Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

LeeroyJones

With ROG not going to be around by 2015 I think we should keep Humphreys in mind and perhaps give him some caps. He's currently 29 and it could be useful to have an experienced head on offer. Consistency is a real concern though.
For me, Keatley is the #1 contender to play second fiddle to Sexton but we should try to have 3 fly-halves developed so we can have different horses for different courses if we are forced into a reshuffle.

.ak

GerM wrote: »

Naturally gifted? Definitely. But I'm not sure he has the consistency or character to be considered way out ahead of Keatley or not far behind ROG and Sexton. Fantastic player to watch but you always worry he'll do something awful when on the field.

I'm a big Humphreys fan so maybe a little biased, but I think he's a class fly-half, extremely good hands and has the attributes of a center at times. But you're right, it's consistency that sets him apart from Sexto/ROG. Big time. But I do think he's miles ahead of Keatley...

wixfjord

I love watching Humpreys play, rivals Sexton for our best attacking 10 imo, but no way would I trust him in a big international game, particularly on the tackling side.

Having said that, I'd play him before Keatley.

Madigan could be a dark horse for the backup 10 jersey if he continues how he has been, particularly if he can play 12 aswell.

danthefan

Ian Humphreys shirks his defensive duties like no player I've ever seen. I'd take Keatley every time.

Madigan won't ever be an option if he's not a regular goal kicker.

Hagz

danthefan wrote: »

Madigan won't ever be an option if he's not a regular goal kicker.

That's unfortunate though isn't it. We should really be more open to other positions kicking at goal. Obviously there's no need for it when Sexton and ROG are great at it, but players like Kearney, McFadden and then you have young McGrath coming up, all have potential in that department. I'd hate for Madigan to continue to improve to the point where he is the best back-up to Sexton, yet he wont be picked based on his poor kicking skills.

GerM

Madigan has some boot on him though if he gets some regular chances to kick. The penalty against Connacht was a monster. He did something similar against Glasgow a couple of years ago when he was 20 against Glasgow slotting one from well inside his half. I hope he gets some regular efforts at kicking because he's a very clean kicker of the ball. I was always critical of his game management but he has improved significantly. I'm not sure if he'll ever be an international option as long as he's with Leinster alongside Sexton but he's definitely a talented option. I've heard his defence criticised several times but I'd like to see him get a run at 12 just to see how he goes. He played there for the Ireland U20 side but I don't think he has ever played anything but 10 or 15 at senior level. His passing and low centre of gravity break could be very effective at 12.

.ak

Madigan nailed some very very hard kicks this season. I hope he gets more runs before Berqy gets back.

desertcircus

Hagz wrote: »

That's unfortunate though isn't it. We should really be more open to other positions kicking at goal. Obviously there's no need for it when Sexton and ROG are great at it, but players like Kearney, McFadden and then you have young McGrath coming up, all have potential in that department. I'd hate for Madigan to continue to improve to the point where he is the best back-up to Sexton, yet he wont be picked based on his poor kicking skills.

I'm not so sure that his kicking skills are poor. He nailed a penalty against Connacht from inside the Leinster half, before knocking over a drop goal to kill Connacht's chances of going home with a losing bonus point. I think to a certain extent he suffers from the fact that Nacewa's in the side and is a good enough kicker to be the second choice from the tee - so Madigan gets little chance to prove himself as long as either Isa or Jonny are on the field.

Incidentally, though, he was excellent while the World Cup was on - he has a mean burst of pace and a sharp eye for a gap.

Podge_irl

Is Madigan's kicking actually poor or does he just not do it for some other reason?

CIARAN_BOYLE

Podge_irl wrote: »

Is Madigan's kicking actually poor or does he just not do it for some other reason?

He always seemed to get good percentages last year when kicking in the B&I cup. I think it is the opinion of the management that a young OH should have the pressure taken off him and to let someone else kick.

Warwick kicked a lot for Munster when Deasy and Cusack got games at 10 last season for Munster and I seem to recall Wallace kicking one game last season when Jackson played at 10.

Its not just a Leinster thing.

irishbucsfan

In fairness when Sexton was younger and he would have a bad day kicking the rest of his game would suffer. I remember for Ireland A he missed about 6 kicks in a game (not the year they won the Churchill, before that) and he was woeful. I'd imagine not having that sort of pressure would make everything a little easier. And it seems to be working with Madigan.

It might be a bit of an odd thing to say, but I hope that he lacks just enough ambition to remain behind Sexton for a while longer, because I'm sure others (Connacht, or British clubs) will come knocking with better offers.

jacothelad

danthefan wrote: »

Ian Humphreys shirks his defensive duties like no player I've ever seen. I'd take Keatley every time.

