Puppy coat

tribalwings

I have 2 cocker spaniels ages 3 and 4. We got them neutered when they were both 6mths but since then their coats have just turned to pure fluff. Its a nightmare to try and brush them.
The groomers just tell us we're better getting them shaved each time. Poor dogs come back like skinned rabbitts.
I was just wondering is there any advise anyone can give us or is it a lost cause ?

**Vai**

Havent used it myself but alot of people here seem to like the furminator.

http://www.zooplus.ie/shop/dogs/dog_grooming_care/grooming_tools/179064

tribalwings

That sounds like a good idea alright but that wouldn't really sort the coat thats just fluff, would it ?

tk123

Have you tried a different groomer OP?

shinikins

I've come across a few groomers who have this opinion-i'd hazard that they are recommending that course as cockers are difficult to groom.

The furminator is very good, also you might try a grooming glove, mine loves it as its not as like a brush or comb, and seems to be very soothing to her.

Spaying/neutering does not neccesarily result in a fuzzy coat(bit of a myth IMO). As a matter of interest, did you pull their puppy coats? Cockers coats become fuzzy at around 6-12 months and need to be pulled or hand stripped to remove the light fluffy hair. Its pretty simple, just pull the fuzzy bits with your thumb and forefinger and it comes out in clumps naturally. Ours used to fight over who would be groomed first as they enjoyed it so much. Its much easier when their coat is a little longer but it can be done with a short coat, the grooming glove is great for this. Our Golden cocker will occasionally need her coat pulled and she's 13 now.

tribalwings

Yes tk123, tried different groomers. Think we might be changing again to see if it makes any difference. I'm not happy paying €45-50 for someone to shave them, I could do that myself.

shinikins: I've only been using one comb on them, it has 2 sides, one side the teeth are about 3mm apart, the other is about 5mm apart. Its probably the wrong thing altogether to be using. I think they had their coats pulled a long time ago at the groomers but when I brush them properly about once a week, I get a football sized ball of fluff off the golden cocker and about half that size off the black cocker.

I must invest in a few bits like that furminator and a grooming glove, see if it makes any difference

tk123

I have a furminator for our golden retriever OP and find it really good. He even likes it and prefers it to other brushes - he lies down for the furminator and runs off with the other brushes!!

tribalwings

Yeh tk123, the brush has the same effect on my dogs, once they see me with the brush in hand its a case of who can hide further under the table

zoby

Have you tried a slicker brush?

I have a furminator and although it is great at removing huge amounts of hair i find that it can leave the hair wispy.

The slicker brush takes longer but will remove the loose hair - just be sure that it isnt too hard by brushing your arm - if it hurts you it will hurt your dog


I have a Cavalier King Charles that was spayed at six months. Most of her coat is silky but her back legs are very woolly and thick. I have tried to use thinning scissors but this makes it worse so i just cut it shorter and use the slicker brush regularly.


I gave up on groomers having a bichon that was constantly either cut too short or left looking like a poodle :eek: I bought a wahl pet trimmer in Argos for €45 - it has several attachements so you can just trim rather than shave. But id say with the cockers if you (and them) get used to the slicker brush their coats would look great


Also to make grooming easier all round use treats! Its amazing how good they will be for something nice!!!

tribalwings

zoby: What do you mean by a slicker brush ?

zoby

http://www.about-cocker-spaniels.com/dog-grooming-tools.html#Slicker-Brush


this should explain better than i could

tribalwings

Thanks zoby, looks like I have a lot of shopping to do now. That link was very informative

carleigh

I've been grooming my Golden Cocker for years with the Slicker brush. He wasnt too keen on it as first, as like was previously said, if you press too hard it can hurt, but now he loves it and I make a game out of him getting brushed, he always knows he will get a treat if he lets me tidy him up! Its really good for the curly hair around the legs and belly, you just have to be nice and gentle. My dog gets groomed maybe 3 times a year as the slicker brush keeps him in such good nick, and its usually just a trim. Definitely worth it.

shinikins

tribalwings wrote: »

Yes tk123, tried different groomers. Think we might be changing again to see if it makes any difference. I'm not happy paying €45-50 for someone to shave them, I could do that myself.

shinikins: I've only been using one comb on them, it has 2 sides, one side the teeth are about 3mm apart, the other is about 5mm apart. Its probably the wrong thing altogether to be using. I think they had their coats pulled a long time ago at the groomers but when I brush them properly about once a week, I get a football sized ball of fluff off the golden cocker and about half that size off the black cocker.

