Doomed To Be Alone

Rick_

WARNING - Melodramatic Post

Yes, I know I had a thread for a year or two ago about trying to find nice guys, but despite that and the wonderful comments and chat that I had in there I'm afraid that other thoughts have creeped into my mind and hence why I am posting this here again.

Since I started that thread I have been on a number of dates with guys. I can't say I particularly clicked with any of them. I myself feel that there is a reason as to why I know I am going to be alone, I'm too "individual". By that I mean that I have my own weird little sense of humour and no-one seems to get / understand it. I also have my own way of doing things and no-one else understands that or thinks it's very sensible. (Apparently I'm too uptight or too old fashioned etc.). I'm also socially very awkward and nervous/shy, which is an instant turn off for guys. I also don't meet guys for sex and this is generally met with disbelief from most gays I have chatted to, where it seems whoring yourself around is the norm.

I don't go on the scene either and have no desire to at any point, which I understand limits my options but it's just not for me and I honestly don't want to be with someone if going on the scene all the time is their prerogative. I also am stuck in a small, shítty narrow minded town in an OK job with little money to spare and moving isn't an option. There also doesn't appear to be any sort of social groups or gatherings local to me I can go to to try and mix with others, the aforementioned socially awkward shyness being part of the reason why I probably wouldn't go even if there was.

The only way I can see anything changing in my life is if I change things about myself to seem more 'attractive' to other people, but then again, why should I? Why can't peope accept me for who I am and not want me to fit into their expectations.

I understand that this post will píss some people off on here as it would generally be considered as a moaning, whiny post but I just have felt this way all weekend and now I'm sitting in work and feel like I have to vent this or I'm going to throw something against the wall, preferably this bloody computer which never works properly anyway. I don't expect any sort of comments or the like, and if there are I fully expect them to be telling me to shut/wise up... I just wanted somewhere to put this down for my own sake. I've been living like this for years and as a 26 year old with no 'life' to speak of I just find myself getting more and more depressed every day. I know 17 year olds who are out having more of a life than I am and that alone makes me just want to cry. Since I was in my mid-teens I have been on my own the majority of the time longing even for just a decent friend let alone a boyfriend. It seems the only people that come into my life only want something from me (or realise how nice/selfless I am and take advantage of it) and once they get it, they're away quicker than a greyhound chasing a hare.

Move along, nothing to see here.

KnifeWRENCH

Sorry to see you feel so down. I honestly don't know what the right thing to say here is (apologies for being rubbish at advice giving) but you're not "destined" to be alone. No-one is destined for anything; the whole concept of fate is pretty much bollocks. Don't think that nothing is ever going to change, because you don't know what's going to happen tomorrow. The man of your dreams may walk into your life. Or you may get hit by a bus. Either way, you don't know.

You say you're stuck in an "OK job" in a "shítty town". Is there any hope you may get a job somehwere else? Somewhere a bit less narrow minded, where there's more stuff to do? Even if it involves leaving the country, you could look around to see if there are any jobs available in your area of work.

Of course, if you don't enjoy your area of work, perhaps you might consider going back into education? At least then you could find yourself in a larger environment where there will be more oppurtunities for you to meet people.

However, the line that jumped out most at me in your post was this one:

Since I was in my mid-teens I have been on my own the majority of the time longing even for just a decent friend let alone a boyfriend.

I think you may be better served concentrating on finding new friends rather than a boyfriend. I'm not the best person to advise how to do that (I always find myself wanting more friends and feeling disconnected from them) but hopefully someone who can give better advice will come along here.

azezil

Yeah maybe you will end up alone but you'll only have yourself to blame for that, after all, clearly everyone else is wrong and you're the only one whose right :rolleyes:

lostwallet

Not trying to crack onto you here, but ur sense of humour is evident from your opening post alone.

I don't have much experience in this so I wont say give it time or any other cliches, but perhaps consider moving away for a time to a less "sh1tty narrow minded town".

Rick_

Well the general reaction so far is what I expected.

azezil wrote: »

Yeah maybe you will end up alone but you'll only have yourself to blame for that, after all, clearly everyone else is wrong and you're the only one whose right :rolleyes:

Way to kick someone when they're down. That moderator badge suits you. Thanks. Majorly. Did it perhaps cross your mind that venting on here in itself would have made me feel better, before you waded in with a totally unhelpful and almost spiteful post? If you haven't got anything nice to say, kindly keep it to yourself.

lostwallet wrote: »

Not trying to crack onto you here, but ur sense of humour is evident from your opening post alone.

Could you elaborate further on this please? What exactly do you mean? What sense of humour do you think I have and what in my OP made you think that?

I also hit a new low tonight, as I discovered that a girl named Kendra is now more important on a guys list of priorities than me. He was nice looking, kind, funny, interesting, but when I didn;t know who this Kendra woman is and didn't agree with him (when I did find out who she was) that she was some amazing role model people should live their lives by and aspire to be like, he decided he didn't want to speak to me any more. Wow. Before I only felt like crying. Now, I actually am doing it.

Paddy The Pirate

Paddy C wrote: »

Well the general reaction so far is what I expected.

Way to kick someone when they're down. That moderator badge suits you. Thanks. Majorly. Did it perhaps cross your mind that venting on here in itself would have made me feel better, before you waded in with a totally unhelpful and almost spiteful post? If you haven't got anything nice to say, kindly keep it to yourself.

