Reloading

session savage

Anyone here have any idea when we could hope for reloading to be legalised?
Just wondering.

Grizzly 45

Saw in the IT article today that the bill head for the explosives act has been generated,but as to contents,tabling,debate,amendments in the bill ,getting it to be an act and finally into legislation......
Maybe in time for the second coming of the Celtic Tiger:rolleyes::rolleyes:

doyle61

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Saw in the IT article today that the bill head for the explosives act has been generated,but as to contents,tabling,debate,amendments in the bill ,getting it to be an act and finally into legislation......
Maybe in time for the second coming of the Celtic Tiger:rolleyes::rolleyes:

So you don't think it'll happen then grizzly:eek::eek::p:p:p

Grizzly 45

OH I 'm sure it will happen 100% somtime between now and the third millineum New years eve party on Dec31st 2999!!!:P:P:P

FISMA

Pardon my ignorance, but what exactly does the law say is illegal when it comes to reloading in Ireland?

Is it that you cannot purchase black powder, thus, you cannot reload.

Or is it purchasing bullets and primers?


Or is it just everything that is illegal?

Any links to the specifics would be appreciated.

Cass

This topic comes up at leats once a month. Here is the current situation.

Re-lolading is not illegal per se. You can have the equipment/tools needed without a license. The componants that are needed to make the rounds are split into different "categories". The bullets and brass would be covered under your firearms license (AFAIK). The powder and primers can only be held as individual componants under license by the DOJ/An Gardai as they are classified as explosives.

These licenses are not currently being issued. Until the drafting, passing of the new explosives Act is done the entire procedure is stalled. As said before the only exception being the pilot reloading scheme being run in the MNSCI with the NRAI.

FISMA

session savage wrote: »

Anyone here have any idea when we could hope for reloading to be legalised?
Just wondering.

Session,
I do believe that someday, soon, you will be allowed to reload in Ireland.

Until then, you should be reading, reading, and reading more. Use this time to get smart about the subject.

Also, you may wish to start collecting all of the bits and pieces that you will need. Just make sure they are all legal to possess.

I have already advised that anyone interested in reloading get this, inexpensive book

http://www.amazon.com/Guide-Reloading-National-Rifle-Association/dp/0935998977

When you actually do decide to reload AND it is legal to do so, you will have to get a few reloading books in order to cross reference. I suggest Speer and Hornady.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=537267

http://www.amazon.com/Hornady-Reloading-Handbook-editor-Johnson/dp/B000PD6SGW

To be honest, if I were still in Ireland 100% of the time, I think I would be buying all of the legal bits and pieces.

I will have to check with my local super to ensure that I can bring back all of my reloading equipment. From what EZ has said, it would appear that I can possess anything that is not explosive. Again, I will check with the Super.

Also, pick up your brass.

The day it is legal, you'll be ready to go.

Slan.

Cass

FISMA wrote: »

Also, you may wish to start collecting all of the bits and pieces that you will need. Just make sure they are all legal to possess.

The tools for reloading in themselves are not illegal however i would definitely advise AGAINST ordering anything. Other than the fact that you could draw unnecessary attention to yourself for no reason (its a safe bet on the behalf of the customs/Gardai to assume if reloading equipment is being delivered to a home that there could be reloading occuring there even though its not), and if the worst were to happen and it was not made legal or even available to all then you could have an outlay of a couple of hundred to nearly a thousand Euro (depending on your choice of tools) for no reason.

Also, pick up your brass.

The day it is legal, you'll be ready to go.

Slan.

Again i do not want to be the voice of doom and gloom, but remember lads, from a legal point of view the spent cases are classified the same as live rounds under Irish law. Meaning if your license allows for 1,000 rounds, and you have 501 spent cases and 500 live rounds you are technically over the quota of your license and hence in breach of the conditions of your lincense. In other words open to prosecution.

It may seem trivial or a small point of law, and most would consider it a "nothing" law as it would be bad form for any Garda to prosecute someone for too many, basically, inert cases, but it is the law and should be remembered.


