All these new signs

niloc1951

What's with the NRA or who ever is responsible for road signs.
There seems to be a campaign underway to plant thousands of new direction signs (which probably cost many thousands of Euro each to buy and have erected) at junctions where minor roads join our N and R roads.
All very well you might say, but surely erecting such signs like the ones I've seen on the N25 which only serve to tell locals joining the road from their grass in the middle boreen which way Cork and Waterford are is surely a pure wast of scarce money which would be better spent on fixing up the N25.
BTW the clowns who ordered, paid for and installed the signs don't seem to be able to get place names right either, Gortroe village has become Gortaroo and I'm told Cahir is now Caher :rolleyes:

ClareVisitor

When I was home over Christmas I noticed there are still signs directing you down the old N18 to Limerick where you should get onto the M18 motorway now. Not getting the new ones right and leaving the old ones in place isn't encouraging!

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

which probably cost many thousands of Euro each to buy and have erected

What's this based on?

niloc1951

etchyed wrote: »

What's this based on?

Cost of signs (design, manufacture and delivery)
Cost of sending a crew with machine and vehicles to dig the holes for the new polls
Cost of setting the new polls in delivered ready mixed concrete
Cost of crew returning after concrete has set to attach new signs
Cost of above crews enjoying multiple tea breaks and investigations of how the holes are progressing:)

Considering your local tradesman can charge over €100 for a call out and half an hours labour, a few thousand for the above would seem to be on the conservative side.

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

Cost of signs (design, manufacture and delivery)
Cost of sending a crew with machine and vehicles to dig the holes for the new polls
Cost of setting the new polls in delivered ready mixed concrete
Cost of crew returning after concrete has set to attach new signs
Cost of above crews enjoying multiple tea breaks and investigations of how the holes are progressing:)

Considering your local tradesman can charge over €100 for a call out and half an hours labour, a few thousand for the above would seem to be on the conservative side.

So, in other words, your own back of a fag packet calculation. I think it undermines your point to use hyperbole such as "clowns" and to surmise based on pretty much zero knowledge that each individual sign costs "many thousands of euro". I may have been willing to consider you had a point if you hadn't made it with an ill-informed rant.

Amtmann

The NRA are installing new signage all over the place at the moment. For the most part I welcome this.
I haven't a clue how much signage procurement and installation costs, but I have seen what looks like waste. On the N24 Cahir Bypass to M8 junction 10, signage that was installed only three years ago is now being replaced. Not only this, but the poles that hold the current signage are also being replaced, sometimes with what look like identical poles just 100cm in front of the old poles.

niloc1951

etchyed wrote: »

So, in other words, your own back of a fag packet calculation. I think it undermines your point to use hyperbole such as "clowns" and to surmise based on pretty much zero knowledge that each individual sign costs "many thousands of euro". I may have been willing to consider you had a point if you hadn't made it with an ill-informed rant.

My apologies if you think I am just having an ill-informed rant.
But, how about giving the tread your informed opinion on the subject, y'know why not shoot the message instead of the messenger.

serfboard

Furet wrote: »

The NRA are installing new signage all over the place at the moment. For the most part I welcome this.

I do too. While signage in this country has improved greatly in the last few years, there is still a good way to go. I was over in England there over the Christmas and the signage is very good. What I particularly like is the fact that areas of the cities are signed. We need more of that here.

As regards cost, well most of it is once off. It's not as if villages and towns are going to move in the next thousand years. However, I would somewhat agree with the original post in that you would wonder why they are doing it now, during a recession, as opposed to say, five years ago.

niloc1951

May I go back to my original point.
My post was to highlight and get some discussion on the value or otherwise concerning the erection of the large green direction signs on N routes which are being placed facing the end of by-roads and boreens, roads which only serve local residents and who are in no need of such signage since they have managed to find their local village or town quite well over the years without them.

marmurr1916

Believe it or not, delivery drivers and other visitors to these boreens can get lost without adequate signposting. People in Ireland have been complaining about the lack of decent signposting for decades. Now that we're finally getting decent signposting, people are still complaining...

