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John Hill acquited

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    #32
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Di0genes wrote: »
    Thats four killing sprees because mentally disturbed men (like John Hill) who believed 911 truth nonsense picked up guns instead of DVDs

    I think I made my point.

    I don't need to take requests

    3 killing spress by your own admission. Down to two because Jared Loughner never mentioned anything about 9/11. I read every post he made on abovetopsecret.


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    #33
    joebucks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    Di0genes wrote: »
    Several 9/11 conspiracy fans have gone on killing sprees.



    You're projecting BB.
    Di0genes wrote: »
    But just for you





    Jared Loughner.


    http://patterico.com/2011/01/10/jared-loughner-9-11-truther/

    Richard Poplawski killed 3 cops....Big Alex Jones and 911 truther fan.

    John Patrick Bedell only wounded three cops at the penatgon

    http://www.leftcoastrebel.com/2010/03/john-patrick-bedell-911-truther-but.html

    Hey Di0genes, I am not too familiar with the Bedell, Poplawski cases but have read a bit about the Loughner one. Alot of information in the sources you have used to demonstrate that 9-11 conspiracy fans is unproven. Do you have any links to back up the claims that Loughner was an anti-semite or that he was involved with 9-11 truth? What forums etc did he post on discussing these issues??


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    #34
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    joebucks wrote: »
    Hey Di0genes, I am not too familiar with the Bedell, Poplawski cases but have read a bit about the Loughner one. Alot of information in the sources you have used to demonstrate that 9-11 conspiracy fans is unproven. Do you have any links to back up the claims that Loughner was an anti-semite or that he was involved with 9-11 truth? What forums etc did he post on discussing these issues??

    http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/search/label/Jared%20Loughner


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    #35
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    3 killing spress by your own admission.

    C'mon Brown Bomber that's ****ing pedanty. Guy goes on a rampage with a gun and gets stopped and you're quibbling it because he only wounded?
    Down to two because Jared Loughner never mentioned anything about 9/11. I read every post he made on abovetopsecret.

    http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/search/label/Jared%20Loughner


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    #36
    Mahatma coat
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,869 ✭✭✭Mahatma coat


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    3 killing spress by your own admission. Down to two because Jared Loughner never mentioned anything about 9/11. I read every post he made on abovetopsecret.

    I wouldnt count the first example either as ONE Death is not a Spree


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    #37
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    Mahatma coat wrote: »
    I wouldnt count the first example either as ONE Death is not a Spree

    Again....the motive was for more.


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    #38
    Mahatma coat
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,869 ✭✭✭Mahatma coat


    how do you link Attacking the Holocaust Museum with 9/11???

    anyway, I'm off to bed, your 9/11 leads to Killing sprees claim is spurious at best, I'd be interested to see if you can come up with some more convincing examples by morning;)


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    #39
    joebucks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    Di0genes wrote: »
    http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/search/label/Jared%20Loughner

    So speculation by a former friend on ABC counts as a quality source now?


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    #40
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Di0genes wrote: »
    http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/search/label/Jared%20Loughner

    WTF was that supposed to prove? :confused: Some random blogger claims that Loughner was a 9/11 conspiracy theorist?


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    #41
    uprising2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,627 ✭✭✭uprising2


    Di0genes wrote: »
    Thats four killing sprees because mentally disturbed men (like John Hill) who believed 911 truth nonsense picked up guns instead of DVDs

    I think I made my point.

    I don't need to take requests

    John Antony Hill is a man of peace, he's sick of death and violence, he's a well mannered man of peace and I an I wish him well, I've spoke with him briefly outside the supreme court on his extadition charges, but in the cold and dark, God told him he will set him free to be one of the two prophets, the witnesses, and he has.
    God is Great


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    #42
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    Mahatma coat wrote: »
    how do you link Attacking the Holocaust Museum with 9/11???

    anyway, I'm off to bed, your 9/11 leads to Killing sprees claim is spurious at best, I'd be interested to see if you can come up with some more convincing examples by morning;)

    Seems Mr. von Brunn wasn’t a big fan of the Iraq War and also believed that 9/11 was an “inside job.”

