Soon to need a prescription for Nurofen/Solphadine/etc?

law86

deelite wrote: »

Will I have to travel to Newry now to get a hangover cure?????

I wouldn't go to Newry this month to cure a hangover; all that marching and drumming is a lethal dose.

SeaFields

These regulations are long overdue. There is a significant amount of people with a dependence on codeine unbeknown to themselves. Anecdotally solpadine and nurofen+ are the single, biggest selling item in most pharmacies.

bleg

phasers wrote: »

The Government has pissed off a lot of hormonal women. They'll live to regret this.

Nothing to do with the Government.

Vladidim

bleg wrote: »

Nothing to do with the Government.

All the legislation surrounding the setting up of this government quango two years ago was devised and signed into law by guess who -the government. Hog Harney also makes regular recommendations to the PSI.

Sick of people talking about 8mg of codeine. Thats why it says on the back of the box to take TWO tablets. So it's 16mg codeine or 22mg for Nurofen Plus per dose.

Its like if I wanted paracetamol removed from sale, so I stamped on it, picked up one of the pieces of dust and proclaimed this only has 0.01 mg of paracetamol in it, that amount is sub-therapeutic!

Also, if the doses of codeine are just addictive and not therapeutic, how did these medicines get their licence from the Irish Medicines Board in the first place? I suspect this is just more bullshlt reasoning we are getting from pharmacists and the PSI to justify half-assed "guidelines" (which incidentally have absolutely no basis in law so could just be ignored outright)

yogy

Vladidim wrote: »

Its like if I wanted paracetamol removed from sale, so I stamped on it, picked up one of the pieces of dust and proclaimed this only has 0.01 mg of paracetamol in it, that amount is sub-therapeutic!

What the **** is that waffle all about?

Vladidim wrote: »

Also, if the doses of codeine are just addictive and not therapeutic, how did these medicines get their licence from the Irish Medicines Board in the first place? I suspect this is just more bullshlt reasoning we are getting from pharmacists and the PSI to justify half-assed "guidelines" (which incidentally have absolutely no basis in law so could just be ignored outright)

Why would there be any problem in getting a license for something that may be sub-therapeutic in dose? The only issue regards licensing would be if the dose is too high.

8mg of codeine per tablet has been proven to be sub-therapeutic which, if anything, makes it easier to get these products licensed.

You obviously have little understanding of the situation if you think these guidelines are an attempt by "pharmacists and the PSI to justify half-assed guidelines"...These guidelines are attempted to be forced upon pharmacies by the PSI, the body which regulates the pharmacy profession. The pharmacies have nothing to do with the drawing up of such guidelines, they are expected to implement them.

Kurtosis

yogy wrote: »

At the end of the day the only actual change will be that these products are no longer on display...

If the PSI think that a pharmacist in a busy pharmacy (prescription wise) has the time to personally interview every patient who asks for a pack of solpadeine then they are kidding themselves..

While it's quite likely that putting it out of view will be the only change, I would be hopeful that at least in some pharmacies, more of an effort will be made by staff (either pharmacists or trained counter staff) to check the suitability of these medicines and give appropriate advice on their use. Even if only a small proportion of pharmacies did this, it would be some small achievement.

genericguy

mardybumbum wrote: »

Pharmacogenetics people, PHARMACOGENETICS. :pac:
Who would have thought I could learn something in AH.

that's pharmacology, not pharmacogenetics.

Kurtosis

genericguy wrote: »

that's pharmacology, not pharmacogenetics.

It is pharmacogenetics ("the branch of genetics that studies the genetically determined variations in responses to drugs in humans or laboratory organisms"), but pharmacogenetics is part of pharmacology too, so you can both be right :pac:

mardybumbum

genericguy wrote: »

that's pharmacology, not pharmacogenetics.