Could you elaborate further on this please? What exactly do you mean? What sense of humour do you think I have and what in my OP made you think that?

I also hit a new low tonight, as I discovered that a girl named Kendra is now more important on a guys list of priorities than me. He was nice looking, kind, funny, interesting, but when I didn;t know who this Kendra woman is and didn't agree with him (when I did find out who she was) that she was some amazing role model people should live their lives by and aspire to be like, he decided he didn't want to speak to me any more. Wow. Before I only felt like crying. Now, I actually am doing it.

I'm no expert, not even close, and to be honest I don't really know much of what i can say, but the thing is, well, that seems slightly petty of him, i know taht if you really like someone you can start to overlok those things, but that doesn't seem fair. Better to try not to get upset over it and let him go, or speak to him about it if you can convince him to listen. Crying, is what I think helps us let it out, talking, crying, lots of those sort of things can help.

Not able to find someone? That doesn't mean you're doomed, not even close, it just hasn't been going right so far, you can still find that person, it takes time for some people, for most people from what i have seen, you persevere, and most likely you WILL find someone who is right for you, but despairing about it will do you no good, you will only push yourself deeper into feeling bad.

And no, you shouldn't change who you are to suit other peoples needs, those quirks are the things that many people are looking for, that little something that interests them, that is unique about you. Being different (in some ways , not the serial killer different :P) Is good, because it's real, its the way you should be. So really despite my useless (and im sorry that im not much help) ramblings, i hope there's something in this post that will bring some maybe new perspective to things. Just keep trying, don't give up, and don't forget who you are.

Chuchoter

Move out of the ****ty narrow minded town. Find a way or you will be stuck there forever. There is someone out there for you, you seem really funny and nice, but they have probably all moved out of their ****ty town as well! :P

I'd also say that you should join stuff you like, not just going out to clubs or whatever. Join a sport or some kind of language class. You're bound to find someone. It could be the case that maybe you come off really negative because you don't believe anyone will like you or you already hate everyone there. It sounds silly, but if you keep telling yourself this is going to be fun and I'm going to enjoy myself it actually works as opposed to what I used to do which was 'No-one will like me, they're all going to be blonde idiots, I hate everything and I'm crap at this anyway so why am I here?'. It turns into an endless spiral of things being crap.

And if its any consolation, I only know two 17 year olds having any fun. The rest of us are all miserable waiting to escape secondary school. :P

elekid

Paddy C wrote: »

I'm also socially very awkward and nervous/shy, which is an instant turn off for guys.

That's a big assumption to make! Like you I'm extremely socially awkward, very nervous and very shy. I never know what to say to people and find it very hard to connect with probably 95% of the people I meet. When I first met my boyfriend 5 years ago I didn't know what to say to him, I barely spoke on our first few dates and it took a long time for me to open up to him on any real level. But he stuck with me and later told me he found my shyness endearing, it made getting to know me more interesting and he preferred to be with someone quiet and easygoing rather than someone who was going to talk his ear off all the time.

I still have lots of problems with shyness and do some really weird stuff sometimes because of it, but he's always been patient and understanding with me (we went to the last lgb forum beers together but I freaked out and left really early because I didn't feel up to making conversation with anyone - he understood and didn't mind me leaving him there alone). Maybe you've had bad luck so far but trust me, there are plenty of guys out there who will understand how you feel and not hold it against you.

So what I'm trying to say is, I know how bloody hard it is to be so shy on top of everything else you've had to deal with but you have to stop beating yourself up over it. Don't assume it makes you unattractive. Lots of people, myself included, would find it to be an endearing quality. I also don't like "the scene" and have never been a pub/club person so I'm not sure I could be with someone who was big into it either (nothing wrong with it, it's just not for me).

So please don't give up hope, you sound like a nice guy who's going through some really hard times at the moment but there are those of us who understand what you're going through if you ever need to talk. And you will meet someone who gets you, it's only a matter of time.

fjireland

Yeah maybe you will end up alone but you'll only have yourself to blame for that, after all, clearly everyone else is wrong and you're the only one whose right

very, very unhelpful,

maybe you dont care to listen to someone's probs and stuff, but i think you would have been better just skipping over this post if that was all you had to add seriously,


now as for what you had to say Paddy,
well its like a page outta my life, except i have turned past the magical 26 , and now am 27 and still in my own rut, very similiar to you, have steady job, but not happy, very little options for exploring gay life in small town and stuff, socially awkward, not into whoring it around on the scene,

i dont know what constructive advice to give you, but just know you are not alone and dont hate yourself for feeling down, must be something in the air in january , i feel like this every year, its just stopping and seeing yourself in rut and feeling powerless about changing it all and facing into new year does that to you,

chin up man,
you are 100% not alone

Annasopra

I completely understand where you are coming from!

I'm in kind of the same position as you - I've never really had a proper boyfriend, am very very shy and socially awkward with new people and sometimes find it so difficult to talk to people I don't know very well - I have interests that I'm reluctant to discuss on dates because I find that they bore others - however I have in lots of ways tried to change things positively over the years - I enjoyed the scene and still do now and again but never particularly felt that being a scene regular was for me - so I set up an LGBT social group in my home town - There are approximately 25 members in the group - I have learned a lot from the experience - working with others, how to build up such groups, where to get funding - how to work with difficult people - Its not necessarily how I imagined it but it has widened my social circles and given me a bit more confidence in myself.

