ULTIMATE VARMINT CALIBER ?

pat58

As above i would like to hear views on what people regard as their best varmint caliber out to 500 yards on foxes,crows,rabbits ect.....?

murtdono

hi pat 'i would have to say 220 swift 40-52 gr 'aprox 4000 fps

bunny shooter

204 Ruger, 220 swift or 22.250

Feidhlim Dignan

220 swift is probably the best to get the job done. but most of are sensible and go for an intermediate caliber

yog1

pat58 wrote: »

As above i would like to hear views on what people regard as their best varmint caliber out to 500 yards on foxes,crows,rabbits ect.....?

are you talking caliber alone or are you taking cost of ammo, availability of ammo ect into consideration as well, might have a factor,
i bought a 22-250 for fox's,
at the time i was torn between a 204 and a 22-250, wish i had look'd at the 223 a bit more purely for the range of ammo, i didn't plan on shooting paper much at the time, but now that i have the gun i would consider advising someone to think about it because most of my shooting is at paper, still love the gun though. and i know that whatevertime i get my marksmanship up to standard i'll love it even more

It wasn't me!

.243 Win or a 6mmBR or any other fast 6mm loaded with about a 70gr Ballistic tip.

jwshooter

500 yards normally dont bother shooting that close.

tomcat220t

The .204 ruger is very good out to 500 yards + on varmint .Any shots from 50 yards onwards i can see my hits which really helps for a followup shots .

bunny shooter

It wasn't me! wrote: »

.243 Win or a 6mmBR or any other fast 6mm loaded with about a 70gr Ballistic tip.

OP stated varmint calibre. Some Supers will only licence anything above a 220 Swift as a deer/target rifle

pat58

bunny shooter wrote: »

204 Ruger, 220 swift or 22.250

So far it seems like a toss up between the .204 and the .220 swift .Thats a supprise ,taught there would be more .223s,222s and .17 fireball views .

pat58

It wasn't me! wrote: »

.243 Win or a 6mmBR or any other fast 6mm loaded with about a 70gr Ballistic tip.

Will the 6mm br feed well in a mag?If not ,hardly much good for quick repeat shot in the field ?

pat58

jwshooter wrote: »

500 yards normally dont bother shooting that close.

JW ,if you had to take such easy shots at 500 yards ,aside from your .22 what caliber would you use;)

It wasn't me!

bunny shooter wrote: »

OP stated varmint calibre. Some Supers will only licence anything above a 220 Swift as a deer/target rifle

.243 was designed as a varminting round, so it's well in. The 6BR is a target round, so whatever about that, but the .243 has to be in, as it's the design purpose of the cartridge.

pat58 wrote: »

Will the 6mm br feed well in a mag?If not ,hardly much good for quick repeat shot in the field ?

Yeah, it feeds plenty fine. It's the universal cartridge in CISM rifles, where rapid fire strings of ten are the order of the day, and failure to feed would not be acceptable.

bunny shooter

It wasn't me! wrote: »

.243 was designed as a varminting round, so it's well in. The 6BR is a target round, so whatever about that, but the .243 has to be in, as it's the design purpose of the cartridge.

If you can get your super to agree with you your right otherwise I'm right

It wasn't me!

bunny shooter wrote: »

If you can get your super to agree with you your right otherwise I'm right

Nope, my super doesn't get a say in what's a suitable cartridge nor what one was designed for, only whether I can have it for that purpose, which is of course ridiculous. The .243 is a varminting cartridge regardless of what any super says. It was designed to do that job. And it's a better choice for the 500 yard game than any .22 centrefire too.

landkeeper

having had a 22 hornet, 222, 223 and a 243 and used them all for shooting vermin if i was to pick one it'd be the 222 hands down , the 243 would come a close second for me ,

bunny shooter

It wasn't me! wrote: »

Nope, my super doesn't get a say in what's a suitable cartridge nor what one was designed for, only whether I can have it for that purpose......