Huh?

bleg

penguin88 wrote: »

While it's quite likely that putting it out of view will be the only change, I would be hopeful that at least in some pharmacies, more of an effort will be made by staff (either pharmacists or trained counter staff) to check the suitability of these medicines and give appropriate advice on their use. Even if only a small proportion of pharmacies did this, it would be some small achievement.

The reps are expecting at least a 75% drop in sales of these products.

genericguy

penguin88 wrote: »

It is pharmacogenetics ("the branch of genetics that studies the genetically determined variations in responses to drugs in humans or laboratory organisms"), but pharmacogenetics is part of pharmacology too, so you can both be right :pac:

nah, they were talking about the effects of ethanol toxicity which is more a situational issue, not heritable variation in the gene expression profile of the individual, so i'm claiming it.

vodafoneproblem

Was walking by a pharmacy today and remembered this issue so I decided to go in and buy a packet. They were still out on a large display and the woman who sold them to me couldn't have been nicer. I wonder is word going around that people are getting worried about their availability. I would say that out of the last 4 times I've bought them over the last year or so, at least 3 of those times I've been given a friendly reminder about the addictive nature of codeine, including in this particular pharmacy. Not a word said today!

gcgirl

I may feck off up to Newry to get stocked up pile of ****e of you ask me !

Herbal Deity

gcgirl wrote: »

I may feck off up to Newry to get stocked up pile of ****e of you ask me !

You should really learn to read threads.

mardybumbum

genericguy wrote: »

nah, they were talking about the effects of ethanol toxicity which is more a situational issue, not heritable variation in the gene expression profile of the individual, so i'm claiming it.

Claim away there mate.
If you actually take the time to read my post again you will see that the discussion revolved around paracetamol, not alcohol (unless paracetamol is the name of a new beverage I'm not aware of).
The 2D6 isoenzyme is extremely important in individual variations. At least 1 to 2% of caucasians are ultra rapid metabolisers of paracetamol. High levels of NAPQI and morphine ( in codeine-paracetamol combos ) is something they need to watch out for.

And by the by, there is huge genetic variance in alcohol metabolism also.

One final thing I must point out is that pharmacogenetics is a branch of pharmacology.
To say "thats pharmacology, not pharmacogenetics" is similar to saying "thats maths, not trigonometry".

Run_to_da_hills

Nevore wrote: »

Jesus. It'll be cheaper and more convenient to ask my dealer to start stocking it.

You will probably now get 5 years for possessing more than one packet without a prescription..

Coriolanus

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

You will probably now get 5 years for possessing more than one packet without a prescription..

Ha! Possession with intent to supply.

Run_to_da_hills

Nevore wrote: »

Ha! Possession with intent to supply.

Seriously, having large quantities of any prescribed drug including Viagra would be considered as possession with the intent to supply. (dealing)

Captain Flaps

We've taken all codeine products off the shelves in the pharmacy I work in and we were all given a leaflet to read listing the signs of codeine abuse. I'm not certain of the timescale but you WILL need to consult the pharmacist before they'll dispense any codeine.

bleg

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Seriously, having large quantities of any prescribed drug including Viagra would be considered as possession with the intent to supply. (dealing)

What's wrong with that. It's a fairly reasonable conclusion to come to. Prescription meds are given out on a monthly basis (barring some drugs and some exceptional basis). Why would one have large quantities of prescription drugs?

Coriolanus

bleg wrote: »

Why would one have large quantities of prescription drugs?

When you're given a repeating prescription for a discretionary treatment?

Run_to_da_hills

bleg wrote: »

What's wrong with that. It's a fairly reasonable conclusion to come to. Prescription meds are given out on a monthly basis (barring some drugs and some exceptional basis). Why would one have large quantities of prescription drugs?

Plenty of reasons, someone who needs a regular supply of nurofen or solpedeine and can get it 1/3 rd the price over the counter in Spain. Why not get several months supply of it when coming back from holidays.

bleg

Nevore wrote: »

When you're given a repeating prescription for a discretionary treatment?

