Global Hunger, Will the fat cat's pay the proposed tax?

Brown Bomber

gizmo wrote: »

I can't find any info on US support for the former two dictators but Amin is a different story, shortly after his rise to power and his subsequent expulsion of Asians in the country (amongst other things) the US closed their embassy and denounced his government. That clearly had no effect. They later began a long line of economic sanctions against the country including the coffee boycott which indirectly led to his downfall. This is hardly a show of support from the US administration?

Later? How much later? After Amin had turned against his masters later?

Amin, a former member of the British Army was trained as a paratrooper in Israel. According to Amin the Israelis were attempting to bankrupt Uganda, hence the break with US/UK/Israel. Prior to this he had been friends with Israeli PM Golda Meir and a house guest of Moshe Dayan. He was clearly a front for CIA/MOSSAD/MI5 who in turn are de facto agents of the corporations.

This is the reason for Amin's rise to power.

The "Common Man's Charter" http://www.radiorhino.org/htm_material/archiv/text/press/monitor/THE%20COMMON%20MAN%20CHARTER%20By%20DrAMO.htm

Then President Milton Obote was on the verge of changing the politcal system in Uganda:

The move to the Left is the creation of a new political culture and a new way of life, whereby the people of Uganda as a whole - their welfare and their voice in the National Government and in other local authorities - are paramount. It is, therefore, both anti-feudalism and anti-capitalism.

Western interests, primarily British were seriously threatened. Amin's coup came about within the year. It's not that hard to figure out is it?

gizmo

Brown Bomber wrote: »

Later? How much later? After Amin had turned against his masters later?

The sanctions began in 1977 I believe, after the Air France hijacking and hostilities with Kenya? But what would you have suggested they do? The leader whom he deposed was going to ruin the country with his nationalization plan, similarly to what Mugabe has done in Zimbabwe so I hope to hell you're not supporting that, so they stepped in and in return, got a monster. They initially broke off diplomatic relations which had no effect, then after increasingly erratic behavior they employed economic sanctions which were decried. So again, what should have been done? Nothing? Let the country implode?

As for the Israeli comments, I've never condoned anything they've done however if you're going to look at Amin as someone who was wronged by them, also look at his behavior during the Airline hijacking with respect to the Jews on board.

Brown Bomber

gizmo wrote: »

You realise that after awhile it's obvious that it's not a conspiracy but just a bunch of barbarians scrambling for power themselves?

An imperialist faux pas?

Everything is obviously not a conspiracy if you don't even scratch the surface and swallow everything the Ministry of Truth tells you.

I'll give you an example. Two semi-related incidents which I am absolutely certain you have no idea about.

The Entebbe Hijacker crisis. It was Israeli engineered.

The Israeli secret service and radical Palestinians may have engineered the hijacking of an Air France plane that flew to Entebbe in Uganda, according to a claim in newly released government documents.

This extraordinary interpretation on the Entebbe raid was cited by a British diplomat, DH Colvin of the Paris embassy, in June 30 1976 as the world was transfixed by the hostage crisis in Entebbe, which features in the recent film The Last King of Scotland.

In a document released by the National Archives, Mr Colvin, citing an unnamed contact at the Euro-Arab parliamentary association, wrote: "According to his information, the hijack was the work of the PFLP [Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine], with help from the Israeli secret service, the Shin Beit."

Describing the collaboration as an unholy alliance, he went on: "The operation was designed to torpedo the PLO's [Palestine Liberation Organisation] standing in France and to prevent what they see as a growing rapprochement between the PLO and the Americans.

"Their nightmare is that after the November elections, one will witness the imposition in the Middle East of a Pax Americana, which will be the advantage of the PLO (who will gain international respectability and perhaps the right to establish a state on evacuated territories) and to the disadvantage of the Refusal Front (who will be squeezed right out in any overall peace settlement and will lose their raison d'etre) and Israel (who will be forced to evacuate occupied territory)."

