Atheist Godparent..

holidaysong

I'm just wondering if any atheists here have ever been asked to be a godparent before by any of their friends or family? And if so what did you do?

I mean it seems like the obvious thing to do would be to decline, as you can't stand there in a church promising to religiously guide this child through life when you don't believe in any of it yourself. How much do you run the risk of offending the parents of the child by doing this? But is that any more offensive than people who know you're an atheist asking you to be a godparent in the first place..?

Difficult situation.

drkpower

Yes, very difficult. Id be inclined to refuse the offer and to thereafter and forever more shun the family and the child for having ever set foot in a church.

ColmDawson

I would be very concerned if anyone I considered a friend got offended when their known atheist chum politely refused the request to be a godparent.

DeVore

I was asked by my sister to be godparent of the first of the next gen.... my mother and father are pleasantly religious, that is, they practice for themselves and we just agree not to argue about it.

I thought about it a lot and I was quite happy to promise to take care of the spiritual guidance of the child (I didnt say how!) and my sister didnt care at all. I asked my mother how she felt about it and her answer kinda surprised me; "I cant think of anyone better!". So, I took the job. I stood in a room beside a sink and said some words. As far as I am concerned thats what happened. For my family they saw something else and thats fine for them, I'm genuinely glad it was nice for them.

All of my family are aware of my scientific view of the world and my agnosticism so they knew what they were getting when they asked. I wouldnt interfere with my sisters choices regarding my godchilds religious upbringing but like all my nephews and nieces, once they are 18+ I will probably engage them with my world view.

DeV.

ColmDawson

DeVore wrote: »

I was asked by my sister to be godparent of the first of the next gen.... my mother and father are pleasantly religious, that is, they practice for themselves and we just agree not to argue about it.

I thought about it a lot and I was quite happy to promise to take care of the spiritual guidance of the child (I didnt say how!) and my sister didnt care at all. I asked my mother how she felt about it and her answer kinda surprised me; "I cant think of anyone better!". So, I took the job. I stood in a room beside a sink and said some words. As far as I am concerned thats what happened. For my family they saw something else and thats fine for them, I'm genuinely glad it was nice for them.

All of my family are aware of my scientific view of the world and my agnosticism so they knew what they were getting when they asked. I wouldnt interfere with my sisters choices regarding my godchilds religious upbringing but like all my nephews and nieces, once they are 18+ I will probably engage them with my world view.

DeV.

I of course don't know you or your family, but it strikes me as strange that your sister would ask you when she knows you're not a theist.

DeVore

I dont think she is particularly religious and would be more concerned about family unity and inclusion so she asked her only sister and brother to be god parents (yeah, the brother-in-law's family didnt get much of a look-in!).
My mothers take on it was, religious or not she considers me a "good moral person" and so I was fine for the job. Me, I vowed to look after my niece, which was unnecessary but fun.

DeV.

Einhard

ColmDawson wrote: »

I of course don't know you or your family, but it strikes me as strange that your sister would ask you when she knows you're not a theist.

I think because for most people, naming a godparent is about honouring someone in the family, rather than about nominating a substitute parent who will ensure religious continuity for the child. I'd be surprised if there are very many people who genuinely think about religion when naming godparents.

ColmDawson

Einhard wrote: »

I think because for most people, naming a godparent is about honouring someone in the family, rather than about nominating a substitute parent who will ensure religious continuity for the child. I'd be surprised if there are very many people who genuinely think about religion when naming godparents.

Yeah, I'd say that's probably right. I wish people would think about religion though!

Improbable

If someone asked me to be a godfather, as long as they knew that I'm an atheist, it wouldn't bother me. As far as I'm aware, these day a godparent is someone who takes care of a child if both the parents are dead rather than someone who is responsible for the spiritual upbringing of a child. I would just be honoured that they would trust me with something so important.

KidKeith89

I'd just say I'd promise to look after the child if anything ever happened his/her parents.

aurelius79

Being a godparent basically means that if anything happens to the child's parents the godparent accepts responsibility for the child. It has more to do with making sure an orphan remains with the family or friends as opposed to a state institution. It also means that you take part in the child's upbringing, teaching them how to be good people, regardless of their religion. You're basically just a co-parent, and parents need all the help they can get.

I would consider a refusal to be a godparent as a slap in the face to be honest. Go in to the church, do the silly little song and dance, and rest assured that your godson/daughter will not end up in care in the the event of both parents dying. As an atheist, it really shouldn't bother you to go into a church and promise to help raise a child.