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/jun/15/the-left-cries-racist-in-a-crowded-country/?page=2

    I've got 4 MC......

    They were also all antisemites as well. Funny that.


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    #43
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    joebucks wrote: »
    So speculation by a former friend on ABC counts as a quality source now?

    Like I said I read every post by Loughner on abovetopsecret it was Erad21 or something like that. He never made any mention of 9/11. He was all about the moon landings, The Fed and "conscience" dreaming.


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    #44
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Di0genes wrote: »
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/jun/15/the-left-cries-racist-in-a-crowded-country/?page=2

    I've got 4 MC......

    They were also all antisemites as well. Funny that.

    This is proof to you
    Seems Mr. von Brunn wasn’t a big fan of the Iraq War and also believed that 9/11 was an “inside job.”


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    #45
    WakeUp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,823 ✭✭✭WakeUp


    I agree with MC the "questioning of 9/11 leads to killing spree" is weak and spurious at best, nite all:).


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    #46
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    This is proof to you
    Von Brunn was the 9,196th person to sign the “Petition of Solidarity” hosted on the website Justicefor911.org, which claims it is sponsored in part by the organization 911Truth.org. According to the website over 16,600 people have signed the petition.

    http://www.nowhampshire.com/2009/06/10/holocaust-museum-suspect-was-a-911-%E2%80%9Ctruther%E2%80%9D/

    And
    Update: Here’s a letter Von Brunn wrote to Earthrainbownetwork.com about 9/11:
    DID YOU KNOW THAT…
    The fixed population of both World Trade Center towers (8am) on Sept 11, 2001: 38,500
    Visitors at any one time during the day: 3,900
    TOTAL population: 42,400
    Experts’ initial estimate of total killed: 6,000
    Total deaths recorded as of this date: 2,800
    Total Israeli people killed: 1
    Evacuation experts estimate buildings were only 30% occupied: 2,720
    Those absent from work that day: 29,680
    One Israeli National died in the WTC. Many didn’t show up that day – the Odigo Instant Messaging apparently gave a two-hour warning prior to the attacks.

    http://www.red-alerts.com/homeland-security/so-it-begins-shots-fired-at-holocaust-museum-in-dc-after-jeremiah-wright-claims-them-jews-are-controlling-obama/


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    #47
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    WakeUp wrote: »
    I agree with MC the "questioning of 9/11 leads to killing spree" is weak and spurious at best, nite all:).


    Um and I never said it did.


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    #48
    RoboClam
    Registered Users Posts: 582 ✭✭✭RoboClam


    Is the argument that people who believe that 9/11 was a conspiracy are more prone to killing sprees/violence? Based on the number of people that believe it, is four killing sprees a large deviation from what is seen in the rest of the population over a 10 year period? Also, it could be just one of a number of things which these people have in common, maybe they're all religious? Or maybe they all blonde? There are really too many other factors here, and correlation != causation.

    Ninja edit:

    Di0genes wrote: »
    Um and I never said it did.

    Ignore what I said so! I wasn't sure what the argument was about.


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    #49
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    RoboClam wrote: »
    Is the argument that people who believe that 9/11 was a conspiracy are more prone to killing sprees/violence? Based on the number of people that believe it, is four killing sprees a large deviation from what is seen in the rest of the population over a 10 year period? Also, it could be just one of a number of things which these people have in common, maybe they're all religious? Or maybe they all blonde? There are really too many other factors here, and correlation != causation.

    Ninja edit:




    Ignore what I said so! I wasn't sure what the argument was about.

    This is what he said
    Thats four killing sprees because mentally disturbed men (like John Hill) who believed 911 truth nonsense picked up guns instead of DVDs

    And isn't "correlation != causation" "CTer" logic?