GerardKeating

niloc1951 wrote: »

May I go back to my original point.
My post was to highlight and get some discussion on the value or otherwise concerning the erection of the large green direction signs on N routes which are being placed facing the end of by-roads and boreens, roads which only serve local residents and who are in no need of such signage since they have managed to find their local village or town quite well over the years without them.

And do these local resident never have visitors/deliveries?

I live at the end of an un-signposted boreen and would love some signs, so that I do not have to drive 2KM to a local landmark to guide visitors in.

loyatemu

Personally I'd like to see more signage maintenance - once a sign is erected, no-one seems to have responsibility for its upkeep and every road and street in the country is littered with signs that are

• broken
• bent
• pointing the wrong way
• fallen down the pole
• so filthy they are unreadable
• poles with no signs on them

NFD100

loyatemu wrote: »

Personally I'd like to see more signage maintenance - once a sign is erected, no-one seems to have responsibility for its upkeep and every road and street in the country is littered with signs that are

• broken
• bent
• pointing the wrong way
• fallen down the pole
• so filthy they are unreadable
• poles with no signs on them

+1. The signs are never maintained or cleaned. Also, what with the very Irish phenomenum of signs half way down poles on some roads? Are ladders not provided?

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

My apologies if you think I am just having an ill-informed rant.
But, how about giving the tread your informed opinion on the subject, y'know why not shoot the message instead of the messenger.

I would tend to agree that a lack of signage has been a problem on Irish roads for decades and saying "sure the locals know how to get around anyway" completely misses the point of having road signs in the first place - they're for those not familiar with an area.

That's my opinion, based on what I know, which, unlike you, I am prepared to admit is relatively little. Of course, everything we spend money on has costs and benefits and these have to be balanced against each other. So, hypothetically, if each set of signs at a T-junction cost a million euro it would be a no-brainer: we'd do without them. There has to exist a cut-off price at which it no longer makes sense to buy the signs. Of course, you'll never get everyone to agree on this. The truth is, nobody here knows how much the new signs cost, and by stating made up figures as fact ("many thousands of euro each"), you only serve to muddy the waters and hence lessen the quality of debate.

That's why it's important not to make up figures in your posts. I don't think I shot the messenger really, but I did tear into your posts, which was a perfectly valid thing to do, as they could never be viewed as the foundation for a fair discussion.

TouchingVirus

loyatemu wrote: »

Personally I'd like to see more signage maintenance - once a sign is erected, no-one seems to have responsibility for its upkeep and every road and street in the country is littered with signs that are

• broken
• bent
• pointing the wrong way
• fallen down the pole
• so filthy they are unreadable
• poles with no signs on them

A worthwhile endeavour if you ask me, don't forget to add signs obscured by hedge/tree growth to that list

serfboard

TouchingVirus wrote: »

don't forget to add signs obscured by hedge/tree growth to that list

+1. My particular bugbear.

SeanW

These signs will be very useful for locals in rural areas to direct delivery van drivers, friends and family, emergency vehicles etc to their houses. For that alone I give the new direction signs 2 thumbs up and reject the OPs completely and without reservation.

All that heavy gantry signage on the m-ways and dual carriageways, however, is another story.

Redsoxfan

SeanW wrote: »

All that heavy gantry signage on the m-ways and dual carriageways, however, is another story.

+1 to that.

tonc76

The gantry signs that are provided on motorways and dual carriageways are needed just as much as low level signage. I'm led to beileve that when the M7/M8 stretch of motorway was opened south of Portlaoise that the majority of phonecalls that the NRA received in the weeks after were from people that had missed the turn off for Cork! In order to do so you would have to drive past 2 verge mounted next exit signs, 3 portal gantries and a butterfly sign in the nosing at the split.

niloc1951

tonc76 wrote: »

The gantry signs that are provided on motorways and dual carriageways are needed just as much as low level signage. I'm led to beileve that when the M7/M8 stretch of motorway was opened south of Portlaoise that the majority of phonecalls that the NRA received in the weeks after were from people that had missed the turn off for Cork! In order to do so you would have to drive past 2 verge mounted next exit signs, 3 portal gantries and a butterfly sign in the nosing at the split.