Or to put it another way the Super may not licence anything over a 220 Swift for varminting

bunny shooter

landkeeper wrote: »

having had a 22 hornet, 222, 223 and a 243 and used them all for shooting vermin if i was to pick one it'd be the 222 hands down , the 243 would come a close second for me ,

Never had a 222, shooting buddy has and swears by it for foxes

It wasn't me!

bunny shooter wrote: »

Or to put it another way the Super may not licence anything over a 220 Swift for varminting

It's genuinely not important to the discussion though. If I wanted a rifle for the job, I'd consider what I wanted, then work on the super. If I then have to get a different thing because he won't let me have it, then what I end up getting isn't the perfect tool for the job anyway, which is what we're discussing.

bunny shooter

It wasn't me! wrote: »

It's genuinely not important to the discussion though. If I wanted a rifle for the job, I'd consider what I wanted, then work on the super. If I then have to get a different thing because he won't let me have it, then what I end up getting isn't the perfect tool for the job anyway, which is what we're discussing.

After reviewing the question in the OP & your comment above and nothwithstanding my original statement regarding the Supers possible refusal to licence anything over 220 Swift and my original calibre choices, which were proposed with this statement in mind, IF the Super would allow it I'd go for .243 Win for varminting

It wasn't me!

bunny shooter wrote: »

After reviewing the question in the OP & your comment above and nothwithstanding my original statement regarding the Supers possible refusal to licence anything over 220 Swift and my original calibre choices, which were proposed with this statement in mind, IF the Super would allow it I'd go for .243 Win for varminting

With meandering speeches like that, you ever consider politics?

bunny shooter

It wasn't me! wrote: »

With meandering speeches like that, you ever consider politics?

Naw, I'm too honest & outspoken

wunwabbit

well lads !!! what about a 22-243 / 22 middle stead !!! super flat !! hard hitting and fast !!! and will do the 1000 yds !!! im own should be finished in sept can wait !!!

dwighet

22br or 6mmbr

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

.243 Win or a 6mmBR or any other fast 6mm loaded with about a 70gr Ballistic tip.

What advantages does the 70gr 243 have over the .204 out to 500 yards ?My ideal varmint round is flat shooting ,good in wind, accurate,light recoil so one can see their hits ,good barrel life and a frangible bullet that will not over penetrate or ricoehet.....Theres no such thing as a perfect round but imo the .204 is very close

tomcat220t

bunny shooter wrote: »

Naw, I'm too honest & outspoken

:D:D:D:D

tomcat220t

landkeeper wrote: »

having had a 22 hornet, 222, 223 and a 243 and used them all for shooting vermin if i was to pick one it'd be the 222 hands down , the 243 would come a close second for me ,

Havent shot a .222 .How do you find it at a bit of range ?

It wasn't me!

tomcat220t wrote: »

What advantages does the 70gr 243 have over the .204 out to 500 yards ?My ideal varmint round is flat shooting ,good in wind, accurate,light recoil so one can see their hits ,good barrel life and a frangible bullet that will not over penetrate or ricoehet.....Theres no such thing as a perfect round but imo the .204 is very close

You've described the .243 Win perfectly there. Personally I'd shoot a 6mmBR with something in the 60-85gr bracket, as I'd take sheer accuracy over flat-shooting. Can always range and aim off if needs be.

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

You've described the .243 Win perfectly there. Personally I'd shoot a 6mmBR with something in the 60-85gr bracket, as I'd take sheer accuracy over flat-shooting. Can always range and aim off if needs be.

.How does that describe the .243?Please explain.

dwighet

tomcat220t wrote: »

.How does that describe the .243?Please explain.

Heres one to run through your ballistics calculator..

204cal 40 gn vmax... muzzle velocity:3900 fps. BC...275

243cal 58 gn vmax... muzzle velocity:3750 fps. BC...250

I dont have time as im at work. will be interesting on the results out to 600 yds

:D

It wasn't me!

tomcat220t wrote: »

.How does that describe the .243?Please explain.

Accurate
Flat shooting
Good in Wind
Reasonable on barrels
Light recoil
Frangible bullets.

That's the .243 Win nailed.

tomcat220t

dwighet wrote: »

Heres one to run through your ballistics calculator..