At the end of the day whether reloading is made available to everyone or no-one i would not "rush" out and buy the tools just yet. If it is clarified with the new explosives Act, and made legal for all then you will have all the time in the world to go and start collecting your tools, etc. For now sit tight and be patient is the best advice.

Grizzly 45

OR better still hit the keyboards to your new TD/shooting group asking that for once some sane and sensible input into the legislation comes from the grassroots,and from people it will affect directly.IE us prospective reloaders.

FISMA

I think EZ's advice is sound and that when it comes to reloading equipment and brass, Irish shooters should heed his advice.

Additionally, I wanted to clarify a comment made above about picking up brass. I always pick up my brass, but be concerned about picking up others brass.

Chances are you are fine from a safety point picking up brass in Ireland since it is unlikely the lad next to you has reloads. However, as EZ pointed out, this could cause a legal headache. Determine how much brass your license is worth.

From a safety standpoint, in places where reloading is legal, you do not know if that brass has been fired multiple times, if the case walls are thinned, whether the case has been trimmed, or whether they shot hot loads which caused cracks not easily visible. Keep that in mind when picking up brass.

With all this said, I cannot stress enough that ye should get that NRA book and read it cover to cover. It is the single best book money can buy.

If you have a few Euro, get the Hornady, Speer, and Lyman manual. Read them all as they all have something to say.

The new Hornady has the SuperFormance powder info.

Read, read, read, and read some more.

Traumadoc

Many of the companies produce very good videos which I found helped me more than the books.

ianoo

[QUOTE=FISMA;71571680

I have already advised that anyone interested in reloading get this, inexpensive book

:D:D ian" rel="nofollow">http://www.amazon.com/Guide-Reloading-National-Rifle-Association/dp/0935998977[/URL.[/QUOTE]
anyone any idea how to get a copy of the above book ,i tried all the usual sites including the link above but they wont ship to ireland due to security issues .....all help accepted :D:D

ian

Mr.Flibble

ianoo wrote: »

anyone any idea how to get a copy of the above book ,i tried all the usual sites including the link above but they wont ship to ireland due to security issues .....all help accepted :D:D

ian

Have you tried them? http://www.nrastore.com/nra/Product.aspx?productid=PB%2001779

FISMA

Mr.Flibble wrote: »

Have you tried them? http://www.nrastore.com/nra/Product.aspx?productid=PB%2001779

True, that's where I bought the book and it was $10.00.

Please try this link and let us know how you get on, in any case.
http://www.nrastore.com/nra/Product.aspx?productid=PB%2001779

<oops> - same link as above - Thanks Mr Flibble (sorry I spelled your name wrong)!

Grizzly 45

http://www.pdf4me.net/pdf-data/reloading-manual.php
For free,download and store on your machine a load of reloading manuals:D:D
Another worth trying but it is a pay site,but with unlimited downloads within 24 hours of payment[$5usd] is
www.scribd.com
A bit of googling works wonders:D

dos29

Fair play Griz, that's fantastic.

virminhunter

would anyone here who's fairly handy at writing letters care to type a draft of a letter for the local td's asking whats going on with the re-loading laws that I and others could copy, paste and email to our local td's.

Cass

I'm putting this up as a courtesy/explanation.

I have removed some posts, my own included. The thread was devolving into a discussion on certain topics that have no bearing on reloading or shooting in general. Any further posts similar to the ones removed will be deleted without notification.

Ez.

ianoo

FISMA wrote: »

True, that's where I bought the book and it was $10.00.

Please try this link and let us know how you get on, in any case.
http://www.nrastore.com/nra/Product.aspx?productid=PB%2001779

<oops> - same link as above - Thanks Mr Flibble (sorry I spelled your name wrong)!

thanks lads ,
just tried to order the book of that site and they want $54.95 to post it to me :eek::eek:so thats a non runner .

ian

johngalway

Hornady Handbook of cartridge reloading
Speer bullets reloading manual #14
Richard Lees Modern reloading second edition
Sierra Rifle and handgun reloading data Edition V Third printing

Sitting on my shelf just itching.

There are also many, many guides on shooting sites based in more enlightened countries with entire reloading sections and numerous people who've been reloading for decades. (Without certification too I might add, which will inevitably be another "racket" in this country).