Madigan won't ever be an option if he's not a regular goal kicker.

No he doesn't. He isn't a good tackler but he doesn't 'shirk' anything.

totallegend

Possibly raised elsewhere, but yesterday's Sunday Times says that Gaffney is not going to be replaced, at least not ahead of the 6N, and that Kiss and Tainton will take over responsibility for attack. Also, McNaughton is leaving and no replacement has been lined up. Are we seeing an EOS-style concentration of power here?

The same paper carried a piece on DOC's book, which seems to say that he prefers Eddie's style of management to that of Kidney...

chupacabra

totallegend wrote: »

Possibly raised elsewhere, but yesterday's Sunday Times says that Gaffney is not going to be replaced, at least not ahead of the 6N, and that Kiss and Tainton will take over responsibility for attack. Also, McNaughton is leaving and no replacement has been lined up. Are we seeing an EOS-style concentration of power here?

The same paper carried a piece on DOC's book, which seems to say that he prefers Eddie's style of management to that of Kidney...

Wouldn't surprise me. Eddie is one of the best coaches in the game imo. Terrible manager though. As for Gaffney not being replaced, its ridiculous. If Kiss is expected to split his time between defence and attack both will suffer and im not sure as to the credentials of Tainton as an attacking coach. The IRFU must be in some financial bother.

I await JustinDee's typical "The IRFU are doing fine financially, what are you talking about? All is well blah blah blah"

GerM

totallegend wrote: »

Possibly raised elsewhere, but yesterday's Sunday Times says that Gaffney is not going to be replaced, at least not ahead of the 6N, and that Kiss and Tainton will take over responsibility for attack. Also, McNaughton is leaving and no replacement has been lined up. Are we seeing an EOS-style concentration of power here?

The same paper carried a piece on DOC's book, which seems to say that he prefers Eddie's style of management to that of Kidney...

Gaffney not being replaced has been rumoured for a while although I originally heard that DK would be working more closely with the backs. Good Christ I hope it isn't true. Kiss is a rugby league convert and a defensive coach. If he's going to be involved in running our attack it means that we'll be looking at expanding on our forward dominated back play. Tainton has been a kicking coach for years now. I don't know how that will transfer to being an international backs coach.

McNaughton will be a loss I feel. He's been a great addition to the squad. Someone that can fight his corner, give a different view and is a great thinker and manager within the squad.

It would be easy to be cynical about what these possible appointments could indicate. We're not going to be using the backs much, we're going to keep a kicking game, like it or lump it.

pajunior

GerM wrote: »

Gaffney not being replaced has been rumoured for a while although I originally heard that DK would be working more closely with the backs. Good Christ I hope it isn't true. Kiss is a rugby league convert and a defensive coach. If he's going to be involved in running our attack it means that we'll be looking at expanding on our forward dominated back play. Tainton has been a kicking coach for years now. I don't know how that will transfer to being an international backs coach.

McNaughton will be a loss I feel. He's been a great addition to the squad. Someone that can fight his corner, give a different view and is a great thinker and manager within the squad.

It would be easy to be cynical about what these possible appointments could indicate. We're not going to be using the backs much, we're going to keep a kicking game, like it or lump it.

Matt Williams often suggested that as DK's tenure has gone one Gaffney has seemed less and less influential. Our back play has definitely gone backwards, I can only imagine it will get worse now that we don't have a backs coach.
Anyone surprised Schmidt hasn't been approached? Did pretty well with the Clermont backs and hasn't been the worst for Leinster

JustinDee

GerM wrote: »

Kiss is a rugby league convert and a defensive coach. If he's going to be involved in running our attack it means that we'll be looking at expanding on our forward dominated back play

Just on this, I don't know quite what you mean. The thing about league defences is that they need greater skills, quicker hands, better kicking from hand and snappier passing to be breached.
If anything, the influence from rugby league will lead to even greater use of the backline.

As for the coaching setup, nothing has been announced as far as I know.

totallegend

pajunior wrote: »

Matt Williams often suggested that as DK's tenure has gone one Gaffney has seemed less and less influential. Our back play has definitely gone backwards, I can only imagine it will get worse now that we don't have a backs coach.
Anyone surprised Schmidt hasn't been approached? Did pretty well with the Clermont backs and hasn't been the worst for Leinster

Yeah, this has been thrown around but it's a complete non-runner. If Schmidt was the Leinster backs coach, then fair enough, he could work with Ireland, but to combine the head-coach job at Leinster with a part-time gig with Ireland just wouldn't work.

Continuing with the Sunday Times, they also say that DK's working relationship with McGahan has deteriorated badly.