Actually...this next part is a test. This video is only 3 seconds long.

http://yfrog.com/5hv0860301512kbframe45656z

It is an American solider at ground zero on 911 who can't speak english? WTF is that all about???

Buildings is going to collapse...Nothing informations

See if you can connect Idi Amin to this "US" solider. Hint: Israeli false-flag attacks.

gizmo

Brown Bomber wrote: »

An imperialist faux pas?

Hah, no I'm specifically referring to those people who would butcher their own people and loot their countries wealth for their own benefit.

Brown Bomber wrote: »

I'll give you an example. Two semi-related incidents which I am absolutely certain you have no idea about.

The Entebbe Hijacker crisis. It was Israeli engineered.

You mean the event I mentioned before your post? The difference being, I don't consider one unsubstantiated report to be proof that it was orchestrated by the Israelis.

As for the rest, if you can indicate which building is being shown in the background I'll first believe it was even taken around the WTC. Secondly, are you now implying the Israelis carried out or had a hand in 9/11?

LevelSpirit

I have a better proposal.
Chuggers donate their wages for hassling people, many of whom already give to charity, would be a good way for them to prove they are actually trying to help the poor, blind, homeless etc.

Yes folks. those chuggers earn €13 per hour. Since they get paid per hour, they can answer the question "Do you get commission?", with a no. But make no mistake, most of the money you donate is going to them. Another chunk of it is going to their bosses.

Imagine how much of the money raised by charity goes into the pockets of those collecting it. Now imagine that how much that pocketed money could help the poor.

Brown Bomber

gizmo wrote: »

Hah, no I'm specifically referring to those people who would butcher their own people and loot their countries wealth for their own benefit.

I know. In fact my post came across unintentionally patronising so I apologise.

gizmo wrote: »

You mean the event I mentioned before your post? The difference being, I don't consider one unsubstantiated report to be proof that it was orchestrated by the Israelis.

I didn't doubt that you weren't aware of Entebbe, though I am sure there are many who are not. What I was confident that you weren't aware of was the Isreali involvement, which I am sure 99% are not.

Apologies for not linking originally.
Guardian Article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2007/jun/01/israel
From the UK national archives: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/releases/2007/june/entebbe.htm

gizmo wrote: »

As for the rest, if you can indicate which building is being shown in the background I'll first believe it was even taken around the WTC. Secondly, are you now implying the Israelis carried out or had a hand in 9/11?

Best we forget about 911, it was my fault for bringing it up. This is an interesting thread IMO and I want to avoid taking it off topic if I can.

gizmo

No problems at all, I can see where you were coming from though but rest assured I don't hold any of those backward colonial beliefs.

You'd be correct on the assumption I wasn't aware of the (supposed) Israeli involvement alright. It just seems a little far fetched really, are there any other documented cases of Israeli agents working with their enemies in such a manner?

pablo_escobar

gizmo wrote:

The problem then is, if economic sanctions are decried and military intervention is decried then what can be done? Should we condemn these nations to generations of tyrannical rule under these monsters?

It's a pity we didn't have some anonymous US foreign policy advisor to answer that question but i'd say it depends on who the monster is working for.

If the monster is helping us achieve some objective, it's no secret those monsters are tolerated by the western governments, including the mainstream media.

Take for example the leader of Uzbekistan, Islam Karimov.
He's been in power since 1990, just after the breakup of the USSR.

Karimov is known as one of the worlds worst dictators but he can apparently do no wrong at the moment.

The US condemned Karimov for ordering to kill hundreds of demonstrators in 2005 who were protesting against the repressive Karimov regime.

In response to the criticism, Uzbekistan kicked out the US military who were using Uzbekistan for a military supply route.

Although there are supply routes through Pakistan, the security situation makes it unreliable

Karimov ordered the death of Muzafar Avazov in 2002 who was a vocal critic of the current regime.

Medical examiners found severe burns on Avazov's legs, buttocks, lower back and arms, covering 60-70% of his body, which they believed to be the result of immersion in boiling water.

