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North Korea, Warmonger State

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    #152
    Jeboa Safari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,202 ✭✭✭Jeboa Safari


    twinytwo wrote: »
    To everyone who said that nuking japan was justified.. you need your head examined. Japan was all but offically defeated. navy/airforce and army destroyed. The bombs were nothing more than a show piece to russia. Both General McAuthur and Eisenhower both said that there was never any need to drop the bombs....The Bombings were one of the greatest war crimes ever commited.

    If Japan was defeated why didn't they surrender? They were given the option to surrender before the bombs were dropped, and after the first ones were dropped yet they didn't. And it would have saved more lives than an invasion or blockade. Look at how the Japanese defended the islands the Allies fought them on, there were massive casualties, if it was the Japanese home islands they'd be fighting even harder. They were even training children as suicide bombers to blow up tanks. As far as I remember they also still occupied land in China and Korea. So it saved lives on both sides, and also the Allies have to put themselves first, not Japan, who was the aggressor.
    And on the Russian point, if it helped ensure that Russia didn't invade Japan aswell and end up splitting the country like Europe, then I'd say thats a good outcome for Japan.


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    #153
    hal9000
    Registered Users Posts: 933 ✭✭✭hal9000


    I blame Alec Baldwin!


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    #154
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,966 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    old_aussie wrote: »
    Nuke the North first.

    Mini nuke on the capital, then one on each of the main navy, army and airforce base. Take out the power supplies/generators/communication facilities.

    And the nukes on Japan were justified, saved countless allied lives and brought a quick end to the war.
    How many nukes would you need to make sure you got all of the essential underground strongholds ? Conventional bombing didn't work during the busy part of the Korean war, and that was using all the stuff left over from WWII. They've had 50 years to dig in.

    re power supplies, they've done that themselves already


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    #155
    jackiebaron
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,038 ✭✭✭jackiebaron


    bobblepuzzle wrote: »
    The Chinese aren't oblivious to what is going on... they know the North are acting like complete dickheads... any attack on South Korea will involve the Americans, the Chinese won't intervene, but say harsh words...

    And how exactly are the North acting like complete dickheads? What, they don't want their country controlled by western corporations and they don't want to be invaded by the US who is run by those same corporations so they bulid up a huge military and just want to be left alone even if that means suffering sanctions and embargoes by the bitchy US.
    Keep drinking that Kool-Aid, pal.


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    #156
    old_aussie
    Registered Users Posts: 3,410 ✭✭✭old_aussie


    up for anything wrote: »
    Is it so difficult to type Japanese and maybe even use capitalise it?

    What are you trying to say?


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    #157
    TKline
    Registered Users Posts: 51 ✭✭TKline


    Developments on the Korean peninsula are very alarming. This could be the catalyst for WW3!


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    #158
    jackiebaron
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,038 ✭✭✭jackiebaron


    Jeboa Safari wrote: »
    If Japan was defeated why didn't they surrender? They were given the option to surrender before the bombs were dropped, and after the first ones were dropped yet they didn't. And it would have saved more lives than an invasion or blockade. Look at how the Japanese defended the islands the Allies fought them on, there were massive casualties, if it was the Japanese home islands they'd be fighting even harder. They were even training children as suicide bombers to blow up tanks. As far as I remember they also still occupied land in China and Korea. So it saved lives on both sides, and also the Allies have to put themselves first, not Japan, who was the aggressor.
    And on the Russian point, if it helped ensure that Russia didn't invade Japan aswell and end up splitting the country like Europe, then I'd say thats a good outcome for Japan.

    How the fcuk do you know? You're just parrotting the propaganda so you can sleep at night. The Japanese were trying to surrender for months before the bombs were dropped. The bombs were dropped to demonstrate to the Russians that the US had no compunction about using nuclear weapons against civilian population centres.
    Funny how every clown says that the Japanese would have defended their island to the death causing millions of casualties yet when the war finally ended they were miraculously on the brink of starvation.
    Get your head out of your rectum.


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    #159
    jackiebaron
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,038 ✭✭✭jackiebaron


    up for anything wrote: »
    Is that supposed to make us blush or cringe with embarrassment? More than enough Irish people lost their lives or gave their lives in WWII to allow us an opinion, if that is the way you view things.

    Is it so difficult to type Japanese and maybe even use capitalise it?


    UFA, old_aussie is constantly calling for countries to be bombed and people to be slaughtered. It's the true sign of an armchair warrior. You can bet this guy never faced the odd angry shot.


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    #160
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,966 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Jeboa Safari wrote: »
    As far as I remember they also still occupied land in China and Korea. So it saved lives on both sides, and also the Allies have to put themselves first, not Japan, who was the aggressor.
    And on the Russian point, if it helped ensure that Russia didn't invade Japan aswell and end up splitting the country like Europe, then I'd say thats a good outcome for Japan.
    Uncle Joe signed a peace treaty with the Japanese back in 1939 after giving them a bloody nose. As soon as the treaty expired the Russians invaded Japanese territory sweeping through all opposition along the way. Had the Japanese not surrendered when they did then the Soviets would have taken all of Korea.