Asked my local TD about it last Monday, must follow it up with an email.

FISMA

ianoo wrote: »

thanks lads ,
just tried to order the book of that site and they want $54.95 to post it to me :eek::eek:so thats a non runner .
ian

I am surprised that we haven't a digital link yet, no luck on google books.

I will see about shipping, that's a ridiculous cost.

All else fails, I will throw a few in my case. I will not be home for a while, but it is a worthwhile book.

Feidhlim Dignan

is it legal to own just a press and bullet seating die?
im wondering because i shoot american eagle hollow points and the length of them varies alot, if i sized them all the same they might be more accurate

jett

That has some bearing on this thread.
Its normal and perfectly safe to reload in the UK.
There is no safety or security issue.
Its legal to have the equipment, its not legal to use it or have primers at the moment.
Its up to everyone to lobby the government to allow us to have the same rights as the UK.
After all its a republic.
Reloading is not rocket science!

Sparks

Yes. We know.
But this isn't the UK, our Ministers don't know it's safe or widely practiced.
And being from the UK, you should know that politicians do not know what's safe and what's not safe when it comes to target shooting and you should also know how little control shooters tend to have over those politicians. We can't handload (yet), you can't shoot even smallbore pistols.
And lobbying now, while there's a pilot programme running, would not be smart.

ormondprop

Sparks wrote: »

Yes. We know.
But this isn't the UK, our Ministers don't know it's safe or widely practiced.

Then we should start telling them all about it by meeting/calling or sending letters and get on their backs about it, rather than sitting back passing time and hoping they will a change a law they probably don't even know exists, and then when they dont change it being pissed off and giving out about them, when they didn't even know people wanted a change

Tackleberrywho

ormondprop wrote: »

Then we should start telling them all about it by meeting/calling or sending letters and get on their backs about it, rather than sitting back passing time and hoping they will a change a law they probably don't even know exists, and then when they dont change it being pissed off and giving out about them, when they didn't even know people wanted a change

Constituency Address:
Alan Shatter TD
57 Delbrook Manor, Dundrum
Dublin 16, Dublin,
Tel: 016183911 Fax:
Email Address: alan.shatter@oireachtas.ie


Get writing boys and girls!!

SVI40

You can get the NRA reloading manual here, www.fass.ie for €15.00 + p&p. That's where I got mine from.

jett

I cannot imagine what that would be like.
I have privately lobbied continually for a more liberal attitude to shooting here.
Its a pity that every single shooter does not do so as well.
People expect others to do it for them.
Most people I meet have not got any idea what reloading entails. Books are fine but practical demonstration shows it better.

Cass

jett wrote: »

I have privately lobbied continually for a more liberal attitude to shooting here.

To whom and in what form?

.243

jett wrote: »

I cannot imagine what that would be like.
I have privately lobbied continually for a more liberal attitude to shooting here.
Its a pity that every single shooter does not do so as well.
People expect others to do it for them.
Most people I meet have not got any idea what reloading entails. Books are fine but practical demonstration shows it better.

it only takes a few hours to learn,but years to master !!!

jett

My local TDs, various Ministers , Party leaders. The last MOJ, The new ministers and relevent TDS.Some by mail and local ones by personal meetings.
All their email addys are at the Dail website.
As for reloading, like most things, some help from those who do it and a bit of reading work wonders.
I did not find it got better with time because there is only one way to do it and that is correctly and safely.
Of course one can get faster in time.
I think there is an advantage with pistol loads but not much cost saving with Rifle loads.
The main advantage is being able to work out the optimum loads.
It isn't going to make a lot of difference for close up pistol but for distance pistol and carbine the results can be amazing.
I am not sure what the regulations may or may not be ( storage, competance etc).Plus just getting the stuff will not be easy as the market is small.
I imagine that it will be made as difficult as possible. Sorry to be miserable but after the licencing fiasco it kind of gets you that way.
As I said earlier it adds a new dimension to the sport. Just like fishing, you can buy flies etc but its more interesting to make them.

rock garden

Lads there might be a problem with ordering reloading gear from mainland uk .ie when i ordered a case trimmer with the sportmans guncentre in devon he asked me if i lived in southern ireland because if i did he was not permitted to send any reloading item to ROI. regards RG.

