by people I knew involved with The Simon Community. Some homeless (not all) are homeless by "sort of" choice. I met a few who you would classify as itinerants, travelling from city to city. They'd stay with friends, stay in squats and some times sleep on the streets. They often had an idealogical opposition to living in a house/home. Most of them had alcohol problems and mental issues, but they steadfastly refused any attempts to get them into social housing or the equivalent. They were the minority, but they were very proud of who they were and didn't want to get help from anyone.

Very sad cases, and of course there are many more people who need direct help.

tenchi-fan

The guy talking on the phone possibly did the homeless guy a huge favour. We should go around throwing buckets of water over the homeless.

The people who treat the homeless worst of all are people who give them small change. It's showy, they'll have a warm mushy feel like you get from giving a dog a biscuit, but because it keeps the homeless on the street it's the opposite of charity.

But could you imagine presenting St Vincent de Paul with a novelty-sized cheque for the price of a can of Druids Cider?

jill_valentine

I saw a crowd of f*cking rugby tough guys on Wexford Street making a laugh of homeless dude a while back, and it made my stomach churn. The dude wasn't doing anything to provoke them, and there they were there teasing him and posing around him for each other's camera phones.

Honestly, at the time, I wasn't really sure what I should have done, and they got bored and wandered off shortly after anyway;, but I'd be lying if I hadn't spent an idle minute or two since imagining how satisfying it would have been to slap the Nivea for Men right off their big fat Heino swollen faces.

What the hell is wrong with somebody, that they'd find that sh*te funny?

Icarus152

tenchi-fan wrote: »

The guy talking on the phone possibly did the homeless guy a huge favour. We should go around throwing buckets of water over the homeless.

The people who treat the homeless worst of all are people who give them small change. It's showy, they'll have a warm mushy feel like you get from giving a dog a biscuit, but because it keeps the homeless on the street it's the opposite of charity.

But could you imagine presenting St Vincent de Paul with a novelty-sized cheque for the price of a can of Druids Cider?

lolwut?

Turpentine

tenchi-fan wrote: »

The guy talking on the phone possibly did the homeless guy a huge favour. We should go around throwing buckets of water over the homeless.

The people who treat the homeless worst of all are people who give them small change. It's showy, they'll have a warm mushy feel like you get from giving a dog a biscuit, but because it keeps the homeless on the street it's the opposite of charity.

But could you imagine presenting St Vincent de Paul with a novelty-sized cheque for the price of a can of Druids Cider?

Jaysis, I hope that's just the sauce talking.

While I can understand your point about the charity of others encouraging pan-handling, I think you might be being a little harsh.

mgmt

tenchi-fan wrote: »

The guy talking on the phone possibly did the homeless guy a huge favour. We should go around throwing buckets of water over the homeless.

The people who treat the homeless worst of all are people who give them small change. It's showy, they'll have a warm mushy feel like you get from giving a dog a biscuit, but because it keeps the homeless on the street it's the opposite of charity.

+1


That's what they do in London. The council goes around and hoses down the street at night, if the homeless happen to be there so be it

Dyr

evercloserunion wrote: »

My girlfriend then told me that when she was getting a taxi the other day, there was a guy on the phone (also drunk I think) at a phone box when a homeless guy came up to ask him for change. The guy on the phone decked him and shouted something at him.

You're mixing homeless people up with begging junkies methinks.

JohnMarston

Ireland gives millions to overseas aid to other countries, to help people we've never met. Obviously helping the irish homeless isn't as important as looking good to the international community.

tenchi-fan

JohnMarston wrote: »

Ireland gives millions to overseas aid to other countries, to help people we've never met. Obviously helping the irish homeless isn't as important as looking good to the international community.

The homeless get their benefits, if they go hungry it's because they squandered them on drink and drugs. And don't believe anyone who says homeless people don't claim benefits , they can find an address to use on their welfare claim.

It's hard to differentiate between homeless junkies and genuine homeless.. Some people have a lot of hate for junkies because of the crimes they commit.
I don't even understand how anyone ends up homeless in Ireland to be fair.. I was never bad to them and bought them food the odd time. But I'm far from feeling sorry for them because it's entirely their fault. No one elses.

I feel sorry for homeless people over here because the government support isn't there. It's a genuine issue unlike homeless in Ireland which really is a farce.

TaraFoxglove

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't even understand how anyone ends up homeless in Ireland to be fair.. I was never bad to them and bought them food the odd time. But I'm far from feeling sorry for them because it's entirely their fault. No one elses.

Mental illness can see someone end up on the street pretty quickly. Could happen to anyone.

