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Aftermath of Mystery Tour

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    #32
    x43r0
    Registered Users Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭x43r0


    maglite wrote: »
    Am, what the heck are the society guild thinking. If criminal acts were committed it should be left the the Gardai to investigate and take action against.
    The guild are obliged to investigate if a society event or a society itself has potentially broken a law and if so punish the relevant society in the event that a illegality has occured
    maglite wrote: »
    Who they hell do they think they are?
    They are the governing body over all societies in UCC
    maglite wrote: »
    I actually find this whole thing offensive.
    Why? :confused:
    maglite wrote: »
    Can someone enlighten me as to what powers of investigation and punishment these people have.
    As for punishments, anything from freezing accounts and assets to completely wiping out said society for the year
    maglite wrote: »
    Also I would question their power to punish whole departments based on the actions of a few.
    Well it was the engineering SOCIETY being discussed not the engineering DEPARTMENT (you see the difference there?).


    maglite wrote: »
    Are they Serious.

    Serious as a heart attack


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    #33
    D-Generate
    Registered Users Posts: 2,945 ✭✭✭D-Generate


    When I was doing engineering the engineering society used to operate somewhat outside the societies guild. Positions on the Eng Soc committee were rotated between departments each year. Class reps were also elected internally and not using the ballot system that the Students Union set up.

    As such I don't see how the Societies Guild has much clout over them. They can surely just organize the Ball amongst themselves, the little stamp from the Societies Guild on the flyers will hardly make ticket sell any faster.


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    #34
    x43r0
    Registered Users Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭x43r0


    D-Generate wrote: »
    As such I don't see how the Societies Guild has much clout over them. They can surely just organize the Ball amongst themselves, the little stamp from the Societies Guild on the flyers will hardly make ticket sell any faster.


    The clout the guild has over them (like any other society) would be both financial and legal.

    Financial: The guild has control of all societies accounts/assets

    Legal: It is illegal to operate under the name "UCC Society" without official society status so any group trying to operate as such outside the system would have a pretty difficult time being any bit successful/active


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    #35
    maglite
    Registered Users Posts: 1,783 ✭✭✭maglite


    x in the city wrote: »

    These allegations are all based on third hand information and as such may
    only be allegations.However given the engineering society's past reputation
    the Societies Guild consider it pretty likely that these events actually
    happened. As it stands unless the Societies Guild find out exactly who was
    involved in these incidents( if anyone) be it engineers or pharmacists the
    Eng ball and all further engineering society events will be cancelled.
    If anyone has any information on any of the issues listed previously, or if
    anyone knows weather these allegations are true or false please contact us    .

    So looking at this I have a group of students, who IMHO are acting like goodie too shoes, want to act on rumor and hearsay imposing a definite punishment even though this may not have occurred, or have been perpetrated by the EngSoc/Ucc Students?
    x43r0 wrote: »
    The guild are obliged to investigate if a society event or a society itself has potentially broken a law and if so punish the relevant society in the event that a illegality has occured

    I would be interested to see where that is stated in their constitution. Obliged by whom or what?
    x43r0 wrote: »
    Why? :confused:
    Because they are trying to play cops..
    x43r0 wrote: »
    As for punishments, anything from freezing accounts and assets to completely wiping out said society for the year
    So based on the action of less than .003% of a society a whole group of people will be punished?
    x43r0 wrote: »
    Well it was the engineering SOCIETY being discussed not the engineering DEPARTMENT (you see the difference there?).
    When near everyone in a dept. is in the society it’s just semantics as to what they are called. Interestingly the number of people in the society would represent ¼ of those who voted in the SU elections. One ponders as to how much of an influence they could have in next years elections should they be persuaded to mount a campaign. I’m sure departments with similar structures would be rather sympathetic to their plight. We could elect Dustin to positions of power. UCC Eurovision anyone?
    x43r0 wrote: »
    Legal: It is illegal to operate under the name "UCC Society" without official society status so any group trying to operate as such outside the system would have a pretty difficult time being any bit successful/active

    But I’m sure operating under a society is’t, or just to play it safe soc.


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    #36
    x43r0
    Registered Users Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭x43r0


    maglite wrote: »
    So looking at this I have a group of students, who IMHO are acting like goodie too shoes, want to act on rumor and hearsay imposing a definite punishment even though this may not have occurred, or have been perpetrated by the EngSoc/Ucc Students?



    I would be interested to see where that is stated in their constitution. Obliged by whom or what?


    Because they are trying to play cops..

    So based on the action of less than .003% of a society a whole group of people will be punished?

    When near everyone in a dept. is in the society it’s just semantics as to what they are called. Interestingly the number of people in the society would represent ¼ of those who voted in the SU elections. One ponders as to how much of an influence they could have in next years elections should they be persuaded to mount a campaign. I’m sure departments with similar structures would be rather sympathetic to their plight. We could elect Dustin to positions of power. UCC Eurovision anyone?



