Why I won't be voting Sinn Fein

squod

BLIZZARD7 wrote: »

A select few, who exactly ? I am quite sure that Brian lenihan was told by the EU to stop all Irish banks from failing, at all costs. So he didn't really have a choice.



I dont think there is any question as to whether the finance bill should be passed or not, if we don't implement it the IMF/EU will stop funding us and the country will run out of money in a few months. Or the IMF will take control of our finances and then we will see very severe cuts in all sectors, and the debt will be cut too nothing within 4 years. Which might be a good thing in the longterm. You only have to look at Latvia to see the cuts they would impose.


Dan

I don't understand this thinking at all. You're suggesting volunteering to give ~€100 billion to gamblers and criminals is likely to solve our economic problems and endear us to shrewd, politically savvy investors? Don't see it.

Dan_Solo

squod wrote: »

I don't understand this thinking at all. You're suggesting volunteering to give ~€100 billion to gamblers and criminals is likely to solve our economic problems and endear us to shrewd, politically savvy investors? Don't see it.

+1
The idea that we replace one lot of investors (=speculators) with another lot with even bigger repayments is lunacy. If we couldn't pay the old one, what makes people think we can pay the new loans?
Expecting property prices to save the day again?:rolleyes:

Dr. Baltar

Dr. Baltar wrote: »

I can see why.
I have no problem with people taking a stab at SF, but what does annoy me is the hypocrisy that a lot of people seem to have when taking such stabs. For example, when people state that they wouldn't vote for them because of past links with the IRA when both FF and FG can trace thier routes to the same organisation. What's the difference?

Time
Theres no living victims of wars nearly a 100 years ago.
Mrs Mcabe is alive and well though and she is but one of many on both sides.

I think sinn fein also need time to evolve their economic policies.
They've only recently realised how stupid rising corporation tax would be.

Sir Oxman

LeixlipRed wrote: »

There is only one reason people should not vote for SF. They have put forward a left-wing economic agenda for the southern elections. However, in NI they are currently involved in delivering the Tory cuts through the NI Assembly and the power-sharing government. Hence, they're hypocrites attempting to pass themselves off as representing low and middle income workers. I implore anyone who agrees with SF's policies to consider voting for the ULA, the policies are the same but we actually represent a real alternative. We won't join a coalition with FF or FG which SF will do if given a chance (and hence they'll have to deliver cuts because both these parties have pledged to do so).

On the other hand, if people have to vote for an established party then I'd encourage them to vote for SF as opposed to FF/FG/Lab.

To be fair, the political setup in the North is completely different to anywhere else in Europe - it's a power-sharing government and needs to be due to the obvious.
I think it's indicative of how SF take their new responsibilities (and no, I don't like cuts and taxes but that's what there has to be - the only difference to be made is the fairness applied)
I have never voted SF but would have no problem doing so now.
I still haven't made my mind up.

Scofflaw

A select few, who exactly ? I am quite sure that Brian lenihan was told by the EU to stop all Irish banks from failing, at all costs. So he didn't really have a choice.

The blanket guarantee was signed without any discussions with any other European country, the EU, or the ECB. It was, on the other hand, signed after discussions with Brian Cowen's golf partners.

The EU were only told afterwards, and had no legal basis on which to overturn such an Irish government decision.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Pat D. Almighty

Pat D. Almighty wrote: »

There is no separate North/South party. It's an All-Ireland party.
Right, well provide a transcript or link to the video. Was it a categorical denial?

LeixlipRed wrote: »

Right, well provide a transcript or link to the video. Was it a categorical denial?

You want me to provide a transcript or link to the video that proves that Sinn Fein are an all-Ireland party?

Tayla

For me there is noone left to vote for after today but Sinn Féin.

BLIZZARD7

squod wrote: »

I don't understand this thinking at all. You're suggesting volunteering to give ~€100 billion to gamblers and criminals is likely to solve our economic problems and endear us to shrewd, politically savvy investors? Don't see it.

I'm sorry but where exactly did I suggest "volunteering to give ~€100 billion to gamblers and criminals" ???






Dan

clln

Sinn Fein,i would not vote for them on the basis of my perceived lack of understanding of economic's by them for now.

To disregard them as a political force though is tantamount to saying FF or FG should never have got a vote after the treaty and then the civil war.

perhaps that would have been a good thing though.?

Asked by Cathal on morning Ireland now,would Gerry adams unilaterally default on the ecb/imf deal,he said yes.
Asked where he was going to get the money to run the country as he was doing no cuts,he hummed and hawed..and said he'd negotiate with the lenders..
Asked what if the lenders response was to unilaterally not lend to us because we unilaterally default [we'd be a bad lend] he had no answer.