:o:o I was one. TBH I was chatting to SWMBO and cruising along at a relaxed 110 km.p.h. and forgot I needed to leave the road I was on.
Realising I was in the wrong lane at the last minute I was able to retrieve the situation with the help of the ABS as there was no traffic close behind or inside me. Won't do it again though :eek::eek:.

Hopefully it was just a passing phase following the opening of junction, and we don't see a pile-up there some day with fatalities due to a sudden last minute maneuver by a driver who fails to check his mirrors first.

I know there is a lot of signage, but is there something wrong with it as quite a few drivers appear to have failed to respond to it , perhaps its the old proverb of not seeing the tree for the forrest :rolleyes:

tonc76

niloc1951 wrote: »

I know there is a lot of signage, but is there something wrong with it as quite a few drivers appear to have failed to respond to it , perhaps its the old proverb of not seeing the tree for the forrest :rolleyes:

There is nothing wrong with the signage. There are 6 signs in 4km indicating that motorists wishing to travel to Cork need to take the next exit. Its plausible that a motorist may miss one or even both verge mounted signs due to a truck travelling in the left lane but there's no excuse for missing 3 portal gantries that span the carriageway! The problem is down to people thinking they know the way and not looking at the signage! It happens all over the country on new alignments and not just at this junction.

niloc1951

tonc76 wrote: »

There is nothing wrong with the signage. There are 6 signs in 4km indicating that motorists wishing to travel to Cork need to take the next exit. Its plausible that a motorist may miss one or even both verge mounted signs due to a truck travelling in the left lane but there's no excuse for missing 3 portal gantries that span the carriageway! The problem is down to people thinking they know the way and not looking at the signage! It happens all over the country on new alignments and not just at this junction.

Didn't say there was something wrong, just posed the question. After all drivers ARE missing these junctions, as you say.
The reason needs to be understood and effective corrective measures taken (I don't know what they might be perhaps the 'experts' at the NRA or the RSA might), perhaps a reduced speed limit for a short distance before such features as I have sometimes seen on Mainland Europe.
As I have said, let's not have a multiple fatality at one of them before the 'experts' exercise their little grey cells 'outside the box'.

One point, motorists have become accustomed to out of date signage relating to long finished/extinct conditions. eg. oil spill, flooded road, road works ahead, new layout (Sarsfield Road Roundabout N25) etc. etc. etc. perhaps this phenomenon has devalued the currency of signage generally.
Just a thought.

whyulittle

What good would a reduced speed limit do? If they can't see great big blue signs telling them where to go, they're not going to see small speed signs.

Maybe they could just pay attention.

coolperson05

whyulittle wrote: »

What good would a reduced speed limit do? If they can't see great big blue signs telling them where to go, they're not going to see small speed signs.

Maybe they could just pay attention.

+1
People never miss the M7/M9 split. An exit is an exit.

Stonewolf

To be fair (and I haven't been on the M8 yet), the Cork signs can't be much worse than the old ones.

Cork
Porlaoise

Trick of the Tail

coolperson05 wrote: »

+1
People never miss the M7/M9 split. An exit is an exit.

Well, they do, I have and a mate of mine did last weekend and had to make a 40-km diversion to get back to the M9 because of the 'ratchet' arrangement of the M7/M9 intersection.

However, that was because he wasn't paying attention (nor was I when I did it).

Not because the junction isn't signed well enough. I think the first sign is 1.2km in advance, and there are at least 3 more large signs.

I'm not sure what more you could do.

Except make it possible for eastbound traffic on the M7 to join the M9!

A.

munchkin_utd

alinton wrote: »

............
I'm not sure what more you could do.
......

Was thinking about this since I saw a Corkbound English car swerve sharply at the last second on the 200m long merge section
(such a major interchange would warrant at the very least 1km of merge abroad BTW)

The de-facto situation at the busy Waterford M9 turnoff by people in the know might be a solution.

People going to Waterford along with Sunday drivers tend to the left lane.
People keeping to the M7 tend to the right lane.
(the speed also tends to 100kmh!)

SIMPLY formalising this by splitting the Waterford/ M7 traffic earlier would ENSURE nobody gets lost.

