Unsealed ballot box, Cork N W

Someone else · 25-02-2011 1:24pm #1

Went to vote at about 10.55 this morning, noted the girls on desk were not only marking off names but also keeping a record of number of voters.

I was the 65th this morning at this particular station.

I also noted fancy new plastic boxes that looked more like a shredder than a ballot box......

Voted dropped in my paper and next of all my 4yr old lifts lid and we can see all of the previous ballots.
Was leaving and thought about it, got the Garda and went back and showed him.
Of course excuses followed and sure it was grand and he would say it to the presiding officer. As I was leaving the other ballot boxes in the other rooms appeared only to have common everyday cable ties on them.

I spotted a guy sitting in the hallway of the school (each station is in a different classroom) asked if he was the presiding officer ad he acknowledged.
I explained to him the problem, he didn't even get off his seat. (11.00am) I then left, the more I thought about the excuses and lack of urgency really gets me!!
I'm F**ing angry now.....

see following link to photo of box, centre areas are where it should have been sealed. http://yfrog.com/h8todszj

Any thoughts on what to do next?

paul71 · 25-02-2011 1:28pm

Since presiding officer and guards are not interested try contacting some of the candidates.

jonnysimples · 25-02-2011 1:31pm

If your on twitter maybe tweet one of the candidates and let them know. I'm sure one of them will see it as a legitimate excuse to make an appearance at the polling centre!

studmystro84 · 25-02-2011 1:33pm

same with the boxes in north dublin this morning.some were locked some were not.compared to the images posted on rte there is a big difference

ghostdancer · 25-02-2011 1:36pm

Someone else wrote: »

Went to vote at about 10.55 this morning, noted the girls on desk were not only marking off names but also keeping a record of number of voters.

doesn't this happen at all polling stations?

mine in Kildare definitely did this for the local elections and the last by-election.

Someone else · 25-02-2011 1:39pm

studmystro84 wrote: »

same with the boxes in north dublin this morning.some were locked some were not.compared to the images posted on rte there is a big difference

Agree about the images....... RTE http://www.rte.ie/news/election2011/

is mise @howyadooin on twitter....!

username123 · 25-02-2011 1:39pm

Someone else wrote: »

see following link to photo of box, centre areas are where it should have been sealed. http://yfrog.com/h8todszj

2 fails here. Not only should that ballot box have been sealed, you should not have been allowed to use a recording device inside the polling station - they should not have allowed you to take that photo.

I strongly suggest you chase this up, tell the candidates, tell the local media, get some attention on it.

studmystro84 · 25-02-2011 1:47pm

username123 wrote: »

2 fails here. Not only should that ballot box have been sealed, you should not have been allowed to use a recording device inside the polling station - they should not have allowed you to take that photo.

I strongly suggest you chase this up, tell the candidates, tell the local media, get some attention on it.

agreed!

Someone else · 25-02-2011 1:49pm

username123 wrote: »

2 fails here. Not only should that ballot box have been sealed, you should not have been allowed to use a recording device inside the polling station - they should not have allowed you to take that photo.

I strongly suggest you chase this up, tell the candidates, tell the local media, get some attention on it.

The Garda was standing next to me when I took the photo!!

studmystro84 · 25-02-2011 1:50pm

Someone else wrote: »

The Garda was standing next to me when I took the photo!!

and people wonder why the country is in such a mess

snubbleste · 25-02-2011 1:51pm

Contact the county registrar by phone and make them aware as well.

mikemac · 25-02-2011 1:52pm

Use twitter to contact the candidates or phone them.
they'll go straight for the officers over it

fayer · 25-02-2011 1:52pm

This thread will be remembered after the FF landslide victory come Sunday!

username123 · 25-02-2011 1:54pm

Someone else wrote: »

The Garda was standing next to me when I took the photo!!

Well he should not have allowed that. It opens potential for people to sell their votes if you allow them to use a camera inside the polling station.

I definitely think you should get onto the candidates on this one - asap. Its a disgrace!

murphaph · 25-02-2011 1:56pm

It's symptomatic of the shabby, shoddy way things are done in Ireland and the "ah shur'n it'll do" attitiude that prevails.