I often go what you are going through - loneliness, sick of being single, finding it difficult to meet people - The ironic thing is I give people like you and others advice all the time on here and elsewhere I just don't know how to follow the advice sometimes myself

Lastly I don't think Azezil was being spiteful just very blunt!

ongarboy

Hi Paddy C. I'm sorry to hear you are going through a difficult time right now. I just want to say that you post a lot on the LGBT forum and you always come across as a really lovely genuine guy. Your personality does come out in your thoughts, opinions and comments and I don't get any negative vibe from it. Therefore, I would strongly recommend you don't try and "change" yourself to be what you think others might find more appealing. You may carry such an act for a while but it would not last.

Secondly, someone posted above that perhaps you should focus on trying to make friends, yes just friends and not try and seek out a partner for now. Establishing a circle of friends, or even just one friend will help you not to feel so isolated. With that friend or friends, you can then start engaging in activities that diminish that feeling of loneliness. Through those social activities, it may or may not down the line lead to opportunities for meeting that special someone. But meeting Mr Right is something you have to let happen if it is going to and not try to orchestrate or overly focus on trying to make happen yourself.

You say you can't stand the scene. I don't know whether you have had past bad experiences on the scene that makes you come to that conclusion. You may not be into bars or having a pint but gay bars are social outlets for gay people and are not all full of self absorbed blokes looking for shags - sure there might be a fair number of them but there are a lot of decent guys too. I know the scene only exists in the larger cities which by the sounds of your post might be far away for dropping in after work for a quiet pint when it's not too busy. That is often the way you can strike up a conversation with a complete stranger at the bar and establish social connections. Sure, you will win some and lose some, come across a fair number of bad eggs but I assure you, they are not all bad. I met my best friend over a pint 8 years ago. We now socialise on a weekly basis and go on at least one foreign holiday a year. I met my partner and love of my life 6 years ago in a club on the stairs on a night out by myself. I was introduced to him by someone who I randomly met for the first time a few minutes before. It was pure chance and I hadn't set out to meet someone that night and that's how it happened. It's one of those chance things. I had been out dozens of times before that and either met no-one,had one night stands, two night stands, or had fantastic conversations with bar staff. I didn't crawl back into my shell permanently those times I met no-one. I kept going out just to meet new people but at the same time I did not go out with a specific agenda to meet Mr Right. I tried to take the attitude of I may be lucky to meet a nice friend and if I don't, not to get disheartened. I'm quite shy too so it wouldn't have always been easy but I gradually built up a small circle of friends so going out become fun just for hanging out with my mates and no disappointment if I didn't meet anyone. Of course now when I go out, it's mostly with my partner or mates but still have fun and enjoy the eye candy!!

Sorry for rambling on but I'll just finish by asking, would you be brave enough to maybe move to a bigger city or abroad for a while? It could help you broaden your horizons, live in a place where there is a larger gay community and social options. You seem unhappy about your current living situation/town as well as being lonely and I think it's as important to make a change in those situations as well. I understand it's difficult with a recession but even trying somewhere like Dublin or London for a few months to see what it's like and find a new job which in turn lead to new social opportunities. Would you be losing out too much if you left a town that you are currently unhappy? Best of luck

dominiquecruz

This might come across a tad abrasive, but you really need to adjust your attitude. If you continue living under the mistaken impression that life owes you something, you're in for some very harsh surprises.

If you're not happy with things, change them. I don't mean yourself or your personality, I mean your situation. ****ty, narrow-minded town? Get out. 'OK' job? Find something new. I dont buy that none of this is an option; make it an option. Maybe you're just too comfortable to challenge yourself? Life is going to pass you by as you sit around waiting for this abstract concept of happiness to arrive.

You're certainly not too 'individual'. Or rather, everybody is. I would hazard a guess that your major problem is your insecurity; stop worrying that your sense of humour doesnt cater to a certain standard.. stop trying to convince yourself that you're too quirky or out-there to ever be compatible with anybody.. you are who you are for a variety of different reasons, learn to appreciate that. Its an age-old cliche, but you're never really going to be happy with anybody else unless you're happy with yourself. I'm grossly awkward in social situations, but who cares? Its just another thing about me.

You seem to be very defeatist - like every problem you have is absolutely irresolvable. Its not. You're only 26, your whole life is ahead of you.

(also, its hugely unfair, and frankly untrue, to say gay men expect you to whore yourself around. most, i would imagine, find that idea pretty repugnant)

lostwallet

Paddy C wrote: »

Could you elaborate further on this please? What exactly do you mean? What sense of humour do you think I have and what in my OP made you think that?

Paddy C wrote: »

and feel like I have to vent this or I'm going to throw something against the wall, preferably this bloody computer which never works properly anyway

Thought that was quite funny along with the description you gave of where your living - having never liked Tommy Tiernan my credentials in this regard are sound.

Like other posters have said you sound like good guy. You deserve a good turn and for that reason i reckon things will work out for you. Keep at it.