204cal 40 gn vmax... muzzle velocity:3900 fps. BC...275

243cal 58 gn vmax... muzzle velocity:3750 fps. BC...250

I dont have time as im at work. will be interesting on the results out to 600 yds

:D

The 40gr .204 Vmax Vs .243 58gr -the .204 gets the nod,imo.But if you compare the .243 55gr federal to the .204 ,the .243 is a much closer match.;).All this at the expence of barrel life and recoil with the .243 .I like the fact i can see my hits with the .204 make it so much easier as a varmint ,tool.

Jonty

It wasn't me! wrote: »

Accurate
Flat shooting
Good in Wind
Reasonable on barrels
Light recoil
Frangible bullets.

That's the .243 Win nailed.

I would have thought that a 243 firing light varmint ammo would be harder on a barrel, plus it can be difficult to get one that stabilizes the heavy game ammo as well as the varmint stuff?

Jonty

I use a .223 myself. There's no 500 yard fields down my way. 250 max. Horses for courses and all that!!:D

It wasn't me!

.243 will be a bit harder on barrels, but you shouldn't have any problem seeing your hits with it. As regards the issue with being a deer cartridge as well, it wasn't envisioned as one, which is why a lot of factory twists are marginal with 100gr bullets. If I were building it as a varminting rig, it wouldn't be required to shoot anything over about 80gr, so I'd keep the twist slow enough and wouldn't worry about shooting deer with it. Still though, like I said, I'd have the 6mm BR Norma and to hell with the flat shooting. That's what rangefinders and drop charts are for.

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

Accurate
Flat shooting
Good in Wind
Reasonable on barrels
Light recoil
Frangible bullets.

That's the .243 Win nailed.

If the lighter 55gr+58gr rounds were compared to the .204 then its a close call in terms of flat shooting,good in wind, frangible bullets but you were talking about a 70gr .243 varmint round.Federal do both 70 gr .243 and .204 39gr and if you compare both in terms of wind drift and bullet drop the .204 is a clear winner .I use a mates .243 from time to time we go out varmint shooting and the first thing we noticed was how easy it was to see the strikes with the .204 .The recoil on the .243 was not mild enough on his 11lb hunting rifle to see his hits ,at all.Also on MR fox ,i have not had an exit wound yet with the 39gr or a ricochet (touch wood) from 500 + round fired so far.I taught about my next caliber been a .243 but as you know will most likley end up getting built a 6XC.

tomcat220t

Jonty wrote: »

I would have thought that a 243 firing light varmint ammo would be harder on a barrel, plus it can be difficult to get one that stabilizes the heavy game ammo as well as the varmint stuff?

My mate with his CZ .243 would not shoot the lighter varmint ammo worth a dam:eek:.

It wasn't me!

Like I say, drop is what range cards are for. 6mm bullets are a clear winner in wind in the weights I've selected. I personally find it easy to see hits with a .243, so that works for me.

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

.243 will be a bit harder on barrels, but you shouldn't have any problem seeing your hits with it. As regards the issue with being a deer cartridge as well, it wasn't envisioned as one, which is why a lot of factory twists are marginal with 100gr bullets. If I were building it as a varminting rig, it wouldn't be required to shoot anything over about 80gr, so I'd keep the twist slow enough and wouldn't worry about shooting deer with it. Still though, like I said, I'd have the 6mm BR Norma and to hell with the flat shooting. That's what rangefinders and drop charts are for.

The 6br only seem to come in target round and not varmint .You cant dismiss the merts of a flat round out to 500 yards ,imo;).As for the 6br been super accurate ,thats true but the .204 is also very accurate out to 500 aswell.It not as accurate perhaps ,as the 6br but well good enough for it desinged purpose .

It wasn't me!

tomcat220t wrote: »

The 6br only seem to come in target round and not varmint .You cant dismiss the merts of a flat round out to 500 yards ,imo;).As for the 6br been super accurate ,thats true but the .204 is also very accurate out to 500 aswell.It not as accurate perhaps ,as the 6br but well good enough for it desinged purpose .