OP: You are perfectly right to feel angry about this. These goons (including the Garda) are PAID by US to make sure these elections are carried out in a free and fair way and a fundamental aspect of that is that ballot boxes must be locked and sealed (and not with a friggin cable tie!).

People who made a huge fuss about eVoting (and there were genuine concerns there) will likely say little or nothing about this, despite it being 100 times easier to tamper with an election "the old fashioned way" when ballot boxes aren't even sealed.

Is there something like an electoral commission in the RoI or are we still waiting for that too?

fionny · 25-02-2011 1:57pm

What a sham, ill keep an eye when I go to cast my vote tonight.

testicle · 25-02-2011 2:00pm

What Polling station is this??

Someone else · 25-02-2011 2:04pm

testicle wrote: »

What Polling station is this??

Scoil Eoin, Ballincollig. Cork NW

Mountjoy Mugger · 25-02-2011 2:06pm

FYI, ballot boxes are only sealed at close of polling. Reference Section 72.

Kasabian · 25-02-2011 2:10pm

Mountjoy Mugger wrote: »

FYI, ballot boxes are only sealed at close of polling. Reference Section 72.

15 hours is a long time to have an unsealed box.

Mountjoy Mugger · 25-02-2011 2:12pm

Actually, I'm wrong..

Section 59..

59. Immediately before the commencement of the poll the presiding officer at each polling station shall show each ballot box in his or her charge to such persons as are present in the station, so that they may see that it is empty, and shall then lock the box and seal it in such manner as to prevent its being opened without breaking the seal and shall place it in his or her view for the receipt of ballot papers, and keep it so locked, sealed and in view during the poll

I was wondering why it (S.72) didn't make sense.

joe316 · 25-02-2011 2:12pm

Mountjoy Mugger wrote: »

FYI, ballot boxes are only sealed at close of polling. Reference Section 72.

thats only so no more votes can be put in the box

Section 53 states

Ballot boxes.
53. Every ballot box shall be so constructed that it can be securely locked and that while it is so locked a ballot paper can be inserted therein but cannot be extracted and that the box and the aperture for the insertion of ballot papers can be sealed.

Someone else · 25-02-2011 2:12pm

Mountjoy Mugger wrote: »

FYI, ballot boxes are only sealed at close of polling. Reference Section 72.

That is the "slot" that is sealed to prevent any further papers entering it.

The box itself should be sealed and Locked and only accessable via slot for the valid papers

username123 · 25-02-2011 2:14pm

Mountjoy Mugger wrote: »

FYI, ballot boxes are only sealed at close of polling. Reference Section 72.

My understanding is that the boxes must be locked all day during polling, but they are in fact sealed with wax seals overnight before they go to be counted.

Ballot boxes.53. Every ballot box shall be so constructed that it can be securely locked and that while it is so locked a ballot paper can be inserted therein but cannot be extracted and that the box and the aperture for the insertion of ballot papers can be sealed.

joe316 · 25-02-2011 2:14pm

I've tweeted RTE, journal.ie and a couple of others that pic and this thread. This needs to be sorted asap

username123 · 25-02-2011 2:15pm

Can someone who is a member of politics.ie also post there regarding this?

Sir Oxman · 25-02-2011 2:16pm

Dodgy as feck.

paul71 · 25-02-2011 2:17pm

Is presiding officer liable for criminal prosecution if he fails to fulfill his duties?

fionny · 25-02-2011 2:25pm

Its beginning to go viral on twitter now, Good job

joe316 · 25-02-2011 2:29pm

Cork Indo tweeting your pic, good work OP this is disgraceful

shoes34 · 25-02-2011 2:33pm

what will be done about it - does that mean the votes are spoilt? I will be checking my ballot box when I go to vote later.

Someone else · 25-02-2011 2:36pm

shoes34 wrote: »

what will be done about it - does that mean the votes are spoilt? I will be checking my ballot box when I go to vote later.

Don't know but if eliminations are tight someone could call for a re-vote.?

Local candidates could loose out with a higher % of No1's and transfers if box was ruled out

um7y1h83ge06nx · 25-02-2011 2:38pm

That's a disgrace.