Doop

Paddy, we all have those days, try not to wallow, (not saying you are), get out an go for a walk and get some fresh air into you. When your feeling more upbeat have a think about what your doing work wise, and living wise. Where do you want to be a year from now? same job, same town?
You cant plan for the boyfriend part, but deal with what is in your control.
You could maybe see a career counciler, if you're struggling with what you want to do, sounds like a school thing but there is guidance for older people too.

Or maybe even just some regular counseling if you feel you have some issues to work through. Chin up, it can only get better!

Aard

OP:

1) It's obvious that you're having a crap night and aren't likely to be diplomatic in anything you say about your town, your job, or your potential boyfriends. I don't get why people are assuming you're like this 100% of the time.

2) Apart from the provincial town, your story sounds a lot like mine: your sense of humour, shyness, awkwardness, lack of interest in the standard gay fare. This isn't intended to rub it in, but despite all that I've managed to be in a relationship for over three years. TV (easy target) will tell you otherwise, but not everybody wants perfection. Usually a little confidence, some effort put into how you dress, a smile, and something to say will go a long way. I'm pretty sure I'm offputting to most people, but I get along great with the handful who can actually stand me.

3) I really don't think you need to change much other than this: "the aforementioned socially awkward shyness being part of the reason why I probably wouldn't go". Find a way to get over not going to things. Put it this way, if each person in the world has only one "soulmate", you're far more likely to find him if you introduce yourself to 10 new people per month instead of 1. "Scanning" the world (I hope you understand what I mean, because I used to do a lot of this) will just lead you to mental monologue, and ultimately rejection of the "scanee". Talking to him, even if you think you probably won't like him, will at least give you practice for when you meet somebody you really like.

Beruthiel

azezil wrote: »

Yeah maybe you will end up alone but you'll only have yourself to blame for that, after all, clearly everyone else is wrong and you're the only one whose right :rolleyes:

Harsh, but true in so far as, you are the commander of your own ship.
You are in control of your own life.
You have the power within you to change whatever you don't like about your life, and if you don't, then you are just self fulfilling your own prophecy.

Paddy C wrote:

I've been living like this for years and as a 26 year old with no 'life' to speak of I just find myself getting more and more depressed every day

So what are you going to do about it?
That's a serious question.
You get to live once, then you're dead. It is up to you what happens during that time you have here on earth.
Don't like your job, find a new one.
Don't like where you live, move.
From your comments in the OP, you come across as a 'glass is half empty' kind of guy, instead of a 'glass is half full' kind of one.
Life is short Paddy, grab it by the balls.

Rick_

To all the comments, thank you. Positive or not they are appreciated.

In regards to some of the points mentioned by quite a few, I will elaborate on them:

My job - A moderately skilled office job that pays quite well. I certainly wouldn't have the required skills to get another job in this town that pays so well as this. If I was to go to another area for work, that is additional expenditure which I don't have spare funds to cover. As it is I spend over 1/2 of my pay per month on paying bills. Another chunk then has to go towards household needs, and most recently my car needed extensive repairs so that wiped out any spare cash I had put aside. The only other option (and is what I would like to do the most) is go back to education and get a qualification in something. Only that requires money too for fees / travel etc. and like I said, I haven't got much of that spare. Also, if I left my job to go to education, how am I going to pay my bills? As much as I'd like them to disappear, they won't!

I would love to go to uni and get the whole Uni experience as I feel that I did miss out on a major part of my life by not going and if I had have went instead of leaving education at 17 my life would be totally different now. It's amazing to think how one small event in your life can totally change the course of it. For me, it was letting some bullies at school make me feel so bad I left education so I wouldn't have to see them again. I was too scared to let anyone else know what was going on. If I'd have stayed on one more year I'd have some better qualifictions as standard without even having gone to University but I would have anyway after that. Live and learn I suppose.

My area - Typical small town with the small minded people to match. No diversity, nothing to do, not many jobs and those that are here aren't the amazingly skilled type either, but plenty of pubs though all filled with the usual type of older drunks and younger fellas who are your usual tramp types who think they own the place and are the toughest men to walk the earth since Schwarzenegger.

I would love to move to a new area, but for a shy/awkward person it is of course expected that this idea is met with some trepidation. My financial situation I feel is the only thing holding me back from taking a real go at it as I wouldn't have the money to pay for accomodation right away in a new area and would also need to have a job ready and waiting for me when I get there and if the jobs in an area outside of reasonable distance I'm going to have to miss days off work to attend an interview, travel there and back. Benefits wouldn't cover what I have to pay a month so a job is essential.

I know I do come across sometimes as a negative person, but I honestly do try to be upbeat. Last night was a bit of a low point for me, a few other things in my life had been on my mind and coupled with the strange rejection I received it just delivered a killer blow and I hit rock bottom. I haven't had the best of luck with guys recently and I just let it all get on top of me. Rest assures I am feeling a bit better today.

stephen_n

Paddy C wrote: »

To all the comments, thank you. Positive or not they are appreciated.

In regards to some of the points mentioned by quite a few, I will elaborate on them:

My job - A moderately skilled office job that pays quite well. I certainly wouldn't have the required skills to get another job in this town that pays so well as this. If I was to go to another area for work, that is additional expenditure which I don't have spare funds to cover. As it is I spend over 1/2 of my pay per month on paying bills. Another chunk then has to go towards household needs, and most recently my car needed extensive repairs so that wiped out any spare cash I had put aside. The only other option (and is what I would like to do the most) is go back to education and get a qualification in something. Only that requires money too for fees / travel etc. and like I said, I haven't got much of that spare. Also, if I left my job to go to education, how am I going to pay my bills? As much as I'd like them to disappear, they won't!

