Test cricket

wicorthered

D3PO wrote: »

Lets just move to cloud cookoo land for a moment.

Lets assume Cricket Ireland decide to create a first class setup here.

Your looking at what perhaps a provincial setup, so 4 teams, perhaps 6 if you try and create a similar setup to say the Magners league in rugby i.e invite the Scottish and Dutch cricket boards to create 1 team each.

So lets assume 6 teams in a First Class championship.

So lets say you play every team home & away to decide the winners.

Thats 10 games to be played in I guess June, July, August.

Now that in itself is a problem as your looking at conflicts with ICC Intercontenantal cup fixtures.

Games would have to be played probably Mon - Thurs or Tue to Friday to facilitate the countries club one day setups

You cannot have players take 40 days off work without paying them. Where would this money come from ?

Likewise umpires & groundstaff.

Im sure theres many other impediments (not least the quality of player avialable even assuming the allowance of 1-2 overseas players per side). Id love to hear a coherant idea on how we could run and afford a first class setup in this country.

The sad fact is we can't, unless the ICC throws bucket loads of cash our way, which lets face it will never happen. Simply, cricket is not big enough in Ireland to support a professional set up. Sponsors won't pay big money and attendence at games will be non existent.

The only hope I can see for Ireland playing test cricket lies with the ECB.

If we can secure some extra funding we can pour it all in developing good young players. Through working with the ECB, the best of these players can be given oppurtunites to impress English counties. If they are good enough the counties will sign them up. If these lads move up to county cricket we would need an agreement where England would not pick them. We have 7 players now with county deals, what's stopping us with a good youth system, having 20-25 in 10-15 years time. 20-25 county pros would provide a decent test side. Not world beaters but competitive. By then hopefully cricket will have taken of over here and more people will be playing and more importantly maybe paying to watch cricket and the sport will continue to grow.

We're at the minimum 10 years from even thinking about playing test cricket. We have to have the ultimate ambition or we'll stay a feeder to England for ever.

Corsendonk

wicorthered wrote: »

The sad fact is we can't, unless the ICC throws bucket loads of cash our way, which lets face it will never happen. Simply, cricket is not big enough in Ireland to support a professional set up. Sponsors won't pay big money and attendence at games will be non existent.

The only hope I can see for Ireland playing test cricket lies with the ECB.

If we can secure some extra funding we can pour it all in developing good young players. Through working with the ECB, the best of these players can be given oppurtunites to impress English counties. If they are good enough the counties will sign them up. If these lads move up to county cricket we would need an agreement where England would not pick them. We have 7 players now with county deals, what's stopping us with a good youth system, having 20-25 in 10-15 years time. 20-25 county pros would provide a decent test side. Not world beaters but competitive. By then hopefully cricket will have taken of over here and more people will be playing and more importantly maybe paying to watch cricket and the sport will continue to grow.

We're at the minimum 10 years from even thinking about playing test cricket. We have to have the ultimate ambition or we'll stay a feeder to England for ever.

Can't see this happening either with the amount of complaints about the number of overseas players in county cricket taking English qualified players places the last time their team took a dip, England can't depend on recruiting South Africans all the time. Kolpak ruling already makes the English playing pool smaller than it should be and if an Irish player is good enough to play test cricket do you tell him to wait another 5-10 years before we get Test status.

wicorthered

Corsendonk wrote: »

Can't see this happening either with the amount of complaints about the number of overseas players in county cricket taking English qualified players places the last time their team took a dip, England can't depend on recruiting South Africans all the time.

That's why I said our test future lies with the ECB. England are the only test playing nation in Europe. The English board could do with a neighboring ally when dealing with the ICC, hence it benefits England if Ireland gain test status.

As Kolpak has now been stopped, once the current contracts these squad places will return to English players. With 18 counties with 15-18 man squads I think 20-25 places for Irish players wouldn't hurt that much.

Corsendonk wrote: »

if an Irish player is good enough to play test cricket do you tell him to wait another 5-10 years before we get Test status.

No you don't, if Stirling or Dockrell want to go play tests for England you let them. I think we should make every conceivable effort to keep them, as losing them hurts our long term development. Imagine Morgan in the current WC team. Imagine what Stirling would have learned from Joyce over the last 2-3 years.

We basically need a couple of martyrs, who would sacrifice a test career to help put Ireland firmly on the cricketing map. This is where the ICC could help. Granting Ireland regular exposure to the top sides, 10-12 ODIs and 10-12 20/20 games a year might convince players they can still play to a high level while helping their country.

Don't get me wrong I know it would be asking a huge amount of any man to turn down the ultimate cricketing aim, but what would you like to be remembered as, an Irish man who played 20 tests for England or an Irish man who helped bring test cricket to Ireland.

I bet when Ireland beat England Eoin Morgan was happier then when England beat SA.

LondonIrish90

wicorthered wrote: »

That's why I said our test future lies with the ECB. England are the only test playing nation in Europe. The English board could do with a neighboring ally when dealing with the ICC, hence it benefits England if Ireland gain test status.

As Kolpak has now been stopped, once the current contracts these squad places will return to English players. With 18 counties with 15-18 man squads I think 20-25 places for Irish players wouldn't hurt that much.




No you don't, if Stirling or Dockrell want to go play tests for England you let them. I think we should make every conceivable effort to keep them, as losing them hurts our long term development. Imagine Morgan in the current WC team. Imagine what Stirling would have learned from Joyce over the last 2-3 years.

We basically need a couple of martyrs, who would sacrifice a test career to help put Ireland firmly on the cricketing map. This is where the ICC could help. Granting Ireland regular exposure to the top sides, 10-12 ODIs and 10-12 20/20 games a year might convince players they can still play to a high level while helping their country.

Don't get me wrong I know it would be asking a huge amount of any man to turn down the ultimate cricketing aim, but what would you like to be remembered as, an Irish man who played 20 tests for England or an Irish man who helped bring test cricket to Ireland.

I bet when Ireland beat England Eoin Morgan was happier then when England beat SA.

I don't think a strong Ireland side would be of benefit to England at all in truth.

and, come on now. You make some good points but Eoin Morgan is a professional, and whats more, he is very close to a lot of members of the England team. I'm sure that he is desperate for his friends and colleagues to win in every game, especially when he is part of that set up.

kryogen

Morgan was over the moon when Ireland beat England, from an Irish point of view, from a professional point of view he wasnt thrilled, but not overly concerned as it shouldnt have affected Englands qualification much

d'Oracle

http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/505895.html

Nicely topical article, on what went wrong with Kenya and their application.
Very relevant to our case at the moment, if only to show how bloody far we still need to go.