    But I’m sure operating under a society is’t, or just to play it safe soc.

    There's so much wrong with this I can't begin to explain. PirateNinja summed it up pretty well in a previous post. You need to educate yourself as to how the system works before you make nonsensical posts like that.

    I won't dissect the post again, I'll just pick the biggest flaw.
    maglite wrote: »
    Interestingly the number of people in the society would represent ¼ of those who voted in the SU elections. One ponders as to how much of an influence they could have in next years elections should they be persuaded to mount a campaign.

    This couldn't possibly be more irrelevant. The SU election has absolutely NOTHING to do with societies. The Student's Union, The Clubs Exec and The Societies Guild are three separate entities with no power over each other.

    So elect Dustin if you like, the SU might be a bit peeved but the Guild's feathers won't be in the least bit ruffled


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    #37
    grenache
    Registered Users Posts: 6,477 ✭✭✭grenache


    I'm puzzled. Why did the OP originally post this thread in After Hours? And without mentioning it was UCC he was referring to?


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    #38
    Papa_Lazarou
    Registered Users Posts: 1,863 ✭✭✭Papa_Lazarou


    I see today there is a table outisde the boole basement entrance selling tickets for the eng ball so im assuming the trouble makers came forward? or that its just being organised outside of the society.


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    #39
    keane2097
    Registered Users Posts: 17,770 ✭✭✭✭keane2097


    Papa_Lazarou wrote: »
    I see today there is a table outisde the boole basement entrance selling tickets for the eng ball so im assuming the trouble makers came forward? or that its just being organised outside of the society.

    As Dgenerate said earlier, the Eng Soc have never paid the slightest bit of attention to the Societies Guild.

    I actually lol'd at the idea of the Soc Guild cancelling the Eng Ball, do people in the Soc Guild really think they are capable of doing that?


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    #40
    Knifey Spoony
    Registered Users Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭Knifey Spoony


    Papa_Lazarou wrote: »
    I see today there is a table outisde the boole basement entrance selling tickets for the eng ball so im assuming the trouble makers came forward? or that its just being organised outside of the society.

    As an engineer myself, I can tell you that there was absolutly no talk of this email when it was sent out, in my class anyway. I don't think anyone came forward, but there was never any worry of the eng ball being cancelled, so I just assume the eng soc is working away on its own.


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    #41
    g5fd6ow0hseima
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,787 ✭✭✭g5fd6ow0hseima


    keane2097 wrote: »
    I actually lol'd at the idea of the Soc Guild cancelling the Eng Ball, do people in the Soc Guild really think they are capable of doing that?

    Of course they are capable. But the question is: Is it fair to punish an entire society for the actions of a few donkeys?


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    #42
    keane2097
    Registered Users Posts: 17,770 ✭✭✭✭keane2097


    Cadence Rancid Timber wrote: »
    Of course they are capable. But the question is: Is it fair to punish an entire society for the actions of a few donkeys?

    You see this was always going to be the line.

    I'm willing to put any amount of my money to any amount of yours at odds of 5:1 (I.e. Your 100 to my 500) that the Eng Ball will go ahead this year regardless of whether or not the people mentioned in the original email are exposed and regardless of any other guild action.

    Obv stipulation that freak weather cancels bets, not that I expect anyone to so much as treat on the terms.


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    #43
    keane2097
    Registered Users Posts: 17,770 ✭✭✭✭keane2097


    Cadence Rancid Timber wrote: »
    Of course they are capable. But the question is: Is it fair to punish an entire society for the actions of a few donkeys?

    On the off chance it needs any more clarification:

    Lol no they're not!


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    #44
    JohnyDarko
    Registered Users Posts: 59 ✭✭JohnyDarko


    Sure they could, but from what I've heard nothing much happened on the mystery tour anyway and it was just people making crap up so no action was taken. And the class reps could organize the ball if they wanted to (as some other depts who don't have societies have done in the past) but couldn't advertise it on the posters or say it was the society.


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    #45
    catiny
    Registered Users Posts: 130 ✭✭catiny


    I am on the ENG SOC this year, and we had to do things by the book. So we've had 2 egm's this year to vote in a committee with a guild rep present a both meetings.

    We got info about the incidents that happened on the mystery tour, hence the going ahead of the ball! :D Which I cannot wait for!


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    #46
    Buceph
    Registered Users Posts: 2,059 ✭✭✭Buceph


    keane2097 wrote: »
    On the off chance it needs any more clarification:

    Lol no they're not!

    You're talking rubbish. The biggest thing the guild are there for is to provide the Societies with a cheque book, and a bank account (as well as indemnifying the students against losses plus funding from the capitation fee.) If the Guild were to stop access to the cheque book, then the Society couldn't use it to pay for their ball. They'd have to do it as private citizens, and with their own money. And if any problems cropped up then, it's the students who would be liable not UCC and not the Society's Guild.

    And someone from the Society has already said they've sorted everything with the Guild, so the Society's committee obviously know what's happening.


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