You should consider it an honor that someone has asked you to help raise their child. Don't spit in their face because of your non-religious views. I am my youngest sister's godfather but am not Catholic, or indeed Christian for that matter. My mother is not a practicing Catholic but had my sister baptized because it's just the thing to do in this country.

Pushtrak

holidaysong wrote: »

I'm just wondering if any atheists here have ever been asked to be a godparent before by any of their friends or family? And if so what did you do?

I was asked this just this January. I didn't want to outright say no so I just came out and said I wasn't religious in the least and if he was ok with that (the brother) that I'd do it. Himself and his missus talked about it and went with someone else.

Honestly, when they were asking me I figured "Yeah, I'll do it" but then, going to the Christening I didn't even want to go into the church and when in there, seeing what the godparent was expected to do, I'm very happy I didn't go through with it. Would have been very uncomfortable. That was the last time I was in a church, the time before that? Must be about 3 years or so, I guess.

After being to two cousins' christenings and seeing what they have to swear, I would honestly have to decline. I would say I was flattered but that in all good conscience I couldn't accept. My family is religious enough and a protestant (:eek: hehe) was the godparent of one of the cousins but they all discussed what they'd do about spiritual upbringing etc.
But honestly I don't think you can show up to a church and swear to bring them up as a catholic or whatever the wording is, maybe it's a ceremony that means very little to people but I couldn't do that.

holidaysong

Thanks for all the replies there. They certainly sums up most, if not all, of the various perspectives on the topic very well.

After a bit more consideration, for me I think it essentially will boil down to being up front with the parents, that as far as the religious part of it goes, you'll just be going through the motions. If they were happy with that then I think I'd be happy enough to go through the charade in the church..

As was said previously, in this day and age I think it is more of an honourary position for most people. If that doesn't suit them, sure they're free to get someone else who is religious to do it.

RedXIV

If they were happy with me being non-relgious, i'd love to be a godparent. I'm with aurelius79, that its a few words, dress up a bit and still a fantastic offer. And likewise, I wouldn't be impressed with someone who declined the family's request

MagicMarker

I don't really get it tbh, if something happened to my nieces parents then I'll naturally want to look after them. What's the point in standing in a church as if you don't have a problem with it all? I'd feel like a hypocrite.

Thankfully, my nieces aren't christened!

Skrynesaver

First of all it's an honour that someone is conferring on you, and so I have on both occasions I've been asked accepted, both sets of parents in question understand where I stand on the existence of magical beings and though my sister would be borderline religious the parents of my other godchild went through the baptism for a combination of reasons, mainly for their own parents and access to schools for the child.

mohawk

I am godparent to twoof my cousins. I was a teenager at the time living at home when I was asked and I was a bit unsure but, it was made clear that if I said no it would be a huge insult. So I went along with it.
These days being a godparent appears to be about sending them birthday cards and buying Christmas presents. Which as an atheist I can go along with.

It would depend on the situation whether or not I would do it again. Many people just christen their children because its the done thing. It has nothing to do with religion. If it was someone who was actually religious I wouldn't be ok with being a god parent. I don't think anyone in my family would ask me again though because I am the black sheep. The crime that made me the black sheep is not baptising my son.

magicbastarder

i'm godfather to my niece. i was told to just smile and nod on the altar. job done.

Dades

aurelius79 wrote: »

Being a godparent basically means that if anything happens to the child's parents the godparent accepts responsibility for the child. It has more to do with making sure an orphan remains with the family or friends as opposed to a state institution. It also means that you take part in the child's upbringing, teaching them how to be good people, regardless of their religion. You're basically just a co-parent, and parents need all the help they can get. .

Being a godparent has no legal bearing on what happens a child in the event of the parents dying. That kind of stuff belongs in a will.

I think it's right to accept a godparent role, as long as the child's parents are aware of your beliefs (or lack of).

goose2005

According to the RCC

a sponsor assists an adult in Christian initiation or together with the parents presents an infant for baptism. A sponsor also helps the baptized person to lead a Christian life in keeping with baptism and to fulfill faithfully the obligations inherent in it.

[A godparent must] be a Catholic who has been confirmed and has already received the most holy sacrament of the Eucharist and who leads a life of faith in keeping with the function to be taken on;

A baptized person who belongs to a non-Catholic ecclesial community is not to participate except together with a Catholic sponsor and then only as a witness of the baptism.

If they want to get the baby baptized in a Catholic church, shouldn't they do the baptism according to the church's rules? A nonreligious naming ceremony seems a better option.