There can be no criticism of Karimov because the US need him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7F00-UNp4rE

gizmo

I'm somewhat confused here...

pablo_escobar wrote: »

The US condemned Karimov for ordering to kill hundreds of demonstrators in 2005 who were protesting against the repressive Karimov regime.

In response to the criticism, Uzbekistan kicked out the US military who were using Uzbekistan for a military supply route.

But then you say...

pablo_escobar wrote: »

There can be no criticism of Karimov because the US need him.

pablo_escobar

Between 2001 and 2005 the United States Air Force used the base, also known as K2 and "Stronghold Freedom", for support missions against al-Qaeda in neighbouring Afghanistan. The 416th Air Expeditionary Operations Group was the host unit. On July 29, 2005, amid strained relations caused by the May 2005 unrest in Uzbekistan, the United States was told to vacate the base within six months. It was vacated by the United States in November 2005

timelines

2005 May 20, The EU and NATO called for an int’l. investigation into the May 13 suppression of protestors at Andijan, Uzbekistan.
(WSJ, 9/2/05, p.A13)

2005 May 25, China rolled out the red carpet for Uzbekistan's Pres. Karimov, underscoring the importance it places on curbing the rise of Islamic militancy as it welcomed the authoritarian leader criticized in the West for a bloody crackdown on protesters. China signed a $600 million joint oil venture with Uzbekistan.
(AP, 5/25/05)(WSJ, 5/26/05, p.A1)

2005 Jul 29, Uzbekistan notified the State Department that US military aircraft and personnel must leave Karshi-Khanabad air base, commonly referred to as K2, that has been an important hub for American military operations in Afghanistan.
(AP, 7/30/05)

2009 Jan 20, The head of US Central Command said the US has struck deals with Russia and neighboring countries allowing it to transport supplies to American troops in Afghanistan through their territory. US officials have said that one likely route is overland from Russia through Kazakhstan and on through Uzbekistan using trucks and trains. Another possible route is via Azerbaijan across the Caspian Sea to the Kazakh port of Aktau and then through Uzbekistan.
(AP, 1/20/09)

The US need Uzbekistan for supply route because of the security problem present in pakistan, so it's unlikely we'll hear any future criticism of Karimov, just praise.

WakeUp

The "people" who run our world should hang their heads in shame. Shame on all of them there is now way in this day and age people should be going hungry. Sort it out you kunt's:),do something and make it happen I for one am tired of excuse's. This really bothers me.

uprising2

Here's an example of plunder from todays news, french and spanish mining uranium, a kidnapping of mine staff, it's blamed on AQIM....(Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb:rolleyes:), france sends in troops to guard the mine from AQIM, kills some terrorists, the fight on terror goes on, oh and some civilians got killed.

Mauritania kills two civilians in Mali Qaeda raid.
The kidnappers, suspected of being al Qaeda fighters, seized seven mining company staff from Arlit in northern Niger last Thursday, five French, one Togolese and one from Madagascar.
Two months ago French and Mauritanian forces killed six fighters from al Qaeda's north African wing in the Malian desert during an effort to free a French hostage the group was holding. Al Qaeda said it later killed the hostage.
About 100 French anti-terrorism specialists have arrived in Niamey, Niger's capital, aboard reconnaissance aircraft, the source added. Arlit is close to the site of uranium mining operations that are the mainstay of Niger's economy.
http://af.reuters.com/article/topNews/idAFJOE68J0ID20100920

More plunder,

The IMF trimmed Congo's 2010 growth forecast to 10.6 percent from 12.1 percent and boosted its 2011 growth forecast to 8.7 percent from 6.6 percent as increases in oil production have taken longer than anticipated.
Melhado said Congo's oil production would peak in 2011 near 370,000 bpd due to new output from fields operated by Total, Murphy, ENI and TEP-Congo, before output falls into decline.

http://af.reuters.com/article/topNews/idAFJOE68J08U20100920

Eyeing up some future bounty.