GerM

JustinDee wrote: »

Just on this, I don't know quite what you mean. The thing about league defences is that they need greater skills, quicker hands, better kicking from hand and snappier passing to be breached.
If anything, the influence from rugby league will lead to even greater use of the backline.

As for the coaching setup, nothing has been announced as far as I know.

Fair points. You're certainly more into your league than I am so you'd know more. I would have thought it would mean big carriers in midfield looking to punch up into contact and get the fast recycle. Very much straightforward, aggressive lines with less intricacy, depth or decoys. Again, I could be wrong.

GerM

totallegend wrote: »

Yeah, this has been thrown around but it's a complete non-runner. If Schmidt was the Leinster backs coach, then fair enough, he could work with Ireland, but to combine the head-coach job at Leinster with a part-time gig with Ireland just wouldn't work.

Continuing with the Sunday Times, they also say that DK's working relationship with McGahan has deteriorated badly.

Who wrote the piece and is there an online copy available, do you know?

wixfjord

totallegend wrote: »

Yeah, this has been thrown around but it's a complete non-runner. If Schmidt was the Leinster backs coach, then fair enough, he could work with Ireland, but to combine the head-coach job at Leinster with a part-time gig with Ireland just wouldn't work.

Continuing with the Sunday Times, they also say that DK's working relationship with McGahan has deteriorated badly.

Any link to this or is it behind a paywall?

I reckon we could be looking at costcutting alright, and it doesn't auger well for our back play, although anything must be better than Gaffney.

Oh what I would give for a Conor O Shea and Joe Schmidt double team!

totallegend

GerM wrote: »

Who wrote the piece and is there an online copy available, do you know?

Think it was Peter O'Reilly (open to correction) but it's behind a paywall and I dumped my copy of it... There was very little info on the alleged falling out between Kidney and McGahan anyway, and not much in the way of substantiating evidence really.

GerM

Assume this is it.

Peter O'Reilly wrote: »

So Donncha O’Callaghan has published his autobiography. A nation braces itself for eye-popping controversy and salacious scandal? Hardly. The only time during a long, successful career that O’Callaghan has shocked us was when he tried to join a lineout wearing a skimpy pair of red undies, after his rugby shorts had been ripped irreparably.

There’s also the unavoidable fact that he is still playing. Dressing rooms are places that operate successfully on trust and secrecy, so how can O’Callaghan enlighten us when he’s still on the inside?

He manages to do just that. Joking Apart focuses as much on the pain of being a professional rugby player — albeit a highly successful one — as on the joy of that success. It also paints a fascinating picture of Declan Kidney, presenting the Ireland coach as someone obsessed with control, and who often maintains that control by instilling doubt in the minds of his players.

What makes O’Callaghan’s story engrossing is that a Grand Slam winner with two Heineken Cup medals and two Lions tours could be so insecure, so aware of his own weaknesses. A psychoanalyst would probably point to the death of his father when O’Callaghan was just five.

What’s certain is that even now, at 32, O’Callaghan thrives on approval, on any sign of reassurance. Yet the coach with whom he has had contact stretching back to his school days, and who is celebrated for his man-management skills, has often played on his doubts and fears.

When O’Callaghan went through his greatest torment was in the weeks leading up to Munster’s 2008 Heineken Cup triumph, specifically when he was dropped for the final league game, against Glasgow, a fortnight before the final in Cardiff.

The phone conversation is almost chilling in its sparseness, in the eerie pauses between the opening line of “I don’t have a place for you on Saturday” to the parting “Like everyone else in the squad, you’re in my thoughts for the final.”

O’Callaghan’s response was that of an addict who cannot see where the next fix is coming from and in the end, it required some intervention by Paul O’Connell to convince Kidney to provide reassurance. Three and a half years on, O’Callaghan can still see no justification for Kidney “pulling this kind of stunt”.

“He believed that I needed a kick in the backside every so often, but by 2008 I was well beyond that stage. Being professional was all I cared about. Getting ready for Toulouse was going to consume me in the days and weeks leading up to the final.

“I didn’t need to be put through the wringer about team selection. The anxiety drained me. If you look at the photographs after the final, there is a massive cold sore on my face. That came from the stress of all this.”

We are shown a coach who sends flowers to Jenny O’Callaghan on the birth of her first child, who remembers everyone’s first name, who has the common touch. And we see an arch-controller who had a driver waiting for the teetotal O’Callaghan outside the school graduation ball because the youngster had training the next day, or who summoned the same youngster to his house to administer a bollocking after some foul play.

O’Callaghan’s account of his early years with Munster reveals a shambolic set-up where gym sessions at the Cork Institute of Technology were more like social occasions. O’Callaghan’s first Munster contract, for the 1999/2000 season was “classic Deccie. He gave me a deal with no money and made me feel like I’d won the lottery.”