    A lot of the problem with the Japanese surrender was due to the demand for unconditional surrender, had terms been advertised earlier they might well have surrendered earlier. Yamamoto had no illusions about how the war would end even before it started.


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    #161
    old_aussie
    Registered Users Posts: 3,410 ✭✭✭old_aussie


    jackiebaron wrote: »
    How the fcuk do you know? You're just parrotting the propaganda so you can sleep at night. The Japanese were trying to surrender for months before the bombs were dropped. The bombs were dropped to demonstrate to the Russians that the US had no compunction about using nuclear weapons against civilian population centres.
    Funny how every clown says that the Japanese would have defended their island to the death causing millions of casualties yet when the war finally ended they were miraculously on the brink of starvation.
    Get your head out of your rectum.[/QUOTE]

    Nice attack jackie on the post jackie.

    The surrender of Japan brought hostilities in World War II to a close. By the end of July 1945, the Imperial Japanese Navy was incapable of conducting operations and an Allied invasion of Japan was imminent.

    While publicly stating their intent to fight on to the bitter end, Japan's leaders at the Supreme Council for the Direction of the War (the "Big Six") were privately making entreaties to the neutral Soviet Union, to mediate peace on terms favorable to the Japanese.

    The Soviets, meanwhile, were preparing to attack the Japanese, in fulfillment of their promises to the Americans and the British made at the Tehran and Yalta Conferences.

    Late in the evening of August 8, in accordance with Yalta agreements but in violation of the Soviet–Japanese Neutrality Pact, the Soviet Union declared war on Japan, and soon after midnight on August 9, it invaded the Japanese puppet state of Manchukuo


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    #162
    Jeboa Safari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,202 ✭✭✭Jeboa Safari


    jackiebaron wrote: »
    How the fcuk do you know? You're just parrotting the propaganda so you can sleep at night. The Japanese were trying to surrender for months before the bombs were dropped. The bombs were dropped to demonstrate to the Russians that the US had no compunction about using nuclear weapons against civilian population centres.
    Funny how every clown says that the Japanese would have defended their island to the death causing millions of casualties yet when the war finally ended they were miraculously on the brink of starvation.
    Get your head out of your rectum.

    They were given the chance to surrender, they didn't. There was also an attempted coup against the emperor when he made moves to surrender, so it was hardly guaranteed.
    'Parroting propaganda to sleep at night' :rolleyes:


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    #163
    up for anything
    Registered Users Posts: 5,776 ✭✭✭up for anything


    up for anything wrote: »
    Is it so difficult to type Japanese and maybe even use capitalise it?
    old_aussie wrote: »
    What are you trying to say?

    I think you know.


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    #164
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    old_aussie wrote: »
    What are you trying to say?

    Probably that the term "jap" is derogatory.


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    #165
    burgerhead
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2 ✭burgerhead


    Jeboa Safari wrote: »
    They were given the chance to surrender, they didn't. There was also an attempted coup against the emperor when he made moves to surrender, so it was hardly guaranteed.
    'Parroting propaganda to sleep at night' :rolleyes:

    This is a falsehood. The Japanese had been trying to surrender since April 1945. The Americans refused to entertain their request. I'm not taking sides here I'm just pointing out the facts. The facts are that the official line is the Japanese wouldn't surrender so the US was compelled to nuke them (twice). This is the story that's fed to Joe Public because the real story is a little too ugly for him to stomach, i.e. that the US were not interested in conventional surrender. They wanted to use their newly found atomic capability on civilians to send a message to the Soviets. If they merely wanted to "scare" the Japanese with this doomsday weapon they could have dropped in in a rural area or in the sea or in the mountains. To try and assert that millions of GI's were saved because of the bomb being dropped is laughable.


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    #166
    SamHarris
    Registered Users Posts: 1,633 ✭✭✭SamHarris


    burgerhead wrote: »
    This is a falsehood. The Japanese had been trying to surrender since April 1945. The Americans refused to entertain their request. I'm not taking sides here I'm just pointing out the facts. The facts are that the official line is the Japanese wouldn't surrender so the US was compelled to nuke them (twice). This is the story that's fed to Joe Public because the real story is a little too ugly for him to stomach, i.e. that the US were not interested in conventional surrender. They wanted to use their newly found atomic capability on civilians to send a message to the Soviets. If they merely wanted to "scare" the Japanese with this doomsday weapon they could have dropped in in a rural area or in the sea or in the mountains. To try and assert that millions of GI's were saved because of the bomb being dropped is laughable.

    Not exactly true, there were elements who wanted to surrender, but not unconditionally which were the stipulations.

    Laughable? Really? Not according to the now released plannings and projections made for the homeland invasions. Your personal incredulity is irrelevant.

    All the whilst thousands of US GI's were being starved and tortured to death on mainland Asia.

    Really the proof of the pudding is in the eating; you say the bomb was unecssary? then why were 2 required before the Japanese surrender. It is interesting to note that there were very few people at the time who said it was not needed.


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