I agree with fg and labours trending position that this bank debt needs to be re negotiated and dealt with more equitably so joe citizen only takes a share commensurate with whats good for the economy and affordable, with the bulk of it carried by those that spent it.
Sinn Fein on the other hand are still in the cloud cuckoo land place as to where the moneys coming from to run the country.
Untill we can balance the books,we need to borrow.
If we are to borrow we need to cut our spending cloth to meet the measure of our abilities.
If we don't,lenders wont give and boy then the cuts you see now are kindergarden compared to what we'd have to do.

Thats a realisation Sinn Fein are ignoring in their cloud cuckoo world.

Bottle_of_Smoke

I think they'll make a good opposition to be honest. Rather have Gerry Adams than Michael Martin any day

ANXIOUS

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

I think they'll make a good opposition to be honest. Rather have Gerry Adams than Michael Martin any day

A good opposition is one that, could possiblely lead the country. So imho that rules seinn fein out as being good opposition.

squod

BLIZZARD7 wrote: »

I'm sorry but where exactly did I suggest "volunteering to give ~€100 billion to gamblers and criminals" ???



Dan

I quote........

BLIZZARD7 wrote: »

I dont think there is any question as to whether the finance bill should be passed or not, if we don't implement it the IMF/EU will stop funding us and the country will run out of money in a few months. Or the IMF will take control of our finances .........

So what do you suggest we do with these IMF/EU loans? You do understand it's not in the country's interest to borrow this money, don't you?

squod

squod wrote: »

So what do you suggest we do with these IMF/EU loans? You do understand it's not in the country's interest to borrow this money, don't you?

All the credible opposition parties ie FG and labour are in favour of renegotiating cognisant of the fact that essentially as the EU is borrowing the money on the markets to lend to us,that some half way point with the markets will have to be reached.

With any luck,we'll replace this shambles government with a stable strongly mandated one who go to do that from their mandated position of political strength.

gbee

100 year since 1916 is arriving soon, maybe we should bring forward the ceremonies.

pazza

To LexlipRed - to say that SF should pull out of government in the North displays a total lack of understanding of the Northern political landscape offers nothing to or from the argument whether anyone should vote for them in the coming elections for Dail Eireann. I also took your advise on Googling what way SF voted on the Bank Guarantee - and found the following links:

SF voted for the Credit Institutions (Financial Support) bill to be passed on the 1st October 2008.

Dil ireann - Volume 662 - 01 October, 2008 - Credit Institutions (Financial Support) Bill 2008: Committee Stage (Resumed) and Remaining Stages.

On the 17th of October SF voted, along with Labour, against approving the terms of the draft scheme of the Credit Institutions Scheme 2008, which was part of the CIFS Act.
Dil ireann - Volume 664 - 17 October, 2008 - Approval of Credit Institutions (Financial Support) Scheme 2008: Motion.

In my opinion they offer a practical thought process for how a party voted - initially to address an immediate (and very real) issue on the run at the banks, and then once the substance was made available they had time to properly consider and vote against (i.e. as opposed to being against everything for the sake of it).

I am not trying to make the SF argument - I am not sure how/who I will vote for and only replied in what I perceived as providing my views - as a wavering and available voter - waiting for someone to convince me to vote for them...just not seeing ANY options of candidate that is worthwhile. I would vote for Paul Sommerville (I think that was his name) the economist I heard on the radio the other morning...seemed to make sense to me.

clln

gbee wrote: »

100 year since 1916 is arriving soon, maybe we should bring forward the ceremonies.

Lol gbee,lord knows we need some humor about the place,
I honestly from reading history do not believe our People have ever felt lower since perhaps the famine days.

a pox on all of them.

Dan_Solo

Deleted User wrote: »

All the credible opposition parties ie FG and labour

credible = agree with me

LeixlipRed

Pat D. Almighty wrote: »

You want me to provide a transcript or link to the video that proves that Sinn Fein are an all-Ireland party?

Now you're being deliberately facetious I want evidence of SF saying that they will categorically not enter coalition with FF/FG.

LeixlipRed

And the argument that the situation is different in the North is rubbish in my opinion. SF would like you to see it that way alright. If they were a proper socialist party, dedicated to protecting low and middle income earners then they would not allow themselves to be used as an instrument to deliver cuts against those people. They should pull out of government, demand fiscal responsibilty, more devolution, whatever and then only return to power if and when that happens. Me, being a cynic, doesn't believe they are a socialist party and hence can't see them ever doing that.