I must invest in a few bits like that furminator and a grooming glove, see if it makes any difference

I doubt the groomer pulled their coats, it takes a good few hours to so it properly, about 3-4, and no groomer would do that for the price you've quoted. All cockers will shed constantly and golden more so than black/particolored. Golden cockers have hair like naturally blonde humans, its extremely fine but very dense, so there is going to be a lot of shedding, regardless of how long or short it is. My dog is currently favouring the convict look(she's clipped tight once a year) and there are still hairballs all over the house! Our black cocker was so much easier to keep groomed, she had very silky hair that was easy to groom, and she loved preening

Combs are great for the longer hair, like feathering on the back of the legs and ears(if they are not too curly), but you need a good brush for the body, a curry brush is ideal. The link zoby posted is a great resource, i recommend it all the time to other Cocker owners. If your dogs still have a short coat then the glove will work wonders without the need for other brushes and combs, but if they have longer hair, the furminator is great-just be careful the first few times you use it, it can hurt them if your rough.

Here's a video showing how to hand strip the coat. There's some related video's to the side that may help if you want to groom them yourself at home.

tribalwings

Thanks shinikins that links very useful. At the minute my 2 are like wooly sheep, badly in need of a grooming. That comb she uses in the link is what I've been using on them all the time

Cherry Blossom

Hi there,

I use the Mars coat king on my Westie pup who has very profuse fluffy hair, it's great for taking out matts as well as gets rid of all the wispy bits and dead hair, the theory is that it encourages the coarser hair to grow, it will be a few months yet though before the coarse coat is due to start comming through but I have come across one or two stray ones in there. From what I've read it's constant clipping that keeps the soft puppy coat and it will stay like that for as long as you keep having them clipped. I also use a long metal toothed comb on her and a slicker brush (by ancol) which is designed for cats works best after trying a few different ones, the one with the little plastic balls on the ends of the pins is useless :rolleyes:

If you like the look of the coat king I can advise on which one I have. I think the furminator is designed more for breeds that shed heavily or blow their coat.

tribalwings

adrenalinjunkie: Does the coat king not cut the hair aswell as getting rid of dead hair ?
I'd prefer if they weren't skinned but I don't hold much hope for their coats after the snow they got matted really badly. This comb thing I have mustn't be the right tool for the job

Cherry Blossom

It will cut through matts but you have to do it carefully and gently so as not to hurt the dog too much. If you use it correctly ie. follow the natural lay of the coat it does seem to pull out the whole hair as opposed to cutting it in that the hair that comes out on the tool is the full length of the hair (no short bits). My dog has a few short bits on top where it took me a while to learn to do it in layers rather than press it into the hair, you basically just let it rest on the dog and glide it downwards (no pressure at all). Where I can I use the long toothed comb to arrange the fur straight down on both sides with a sort of shed in the middle before I do it, if you go across the hair it will cut it as opposed to pull it out. If nothing is comming out it means it isn't ready to come out, once every 2 weeks seems to work best as you get a bit out and it's easier to tell when to stop. If used every day I think you would tend to over use it and end up cutting the hair in an effort to get something to show for your efforts .

tribalwings

Yeh but is there any way of knowing whats the right option for the dog...
furminator
slicker brush
curry brush
coat king
????

Cherry Blossom

tribalwings wrote: »

Yeh but is there any way of knowing whats the right option for the dog...
furminator
slicker brush
curry brush
coat king
????

OP there is no one option that will work it's getting the right combination of tools for the job, the coat king is an alternative to the hand stripping in the video shinikins posted which cuts down the 'bulk' of the coats. I am assuming you are combing the dogs through on a daily basis? You need to deal with the matts as they occur and if the dogs are groomed properly every single day you shouldn't have a mass of matts. Growing the full coat requires time, effort and patience and you have to stick with it.

Also just another tip, dog coats with splashguards are a godsend, I couldn't survive without them

zoby

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

Also just another tip, dog coats with splashguards are a godsend, I couldn't survive without them

Ooooohhh sounds great where did you get theese? I have two very filthy dogs this morning from all the grit that is left on the footpaths since the snow

ppink

One of my dogs is also a ball of fluff and coincidentally it turned that way after he was neutered. I have all the brushes and rakes and gadgets. what i find is every week there will be mats that I just have to cut out. I got a detangle spray for dogs too and that is actually good. it helps to brush it a bit better. I cant use the slicker on him as he is too sensitive for the one i have so I use a wire brush but it haas rubber bits on the ends of the wires like this http://www.petshoponline.ie/dog-brush-wood-double-sided-oval.
The furminator is good for the denser areas and to get out the old coat underneath.

shinikins

OP, you need a variety of different brushes and combs-at last count i think have about 10, including a carding comb, a curry brush, wide tooth combs, furminator, bristle brush and grooming glove. At the moment i use the glove most-she's been recently clipped and its especially good at looseing and removing dead hair. A comb or brush would just be too hard on her skin because she's been clipped tight, but as soon as her feathers start showing again, the comb and brush will come out.

When her coat is longer then i tend to use the curry comb first, comb her feathers and ears, and chest, then finish with a bristle brush. She's not too curly any more, so doesn't tend to matt too much apart from her chest, but she's always been the type of dog to just lie back and snore while being pampered. I don't use the furminator too often nowadays-she's 13 now so maybe once or twice a year. I've always kept her paws clipped tight, for one reason she has the smelliest feet i have ever come across, and another we had a problem with her as a pup picking up squashed slugs in between the pads(yuck) so its easier to keep them tight clipped. One major benefit is that she drags in very little dirt and muck, and her paws dry off pretty quick.

tribalwings

Well thanks for all the good advise everyone. I need to invest in alot more equipment to groom the dogs.