TaraFoxglove

TaraFoxglove wrote: »

Mental illness can see someone end up on the street pretty quickly. Could happen to anyone.

Don't they get picked up my the guards within a few days and then put into the proper channels.

I don't remember any mentally ill homeless in Galway.

themadchef

Bambi wrote: »

You're mixing homeless people up with begging junkies methinks.

Probably is but, where do you draw the "pity line"? Are some types of homeless people more deserving of it than others? I'm sure even the most hard core junkies didint have a mighty upbringing, or can find some place to apportion the blame as to why their life is the way it is.

Treatment of homelss people, i mean should we not point a very angry figure towards our government? Even when the piss pot was lined with gold there were people on the streets. (Yes, some will still choose to be there, but in general, little was ever done)

Rehab, life skills, clean and safe living environment, training and help to find work. Where is the support? Where are the centres? Those that are trying to help are losing funding by the day.

We can pass by these guys, and throw them a sandwich or a few quid thinking "but for the grace of God, there go i" but at the end of the day the homeless are not fit to fight for themselves. Too low, too broken, too ashamed to, out of their heads, and we're quite happy to walk by so long as we dont get to feel bad about it. Watching people pick on the homeless makes us feel bad, so it means we cant turn a blind eye for a second. We are happy to be blind, it's easier that way.

TaraFoxglove

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't they get picked up my the guards within a few days and then put into the proper channels.

I don't remember any mentally ill homeless in Galway.

Mental illness is one of the leading causes of homelessness. Did you have an in-depth discussion with every homeless person in Galway?

tenchi-fan

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't they get picked up my the guards within a few days and then put into the proper channels.

I don't remember any mentally ill homeless in Galway.

i think we're talking along the lines of "depression is a mental illness" "alcoholism is a mental illness".. etc etc

My view, some people just can't fit into society.

Do they even need to beg? no idea. I just know if some one is mentally ill, just because they ask for money does not need its good for them to receive it.

They'll just spend it on drink or drugs.

Or soup..

I saw a newspaper article on the life of a junkie. "I don't always by drugs with it.. sometimes I buy soup"

WindSock

Those foreigners have no right to treat our homeless that way. They are reserved for us to maltreat.

tenchi-fan

tenchi-fan wrote: »

They'll just spend it on drink or drugs.

So what? Many addicts on the street don't choose to spend it on such things, they need to, especially with regards to alcohol as withdrawal from it can be fatal. I don't think getting appropriate help is very easy considering their circumstances.

The only thing is I wish they'd be more honest about it.

The King of Moo

To me, people who mistreat the homeless, like people who mistreat animals (not equating the homeless with animals! ), are generally incredibly insecure and/or self-loathing, and can only make themselves feel in any way worthwhile by picking on someone or something they see as being so far beneath them there's no risk of them coming out second-best, so they can score themselves a little victory.
The number of stories I've heard of "lads" pi**ing on homeless people "for a laugh" is absolutely sickening.

stovelid

Some homeless people have no doubt supposedly "brought it on themselves" through addiction and whatever but I could never look at anybody on the street and gloat and sermonize before heading home to a nice house and a warm bed. Just not in me to do so.

cocoa

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pjrVohm2nE

JohnMarston

tenchi-fan wrote: »

The homeless get their benefits, if they go hungry it's because they squandered them on drink and drugs. And don't believe anyone who says homeless people don't claim benefits , they can find an address to use on their welfare claim.

Thats a good point actually

ebixa82

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't they get picked up my the guards within a few days and then put into the proper channels.

I don't remember any mentally ill homeless in Galway.

How the fcuk would you know if they had a mental illness or not?

stovelid

ebixa82 wrote: »

How the fcuk would you know if they had a mental illness or not?

On-the-spot psychological tests and questionnaires. I don't part with a cent unless they complete it.

ebixa82

Although underfunded and stretched to the last, homeless services in Ireland are relatively good thanks to the likes of Simon, Focus and Salvation Army. Most people will find a bed in some homeless shelter, hostel etc.

For most of these, the person has to book themselves in by a certain time, and are usually not allowed into the shelter until the evening, hence they spend their day with nothing to do and so often sit in a spot and beg.

There is only ever a small number of homeless people who actually sleep rough. Very often they have gotten to fcuked up on drink or heroin that day to sort out a room for themselves. Often, they'll be so fcuked that they'd sleep through anything anyways...

ebixa82

stovelid wrote: »

On-the-spot psychological tests and questionnaires. I don't part with a cent unless they complete it.

But if they can complete it that means they don't have any psychiatric illnesses and so must be an addict. Bit of a catch 22!