The same could apply for the M8/ M7 junction.
1km + before the split, change the left/ right aka driving/ overtaking lanes to a Cork/ Limerick decoupling section.
i.e. Cork traffic is directed to the left lane, Limerick traffic is directed by overhead gantry to the right lane.
At the existing de-merge section, the 1 lane to cork/ 1 lane to Limerick becomes 2 lanes to cork/ 2 lanes to Limerick.
(A 100 limit though may be appropriate for that 1000/ 1500m section)

As a solution its not the worst.
Costwise you only need a gantry or 2 and a thickening of the white line between driving lane 1 and lane 2 for a kilometre.
Its safe and the traffic isn't that high that you are causing any unneeded congestion.
Its also proven as its already the defacto situation at the M7/ M9 split.

The alternative would be to lenthen the 4 lanes back another km, which would be a costly exercise for a government that has no cash, and the private operator wouldnt do it for free.

tonc76

I think the underlying factor here seems to be that people are not paying attention when driving. As said previously motorists travelling south on the M7 have to pass 4 signs (4km verge mounted, 2km verge mounted, 1km portal gantry and 500m portal gantry) before they meet the junction (which has a portal gantry spanning the 4 lanes). The entire motorway network works on a left in left out basis at the junctions so it should be safe to say that anyone travelling on the M7 towards Cork should position themselves in the left lane in advance of the junction.

The most recent RSA ad campaign focused on a lady who admitted not paying full attention while driving and the consequences are plain for everyone to see. This is a welcome addition to the RSA's campaign which has been heavily focused on drink driving and speeding for a number of years now.

I think all exits from a motorway and entry to should be of a standard type thereby minimising confusion for the motorist.

jd

tonc76 wrote: »

I think the underlying factor here seems to be that people are not paying attention when driving.

+1

spacetweek

niloc1951 wrote: »

roads which only serve local residents and who are in no need of such signage since they have managed to find their local village or town quite well over the years without them.

You've completely failed to understand what road signage is actually for. It's not for the local residents; it's for everyone else.

It's the attitude "sure the locals know the way" that has resulted in this country having poor road signage.

SeanW wrote: »

All that heavy gantry signage on the m-ways and dual carriageways, however, is another story.

What do you mean exactly? Gantry signage was long overdue in Ireland and is a very welcome addition. There is not enough of it though, it should be on dual carriageways too.

niloc1951 wrote: »

As I have said, let's not have a multiple fatality at one of them before the 'experts' exercise their little grey cells 'outside the box'.

The NRA certainly should not stoop to the needs of idiots by taking these criticisms on board. If people are too inattentive to read the information on the road signage then they are not driving correctly. The solution to last minute swerving at the split is to fine anyone that does it.

niloc1951

munchkin_utd wrote: »

Was thinking about this since I saw a Corkbound English car swerve sharply at the last second on the 200m long merge section
(such a major interchange would warrant at the very least 1km of merge abroad BTW)

The de-facto situation at the busy Waterford M9 turnoff by people in the know might be a solution.

People going to Waterford along with Sunday drivers tend to the left lane.
People keeping to the M7 tend to the right lane.
(the speed also tends to 100kmh!)

SIMPLY formalising this by splitting the Waterford/ M7 traffic earlier would ENSURE nobody gets lost.

The same could apply for the M8/ M7 junction.
1km + before the split, change the left/ right aka driving/ overtaking lanes to a Cork/ Limerick decoupling section.
i.e. Cork traffic is directed to the left lane, Limerick traffic is directed by overhead gantry to the right lane.
At the existing de-merge section, the 1 lane to cork/ 1 lane to Limerick becomes 2 lanes to cork/ 2 lanes to Limerick.
(A 100 limit though may be appropriate for that 1000/ 1500m section)

As a solution its not the worst.
Costwise you only need a gantry or 2 and a thickening of the white line between driving lane 1 and lane 2 for a kilometre.
Its safe and the traffic isn't that high that you are causing any unneeded congestion.
Its also proven as its already the defacto situation at the M7/ M9 split.

The alternative would be to lenthen the 4 lanes back another km, which would be a costly exercise for a government that has no cash, and the private operator wouldnt do it for free.