Grizzly 45

Everyone must have tons of money to burn still,when I hear you all ordering from the UK etc.:D
EBAY.com..Lads the stuff is cheap and plentiful and just as good 2nd hand,and they will ship it to Europe.Takes abit of shopping around and time to get the right bits.But whats the hurry???
It's not like full reloading is legal here yet!:pac:You can certainly "customise" the loads which is legal and does require a certain amount of the reloading equipment to do this.

So you can certainly practise customising the ammo,learning the procedures ,and how to do already.
Just dont order powder,primers or bullet heads or cases,and it should be ok.

AS usual.
Dont take this as legal advice or gospel.But the customising of ammo was certainly discussed in two DC cases in the mid 80sor early 90s up around the NW part of the Island,if my memory serves me right,and both were thrown out of court,as it was ruled as customising the ammo was not making ammo from fresh "ingredients":)

Cass

While the discussion of "what ifs", hypotheticals, and the general equipment used in reloading is fine. Discussing ANY alterations, customising, changing, etc of loads, rounds, ammo cannot and will not be allowed.

Irrespective of the outcome of previous cases i do not believe anyone can either afford or want to try their luck with their own case. Remember that discussion of reloading is legal, and allowed. Practising of reloading is illegal and not allowed.

Traumadoc

Practicing reloading in the republic of Ireland may be illegal. I think the reloading in itself is not illegal, just the possession of components.
Many of us have reloaded and continue to do so legally in other countries.

Cass

Traumadoc wrote: »

............ I think the reloading in itself is not illegal, just the possession of components.

Illegal is the best word i can use to describe the current situation. Currently, and as has been said before, reloading is in a state of legislative suspension. Possession of primers ad powder is illegal without the necessary paperwork/authorisation from the DOJ which is not being issued. Until the release of the new Explosives Act this situation will not change.

Many of us have reloaded and continue to do so legally in other countries.

And hopefully we will all have it here sooner rather than later. However until that day the discussion of reloading will and can only be a hypothetical. As with the numerous threads on shotgun cartridges, and altering them. I would sooner air on the side of caution and not have discussions about it. I don't think ayone will want to go through the ordeal of a court case to either find out they can or cannot do certain things.

Traumadoc

I don't mean to be difficult but it is not hypothetical if some of us are doing it legally outside the republic.

Doing it in the republic of ireland is potentially illegal ( although I know of no cases that have been taken successfully) It would be interesting case law in that I presume you would be charged for possession of a component you were legally allowed to posess. ( in the form of a full cartridge).

Sparks

It's hypothetical within the Republic, for now at least. When explicitly outside the republic, as this thread shows, the problem doesn't arise (you'll note Ezri and john both posting in there).

ianoo

SVI40 wrote: »

You can get the NRA reloading manual here, www.fass.ie for €15.00 + p&p. That's where I got mine from.

thanks to sv140 and declan from fingal academy of shooting sports a copy of the above NRA manual is on its way to me ,:D:D

fair play to ye lads

ian

FISMA

ianoo wrote: »

thanks to sv140 and declan from fingal academy of shooting sports a copy of the above NRA manual is on its way to me ,:D:D
fair play to ye lads
ian

ian,
Congrats - that book is great and you got it at the right price. It takes you through everything you need to know - all of the basics.

Once reloading is legal, you will want to get a reloading manual. It will cover the same material as the above and have all of the powder loads you need.

It may pay to pick one up, but I would not go buying many until it is legal to reload.

You will want three books to cross reference and ensure no-one made a typo. Plus, all three will not be exactly the same.

Again, it may pay to wait to buy all three since you will want the latest and greatest data. For example, this year's Hornady manual has the Superformance powder loads.

On the subject of reloading, I agree with what EZ is saying. You don't want to give anyone the opportunity to interpret the law when it comes to your firearm license. It is better to steer clear.

I know a prosecutor that likes to say: "it's easy to convict a guilty person, the real trick is in convicting someone that is innocent!