When some of the most influential figures in emerging markets finance spoke to a group of Reuters editors, they were asked about top picks for growth beyond the so-called BRIC countries of Brazil, Russia, India and China.
One continent came up again and again – Africa – and one country in particular – Nigeria. Goldman Sachs global head of economic research, Jim O’Neill, highlighted the improvement in the growth-environment index of Africa’s giant over the past decade.

http://blogs.reuters.com/africanews/2010/07/07/africa-optimism-rising/

Stealing the gold.....

Lake Victoria Completes Drilling of Sambaru 3, 4 and 5 Targets at Singida Gold Project, Tanzania and Submits the First.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS108450+20-Sep-2010+MW20100920

Some of the thieves,

The company quickly realized that there were tremendous benefits to be had, marrying the international investor to the peaceful country of Tanzania, its people and its mineral wealth.
http://www.lakevictoriaminingcompany.com/corporate/overview.php

plunder and death....

AngloGold shuts S.Africa mine after death
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLDE68J1IE20100920

Some happy gold barons........

DENVER, Sept 19 (Reuters) - Small wonder that gold mining executives are smiling these days.
Many gold bulls seem to think the sky's the limit. Even billionaire George Soros, who has warned that gold is "the ultimate bubble," has heavily invested in gold and gold-mining companies through his Soros Fund Management LLC hedge fund.
That's what a recession will do for the metal, which is traditionally regarded as a safe haven for investors in times of economic uncertainty.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN167056020100920

Maggie's son trying to take over a small African country, how very british of him..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUHssNKl8xc

joebucks

Great to see Bono is still fighting the good fight.

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/poor_idea_bono_bsUzJMfT2mBJbqyXgp6YoO#ixzz10AdTHKdI

The Bono nonprofit took in $14,993,873 in public donations in 2008, the latest year for which tax records are available.
Of that, $184,732 was distributed to three charities, according to the IRS filing.
Meanwhile, more than $8 million was spent on executive and employee salaries.

Yitzhak Rabin

joebucks wrote: »

Great to see Bono is still fighting the good fight.

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/poor_idea_bono_bsUzJMfT2mBJbqyXgp6YoO#ixzz10AdTHKdI

What a self serving scumbag.

To think he is in the "Top 5 Greatest Irish People" as voted by us the public is sickening.

Torakx

Well he did bend knee to the queen so anything isnt suprising after that :P

WakeUp

joebucks wrote: »

Great to see Bono is still fighting the good fight.

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/poor_idea_bono_bsUzJMfT2mBJbqyXgp6YoO#ixzz10AdTHKdI

St. Bono is a muppet who makes' "normal" people feel bad about our not so great live's, tonight thank God its them instead of you and all that, whilst him and his rich type ilk live the high life without a care in the world. Thanks for that Bono:).

uprising2

I hate that little self serving dikk, its all about Bono, Bono and Bono, the elites on-call 24/7 lapdancer.
The great humanitarian, he just ooze's sincerity to millions of deluded boners, hypocite, tax dodging runt.


"Hurry up and take the picture, he's breathing on me and this crap smells rotten".



"Look at them idiots george, they'd believe anything, isn't being us great!"

"Sure as heck is boner"





Intimate moment.









Remember the LIVE 8 "Make Poverty History" (past, present and future history!) scam.

Live 8: Corporate Media Bonanza
Disinformation Campaign and Public Relations Stunt on behalf of the G8

Distorting the Causes of Global Poverty
The concerts are totally devoid of political content. They concentrate on simple and misleading clichés.
They use poverty as a marketing tool and a consumer-advertising gimmick to increase the number of viewers and listeners worldwide.
Live 8 creates an aura of optimism. It conveys the impression that poverty can be vanquished with the stroke of the pen. All we need is good will. The message is that G8 leaders, together with the World Bank and the IMF, are ultimately committed to poverty alleviation.