But that prescription is only valid for 6 months.

bleg

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Plenty of reasons, someone who needs a regular supply of nurofen or solpedeine and can get it 30% cheaper over the counter in Spain. Why not get several months supply of it when coming back from holidays.

Those aren't prescription drugs...

Run_to_da_hills

bleg wrote: »

Those aren't prescription drugs...

They will be and you will see a lot more people bringing them in from abroad where they can be got for less than half the price.

bleg

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

They will be and you will see a lot more people bringing them in from abroad where they can be got for less than half the price.

When will they be restricted to prescription only?

goat2

rarnes1 wrote: »

Your wife grew headaches when you got the horn?

?

he must be boring in the sack

sesna

bleg wrote: »

When will they be restricted to prescription only?

They wont be. Now you will go into a pharmacy and ask for a codeine-containing painkiller. The pharmacist will most likely recommend something else first. If you're not happy with that and have good reason, the pharmacist will put on a serious face and warn you of the dangers of codeine before supplying it to you, or refuse to sell it.

This is bulls*hit regulation from the PSI. Hint - the Irish Medicines Board decides on prescription status. They have concluded most codeine containing products are perfectly safe.

The pharmacists in the PSI aren't all very happy about this, and presumably want to flex their muscle given they have been in operation for two years now as regulator. As they can't legally change prescription status (once again this is not in their remit), they invented these stupid "guidelines" which in my opinion, will serve to remove codeine from people who would have used it safely, while resourceful addicts will still be able to buy it no problem.

If there is a problem, the IMB would have moved it to prescription only status. They commonly change prescription licences from prescription to not needing a prescription, and vice versa.

Also if there is a problem, it suggests to me pharmacists have been negligent in supplying it, the Irish Medicines Board has been negligent in not controlling it properly by putting it on prescription, and the system of obtaining medicines is flawed by virtue of the fact that there are 8 different pharmacies in any average town where you can get your medicines from.

bleg

sesna wrote: »

They wont be.

I was just waiting for him to try to back up his claim. I know he's talking rubbish.

yogy

These are 3 probable scenarios:

Scenario #1:

JoePublic (after looking around a bit lost looking):."Hi, do you not sell solpadeine here?"

Pharmacist: "We do, we just don't display it anymore"

JoeP: "Fair enough, give us a pack of of solpadeine please, 24, soluble"

Pharmacist: "You do realise these contain codeine and..."

JoeP: "Ya, ya, I know...max dose is 8 a day and all that"

Pharmacist: "Well I am obliged to inform you.."

JoeP: "I know ya, cheers, here ya go..

Pharmacist: "Thank you"..

Scenario #2

JoeP: "Hi, can I have a pack of nurofen plus please"

Pharmacist: "Do you mind me asking what is the problem?"

JoeP: "I have a wicked toothache, I was up all night"

Pharmacist: "What about taking some plain nurofen first off to see if that does it"

JoeP: "Nah, you're all right I'd prefer the plus"

Pharmacist: "Sorry but I think nurofen might be sufficent, you might be unnecessarily taking codeine"

JoeP: "So will you not sell me any of the plus?"

Pharmacist: "I'm afraid not!"

And off goes JoeP into the other pharmacy 2 doors down to get served his nurofen plus.

Scenario #3:

JoeP: "Hi, do you have any solpadeine?"

Assistant: "Hold on and I'll get the pharmacist
(comes over to Pharmacist in dispensary)..
."that man wants some solpadeine, can you talk to him?"

Pharmacist: "Look, it's lunchtime and I've got 5 Rx's to dispense including Mrs. Murphy who wants all her Amitriptyline 25mg split in half along with the other 27 items on her Rx, just give him a pack of solpadeine...Thanks"

If you ask me they should treat these products like cigarettes...
1) Don't sell to minors
2) Ban advertising of these products (inc. pharmacy windows)
3) Have big warnings like on fags saying: "WARNING, EXCESSIVE USE MAY LEAD TO ADDICTION"
(maybe even have a picture of a junkie madouvit on the box!! )