I would love to go to uni and get the whole Uni experience as I feel that I did miss out on a major part of my life by not going and if I had have went instead of leaving education at 17 my life would be totally different now. It's amazing to think how one small event in your life can totally change the course of it. For me, it was letting some bullies at school make me feel so bad I left education so I wouldn't have to see them again. I was too scared to let anyone else know what was going on. If I'd have stayed on one more year I'd have some better qualifictions as standard without even having gone to University but I would have anyway after that. Live and learn I suppose.

My area - Typical small town with the small minded people to match. No diversity, nothing to do, not many jobs and those that are here aren't the amazingly skilled type either, but plenty of pubs though all filled with the usual type of older drunks and younger fellas who are your usual tramp types who think they own the place and are the toughest men to walk the earth since Schwarzenegger.

I would love to move to a new area, but for a shy/awkward person it is of course expected that this idea is met with some trepidation. My financial situation I feel is the only thing holding me back from taking a real go at it as I wouldn't have the money to pay for accomodation right away in a new area and would also need to have a job ready and waiting for me when I get there and if the jobs in an area outside of reasonable distance I'm going to have to miss days off work to attend an interview, travel there and back. Benefits wouldn't cover what I have to pay a month so a job is essential.

I know I do come across sometimes as a negative person, but I honestly do try to be upbeat. Last night was a bit of a low point for me, a few other things in my life had been on my mind and coupled with the strange rejection I received it just delivered a killer blow and I hit rock bottom. I haven't had the best of luck with guys recently and I just let it all get on top of me. Rest assures I am feeling a bit better today.

Job, money isn't everything

College, never to late. I left school at 15 went back to college at 36 and am 2 and a half years into my degree, while working full time and being a parent to my kids. So it's never too late you just have to want it enough and be prepared to work for it.

Your area can always be changed, accommodation could be a house share but firstly you would need to find a job in the area you want to move in. Looking at the bigger picture makes change seem impossible, break it down into managable tasks and put them in an order that best suits your goals.

Finally the relationship issue, from what you have posted here and previously I think your expectations of what a relationship will bring, would kill it before it ever had a chance to take off. Sort the other stuff in your life find your own happieness and you will be a very attractive prospect.

rochey84

Hi Paddy,

First thing I'm gonna say is I'm not blaming you but what I say may sound harsh. I joined boards mainly because I read your original post and felt that we could be friends, there were a few pm's, added you on MSN, and facebook but then you just stopped talking to me I understand that friendship is a two way street but it was like once all that was done it was up to me to maintain the new friendship, and I'm not being bad but without a bit of effort from both parties a friendship esp a new friendship won't work, it was like you gave up on it before it had a chance.

You're a nice intelligent bloke but you do seem to have a defeatist attitude, you speak in negeative terms a lot, I don't know if it is an option but maybe you could move back in with your parents to save so you could return to Uni or move to a more metropolition area? I know thats a big ask but it could be something worth thinking about, short term pain for potential long term happiness?

Also in reading your posts on here although you do seem like a lovely friendly guy, I think you might benefit greatly from speaking to a counsellor, I know there is stigma attached to that statement but speaking to a counsellor is just the same as speaking to a friend, they will NEVER betray your trust and you can tell them anything and everything and might find that getting to the underlying issues, ie your experience of being bullied at school still seems to "haunt" you might help you deal with them and get some closure.

There is a sense in your post that everything else is to blame for your sittuation, you're not stuck in that town it isn't its fault you live there, you aren't stuck in your job you're free to leave whenever you want (within reason) you aren't stuck paying such high bills, move to cheaper accomodation or even move home, your car needed extensive repairs, it's not the car's fault you chose to repair it. I'm not blaming you either but I'm sayin stop looking at the world in a negetive light. Not everyone is out to get you, or just sleep with you once and then tell ya to get the boat. If you're shy Paddy the best advice I can give you on that is face it don't give in to it. I was shy once and then I just constantly put myself in positions where it was do or die, (or talk or be shy to be more exact) since I did that I've been on National TV once and Dublin Radio more times than I'd like to remember although I'm sure some of my friends could remind me ha ha!!!

Paddy unlike everyone else I'm not gonna tell you to keep your chin up, I'm gonna tell you to lift your chin up be who you are, and if ppl can't deal with that, thats their problem but don't anticipate problems before you encounter them. I'm not say fail to prepare but expect sucess.!!!!!

Best of luck mate, might catch ya on FB or MSN!

Beruthiel

rochey84, you said what I was trying to say so much better!

If you're shy Paddy the best advice I can give you on that is face it don't give in to it. I was shy once and then I just constantly put myself in positions where it was do or die

Yup.
Once upon a time, way back in the day when I was a young un, I was also dreadfully shy, no confidence and a total lack of belief in myself.
Taking yourself out of your comfort zone, putting yourself in situations that will drag you out of yourself is the only way to go.
Realising that it won't kill you to do this is paramount.
Understanding that it really doesn't matter what others think of your opinion makes a big difference.
Remember, everyone has an opinion, we are not all going to agree with it. Knowing it doesn't matter what others think of you.
Not everyone is going to like me. That's ok. I am surrounded with people I know love me.
You don't need the world to care about you, just the people you surround yourself with.