The Garda and the presiding officer should be ashamed of themselves. Not good enough!!

I'll be checking my box tonight.

Cavehill Red · 25-02-2011 2:40pm

Someone else wrote: »

Went to vote at about 10.55 this morning, noted the girls on desk were not only marking off names but also keeping a record of number of voters.

I was the 65th this morning at this particular station.

I also noted fancy new plastic boxes that looked more like a shredder than a ballot box......

Voted dropped in my paper and next of all my 4yr old lifts lid and we can see all of the previous ballots.
Was leaving and thought about it, got the Garda and went back and showed him.
Of course excuses followed and sure it was grand and he would say it to the presiding officer. As I was leaving the other ballot boxes in the other rooms appeared only to have common everyday cable ties on them.

I spotted a guy sitting in the hallway of the school (each station is in a different classroom) asked if he was the presiding officer ad he acknowledged.
I explained to him the problem, he didn't even get off his seat. (11.00am) I then left, the more I thought about the excuses and lack of urgency really gets me!!
I'm F**ing angry now.....

see following link to photo of box, centre areas are where it should have been sealed. http://yfrog.com/h8todszj

Any thoughts on what to do next?

Same in Dublin South. Looked fairly dodgy, I have to say.

joe316 · 25-02-2011 2:41pm

Just got a response from Will Goodbody and he said that RTE are looking into it

mikom · 25-02-2011 2:41pm

Ismael Mushy Cell wrote: »

I'll be checking my box tonight.

studmystro84 · 25-02-2011 2:42pm

joe316 wrote: »

Just got a response from Will Goodbody and he said that RTE are looking into it

great we can all go back to bed now! the country is safe

Sir Oxman · 25-02-2011 2:43pm

Time to call for the UN to monitor elections in this country - one look at how the register is compiled and 'maintained' would be enough.

JoeyJJ · 25-02-2011 2:43pm

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Same in Dublin South. Looked fairly dodgy, I have to say.

St Marys in Sandyford looked fine, just to clarify, so not all Dub South.

fionny · 25-02-2011 2:44pm

Now now Captain Sarcy. Considering we threw out a multi million euro epolling system based on vulnerabilities its pretty dodgey they couldnt even put a seal on the ballot box..

Whats to stop someone putting a handful of votes in or taking them out.... its bull and quite worrying.

Cavehill Red · 25-02-2011 2:47pm

JoeyJJ wrote: »

St Marys in Sandyford looked fine, just to clarify, so not all Dub South.

Sadly I don't have a vote in every polling station. I can only speak for the one I was in, as I assume, do you.

Horse_box · 25-02-2011 2:47pm

Bad parenting, you should have not let your child near that ballot box! I jest

I'll be heading up to vote later and will have a look aswel. I know it's a cliche but it really is typical of the attitude we have in this country, unprofessional twats possibly spoiling one of the biggest elections in the history of the state

shoes34 · 25-02-2011 2:59pm

joe316 wrote: »

Just got a response from Will Goodbody and he said that RTE are looking into it

Will be interesting to see if RTEff mention it in the news.

joe316 · 25-02-2011 3:05pm

shoes34 wrote: »

Will be interesting to see if RTEff mention it in the news.

not a chance, nothing on the 3pm news

Atlantic Dawn · 25-02-2011 3:06pm

Makes Zimbabwee look legit, I'm going to check mine later, if not sealed I will make a huge scene and probably be ejected or arrested.

Irishdudedave · 25-02-2011 3:08pm

Best thing to do would be to "accidentally" knock the box over. Just make sure you have a friend ready with a camera to get pictures of the votes all over the floor.

[Jackass] · 25-02-2011 3:13pm

The presiding officer asked me to keep an eye on the box earlier while he ran to the jacks, it was fairly quite and he was taking his time, so I started to read through some of the votes in the box...it was disgraceful how many people were voting for bad candidates! Straight in the bin! I have to say the quality of candidates this year has been quite poor.

county man · 25-02-2011 3:22pm

Ballincollig is the home base of Canty O Donnabhain and Mark Collins and not far from O Grady so surely they should look into this if they are made aware of it.On another point I voted at lunchtime and there was no Garda present.What is the rule on this?