In this regard, the concerts are part of the broader process of media disinformation. They are used as a timely public relations stunt for Prime Minister Tony Blair, who is hosting the G-8 Summit at Gleneagles, Scotland. Tony Blair is presented as stepping up his campaign to convince other G8 nations "to take action on poverty". The G8's Debt Forgiveness Proposal

Live 8 fails to challenge or comprehend the G8 policy agenda which directly contributes to creating poverty, nor does it question the role of the World Bank, now under the helm of Paul Wolfowitz, the neo-conservative architect of the invasion of Iraq,

In addressing the issue of debt forgiveness, Live 8 does not even acknowledge the impacts of IMF-World Bank "economic medicine" imposed on the World's poorest countries on behalf of Western creditors.

These deadly macro-economic reforms have contributed to the impoverishment of miillions of people. They oblige countries to close down their schools and hospitals, privatize their public services and sell off the most profitable sectors of their national economy to foreign capital. In return, the G8 promises to increase foreign aid and provide token debt relief. These reforms kill and the G8 is not the solution but the cause. Actor Will Smith addressed the crowds at the concert venues "to snap their fingers" as a reminder that every three seconds a child dies in Africa. What he failed to mention is that the main cause of child mortality in Africa are the deadly macroeconomic reforms.

Bob Geldof sees an increase in foreign aid completely out of context, as a "unique opportunity" to eradicating poverty, when in fact the proposed increase in aid flows by the rich G8 countries will lead to exactly the opposite results.

A large percentage of the debt of these countries is owed to the World Bank, the IMF and the African Development Bank
To address this issue, G8 finance ministers had indeed put forth a proposal which consisted in "foregiving" the outstanding debt owed to these three international financial institutions by the 18 highly indebted countries. The debt forgiveness figure mentioned was of the order of 40 billion dollars. Concurrently, there was a vague commitment to eventually increasing foreign aid flows to the 0.7% of GDP target. (http://www.g8.utoronto.ca/finance/fm050611_dev.htm )

Where is the hitch behind this seemingly reasonable "debt forgiveness" proposal?
The IMF, the World Bank and the African Development Bank, never cancel or forgive outstanding debts.

Because they do not forgive debts, the G8 has committed itself to reimbursing the multilateral creditors acting on behalf of the World's poorest countries.
Where will they get the money?

For each dollar of "debt cancellation" to the international financial institutions, the G8 will reduce the flow of foreign aid to these countries. In other words, the foreign aid earmarked to finance much needed social programs will now go directly into the coffers of the IMF and the World Bank.

There is nothing new in this financial mechanism. It has been used time and again since the onslaught of the debt crisis.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=641

“Live 8”--a political fraud on behalf of imperialism
Returning the favour, Geldof and Bono have been invited to attend the G8 summit. Almost every utterance made by the pair portrays Blair and Bush as the potential saviours of Africa, whilst keeping silent on their war against Iraq. Bono described Blair and Brown as “the John [Lennon] and Paul [McCartney] of the global development stage,”
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2005/jul2005/live-j01.shtml

Another sckening example of fat cat greed closer to home, Savage cutbacks being called for from a man, Dr Patrick Honohan whose predecessor was paid €369,078 a year, and doesn't like the idea of capping bank exec's salaries.

New Central Bank chief wants salary cap lifted
THE new governor of the Central Bank has come out against capping the salaries of top-earning bank executives.
In an exclusive interview with the Irish Independent, Dr Patrick Honohan said banks risked losing out on the best candidates if they could not offer competitive pay packages
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/new-central-bank-chief-wants-salary-cap-lifted-1947871.html

Central Bank boss calls for more savage cuts in Budget

By Donal O'Donovan and Sarah Collins

Tuesday September 21 2010

MORE savage Budget cutbacks are necessary if international investors are to be convinced that Ireland is on the path to recovery, the governor of the Central Bank warned yesterday.
Professor Patrick Honohan suggested the Government look again at its cost-cutting plans for the upcoming Budget.
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/central-bank-boss-calls-for-more-savage-cuts-in-budget-2345640.html

bonkey

This doesn't seem to be much about any sort of conspiracy....rather just a "rail against the injustice and inequality inherent in the system" thread.