Well thought out, it's good to see people think for a solution rather than consider the status quo to be without fault.
Splitting the carriageway as you described is common enough elsewhere in Europe, hadn't thought of it myself though I must have driven through such layouts hundreds of times while abroad.
But then as is said if we were to be honest a lot of drivers, particularly competent drivers tend to be relaxed about the chore and focus on the more important features of traffic conditions, how many can remember details of signage and scenery even on todays trip but I bet any out of the ordinary behavour of other vehicles can be remembered.

etchyed

munchkin_utd wrote: »

Was thinking about this since I saw a Corkbound English car swerve sharply at the last second on the 200m long merge section
(such a major interchange would warrant at the very least 1km of merge abroad BTW)

The de-facto situation at the busy Waterford M9 turnoff by people in the know might be a solution.

People going to Waterford along with Sunday drivers tend to the left lane.
People keeping to the M7 tend to the right lane.
(the speed also tends to 100kmh!)

SIMPLY formalising this by splitting the Waterford/ M7 traffic earlier would ENSURE nobody gets lost.

The same could apply for the M8/ M7 junction.
1km + before the split, change the left/ right aka driving/ overtaking lanes to a Cork/ Limerick decoupling section.
i.e. Cork traffic is directed to the left lane, Limerick traffic is directed by overhead gantry to the right lane.
At the existing de-merge section, the 1 lane to cork/ 1 lane to Limerick becomes 2 lanes to cork/ 2 lanes to Limerick.
(A 100 limit though may be appropriate for that 1000/ 1500m section)

As a solution its not the worst.
Costwise you only need a gantry or 2 and a thickening of the white line between driving lane 1 and lane 2 for a kilometre.
Its safe and the traffic isn't that high that you are causing any unneeded congestion.
Its also proven as its already the defacto situation at the M7/ M9 split.

The alternative would be to lenthen the 4 lanes back another km, which would be a costly exercise for a government that has no cash, and the private operator wouldnt do it for free.

While I see the logic of your suggestion and I realise it's a compromise, I think that on balance it's a bad idea.

Unlike niloc, I don't recall seeing such an arrangement (lane drop on a 2-lane road) anywhere else. Lane discipline on Irish motorways is bad enough already without giving people the impression that they ever need to be in the overtaking lane to avoid an exit. With signs as far as 4km in advance it should be clear to motorists intending to exit that they need to get ready to exit by staying in the driving lane. And if they don't pay attention to signs for a turn-off exit what's to say they'll pay attention to signs for a lane drop exit?

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

:o:o I was one. TBH I was chatting to SWMBO and cruising along at a relaxed 110 km.p.h. and forgot I needed to leave the road I was on.

So you weren't paying attention.

niloc1951 wrote: »

I know there is a lot of signage, but is there something wrong with it as quite a few drivers appear to have failed to respond to it , perhaps its the old proverb of not seeing the tree for the forrest :rolleyes:

Actually, it's to not see the forest for the trees but whatever. If you mean an inability on drivers' part to see relevant signs because of clutter then that doesn't really make sense in this context. There are signs saying M8 Cork at 4km, 2km, 1km and 500m from this junction and nothing else to distract the driver's attention from them.

niloc1951 wrote: »

...perhaps the 'experts' at the NRA or the RSA might ... before the 'experts' exercise their little grey cells 'outside the box'.

Ah, the old trick of dreaming up a bunch of imaginary idiots and referring to them as quotation-mark surrounded "experts" to emphasise their supposed incompetence. I note your imaginary idiots are unable to think outside the box. I'm guessing they're also guilty of "tunnel vision", groupthink and public service laziness.

niloc1951 wrote: »

Well thought out, it's good to see people think for a solution rather than consider the status quo to be without fault.

Nice of you to compliment munchkin_utd for his post. Of course his idea will not have been considered by any of those lazy, closeminded "experts" at the NRA

To be honest, niloc, the overall picture I'm getting from your posts is that the main problem with the M7/M8 diverge is, well... you. An implementation of munchkin_utd's suggestion would not have helped you as you weren't reading the signs anyway. Maybe that's because, as is apparent from your first post in this thread, you don't seem to see the point of road signs in the first place.

niloc1951

etchyed wrote: »

So you weren't paying attention.