    And it's not 4. Loughner never mentioned anything about 9-11. And of the 3 the 9-11 connections seems to be mostly hearsay and tenuous links, 1 wasn't a spree and the other involved no killing.


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    #50
    EarlERizer
    Registered Users Posts: 2,192 ✭✭✭EarlERizer


    Di0genes wrote: »
    But just for you

    James W Von Brunn

    Jared Loughner.

    Richard Poplawski killed 3 cops....Big Alex Jones and 911 truther fan.

    John Patrick Bedell only wounded three cops at the penatgon

    James W Von Brunn - 88 yr old White Supremacist with a deep rooted hatred of Jews (denied the holocaust ever happened) & Blacks shots a Black security guard at the Holocaust meuseum a couple of days after a Black American president makes a speech at a holocaust site ......cant really blame this one on his 911 veiws.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_von_Brunn

    Jared Loughner. - Supressed loner,drug abuser & unable to accept women in powerful positions,takes a serious dislike to Gifford after a question n answers session relating to his constituitional rights,documents his desire to assasinate her,goes on to buy weapons and ammunition and sets out to do as he intended at a convention that Gifford is addressing......straighforward case there without the need to attribute it to his thinking on 911.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Lee_Loughner

    Richard Poplawski - US Marine failure, kicked out of Marine Corp at boot camp stage after assaulting a drill sergeant,massive gun lover with a stock pile of weaponary who couldn't take been barked at by a figure of authority and carried a deep sense of self protection of his constituitional rights.....another straighforward case here with no need to attribute his crime to his thinking on 911
    http://www.wtae.com/r/19096134/detail.html

    John Patrick Bedell - The only one of the listed 4 with a motivation to go out and kill due to his beliefs regarding the government.However he was also a sufferer of Bi-polar disorder so it's unclear as to what state of mind he was in when he carried out the shooting ..... so I'll give ya that one!
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Pentagon_shooting

    Jeez Di0genes I'd have expected you to have produced something a little more solid given your hard line no nonsense approach to CT's


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    #51
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    RoboClam wrote: »

    Ninja edit:




    Ignore what I said so! I wasn't sure what the argument was about.

    Precisely the general concurrence is that Joe Hill was crazy. And some crazy people believe 9/11 conspiracy theories. And go on killing sprees.

    I am not, and have not claimed that 9/11 conspiracy theories cause killing sprees. Just that certain crazy people believe them, and justify them for their crimes.

    Plenty of nice normal people believe 9/11 conspiracy theories (one or two of them are on this forum).

    What Mahatma and Brown Bomber seem to be arguing about is the idea that anyone who believes 9/11 conspiracy theories could possibly have gone on a rampage.

    In fact they're distastefully trying to discount one because the killer had poor aim or the police got to them quickly and frankly unbelievably trying to argue that James Von Brunn doesn't count because he only killed one!


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    #52
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    EarlERizer wrote: »
    J

    Jeez Di0genes I'd have expected you to have produced something a little more solid given your hard line no nonsense approach to CT's

    All three wikipedia posts mention 911 truth.


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    #53
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Di0genes wrote: »
    Precisely the general concurrence is that Joe Hill was crazy. And some crazy people believe 9/11 conspiracy theories. And go on killing sprees.

    I am not, and have not claimed that 9/11 conspiracy theories cause killing sprees. Just that certain crazy people believe them, and justify them for their crimes.

    Plenty of nice normal people believe 9/11 conspiracy theories (one or two of them are on this forum).

    What Mahatma and Brown Bomber seem to be arguing about is the idea that anyone who believes 9/11 conspiracy theories could possibly have gone on a rampage.

    In fact they're distastefully trying to discount one because the killer had poor aim or the police got to them quickly and frankly unbelievably trying to argue that James Von Brunn doesn't count because he only killed one!

    Are you an atheist? Loughner was an atheist. Certain crazy people are atheists and go on killing sprees.