Shenshen

It would depend.
I have to admit that I'm not a big fan of small children, and the only person who ever told me that in case she has children, she'd want me as a godmother was a friend of mine who keeps trying to convince me that babies and toddlers are just fantastic and great and better than chocolate... (not saying they aren't, but I'm just not the least bit interested in them... I know that's weird and unnatural).

I think it would really depend on the situation, and quite possibly on the priest. If the parents would want me as an atheist, I've got no problems with that. But if they go for some sort of ultra-conservative ceremony and try to make me promise to help raise the child as a Catholic... how on earth am I supposed to be able to promise something like that???

Mrmoe

I am a godparent for my nephew. I do not really see a distinction between going to a christening, a wedding or a funeral. My sister knew my beliefs or lack of belief. In our family it is more of a way of honoring your family rather than as any spiritual guide.

It was only a five minute ceremony, we spent more time taking photographs. It is usually a good opportunity for all family members to come together and celebrate the arrival of a new baby.

Sardonicat

If the parents know that you are an atheist/agnostic they shouldn't ask you in the first place. It shows the whole thing up for the farce that it is. I was asked by by brother and I politely declined, citing my complete lack of religious belief. An atheist is hardly a suitable choice for a God parent.

There was no falling out over my refusal. I have a good relationship with my brother and his wife and I adore their kids.

strobe

Sardonicat wrote: »

If the parents know that you are an atheist/agnostic they shouldn't ask you in the first place. It shows the whole thing up for the farce that it is. I was asked by by brother and I politely declined, citing my complete lack of religious belief. An atheist is hardly a suitable choice for a God parent.

There was no falling out over my refusal. I have a good relationship with my brother and his wife and I adore their kids.

Well it's back to the al a carte thing. I agree with Aurelius, for most people it is about assigning someone to care for the child if anything happens to the parents. I know that's not the actual meaning of it but for the parents, in general, that is what it's about.

As an aside I really think secular alternatives to these religious ceremonies {weddings. funerals, baptisms, christenings}, if popularised, would do more to cripple religion than any amount of debates/talks/protests etc. It's not only a mean to diminish the influence of religion on the world, it is essential to that end.

Sardonicat

I fully appreciated the honour it was intended to be, but at the same time was a little put out by the position that they put me in. I think asking someone that you know for a fact is atheist/agnostic to be a God parent is going beyond al-la-carte. You clearly couldn't give a fig about your child's spiritual development if you ask an atheist. It is because I do have respect for the religious beliefs of others that I wouldn't accecpt the role. The child deserved someone who could fulfill the task should something happen to her parents. As it happened, my other sister became God-Mother; a woman who knows less about her religion then me but went through all the communion and confirmation malarchy with her son, i.e big party, expensive outfits etc. etc. Nothing religious or spiritual about it.

If people aren't serious about their religion, whatever it may be, then what is the point?

Helix

out of curiousity, is the godparent thing a legally binding thing? like, if the kids folks die are you bound by law to look after it?

strobe

Helix wrote: »

out of curiousity, is the godparent thing a legally binding thing? like, if the kids folks die are you bound by law to look after it?

No.

Helix

didnt think so

utterly pointless thing then so

i couldnt do it, i formally defected last year so im no longer a member of the catholic church. easy one to get out of if asked so "i cant, im not catholic"

Dave!

Been thinking about this a bit lately, as there's a slim chance that my brother could ask me to be the godfather of his next child (in the future laike!). I reckon if he does ask me I'll just have to talk to him and explain that I'm not religious and don't believe in any of it, so if he wants me to bring the child up as a good Catholic and discuss Jesus, etc., with it, then it's probably not a good idea to choose me. But if he's more interested in having someone take on a special role in the child's life, to discuss morality and ethics, be a good role-model and be someone that the child can discuss 'spiritual' matters with, then I'd be happy to do it, and I don't think that being religious is a requisite for such a job.

I'd say his missus wouldn't go for that though...

Dades

Helix wrote: »

out of curiousity, is the godparent thing a legally binding thing? like, if the kids folks die are you bound by law to look after it?

A few posts back :pac:

bnt

I was asked to be "godfather" to the daughter of friends of mine, but not in that "Catholic" sense. My friends are Christians, but in that generic Methodist way - bible stories for the kids, and so on. They're on the other side of the Atlantic, but I'm still closer than the rest of their families, who are in South Africa. They know I'm an atheist, and for a while I wondered whether they were doing that to try to attract me to Christ-inanity, but it seems that were just trying to be nice and hadn't thought about it too carefully.

Pushtrak

Being asked to be godfather. An offer you can refuse.