StephenHendry

no excuses for mistreating homeless people, but sometimes they don't help themselves. its very hard to know the genuine ones from the chancers who sometimes go after people for change etc. i remember last year when a saw a homeless guy giving out, swearing at a woman (roma gypsy) who was begging for change outside the church near the arlington hotel, and i've seen there recently irish homeless people giving out to people for not giving them change as they were complaining about the non-irish homeless people .


i think these type of incidents don't help the homeless people but i do have genuine sympathy for them. i mean government after government have neglected them and i think they should put the homeless people in all those ghost estates around the country, now maybe they will not want to move from dublin but at least there should some plan by government on how to tackle the issue

Seloth

I know we like to complain about American tourists but I live in a tourist town and while we can poke fun at them 20 somthing French & Belgian tourists are so of the most dickish I've come across.

They go about insulting everthing,Poking fun at different people,especially teenagers and old people,They are quite loud and obnoxious,a far cry from the so called "Loud ignorant American".

While some may hail it as a isolated incident this has happened several times before but the most recent was last summer.A group of belgian 2's somthings were staying about the town.I heard of a couple of them croping to friends of y who had recently turned 18 and throwing drink in bar tenders face's saying it was muck.My own experience was coming down on a train from cork where they spent the day drinking.They harassed an elderly couple,knocked one of their friends into a buggy and started to come down to myself and a few friends chating stuff and then started taking pictures of us .Not long after they got into a fight with one of their own group knocking his tooth out.

Now I know that it may have been a bit topic but this just reminded me of it.

KyussBishop

TaraFoxglove wrote: »

Mental illness can see someone end up on the street pretty quickly. Could happen to anyone.

Indeed; a lot of people with even some moderate forms of mental illness are just unable to take care of themselves, and the unlucky ones end up out on the street, while the (comparatively) lucky ones have family to fall back on for support.

The state of mental health support in Ireland is pretty poor to boot; improving that would stop more people falling through the cracks, and could help get some of the current homeless people more help.
When's that going to happen though?

Jesus Wept

should have kicked those ***** in the face

purplepanda

Not all homeless people are drug / drink addicts although I personally won't give any money to those that beg on the street because most will spend it on their addictions. I always give donations to homeless & other charities every few months or more instead.

There was a old lad that used to live in the side doorway near Camden Town tube station in North London up until about 10-15years or so ago. He was disabled from the waist downwards but would not take money from no one & refused all offers of help with housing from many including social services. He managed to look after himself well given the circumstances. The locals would keep an eye out for him.

When his funeral was held hundreds of people turned up, he was well liked. Many only found out afterwards that the reason he lived outdoors was because he was suffering from clausetrophobia. He was a Polish Fighter Pilot in the RAF who managed to get out of a plane that was on fire before it crashed and couldn't stand being indoors.

Worst problem is the "professional" beggars, especially those who use a baby to get more sympathy from passers by. Two Roma women with babies who had been begging outside a supermarket for hours came up to me & the brother & asked where can they get a taxi to a destination 3 miles away. Obviously the frequent bus service was much cheaper but they could obviously afford a taxi after their supermarket shift :mad:

Icarus152

Loonies ITT.

JohnMarston

purplepanda wrote: »

Worst problem is the "professional" beggars, especially those who use a baby to get more sympathy from passers by. Two Roma women with babies who had been begging outside a supermarket for hours came up to me & the brother & asked where can they get a taxi to a destination 3 miles away. Obviously the frequent bus service was much cheaper but they could obviously afford a taxi after their supermarket shift :mad:

I seen a few of those in waterford, one of them i've seen more than once carrying a different baby with a different buggy. I guess most people wouldn't notice or remember that sort of stuff.

kkdela6

I was standing outside a shop in Waterford talking to the boys and there was a roma beggar not far from us just doing the usual oul begging.
no word of a lie, a 2010 Dublin registered BMW pulled up beside her, she hopped in and another roma beggar hopped out and took her place with the maccy d's cup. wouldnt give a dime to those scammers.

As regards homeless people, there arent too many in Waterford (that come out in public at least) and those who are there are quite popular, they have a laugh with everyone during the day and most of them have a bedsit to go to at night.
The ones in Dublin, lying in there sleeping bags on a wet day, you couldnt feel anything but sympathy for them. I couldnt imagine making fun of them. You'd nearly feel guilty that you have somewhere to go and they dont.

few cans?

i saw that happen in Waterford too outside a nightclub, im guessing its the same roma beggars that go round saying 'you buy rose?'

Mike 1972

JohnMarston wrote: »

I seen a few of those in waterford, one of them i've seen more than once carrying a different baby with a different buggy.