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    #54
    uprising2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,627 ✭✭✭uprising2


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    Are you an atheist? Loughner was an atheist. Certain crazy people are atheists and go on killing sprees.

    I'm afraid all do, (digme resonse)


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    #55
    EarlERizer
    Registered Users Posts: 2,192 ✭✭✭EarlERizer


    Di0genes wrote: »
    All three wikipedia posts mention 911 truth.

    As does your post, and like your post,the 911 mentions bear no relevance to the crime that each of the listed carried out and is just an add info tit bit of info in the lower paragraphs.

    Gun crime in the U.S.A. shooting spree's have been happening since the forming of the states
    ,most are attributed to their lax attitude to gun ownership/licencing laws, shooting sprees were happeninf long before the 911 truth movement and will continue long after it has gone.....it's just the way they are over there!

    I honestly thought you were going to throw up examples of people who actually went on shooting spree's due to nobody listening to their 911 rethoric......i.e. I expected more from you giving your previous input on CT forums.


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    #56
    EarlERizer
    Registered Users Posts: 2,192 ✭✭✭EarlERizer


    Di0genes wrote: »
    Precisely the general concurrence is that Joe Hill was crazy. And some crazy people believe 9/11 conspiracy theories. And go on killing sprees.

    I am not, and have not claimed that 9/11 conspiracy theories cause killing sprees. Just that certain crazy people believe them, and justify them for their crimes.

    Plenty of nice normal people believe 9/11 conspiracy theories (one or two of them are on this forum).

    What Mahatma and Brown Bomber seem to be arguing about is the idea that anyone who believes 9/11 conspiracy theories could possibly have gone on a rampage.

    In fact they're distastefully trying to discount one because the killer had poor aim or the police got to them quickly and frankly unbelievably trying to argue that James Von Brunn doesn't count because he only killed one!

    Misleading! (and frankly a case of Mr Pot calling the Kettle names), in the case of John Bedell he was stopped at a security gate for identification checking where he produced a handgun and began shooting,the obvious skilled trained police officers took evasive and affirmative action and Bedell copped for one in the head.

    It's not like he went on a rampage shooting all in sight (infact the only one of the 4 you mentioned that did just that was Loughner and it's already been cited that he wasn't all about 911 truths)

    I'd hazard a guess that the ratio of 911 truthers commiting homicides versus homicides by drug dealers,robbers and/or average joe jilted lovers is minimal at best.


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    #57
    uprising2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,627 ✭✭✭uprising2


    can i back that up with the fact that when i'm put down i'll go down


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    #58
    Di0genes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭Di0genes


    EarlERizer wrote: »
    Misleading! (and frankly a case of Mr Pot calling the Kettle names), in the case of John Bedell he was stopped at a security gate for identification checking where he produced a handgun and began shooting,the obvious skilled trained police officers took evasive and affirmative action and Bedell copped for one in the head.

    It's not like he went on a rampage shooting all in sight (infact the only one of the 4 you mentioned that did just that was Loughner and it's already been cited that he wasn't all about 911 truths)

    I'd hazard a guess that the ratio of 911 truthers commiting homicides versus homicides by drug dealers,robbers and/or average joe jilted lovers is minimal at best.

    pedantry.


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    #59
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    It may be interesting to do research into the wider question of how mental illness factors into CT belief, but it's hard to see here how we could reasonably discuss it without it turning into a slanging matach of some sort.

    Just to clarify, I'm not saying that you have to be mad to believe them. :)


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    #60
    jackiebaron
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,038 ✭✭✭jackiebaron


    humanji wrote: »
    That actually makes little sense to me. He's obviously guilty. I wouldn't want him to get any major punishment, just a slap on the wrist and told to not do it again. But is this going to set precedent for people to harrass family members and juries in future?

    But what's he guilty of?


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    #61
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Di0genes wrote: »
    pedantry.

    Evidence that Loughner was a 9/11 "fan" pleeeease-


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