The Big Red Button

Sardonicat wrote: »

You clearly couldn't give a fig about your child's spiritual development if you ask an atheist.

Now, this, I wouldn't agree with.

If religious parents choose to ask a non-religious person to be godparent, chances are that the parents are prepared to take full responsibility for their child's spiritual development, and they are asking the non-religious person to be godparent for other reasons - perhaps they consider them to be a good, moral person and a good role model for their child. I know that the traditional role for godparent is to be responsible for the child in a religious sense, but really, in this day and age how many religious godparents even do that? At the end of the day, it's up to the parents how they want to raise their child. If they're prepared to take on the child's religious/spiritual education and development themselves and not to depend on the godparents for this, it's their own decision.

Personally, I suppose I'd describe myself as agnostic. But if I was ever asked to be a godparent, I'd consider it to be a great honour. I would make sure that the parents knew that I'm not religious and that I'd just be going through the motions on the alter. If they were OK with that, I would be happy to be godparent.

Denerick

I'm an agnostic but if I was ever asked I would make it very clear what my thoughts are, and should not be expected to 'spiritually guide' the child in any way shape or form. I understand for most people its all about honouring a family member, but as long as they understood what I'm about it wouldn't be a big deal.

Cú Giobach

Friends of mine who are quite agnostic had a child at school due to make his first communion, but he had never been baptised. They know how important it is for kids of that age to feel a part of their peer group. So as I was a close friend of their kids as well as with the parents, they asked myself and another friend of ours who is also atheistic, to be godparents for his baptism, so he could make his communion.
From when he was first able to talk and ask me such questions I never said anything other than I don't believe in a god.
We muttered our way through the ceremony and had no problem doing this, even though it did feel a bit uncomfortable.
The most important thing for all of us, was the little boy having a great time and feeling special.
He will when he is old enough make up his own mind about religion.
I think he is very lucky because from day one he has learned that some people believe in god and some dont.

Cú Giobach

Cú Giobach wrote: »

He will when he is old enough make up his own mind about religion.
I think he is very lucky because from day one he has learned that some people believe in god and some dont.

And that it's ok to tell people something you're not, particularly if you want to dress up and get communion money

Cú Giobach

bluewolf wrote: »

And that it's ok to tell people something you're not, particularly if you want to dress up and get communion money

What do you mean here?

deandean

I am referred to as a "Godless Godfather" and it works out fine.

IMHO you can provide support in many ways for your godchild regardless of your religious beliefs - if of course child's parents are OK with your position re: religion.

It is (for most) an honour to be asked to be a Godfather. Good luck with your decision.

DeVore

I promised to look after the spiritual wellbeing of my niece should anything happen to her parents (and even if something doesnt). My idea will be to give her what I got, which is a rounded explanation of all the worlds major religions and information about agnosticism and atheism, tell her what I believe and let her come to her own conclusions.

DeV.

mewso

Personally I would ask them to check with the priest. I wouldn't want to offend those who asked me but I don't think I would be willing to disrespect a religion no matter how I feel about it. If I go to a wedding/funeral I don't speak any of the words. Does the presence of a child mean it's then o.k. to drop all principles? Not a great start to setting an example.

Cú Giobach

Cú Giobach wrote: »

What do you mean here?

I mean agnostic parents going to the church and asking their atheist friend to "mutter through" a ceremony where nobody is catholic and promising to raise him catholic, all for a party and so he can "feel special" and "fit in"

lucianot

I said no, twice. A friend got offended and a year later he confessed to me he actually didn't believe in all that krapp and that I was right.
Consider this, would a catholic ask a friend of another religion to be a godfather? Most likely not.

magicbastarder

i didn't say yes for religious reasons. i said yes because it was a nice gesture to be asked.

Cú Giobach

bluewolf wrote: »

I mean agnostic parents going to the church and asking their atheist friend to "mutter through" a ceremony where nobody is catholic and promising to raise him catholic, all for a party and so he can "feel special" and "fit in"

He wanted to make his communion for his reasons (the fact all his class were, and 2 older sisters did, probably counted as well ).
"Fitting in" is arguably one of the most important things in the mind of a 7-8 year old and cannot, just be dismissed.
Looking back (that was quite a few years ago) I wouldn't change a thing. Neither would he nor his parents.

P.S. I Showed Him my Declaration of Defection a couple of years ago and he said he wanted to fill one out as well, The next time I meet him, I will mention it.
I'm not a good godparent in the real sense of the word, Bit none of us gives a flying f**k about that.
I was honoured to be asked and he was delighted to have me.