As such, it seems more suited to somewhere like Humanities

uprising2

bonkey wrote: »

This doesn't seem to be much about any sort of conspiracy....rather just a "rail against the injustice and inequality inherent in the system" thread.

As such, it seems more suited to somewhere like Humanities

The conspiracy is that world leaders and various elites and international organisations act as if the want to stop and fix hunger and poverty, when the opposite is in fact what their true goals are, millions of people around the globe foolishly believe believe that the IMF,World Bank, Bono, Bill Gates, Bill Clinton and co are trying to relieve debt and suffering, the foolishly believe that the world cannot feed itself, that we need these multinational movers and shakers to make the world go round, when its all just a meaningless illusion, to keep the system as is.

Hope thats conspiracy enough.

bonkey

uprising2 wrote: »

The conspiracy is that world leaders and various elites and international organisations act as if the want to stop and fix hunger and poverty, when the opposite is in fact what their true goals are,

Thats not a conspiracy though....its assigning a motive to individuals to explain their actions, rather then showing that they are conspiring about anything.

People are greedy. We know this. Discussing human greed isn't a conspiracy theory. Accusing people of greed isn't a conspiracy theory.

Consider this...it is almost certain that the average poster on this forum lies above both the median and the average when it comes to wealth and standard of living. Its certain that simply by being able to read this message, you are in the top 33% when it comes to literacy, and in the top 7% simply by having access to a computer (regardless of whether or not you own it). If you went to college and got a degree, you're in the top 1% when it comes to education.

If you're not malnourished, you're already in the top 50%

Now...we can look at the fat cats and complain that they aren't solving the world's problems....and that's true. We're not solving them either, though. We have more then our fair share, and insist that the problem lies elsewhere...but that's not a conspiracy. Its not even greed. Its justifiable.

So tell me again where the conspiracy is? Is the conspiracy that people with more then their fair share are conspiring to do something? Are we all in on it then? We are the elite....at least in the eyes of those without.

I don't know about you, but I'm pretty sure I'm not conspiring to do anything to these people. I profess to care about them, but I'll readily admit that I'm also part of the problem. That's what it is, though. Its a problem, not a conspiracy.

So why does it become a conspiracy when its richer or more influential people? Why are they not just richer and more influential versions of us here...people who may or may not care about the problem, but either which way are part of the perpetuation of the problem?

So where is the conspiracy?

the foolishly believe that the world cannot feed itself,

Other then people trying to argue that its false, I haven't seen anyone suggest the idea that the current world population cannot be fed by the current world generation of food. I've never seen any activist who's combatting poverty and malnutrition suggest as much. I have never once seen someone suggest that we need to increase world food production in order to be able to feed people, or that we need to let people die of starvation because we don't have the food to feed them.

Nehaxak

uprising2 wrote: »

Maggie's son trying to take over a small African country, how very british of him..

Shows how utterly childish and out of touch they are really, in their coup document they list "bum-fúcking" rather than, oh I dunno, homosexuality or even sodomy - but no, they revert back to words used when you're 9 years old.

Brown Bomber

Bono's ONE foundation under fire for giving little over 1% of funds to charity

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1314543/Bonos-ONE-foundation-giving-tiny-percentage-funds-charity.html#ixzz10eNV5RDw

gizmo

Brown Bomber wrote: »

Bono's ONE foundation under fire for giving little over 1% of funds to charity

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1314543/Bonos-ONE-foundation-giving-tiny-percentage-funds-charity.html#ixzz10eNV5RDw

This was discussed over in AH already. ONE is more of a lobbyist group who do advocacy work rather than actual direct charity work. The idea being that the work they do helps raise more money than they actually have themselves. Also note that they take no money from the public so I think it's safe to assume those donating money know how it's going to be spent.