Actually, it's to not see the forest for the trees but whatever. If you mean an inability on drivers' part to see relevant signs because of clutter then that doesn't really make sense in this context. There are signs saying M8 Cork at 4km, 2km, 1km and 500m from this junction and nothing else to distract the driver's attention from them.


Ah, the old trick of dreaming up a bunch of imaginary idiots and referring to them as quotation-mark surrounded "experts" to emphasise their supposed incompetence. I note your imaginary idiots are unable to think outside the box. I'm guessing they're also guilty of "tunnel vision", groupthink and public service laziness.


Nice of you to compliment munchkin_utd for his post. Of course his idea will not have been considered by any of those lazy, closeminded "experts" at the NRA

To be honest, niloc, the overall picture I'm getting from your posts is that the main problem with the M7/M8 diverge is, well... you. An implementation of munchkin_utd's suggestion would not have helped you as you weren't reading the signs anyway. Maybe that's because, as is apparent from your first post in this thread, you don't seem to see the point of road signs in the first place.

Definitely I was not paying full attention to the signage the day I nearly passed the exit to the M8, and I definitely won't be caught out a second time. I was just asking an open question whether the signage lacked impact of some kind as it has been reported that others have had a similar experience.

Regarding "I don't recall seeing such an arrangement (lane drop on a 2-lane road) anywhere else" I take it that you have also driven extensively in The UK, Denmark, Holland, Belgium, Germany, Switzerland, Austria, Italy, France, Spain and Portugal. Perhaps like me that evening at the M7/M8 interchange you might have not have been paying full attention and missed such a feature.

As regards my OP it referred to grossly over specified signs being planted in place of existing signage which carried the same direction information and still in perfectly serviceable condition.

Regards the competence or otherwise of the NRA, all I can say is - motorways designed and built without rest areas - as an example

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

Regards the competence or otherwise of the NRA, all I can say is - motorways designed and built without rest areas - as an example

Although I'm not up on the history of this, I've seen it stated here that the motorway network without service areas was down to political decision-making rather than the NRA.

niloc1951

etchyed wrote: »

Although I'm not up on the history of this, I've seen it stated here that the motorway network without service areas was down to political decision-making rather than the NRA.

Same excuse from lame administrators and QUANGO's why most stuff in this country is fcuked.

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

Same excuse from lame administrators and QUANGO's why most stuff in this country is fcuked.

Really? Because it sounds perfectly plausible to me that Fianna Fáil would be afraid of putting businesses in towns along a route out of business for fear of losing votes. Also seems perfectly plausible that the PDs would've preferred services to be offered by the market.

Also your point doesn't really make sense when in a context of QUANGOs being accused of being unaccountable to politicians.

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

As regards my OP it referred to grossly over specified signs being planted in place of existing signage which carried the same direction information and still in perfectly serviceable condition.

No it didn't. It didn't mention replacement of existing signs at all. In fact, you specifically stated that you didn't see the point of having any signs at all, an opinion torn to shreds by subsequent posts, none of which you've bothered to respond to.

Zoney

etchyed wrote: »

While I see the logic of your suggestion and I realise it's a compromise, I think that on balance it's a bad idea.

Unlike niloc, I don't recall seeing such an arrangement (lane drop on a 2-lane road) anywhere else. Lane discipline on Irish motorways is bad enough already without giving people the impression that they ever need to be in the overtaking lane to avoid an exit. With signs as far as 4km in advance it should be clear to motorists intending to exit that they need to get ready to exit by staying in the driving lane. And if they don't pay attention to signs for a turn-off exit what's to say they'll pay attention to signs for a lane drop exit?

Indeed - but what there should be is a lane-drop from a 3-lane carriageway.

I don't think we should have quite the crazy situation of the M2/M5 in NI, but I would say that for the M7/M9, M7/M8, M4/M6, M7/M20/N18, M11/M50, M1/M50 there should be an extra lane for about 2 km in advance of the split, with the extra lane being dropped to start the other motorway. This should also be used for the N21/M20 if it ever gets built.

niloc1951

etchyed wrote: »

Really? Because it sounds perfectly plausible to me that Fianna Fáil would be afraid of putting businesses in towns along a route out of business for fear of losing votes. Also seems perfectly plausible that the PDs would've preferred services to be offered by the market.