Dougla2

bluewolf wrote: »

And that it's ok to tell people something you're not, particularly if you want to dress up and get communion money

pff I didn't lie to get confirmation money i told everyone that i was atheist and I don't subscribe to such things I don't sell out my beliefs and i think its dumb to

strobe

Dougla2 wrote: »

pff I didn't lie to get confirmation money i told everyone that i was atheist and I don't subscribe to such things I don't sell out my beliefs and i think its dumb to

Screw that. I wanted my big wad of cash and turkey dinner down in The Red Cow. I wasn't saying anything to jeopardise that baby.

zyndacyclone

Been an atheist since I was old enough to tell the priest 'no'. Am also a godparent.

Atheism is no reason to say 'no'. It's about the kids, what's best for them.

lucianot

I didn't see it as an honour, it was a burden so I say no, and I was being honest.
Also the best for a newborn is not being signed up into a giant organized religion without its concent.

MagicMarker

zyndacyclone wrote: »

It's about the kids, what's best for them.

How, exactly?

FionnMatthew

aurelius79 wrote: »

Being a godparent basically means that if anything happens to the child's parents the godparent accepts responsibility for the child. It has more to do with making sure an orphan remains with the family or friends as opposed to a state institution. It also means that you take part in the child's upbringing, teaching them how to be good people, regardless of their religion. You're basically just a co-parent, and parents need all the help they can get.

I would consider a refusal to be a godparent as a slap in the face to be honest. Go in to the church, do the silly little song and dance, and rest assured that your godson/daughter will not end up in care in the the event of both parents dying. As an atheist, it really shouldn't bother you to go into a church and promise to help raise a child.

You should consider it an honor that someone has asked you to help raise their child. Don't spit in their face because of your non-religious views. I am my youngest sister's godfather but am not Catholic, or indeed Christian for that matter. My mother is not a practicing Catholic but had my sister baptized because it's just the thing to do in this country.

Hello? As a human being, it should cause you to take pause if asked to promise to raise a child! And it's pretty impertinent to ask someone to take on that responsibility, even extralegally, and make it such an issue that you'll take it as a slap in the face if it's refused. I don't like children, but even if I did, promising to take them as your own is momentous. It's a massive responsibility to ask someone to take on, especially if, as with me, I have no intention of taking on the life sentence of bringing up yet another bloody human being, least of all one of my own. Why would I make a fake or genuine promise to anyone to do it for the poor fools they decided to bring into the world?

I was asked to be the godfather of my uncle's firstborn, and I refused. It caused me some consternation, and I resented him for having asked me, for having asked me to do something when he knew I regard the institution through which that tradition is continued only with the most extreme of contempt, and when within familial etiquette, to refuse such a thing is such a slight that agreeing to do it is supposed to be an overriding duty.

I refused because I want to have no part in his reproductive participation in a religious institution, and also because I wish to have no part in raising his child. On the first count, perhaps this is more of a principled objection to being part of something you fundamentally disagree with, and also to making promises you not only have no intention to keep, but are already disqualified from making, but on the second count, this is one of the most practical objections you could ask for, and I'm surprised it doesn't even occur to you to mention it in your post.

When I refused, my uncle took me aside, and said, it's all a load of bollocks anyway, would you not just do it? And I said that if it is a load of bollocks, he shouldn't christen his child. He wasn't pleased, but he got over it, and he respected the decision in the end. And I got not to compromise my principles, to speak truth to someone I otherwise respect, and avoided playing silent pillar to an organization that I would rip rudely from the world if I could.

I think strobe is right, too. The more atheists refuse to enable this ceremonial nonsense, the quicker the church will be disempowered in its structuring of our familial relationships.

Everyone's talking about how it's about doing what's best for the child, but if I had a choice now about whether I wanted that filthy organization to be able to claim me for the years until I defected as a member, I would say no. And I resent that that decision was made for me. I resent that my parents didn't have the presence of mind to throw off the religion they only superficially adhered to to satisfy their parents. So much of the support these institutions enjoy is because of this sort of cowardice.

Mrmoe wrote: »

I am a godparent for my nephew. I do not really see a distinction between going to a christening, a wedding or a funeral. My sister knew my beliefs or lack of belief. In our family it is more of a way of honoring your family rather than as any spiritual guide.

It was only a five minute ceremony, we spent more time taking photographs. It is usually a good opportunity for all family members to come together and celebrate the arrival of a new baby.

I have attended funerals at times, but I categorically refuse to attend weddings.