Medicine course thread

Taco Chips

chymes wrote: »

Hi,

I'm looking to choose between TCD Med and another UK School. I was just wondering if the papers reflected on tcd.ie/Local/Exam_Papers are accurate?

Because the physiology papers at least in year one seem to differ quite a bit from other UK schools in the sense they don't test it in a integrative style. And is it then correct to assume there are 9 papers in one year? (seems like a lot to study haha)

By integrative style i'm talking about those questions that seem to appear in the year 5 papers where they ask you about abnormalities and such...

Also, does TCD use a Systems-based approach in teaching??

Trinity does not teach systems based modules. In first year you learn Anatomy and Physiology in separate lectures, but they are both assessed together (in separate sections) on the same exam paper at Christmas and at Summer. Biochemistry is also a separate subject in first year.

In second year you cover Pharmacology, Clinical Biochem, Head & Neck Anatomy, Molecular Medicine, Microbiology, Pathology, Neuroscience. Micro and Path are tested on the same paper. Neuroscience consists of 2 papers and includes neuroanatomy, neurophysiology, neuropharmacology, neurochemistry and neuropsychiatry. I suppose the neuroscience module is as close to systems based as you will get.

There are benefits and weaknesses towards both methods of teaching. I only have experience of the Trinity system so can't comment on the other ways.

chymes

Hi

And what would be the advantage and disadvantage of this? Sorry I'm just trying to find out as much as I can so I can make a good decision that I don't regret . Would this be considered pre med and clinical separation kind of teaching style? Although it does seem to be a mix of both...

Taco Chips

chymes wrote: »

Hi

And what would be the advantage and disadvantage of this? Sorry I'm just trying to find out as much as I can so I can make a good decision that I don't regret . Would this be considered pre med and clinical separation kind of teaching style? Although it does seem to be a mix of both...

Well there is plenty of clinical aspect in all areas of teaching. It is a clinical and academic degree after all. You can't separate the two. It's not premed education, it would be better described as pre formal clinical teaching in that you aren't directly dealing with patients but rather learning all of the science you will need.

I suppose in a general sense the disadvantages are it can often be a lot harder to connect the dots between all of the systems in the human body when you are taught each aspect in isolation. This is especially true at the start when you really don't know anything in the first place. But as time passes you will get better as integrating knowledge for yourself. Advantages I suppose are the other side of this in that it probably pushes you to be a lot more critical thinking since you have to connect all the dots for yourself. You will understand a lot or a little depending on how hard you work. It's more academically challenging in that aspect.

Depends on what you consider an advantage tbh. There are often times when I wish I was being taught systems based and other times when I'm fine with the way things are. It's nice to have an overview of every aspect of a human system presented to you in one go thats for sure.

sleepyheadh

Hi just finished first year in TCD.

I would love to take a look at the papers that you are looking at from the UK, see how they differ from the TCD ones.

Even one lecture said during the year that the only thing integrated in TCD is the exams. They like to say that the modules are all integrated but in reality they couldn't be further from it. As you can probably see from the papers, in the Anatomy and physiology there is one "integrated" question - which this year was basically a clinical based question, on a topic with two completely separate question one for anatomy and one for physiology. They system is no more integrated!

With regards to the papers listed in the portal. There are only 3 exams in Christmas (Michaelmas term) - Biochemistry essays paper, Biochemistry Multiple Choice Questions (MCQ's) ( this is only 20 Q's that take literally 5 mins to complete), and Anatomy and Physiology.

At summer (Hilary term) there are four papers, (i) Biochemistry Long questions and (ii) MCQ's, (iii) Anatomy and Physiology, and (iv) Human development, Behavioural science and Ethics.

Overall the work load is pretty decent, especially at summer you will basically have 4 entire weeks off before your first exam so as long as you keep on top of the work during the year and attend most of the lectures you should be fine.

Any more questions I'd love to help you with them!

chymes wrote: »

Hi,

I'm looking to choose between TCD Med and another UK School. I was just wondering if the papers reflected on tcd.ie/Local/Exam_Papers are accurate?

Because the physiology papers at least in year one seem to differ quite a bit from other UK schools in the sense they don't test it in a integrative style. And is it then correct to assume there are 9 papers in one year? (seems like a lot to study haha)

By integrative style i'm talking about those questions that seem to appear in the year 5 papers where they ask you about abnormalities and such...

Also, does TCD use a Systems-based approach in teaching??

chymes

sleepyheadh wrote: »

Hi just finished first year in TCD.

I would love to take a look at the papers that you are looking at from the UK, see how they differ from the TCD ones.