Rick_

I'm actually enjoying (a lot more than I thought I would) hearing all the negative stuff being told to me, helps me identify the areas in which I need to work on, so thanks for all of this feedback. It really is helping.

On the plus side reading from a few of the posts in the thread that I'm considered to be a nice / intelligent / friendly guy etc has put a smile on my face. I wasn't fishing for compliments in this thread but certainly is nice to receive them unexpectedly. Thank you.

Endymion

You talked about being too much of an individual and you seem to expect likely partners to accept that. Everyone is "Individual", what's required is a willingness to compromise in order to make things work with someone else. I'm an absolute bull dog in day to day life, I can be brass and abrasive. I wouldn't last five minutes in a relationship if that's how I behaved with my partner. I respect that you have your ways of doing things, and looking at the world, but frankly your way has lead you to being miserable.

You have a defeatist and negative attitude. You may be a lovely, pleasant guy, but those attitudes are infectious and most people try to avoid them. You can't be told to have a brighter disposition, you need to create things to live for and look forward to. You've mentioned being "stuck" in a ****ty town, but you have a car, I'm sure you're no more than 50 minutes away from one of Galway, Cork, Limerick, Belfast, or Dublin. If you don't like you job, upskill, take on a part time night course. Two/Three years time you can have the skill you feel you need for the job you want.

Unfortunately all this takes work, and misery can be very attractive. You simply need things to live for in life, and then the rest, (Friends and lovers will come). Look at it this way, what are you waiting for, things to magically be better a year from now. You, yourself, need to take immediate action.

DS333

Having read a number of comments about being stuck in a rut and having no way out, it just struck me that the following might help.

It's a book called "The Artist's Way" by Julia Cameron. It's a twelve-step programme to help you unearth your creative self. And it does work. But you must follow the steps, no matter how childish they seem.

Plus, it works in many surprising ways. A friend of mine did it. She was a vet and now is an opera singer. I know of a lawyer in New York who became a singer/composer, an accountant who became a poet. They are all earning enough to give up their day jobs. Although I'm an artist already, I did it 10 years ago and it was the impetus to make me come out. I recommended it to a cousin who was having problems in her marriage. Both she and her husband did it and now are very happy together.

Who knows what it might lead to.

BUT

You must do exactly as she says. Otherwise you're wasting your time. The exercises take about 30 minutes a day.

I don't know a soul it didn't help in some way. The possibilities are endless.

The best of luck to anyone who takes the plunge.:)

As the saying goes... Dare to fail. You can't get wiser than that.

diddlybit

Social awkardness can be very endearing in a individual and it's a hell of a lot more attractive than arrogance. My girlfriend's a little geeky and it's her quirks, and what makes her different that what I adore the most. In regards to being different, cookie-cutter personalities don't do it for everyone.

In regards to the shyness, chronic shyness can take years to overcome and it never really goes away. In general, the anxiety inspred by social interactions, seems a lot worse in the head of a shy person than what is actually happening in reality. I say something and then immediately think "God, why did I say that, I sound like an idiot, they now think I'm an idiot." The listener simply hears the second half of the conversation.

My only advice is if stuck in a rut, is to do something that scares you and break out of your comfort zone. And hey, if it doesn't work out, you tried, and the next time won't seem as scary.

Monkey61

Hey Paddy,

If I remember correctly I posted on your similar thread about 2 years ago. At the time I had just gotten out of a long term relationship and had realised that if I ever wanted to meet anyone again I was going to have to put myself out there and make things happen.

When I lived in Ireland I sort of had the same defeatist attitude when I came to meeting people - never had any desire to go out on the "scene" and resigned myself to the fact that I would never meet anyone like me...and truth be told, had I stayed in Dublin I probably wouldn't have.

So 2 years ago, I had moved to London and I had somehow, through the magic of the internet, lined up 3 dates in a week - something I never would have been able to do before! So I went on them, and I had fun. The very first girl I went on a date with, while nothing romantic came of it, introduced me to loads of her friends - and we all live together now! Next couple of dates were fun. Then I met a girl that I went out with for a year. And then, unexpectedly, I found love - have been with my girlfriend for more than a year, ridiculously in love, want to get married one day etc. Honestly feel like we are meant to be - and I would never, ever in a million years have met her had I not moved and thrown myself out into the world.

Aside from finding love, what all of those dates taught me - was that it was okay to be gay. I wasn't different or weird or on my own. I met all these amazing girls who were nothing like the stereotypes that I had imagined, they were like me.

So my advice is the same as it was 2 years ago Paddy - move! If you want to change your life and meet people, just do it. Yeah it is terrifying, but my God it could make you happier than you have ever realised. Maybe a small step first, move to the UK, pick a big city, get your CV on a few websites, take holiday from your job and go to some interviews, even for jobs in retail, restaurants or something new that will enable you to make the move. Then you can work on finding your perfect job. Like has been said already, you only get one life, so why waste it by sitting around and wishing that it was different?

Beruthiel

Monkey61 wrote: »

move to the UK, pick a big city, get your CV on a few websites, take holiday from your job and go to some interviews, even for jobs in retail, restaurants or something new that will enable you to make the move.