Is there someplace that hires out babies for the purpose

pragmatic1

Seloth wrote: »

I know we like to complain about American tourists but I live in a tourist town and while we can poke fun at them 20 somthing French & Belgian tourists are so of the most dickish I've come across.

They go about insulting everthing,Poking fun at different people,especially teenagers and old people,They are quite loud and obnoxious,a far cry from the so called "Loud ignorant American".

While some may hail it as a isolated incident this has happened several times before but the most recent was last summer.A group of belgian 2's somthings were staying about the town.I heard of a couple of them croping to friends of y who had recently turned 18 and throwing drink in bar tenders face's saying it was muck.My own experience was coming down on a train from cork where they spent the day drinking.They harassed an elderly couple,knocked one of their friends into a buggy and started to come down to myself and a few friends chating stuff and then started taking pictures of us .Not long after they got into a fight with one of their own group knocking his tooth out.

Now I know that it may have been a bit topic but this just reminded me of it.

+1. I'd take an American tourist any day of the week over most Europeans. They have better manners and are more respectful.

ladysarastro

I've seen those roma women get on in carlow train station on several occasions and head down to waterford

Dudess

tenchi-fan wrote: »

We should go around throwing buckets of water over the homeless.

Haha, I saw you sh1te-ing on about Jesus on some other forum... Real christian of you there dude.

Deleted User wrote: »

it's entirely their fault. No one elses.

How do you know? There's a myriad of reasons a person could be homeless. ****ing hell...

Icarus152 wrote: »

Loonies ITT.

Do elaborate.

previous user

Plenty of jobs in McDonalds and SuperMacs.

prinz

evercloserunion wrote: »

How can someone treat the most vulnerable people in society like this, even when drunk? I was utterly disgusted and ashamed. There was absolutely no threat to any of these people, no reason to act like they did except pure scumbaggery. What kind of person do you have to be to think this kind of behaviour is acceptable or fun?

There's no excuse for looking for trouble by interfering with people minding their own business. That goes the same for idiots picking on a homeless person, as it does for 'homeless' people hassling people for money at busstops/ATMs etc..

Not making any excuses for the lad on the phone decking anyone but at the same time you don't know what kind of conversation he was in the middle of when he was getting annoyed by someone looking for money.

Icarus152

Dudess wrote: »

Do elaborate.

Both of the quotes in your post are good examples.I was just being lazy with my loonies remark.

Ignorance ITT would have been more accurate perhaps.

'Plenty of jobs in McDonalds and SuperMacs.'.......There aren't.

'no word of a lie, a 2010 Dublin registered BMW pulled up beside her, she hopped in and another roma beggar hopped out'........Old as the hills,used to be travellers.

'one of them i've seen more than once carrying a different baby with a different buggy. I guess most people wouldn't notice or remember that sort of stuff.'........Shocking as it may seem,there's a chance that she may have more then one child.

Bambi

Bambi wrote: »

You're mixing homeless people up with begging junkies methinks.

sorry but the only homeless people in Ireland are those with addictions

we have excellent help available and a welfare state where people are homed and paid dole/rent allowance if they dont have a job
People with mental illnesses are often sectioned and put into hospitals

prinz

Icarus152 wrote: »

'no word of a lie, a 2010 Dublin registered BMW pulled up beside her, she hopped in and another roma beggar hopped out'........Old as the hills,used to be travellers..

Not necessarily. I have seen very similar myself, while it certainly wasn't a 2010 BMW, I have seen a woman drive up a decent car, take a kid out of the back, they started off in the direction I was going. Fair enough. Gets to where I was also going and starts begging, for food apparently was her own line.

Dudess

Icarus152 wrote: »

'Plenty of jobs in McDonalds and SuperMacs.'

Plus, it's not like the poor dudes are gonna be what employers are looking for.

The Big Red Button

tenchi-fan wrote: »

The people who treat the homeless worst of all are people who give them small change. It's showy, they'll have a warm mushy feel like you get from giving a dog a biscuit, but because it keeps the homeless on the street it's the opposite of charity.

But it doesn't keep the homeless off the streets. It's silly to think that.

If it's cold outside and I pass a homeless person, I often go into a nearby shop and bought a takeaway hot meal, or a pair of warm socks, a jumper, etc. Despite the fact I'm not well off by any standards, and literally regularly struggle to feed myself by the end of the month. I have no illusions that I'm any sort of a martyr because of this! I do little/no charity work, I don't really get a "warm mushy" feeling when I do such a thing, because I know I'm making no long-term difference in this person's life.

But, come on, it might give them a wee lift on the night in question. I don't have the financial backing to make a "real" difference. So I'll just continue to do the tiny little bit that I can.