Hows about a few pics to show off your fine examples of good grooming ???

tribalwings

Can a neutered cocker be hand striped ?
Or does it not make any difference

shinikins

Of course! Its just hair. How long is the coat as a matter of interest? If its long enough to curl your finger around then try hand stripping, but any shorter and you should stick to brushing.

The idea that neutering changes a dogs coat is just silly, hormones or lack thereof cannot change the shape of a hair follicle!

tribalwings

They got skinned the last grooming so its about 4"-5" long all over

shinikins

Well pull away so, just start slowly and remember they(and you)aren't used to it. One of my dogs was a little more sensitive/patient than the other and would only tolerate it for about 30-40 minutes at a time. After a while you'll really notice a difference in their coats, it'll sit much better and you'll find fewer snarls and matts(your never going to be able to get of them completely ) Combs are great but they tend to break dead hair, and it leaves the coat kind of fuzzy a rough looking, while the hand stripping pulls the dead hair from the root without hurting, so your left with a smooth coat. I find its pretty therapeutic for me too, very calming. I'll sit on the floor and groom the dog for ages(or until my ass gets numb lol), and its a good bonding experience with her.

tribalwings

And how often does the coat have to be striped ?

shinikins

Depends on the dog, on average they moult badly once a year, my golden cocker gets the fuzzies in spring, so i spend a little more time on her coat then, and the rest of the year its just general grooming. She has a coarser coat too, and as she's gotten older there's more grey so the texture has changed, but strangely she always had straigh coat with very little curls apart from her tail. She still gets the fuzzies on her haunches and some on her chest, but its no big deal to clear.
My black cocker(who very sadly is gone now) had a very smooeth soft coat, but had loads of curls, especially her feathers and ears, and needed much more general grooming, but rarely needed to be hand stripped as once it was done as a 6 month old that was pretty much it.

You'll find that once you clear them really well once, its just little patches that crop up.

tribalwings

Aw sorry to hear about your black cocker. We had to have our 1st cocker put down, long story, puppy farm, stupid us didn't know, learned from that. But our golden is just pure fluff and the black is more smooth and more wavy than curly

shinikins

Thanks Tribalwings, its been a few years now but i still miss her, she was my baby andshe was a beauty. She was pts as she was wasting away with secondary cancers, and we just couldn't let her suffer.

Our goldens coat is just the same-pure fluff if its left alone! Her coat is beginning to grow again, so at the moment she looks a little like a teddy bear. The trick is to stay on top of it. Most goldens are the same, as i said before its like a naturally blonde human, very fine but lots of it. The more grooming you give the coat the more easily maintained it will be. I know that sounds really ominous-like you'll be spending hours daily grooming them, but once you get all the knots out and the fluff sorted its really nothing more than a very quick brush daily. No more than you would do with your own hair really. When we had the two of them i would brush them as they sat waiting for their dinner, and once a week give them a good grooming and check for matts. Now that its just the one, and she's elderly, we keep her coat short as it was less stressful with her medical issues. But she still loves being pampered, and stroked with the grooming glove. Thats another reason i use the glove incidentaly, she equates it with affection and attention because its not really a brush so she really enjoys it and i mean really!!(ever see a dog groan with pleasure?-daily occurance in our household:P) The cat loves it too, so its hilarious watching the pair of them trying to muscle in on each other when the glove appears!

Oh, one thing i did find good for flyaway hair, when your done grooming her, rub a kitchen towel thats had a (very)little veg oil soaked into it over the coat, it keeps the hair under control, encourages the dog to self groom and its good for them too.

tribalwings

I think this time I'll have to concede to the short grooming beacuse their coats are heavily matted underneath and I don't have the right tools to deal with with. They just end up distressed when I try and tackle the mats with the comb I have.
So I am going to invest in the proper equipment and keep them right from now on.
I know grooming is primarily a female occupation but is there any particular reason not many blokes are doing it ????

shinikins

tribalwings wrote: »

I know grooming is primarily a female occupation but is there any particular reason not many blokes are doing it ????

Lol, never heard of that!! I was taught how to groom our pets from an early age by my father, and a professional groomer i would always recommend was male(retired now) Most of the hunters who bring their dogs into my practise have longer haired breeds and all of these dogs are immaculate.

Why not get the clipped short again and start with a fresh slate so to speak. Then you can get used to giving them a quick brush down every day and as their coats grow out start using combs and brushes on the longer areas. Like everything with dogs, its as much about training yourself to do something as it is about training the dog!

tribalwings

Yeah I think that might be the right thing to do alright. I must have a look around and see if theres any classes or courses that could help me along with the grooming side of things, haha could be the start of a new career