Great advice and something anybody can do!

DS333

I was painfully shy when I was young, but in my teens it struck me that I was judging everyone without giving them a chance. So, I forced myself to talk to people, only to discover that the vast majority of people are decent and friendly. Even those who appeared somewhat hostile at first were won over with a little perseverence.

I have just started a book called "The Velvet Rage" by Alan Downs. It shows how growing up gay in a straight world affects our image of ourselves and our outlook on life, and he tells us how we can rectify the situation. It's well worth a read.

Quentinkrisp

Don't worry Paddy C, there's plenty of other people who've felt exactly like what you're feeling now, don't worry you're not alone.
tbh being gay is not about casual one nighters and throwaway drunken snogs in dark nightclubs, there's a more constructve side to it:)
check this out for example:http://www.queerid.com/gay-ireland-directory/sports-clubs-.aspx

Fair enough if you don't like the self-whoring that you see on the scene (much like any other setting). i know i don't and believe me there's nothing cool about picking up std's.at all.

I say be who you are OP, It's all you can be:)

(although try to take a tougher stance with the freeloaders!:D)

Rick_

OK, an old thread but I thought I'd do a follow up. I am still in the same job/area problem, but in the last few weeks I have pushed myself out a bit more and ended up going on a date with a lovely guy. It's going well between us (fingers crossed) and I have even ventured out onto the scene and it was nowhere near as bad as I was expecting.

So, anyone in the same position, my advice is to just get out there and do something about it. The longer you stay in and don't, the longer you are prolonging your own misery. You only have one life, go live it!

Conor30

Paddy C wrote: »

OK, an old thread but I thought I'd do a follow up. I am still in the same job/area problem, but in the last few weeks I have pushed myself out a bit more and ended up going on a date with a lovely guy. It's going well between us (fingers crossed) and I have even ventured out onto the scene and it was nowhere near as bad as I was expecting.

So, anyone in the same position, my advice is to just get out there and do something about it. The longer you stay in and don't, the longer you are prolonging your own misery. You only have one life, go live it!

Great to hear it Paddy! I was about to suggest that you come to the next LGBT Boards meet that are usually held in a straight pub in Dublin. (I don't know how far from Dublin you live). Great to hear you've recently met a nice guy and have ventured onto the scene a bit too.

Rick_

I'm in Armagh so about 80 odd miles away from Dublin!

I'm slowly but surely getting myself out there more. Whether it works out with this guy or not (and hopefully it does!), I think a repeat visit to the gay club we went to may be in order, hard to resist £20 entrance fee and then free, unlimited drinks all night!

gcgirl

Paddy C wrote: »

I'm in Armagh so about 80 odd miles away from Dublin!

I'm slowly but surely getting myself out there more. Whether it works out with this guy or not (and hopefully it does!), I think a repeat visit to the gay club we went to may be in order, hard to resist £20 entrance fee and then free, unlimited drinks all night!

Belfast ?

Rick_

Yeah, the Kremlin I think it was called. I'd heard horror stories from many but upon first hand experience, it wasn't that bad. Maybe I was lucky, or they were unlucky on certain nights?

TylerIE

Paddy C wrote: »

Yeah, the Kremlin I think it was called. I'd heard horror stories from many but upon first hand experience, it wasn't that bad. Maybe I was lucky, or they were unlucky on certain nights?

Just see your original post and the update. Cheers for coming back.

Im from near enough Armagh and TBH I used to feel there was a more liberal approach to LGBT issues in the North. I recognize now that its probably similar to the south than I realized, but its definitely not Texan style conservative.

Glad you liked the Krem, there is a lot of people from Newry & Armagh city who go there on a weekly basis. I heard mixed reports on it too, but found the crowd really friendly and the atmosphere pretty relaxed. I too had heard awful things about "the scene" in general from some people, but like everything its what you make of it... The stuff that people are critical of in gay clubs (e.g. drunken forceful older people, people not taking no for an answer, and excessive public activities) are the exact same as what happens inside (and at the back of) straight clubs throughout the country....

There was a recent Dundalk Pride and Newry Pride. I dont know if Armagh city had any events. The Dundalk and Newry prides were well attended, by people in the 17 - 40 age range, and one of the political parties in the North has a VERY active & friendly LGBT group.

Rick_

The only negative things I seen in the Kremlin were a younger drunken guy who was trying it on with anyone and everyone he could, including the guy I was there on a date with! Wasn't impressed but was told afterwards that he is a regular there and that's all he does and most people have the sense to ignore him. Another guy there was being rude at the bar and pushing in front of some girls who wern't having any of it and he got angry but the bar staff seen this and had him quickly removed from the premises. Everything else was fine, including the unisex toilets which was a bit of a weird experience the first time I went in!

No, Armagh doesn't have any pride marches or anything like that. From what I know from talking to other people it wuld appear the Nationalist parties are very friendly and active with the LGBT community whereas the Unionist ones are quite opposed and vocally so in many cases.

TylerIE

Paddy C wrote: »

The only negative things I seen in the Kremlin were a younger drunken guy who was trying it on with anyone and everyone he could, including the guy I was there on a date with! Wasn't impressed but was told afterwards that he is a regular there and that's all he does and most people have the sense to ignore him. Another guy there was being rude at the bar and pushing in front of some girls who wern't having any of it and he got angry but the bar staff seen this and had him quickly removed from the premises. Everything else was fine, including the unisex toilets which was a bit of a weird experience the first time I went in!