Even one lecture said during the year that the only thing integrated in TCD is the exams. They like to say that the modules are all integrated but in reality they couldn't be further from it. As you can probably see from the papers, in the Anatomy and physiology there is one "integrated" question - which this year was basically a clinical based question, on a topic with two completely separate question one for anatomy and one for physiology. They system is no more integrated!

With regards to the papers listed in the portal. There are only 3 exams in Christmas (Michaelmas term) - Biochemistry essays paper, Biochemistry Multiple Choice Questions (MCQ's) ( this is only 20 Q's that take literally 5 mins to complete), and Anatomy and Physiology.

At summer (Hilary term) there are four papers, (i) Biochemistry Long questions and (ii) MCQ's, (iii) Anatomy and Physiology, and (iv) Human development, Behavioural science and Ethics.

Overall the work load is pretty decent, especially at summer you will basically have 4 entire weeks off before your first exam so as long as you keep on top of the work during the year and attend most of the lectures you should be fine.

Any more questions I'd love to help you with them!

I googled for Glasgow University Medicine Papers! I was wondering which would give you the best training to be a good doctor! (No, I'm not trying to start some war here, I know they are both good schools, but one cannot deny that even among good schools there are differing standards).

And this get's me a bit worried because just flipping through the papers roughly there seems to be a big jump in difficulty level from Year 1 to Year 4-5, where they seem to magically expect you to integrate everything yourself! (Year 4-5 questions seems to be integrated on systems based there after)

And...Hmm you probably wouldn't know because you're year 1/2 now! But would there be any graduating/graduated doctors able to tell if this lack of integration makes it difficult in coping and performing as a housemen? Ofc, I have often heard doctors saying that what they study in Med school sometimes isn't really THAT relevant after all. Because I hope to be able to return to my home country after studying in Ireland!

Thanks so much for your help and advise!

sleepyheadh

can you send me a link i can't see any on google thanks!

It really isn't that much of an outlandish statement, loads of students in TCD will say that the organisation of the course and the layout of material is far from optimal. Often times i find myself looking towards the US Med schools websites which offer a much more structured approach.

One that will be explained to you fairly early in med school is that the stuff you are learning is not going to matter in a few years. obviously the major stuff still will, anatomy isn't going to change but treatments etc. The goal of a med school is not to train you for life it is simply to provide you with enough basic information, so that when you are on your internship and out of rotation in later years you don't look like a complete idiot. In this way, you can look at it like going back to primary school. Its only the bare minimum of concepts which can be built on latter.

As far as I can tell there some be no real difference between the Doc from TCD than from anywhere else. later years are far more important than the initial years in med school.

AndrewJD

To be honest I think you're over-worrying about the significance of integrated teaching. It's lovely I'm sure, and probably gives you a more rounded knowledge of things entering third year, but from that point you're taught everything clinically. Teaching in third and fourth year is centred around disease areas, so is systems based from then on. This draws upon any relevant bits and throws away the irrelevant parts of biochemistry, physiology and anatomy and adds in all the good medicine stuff on top. So you're not integrating anything yourself. It's not difficult to transition to this style, I'd honestly never thought about it until right now.

And I can guarantee you there are no junior doctors running around at 3am cursing their choice in medical school because of how unintegrated their pre-clinical years were.

sleepyheadh

AndrewJD wrote: »

To be honest I think you're over-worrying about the significance of integrated teaching. It's lovely I'm sure, and probably gives you a more rounded knowledge of things entering third year, but from that point you're taught everything clinically. Teaching in third and fourth year is centred around disease areas, so is systems based from then on. This draws upon any relevant bits and throws away the irrelevant parts of biochemistry, physiology and anatomy and adds in all the good medicine stuff on top. So you're not integrating anything yourself. It's not difficult to transition to this style, I'd honestly never thought about it until right now.

And I can guarantee you there are no junior doctors running around at 3am cursing their choice in medical school because of how unintegrated their pre-clinical years were.

Exactly

Kez1

chymes wrote: »

And this get's me a bit worried because just flipping through the papers roughly there seems to be a big jump in difficulty level from Year 1 to Year 4-5, where they seem to magically expect you to integrate everything yourself! (Year 4-5 questions seems to be integrated on systems based there after)

Of course the difficulty level has jumped, you've gone from 1st year medicine to 5th year! And no they don't magically expect anything, we are taught in a more integrated style, more clinically after 2nd year. Not trying to be rude but you're judging which college to go to based on how they examine, that doesn't seem very smart to me. And again, if I seem harsh I'm not trying to be but do you have a medical background? If not then of course flicking through the papers you think they look horrible. Yes the exams are hard there's no doubt about that but they're not impossible otherwise TCD wouldn't have 100+ doctors graduating each year.