Also your point doesn't really make sense when in a context of QUANGOs being accused of being unaccountable to politicians.

I said 'rest areas' not 'service areas'.
Rest areas are a basic facility to enable drivers and their passengers to take a rest if feeling fatigued for safety reasons.
Typically a rest area comprised parking, maybe a few pick-nick tables and basic unattended toilet facilities.

Not to be confused with 'service areas'

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

I said 'rest areas' not 'service areas'.
Rest areas are a basic facility to enable drivers and their passengers to take a rest if feeling fatigued for safety reasons.
Typically a rest area comprised parking, maybe a few pick-nick tables and basic unattended toilet facilities.

Not to be confused with 'service areas'

My bad. It's still a bit of a red herring though in this discussion about signs. My point about the "experts" was that it is tiresome to read you bashing anonymous staff of the NRA and assuming them all to be incompetent morons. It's very tabloid and takes away from valid points you may have. It would be better to point out what they do wrong than insult them, which, to be fair, you have done with the rest areas. I'll stop this back-and-forth now as it's kinda OT and I'd imagine not very interesting reading.

charlemont

tonc76 wrote: »

The gantry signs that are provided on motorways and dual carriageways are needed just as much as low level signage. I'm led to beileve that when the M7/M8 stretch of motorway was opened south of Portlaoise that the majority of phonecalls that the NRA received in the weeks after were from people that had missed the turn off for Cork! In order to do so you would have to drive past 2 verge mounted next exit signs, 3 portal gantries and a butterfly sign in the nosing at the split.

No amount of signage can compensate for the high level of idiots on our roads..

runway16

Anybody who misses that turn (M7/M8) has only themselves to blame because they were not paying attention at the time. Simple.

Stop trying to blame others for the fact that you somehow managed to miss the Huge Blue signs to your left and directly over your head.....

highlydebased

I notice on the M20 from about exit 5 inwards to Limerick there are new foundations for what I assume are the electronic signage cantilever gantries?

Amtmann

Neon-Circles wrote: »

I notice on the M20 from about exit 5 inwards to Limerick there are new foundations for what I assume are the electronic signage cantilever gantries?

Correct... they're on the M7 as well, plus the Watergrasshill, Cashel and Glanmire bypasses too. The NRA are investing quite heavily in signage at the moment.

rcdk1

Neon-Circles wrote: »

I notice on the M20 from about exit 5 inwards to Limerick there are new foundations for what I assume are the electronic signage cantilever gantries?

Tremelo wrote: »

Correct... they're on the M7 as well, plus the Watergrasshill, Cashel and Glanmire bypasses too. The NRA are investing quite heavily in signage at the moment.

They're also putting them up on the N22 Ballincollig Bypass. Apparently a nationwide initiative controlled from head office. Dunno about the electronic bit though. I would imagine the vast majority will be standard aluminium signs.

highlydebased

Well, there is two small yellow pipes emerging from them which looks like it could carry cabling. What messages they'd want to be displaying I'm not sure though.

munchkin_utd

Neon-Circles wrote: »

Well, there is two small yellow pipes emerging from them which looks like it could carry cabling. What messages they'd want to be displaying I'm not sure though.

on the ballincollig by pass it could warn of disruptions with the building of the flyovers when that gets underway on the south ring.

After the Monklands turnoff west from Athlone off the N6
I've just noticed that the Athlone - Ballinasloe R446 has just been renamed "R446 (old N6)" on the signs in the area.

Looks like the council have accepted that no one uses the "R" number!

Danno

On the old N8, the extended N77, they have signed Cork as the terminus with M8 patched on the signs southbound...

Surely if it is the alternative route to Cork, for L drivers etc... they should have R639 patched as opposed to the M8?
If not, why is Kilkenny City omitted, as it is the southbound terminus of the N77...

Strange logic it seems.

spacetweek

Deleted User wrote: »

After the Monklands turnoff west from Athlone off the N6
I've just noticed that the Athlone - Ballinasloe R446 has just been renamed "R446 (old N6)" on the signs in the area.

Looks like the council have accepted that no one uses the "R" number!

Yes - on the old N9 near Athy, the signage is listed as "(Old N9)". Not ideal but it's useful information to many people.