No, Armagh doesn't have any pride marches or anything like that. From what I know from talking to other people it wuld appear the Nationalist parties are very friendly and active with the LGBT community whereas the Unionist ones are quite opposed and vocally so in many cases.

Ye the toilets are a bit odd. I think the pushing at the bar is a £20 night thing cause everybody wants drink. The other nights I went the bar was much calmer. Ye its a Nationalist Party I was thinking of. Two of the Unionist elements couldnt be more anti...

There is a group in Newry, its not that far from Armagh city! It mightnt be great long term but could help ease you into being a bit more comfortable with meeting people and having some friends who happen to be gay... They appear to have drop in evenings also...

Rick_

Yes, I have seen that groups website before and was considering going to the drop in centre some night to see how it goes. Have you been to it before? What's it like and what sort of things do they do on the drop in nights?

Seeing as my closest friend is heading to university in London next week I will have a lot more time on my own as he was really the only person I would have seen nearly every day and hung around with, so I'm on the look out for some new friends, gay or straight!

TylerIE

Paddy C wrote: »

Yes, I have seen that groups website before and was considering going to the drop in centre some night to see how it goes. Have you been to it before? What's it like and what sort of things do they do on the drop in nights?

Seeing as my closest friend is heading to university in London next week I will have a lot more time on my own as he was really the only person I would have seen nearly every day and hung around with, so I'm on the look out for some new friends, gay or straight!

Na Ive never been. It was mentioned to me by someone at another event just, when they were aware I was originally from that area.

Maybe someone else would have an idea but the drop-in evenings in Dublin are pretty much that. In Outhouse I believe ya just drop in and can have a tea/coffee/soft drink, do a bit of reading or whatever, and there will be other people there doing the same. Ya can talk to each other or ignore each other. I know some of the people in the Dublin group always welcome new visitors, and [using a positive stereotype] Im sure the same could be said for Newry. The people who were telling me about it were absolute gents.

Even if ya dont like it, it can be a stepping stone to getting a bit more comfortable with being around gay people, going into a gay venue, understanding and getting over any personal prejudices etc... Do you have any straight or gay friends/acquaintances who ya think would be interested in going?

Rick_

To be honest, I don't have a problem being around gays or going into a gay venue as I've done that, but it's more just a place I could meet like-minded people without banging music in the background and try to get to know them and forge friendships with them. You can do that in a nightclub with all the noise and alcohol distracting you.

I have a even decreasing number of friends I see on a regular basis that I can do anything with. Not because we are falling out, but because they are either moving away for uni, are in relationships and are very hard to get out of their own little worlds they are now in or work awkward hours which make going there with them impossible. I honestly wouldn't mind going there on my own, it's just finding what to say to people when you first meet them and try to avoid uncomfortable silences. I'd also be mortified if someone came over with a pick-up line or something as I'd certainly not be there to try and hook up, even if I was completely single, it's friendship only I'm after and if something develops from that, then great. If not, then at least I have a new friend.

easychair

I've heard it said that a man who knows what he wants will usually find it, and a man who doesn't know what he wants will find that also.

Curiously, I know a few couples now who have met on Gaydar, both male and female couples. They say the trick is not to chat with the chat facility there, which they say is designed to more or less encourage both parties to find fault, but to send messages to likely profiles and meet for a coffee. Evidently, gaydar has become less and less useful to find casual sex, with the crusing room inhabited mainly by guys who sit there for hours copy and pasting the same lines pretending they want to meet.

TylerIE

Paddy C wrote: »

I have a even decreasing number of friends I see on a regular basis that I can do anything with. Not because we are falling out, but because they are either moving away for uni, are in relationships and are very hard to get out of their own little worlds they are now in or work awkward hours which make going there with them impossible. I honestly wouldn't mind going there on my own, it's just finding what to say to people when you first meet them and try to avoid uncomfortable silences. I'd also be mortified if someone came over with a pick-up line or something as I'd certainly not be there to try and hook up, even if I was completely single, it's friendship only I'm after and if something develops from that, then great. If not, then at least I have a new friend.

A lot of the people there may be in a similar position with regards to being shy, etc. Other people here have complimented your personality, and in my limited experience of what Outhouse's drop in evenings are like, a good personality is always welcome.

My knowledge of Outhouse's social evenings is unfortunately mainly second hand from an [older] acquaintance, but the evenings are more of a social club for those who want to chat with other men / women, who happen to be gay.

A lot of the people who attend the Friday evenings in Outhouse would be older and single and just enjoy company. There would be a lot of youths who regularly attend and hang around during the week who either were in the seperate youth Service (BeLonGTo) and are now older or want a safe space to hang around with other LGBT youth... It doesnt serve as a "pick-up" joint, although I do know some people have went on dates with people who they met there and got on with.

If there are a few people there you neednt worry about awkward silences as a group will keep talking. If its only you and one or two others and you are talking to them they will probably be so interested in the newbie that there wont be time for silence. If not then ya can just entertain yourself with coffee, read a magazine and leave. Id say its sometimes easier to blend in and out of a drop-in centre than a club!