Lazare

Why I won't be voting Sinn Fein.

Eight words.

Martin Ferris collecting Gerry McCabe's killers from prison.

People have short memories, imagine Sinn Fein holding the ministry of justice.

I would abandon my mortgage and leave this country immediately.

Or, I could probably stay here and open a Lada dealership given their laughable economic policies.

madmac187

Is it not a stupid idea to vote for a party whose policies on economic recovery is to just not pay anything to anyone and forget about the banks?? If Anglo was left alone from day one this would be ok. But it wasn't now the entire idea of getting all the IMF money into banks is to recapitalise them in order to lend money again for economy growth. If Sinn Fein get into government, it would be like giving control to the Taliban.

Sinn fein want the people to have nothing, that is where they thrive. As for Northern Ireland, he should stay there. They haven't done anything up there in recent times, our money and British money has and despite us not having it, we are still sponsoring Northern Ireland.

A vote for Sinn Fein is an errosion of our country and our fiscal security. In saying that, for the other parties, votes for them aren't much better but they don't have alleged links to paramility organisations who in turn have supposedly have links with drug dealers??????

Bottle_of_Smoke

LeixlipRed wrote: »

And the argument that the situation is different in the North is rubbish in my opinion. SF would like you to see it that way alright. If they were a proper socialist party, dedicated to protecting low and middle income earners then they would not allow themselves to be used as an instrument to deliver cuts against those people. They should pull out of government, demand fiscal responsibilty, more devolution, whatever and then only return to power if and when that happens. Me, being a cynic, doesn't believe they are a socialist party and hence can't see them ever doing that.

Right so they pull out and direct rule resumes. Oh yeah that's definitely gonna stop cuts isn't it:rolleyes:

um7y1h83ge06nx

Lazare wrote: »

Why I won't be voting Sinn Fein.

Eight words.

Martin Ferris collecting Gerry McCabe's killers from prison.

People have short memories, imagine Sinn Fein holding the ministry of justice.

I would abandon my mortgage and leave this country immediately.

Or, I could probably stay here and open a Lada dealership given their laughable economic policies.

Adare 7th of June 1996.

Those convicted - O'Neill was released from prison on 15 May 2007 with Sheehy released on 4 February 2008, Walshe and McAuley were released on the 5th August 2009.

Collecting and greeting Garda killers within the last 4 years, doesn't exactly paint SF as pillars of democracy.

Dan_Solo

LeixlipRed wrote: »

They should pull out of government, demand

Difficult to demand anything when you're not in power.
Unless you're an AIB manager.

Dan_Solo

Jayce Important Creature wrote: »

Collecting and greeting Garda killers within the last 4 years, doesn't exactly paint SF as pillars of democracy.

Well it's a shame that it's come to this, but what's the euro value of a murdered garda? If you ask me to choose between untold misery for the whole country indefinitely trying to pay off impossible IMF/ECB loans and turning a blind eye to SF hypocrisy on McCabe, I'm afraid there's only one answer for me.

um7y1h83ge06nx

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Well it's a shame that it's come to this, but what's the euro value of a murdered garda? If you ask me to choose between untold misery for the whole country indefinitely trying to pay off impossible IMF/ECB loans and turning a blind eye to SF hypocrisy on McCabe, I'm afraid there's only one answer for me.

What's the euro value of keeping convicted criminals out of Leinster House?

"Ferris served ten years (1984-1994) in prison for his involvement in the attempted importation of arms from the United States"

We can put a monetary value on everything if need be.

fivefreedoms

well my policy is going to be keep them at the door , bend their ears about anything you feel like ranting about and eventually tell them you are not voting for them. Haven't decided who i will vote for but it will not be FF or Sinn Fein they scare the hell out of me

Chucky the tree

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Well it's a shame that it's come to this, but what's the euro value of a murdered garda? If you ask me to choose between untold misery for the whole country indefinitely trying to pay off impossible IMF/ECB loans and turning a blind eye to SF hypocrisy on McCabe, I'm afraid there's only one answer for me.

Sinn Fein only policy is refuse the IMF/ECB bailout, I've yet to hear where they are going to come up with the £20bn to pay off our deficit. Magic beans maybe? Voting for SF is voting for untold misery for the whole country, and it's can't be claimed otherwise.

LeixlipRed

As I've said a million times, you represent the working class or you don't. If you're in power delivering cuts to those people you claim to represent then there's only one conclusion I can make and that is that SF are not representative of the working class but are using them to get into power and claim mainstream credibility.