I'm talking about an ideal scenario, where you'd be handloading for it. We're still in daydream discussion for the time being, so yeah, I'd have the 6mmBR. The .204 just doesn't have the same ballistics as a good 6mm, nor could it ever be expected to; it's in a different case class altogether.

Tackleberrywho

tomcat220t wrote: »

The 6br only seem to come in target round and not varmint .You cant dismiss the merts of a flat round out to 500 yards ,imo;).As for the 6br been super accurate ,thats true but the .204 is also very accurate out to 500 aswell.It not as accurate perhaps ,as the 6br but well good enough for it desinged purpose .

Tom, would it be fair to say that there are several quite close, but due to different hunting locations, Mountain, flat land, bog, or undulatingt low land in this country that there is a place for at least 3.

I'm very interested in this .204, especially after seeing the stats Dwighet published.
You may show me it in operation some day soon

I only have 2 or 3 places that 500 yards is safe and very hard to tell bunnies to be at 500 yards and not 350 or less

cavan shooter

I would have to say that I would go for a 204 ruger hands down, its very poular in the USA and is very flat shooting. 500 yrds is a very long way, youd need good glass. I am taking greys with the hornet at 200yrds at the moment with a 6-24 Hawke

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

I'm talking about an ideal scenario, where you'd be handloading for it. We're still in daydream discussion for the time being, so yeah, I'd have the 6mmBR. The .204 just doesn't have the same ballistics as a good 6mm, nor could it ever be expected to; it's in a different case class altogether.

Thats it you see,im talking from real life experience not DAYDREAMS,my bad:o.If that was the case everyone would have put up the 6.5x284 ,7mm and 30 cals........

It wasn't me!

tomcat220t wrote: »

Thats it you see,im talking from real life experience not DAYDREAMS,my bad:o.If that was the case everyone would have put up the 6.5x284 ,7mm and 30 cals........

No, because they'd be awful varminting rounds, while the ones I'm mentioning are extremely practical for the job. Low recoil, low wind drift and suitable bullets.

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

No, because they'd be awful varminting rounds, while the ones I'm mentioning are extremely practical for the job. Low recoil, low wind drift and suitable bullets.

For varmint shooting in (real life) a the flatter shooting round which you seen to dismiss ,is a real asset in the field .Even though i use a range finder and a drop chart, not every rabbit is an exact range or perpared to sit in the same spot while setting up the shot.Every thing about the .204ruger caliber is desinged around increasing your hit probabitly on small varmint at distance.Its not the only caliber for the job but far better suited than the 6br out to 500 yards .

It wasn't me!

If you have the data to hand, you won't be stuck with either. Personally I'd take the 6BR for the retained energy and inherent accuracy, as well as the better ballistics.

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

If you have the data to hand, you won't be stuck with either. Personally I'd take the 6BR for the retained energy and inherent accuracy, as well as the better ballistics.

One thing ,im not stuck with anything .You are dreaming up a round to suit your ideas:o.Any data i have spoken about in this thread on the .204 has been in my hand,rather than yours been on the pillow. ( VARMINT 6br):p.

It wasn't me!

tomcat220t wrote: »

One thing ,im not stuck with anything .You are dreaming up a round to suit your ideas:o.Any data i have spoken about in this thread on the .204 has been in my hand,rather than yours been on the pillow. ( VARMINT 6br):p.

There are a rather large number of shooters in the US and the UK using the round as a varminter, because it's a superb choice for the role.

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

There are a rather large number of shooters in the US and the UK using the round as a varminter, because it's a superb choice for the role.

What do you use for varmint shooting ?

It wasn't me!

tomcat220t wrote: »

What do you use for varmint shooting ?

It's not really my bag, so I don't own a dedicated rifle for it at the moment. I know of one I'm very tempted by, but for the time being, the .25-06 does when I need to do a job on them.

tomcat220t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

It's not really my bag, so I don't own a dedicated rifle for it at the moment. I know of one I'm very tempted by, but for the time being, the .25-06 does when I need to do a job on them.

Well,with all due respect a range finder is no compensation for a round like the 6br in real life varmint shooting .Im not been smart but if you were thinking up a varmint round and could load the .243ai with a 105gr a max would be a far better setup ,imo;).