Pick a college you think can offer you more- more support, opportunities to better yourself, prestige if you're into that, early clinical teaching rather than later, opportunities of Masters in the degree, opportunities to be involved in research projects and to be published. All of these are some of the benefits of TCD.

chymes

Thanks for all the info you've given Real helpful!

@Sleepyhead: Dropped you a PM. Sorry for the late reply! Was away

@Rest: Do you recommend getting BRS in addition with Sherwood? I've heard that BRS Physiology is really good to get and was wondering if i should purchase it before i fly over to Dublin. (Is the BRS content enough?/Anyone that has used it willing to share their opinions on it?)

sleepyheadh

Hi Guys,

I was wondering if one of you nice folks would be able to give kind of a quick "absolutely essential" booklist for 2nd year Med.

I am talking about Sherwood's level of essentialness. I would really appreciate it guys, thanks. ;-)

medicine12345

sleepyheadh wrote: »

Hi Guys,

I was wondering if one of you nice folks would be able to give kind of a quick "absolutely essential" booklist for 2nd year Med.

I am talking about Sherwood's level of essentialness. I would really appreciate it guys, thanks. ;-)

ill try and remember what i used!
-pharm - rang and dale
-neuroscience - fitzgerald or crossman and neary for anatomy; pharm - rang and dale; chem - basic biochem siegel (available online for free); phys - lecture notes mostly; psych - lecture notes
-mol med - notes mostly, google, etc
-clinical skills - talley and o'connor
-head and neck anatomy - just netters and lasts or grays & PT notes
-clinical biochem - cant really remem, notes mostly, maybe some of kumar and clark for endo
Think thats everything?

medicine12345

sleepyheadh wrote: »

Hi Guys,

I was wondering if one of you nice folks would be able to give kind of a quick "absolutely essential" booklist for 2nd year Med.

I am talking about Sherwood's level of essentialness. I would really appreciate it guys, thanks. ;-)

ill try and remember what i used!
-pharm - lecture notes & rang and dale
-neuroscience - fitzgerald or crossman and neary for anatomy; pharm - rang and dale; chem - basic biochem siegel (available online for free); phys - lecture notes mostly; psych - lecture notes
-mol med - notes mostly, google, etc
-clinical skills - talley and o'connor
-head and neck anatomy - just netters and lasts or grays & PT notes
-clinical biochem - cant really remem, notes mostly, maybe some of kumar and clark for endo
Think thats everything?

sleepyheadh

medicine12345 wrote: »

ill try and remember what i used!
-pharm - lecture notes & rang and dale
-neuroscience - fitzgerald or crossman and neary for anatomy; pharm - rang and dale; chem - basic biochem siegel (available online for free); phys - lecture notes mostly; psych - lecture notes
-mol med - notes mostly, google, etc
-clinical skills - talley and o'connor
-head and neck anatomy - just netters and lasts or grays & PT notes
-clinical biochem - cant really remem, notes mostly, maybe some of kumar and clark for endo
Think thats everything?

thanks thats awesome!

Kez1

Can any final meds recommend textbooks for fourth med please?

Jezek

Kez1 wrote: »

Can any final meds recommend textbooks for fourth med please?

impey for gynae
sunflower book for pads
core psychiatry
no book for gp

A Neurotic

Oxford handbooks for obs/gynae and psych are great also. There's a paeds book called something like clinical paediatrics for postgraduate examinations which is very good for OSCEs and clinical finals.

outnumbered

Hey guys,
I am going into SF HHD and will be doing the same Human Form and Function module that you do in first year. Does anyone know where I can find the notes for this module? Or does anyone have the notes that they could email to me?
Thanks in advance!

Taco Chips

outnumbered wrote: »

Hey guys,
I am going into SF HHD and will be doing the same Human Form and Function module that you do in first year. Does anyone know where I can find the notes for this module? Or does anyone have the notes that they could email to me?
Thanks in advance!

All the notes will probably be put up on Blackboard during the year. How it worked for us was PT emailed his notes in advance of the lecture, some of the physiologists had theirs up before, some after. This module is a beast, theres a lot of content. You will be suffocated with information trust me haha! Also I think the physio ones are revised from what I have. If you're still interested send me a PM and I'll link you.

Healium

Has anyone on here entered as a mature student in recent years?

eigenboggle

Healium wrote: »

Has anyone on here entered as a mature student in recent years?

Hi Healium, I was offered a place as a mature student in this years CAO round 0. I saw your posts on another thread regarding application and can answer questions about applying as a mature student if you have any. But as I start in September I have no idea what the course is like for mature students, yet

EDIT: Words. I shouldn't post while watching Great British Bake Off.

Kez1

Hey!

Could the new interns/ex-final meds recommend books needed for final year? Also any tips?