Kidney could cite something O’Callaghan had written in a pre-season questionnaire as a reason for not picking him. Yet when the player sought advice on how to improve his game, he found his coach evasive at first, then vague, before eventually he was called into Kidney’s office and handed a tennis ball, with a view to improving his eye-hand coordination. “Deccie could be full of surprises” is how O’Callaghan puts it.

O’Callaghan is the first to admit that as a youngster, he needed direction, needed discipline — there are countless examples of him giving away daft penalties. Kidney was as hard on him as anyone, and justifiably so.

Yet when O’Callaghan was at a low ebb after the 2007 World Cup, his Munster coach showed him a picture of him pinned to the ground by an Argentinian, arms outstretched to show the officials he was the victim. Here was O’Callaghan proving he had grown up, but Kidney told him he never wanted to see him in that situation again.

There’s no escaping the impression that O’Callaghan felt much more comfortable dealing with Eddie O’Sullivan, who may have excoriated him on the training pitch in front of teammates yet always let him know where he stood.

“That was the thing about Eddie and all the coaches he had working with him, they were incredibly direct and honest,” he writes.

This is not surprising, for it’s how O’Callaghan plays rugby. It’s how he tells a story, too, aided by Denis Walsh’s deft touch. The irony is in the epilogue, with its Beckettian outro, where he asks: ‘What next? Start again. Start again.’ For O’Callaghan can’t really start again when he’s been demoted to the bench by Munster, with the Six Nations only around the corner.

This is when he could do with some reassurance. Something says it won’t be coming from Kidney.

danthefan

Nope GerM, that's not it.

There's a piece that talk specifically about Ireland not getting a backs coach, and it's mentioned in there that McGahan and Kidney have virtually no relationship.

DOC is also less than complimentary of Kidney, you'd wonder if he's still in his plans, or has been cut loose and felt he could release the book so.

GerM

danthefan wrote: »

Nope GerM, that's not it.

There's a piece that talk specifically about Ireland not getting a backs coach, and it's mentioned in there that McGahan and Kidney have virtually no relationship.

DOC is also less than complimentary of Kidney, you'd wonder if he's still in his plans, or has been cut loose and felt he could release the book so.

Can't see it on the online version then. That's the only article I could see that deals with DK. Hopefully it's posted at some point.

GerM

Bit more light on the situation:

Gavin Cummiskey wrote: »

PAUL McNAUGHTON’S replacement as national team manager will come from within Ireland.

The specific demands of the position McNaughton has held since May, 2008 requires someone with an innate understanding of the Irish provincial and club scenes.

The 59-year-old, who won 15 caps for Ireland from 1978 to 1981, also acted as an intermediary in negotiations between the IRFU, national and provincial coaches. Another duty was to regularly brief the media.

McNaughton will assist the process of finding his own replacement along with Declan Kidney and the union management committee.

This includes IRFU chief executive Philip Browne, director of rugby Eddie Wigglesworth and committee chair Finbarr Crowley.

The hope is to announce a new team manager before the Six Nations opener against Wales on February 5th.
There will, however, not be a new backline coach to replace Alan Gaffney, whose contract wasn’t extended prior to the World Cup, unlike Kidney, defence coach Less Kiss, forwards coach Gert Smal and kicking coach Mark Tainton.

The union view is that there is not enough preparatory time to add a new voice to the coaching ticket ahead of the Six Nations.

Kidney, Kiss and Tainton – who along with Smal are contracted until the end of next season – will oversee Ireland’s attacking strategy.

Browne has previously stated that Kidney is permitted to bring in a new backline expert, so this may be reconsidered before the three-Test series in New Zealand next summer.

In contrast, Ireland’s conquerors in the World Cup quarter-final Wales recently secured both their defence, Shaun Edwards, and attack coach, Rob Howley, for another four years.

The recruitment process for the IRFU head of fitness is also under way.

There is no guarantee of a provincial promotion as some highly-respected international candidates will be interviewed to replace Philip Morrow.

A new strength and conditioning coach to the national squad also needs to be hired, to cover another role previously held by Morrow.

Podge_irl

Well, our backline is going to be ****e during the 6N so.

GerM

Podge_irl wrote: »

Well, our backline is going to be ****e during the 6N so.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

irishbucsfan

Brian O'Driscoll will be with the squad.

Jus sayin'

AtItAllDayRef

Podge_irl wrote: »

Well, our backline is going to be ****e during the 6N so.

Can't be much worse than they've been under Gaffney's stand flat and get small backs to run straight with no space. (sorry I left out the Sexton loop move which is the only variation).