Sharing space with cyclists

coolbeans

Sacred_git wrote: »

same with pedestrians, if you hit one in a car .....you have very little say, quite unfair really

It's not unfair. A car is probably the most dangerous thing Joe Public can bring into an urban area. This isn't anti car, it's just a statement of fact based on the principle that almost everyone is more vulnerable than a motorist and therefore drivers must assume greater responsibility. This is not to say that cyclists and peds should should not be held accountable for irresponsible actions but the law is rightfully harshest on those who can potentially do the most harm to a third party.

Alanstrainor

Glad to see this also. I cycle to and from college/work as it's quicker than driving, and some of the things i witness daily are nothing short of astonishing. I've been knocked down once and had a door open in my face, which resulted in 6 stitches on my upper lip, and 12 in my shoulder:eek:.

Sacred_git

coolbeans wrote: »

It's not unfair. A car is probably the most dangerous thing Joe Public can bring into an urban area. This isn't anti car, it's just a statement of fact based on the principle that almost everyone is more vulnerable than a motorist and therefore drivers must assume greater responsibility. This is not to say that cyclists and peds should should not be held accountable for irresponsible actions but the law is rightfully harshest on those who can potentially do the most harm to a third party.

i was suggesting about people and cyclists just doing somewhat foolish things, obviously a motorist has to be vigilant, i am a cyclist too !!

chiefwiggum

how can you give cyclists 1.5 mtr space when overtaking when they insist on cycling 3 abreast on a small windy wicklow mountain road do they want me to drive with my two wheels in the next field why they continue to natter away blissfully unaware of how to INTERACT with vehicles

Canis Lupus

chiefwiggum wrote: »

how can you give cyclists 1.5 mtr space when overtaking when they insist on cycling 3 abreast on a small windy wicklow mountain road do they want me to drive with my two wheels in the next field why they continue to natter away blissfully unaware of how to INTERACT with vehicles

Does this really happen so much? Really?

Look it drives (see what I did there) me mad the way both camps get their backs up the minute someone says anything against them.

I think it's simple, we all share the road and no one wants to hit anyone else. As a driver I give time to cyclists because it's really not that big a ****ing deal to wait for an overtaking spot, give time and room etc.

When I cycle I give due attention to other motorists as a I know I can sometimes get in the way and going down the vulnerability chain I give pedestrians a wide berth and time to do what they need to do although I tut continually when they forever step onto the road without looking just because they don't hear a car.

There are some cyclists who are retards and there are just as many motorists who are also retards neither side is special or owns the road....

/rant

glic71rods46t0

chiefwiggum wrote: »

how can you give cyclists 1.5 mtr space when overtaking when they insist on cycling 3 abreast on a small windy wicklow mountain road do they want me to drive with my two wheels in the next field why they continue to natter away blissfully unaware of how to INTERACT with vehicles

I give the 1.5 mtr if its available and the cyclist uses the left side of the road. If the cyclist chooses to use the middle of the road or cycle more than single file while I'm trying to pass, then I assume they dont want the 1.5m and overtake accordingly. Simple physics means that the more of the road they choose to use, the less there is to leave a gap when overtaking - but I will overtake either way so the ones that leave the gap are better off!

DirkVoodoo

chiefwiggum wrote: »

how can you give cyclists 1.5 mtr space when overtaking when they insist on cycling 3 abreast on a small windy wicklow mountain road do they want me to drive with my two wheels in the next field why they continue to natter away blissfully unaware of how to INTERACT with vehicles

2 abreast is legal (and indeed safer for everyone), 3 is obviously not. Give them a few pips of the horn (at a safe distance, not right behind them).

Infuriating as it may be, there is not much you can do. Like I said before, I can't police every cyclist, I've never gone blocking traffic by cycling 3 abreast, but from your description of a "small windy mountain road" where 3 cyclists (about the width of a car) puts you in a ditch, then it clearly isn't safe to overtake. Yes, they should have let you pass, I don't know what more you want to hear. If it was a slow moving car or a tractor it would have been equally difficult if not impossible.

1.5 metres isn't much, I've nearly been sent sideways/sucked under wheels by buses and trucks passing within arms length of me. And a lot of this happens on straight roads where there is no traffic coming against them.

SleepDoc

kv4dw0oujg9n3z wrote: »

I give the 1.5 mtr if its available and the cyclist uses the left side of the road. If the cyclist chooses to use the middle of the road or cycle more than single file while I'm trying to pass, then I assume they dont want the 1.5m and overtake accordingly. Simple physics means that the more of the road they choose to use, the less there is to leave a gap when overtaking - but I will overtake either way so the ones that leave the gap are better off!

This is an incredibly stupid and dangerous attitude. No matter how much of the lane the cyclist takes up, it is your responsibility to overtake safely.

glic71rods46t0

SleepDoc wrote: »

This is an incredibly stupid and dangerous attitude. No matter how much of the lane the cyclist takes up, it is your responsibility to overtake safely.

I dont feel like I'm putting myself in danger is such situations. I wonder if the cyclist does?
If the cyclist is not keeping in to the left then I assume he doesnt want the 1.5 m overtaking gap and I act accordingly - I'm overtaking anyways so the gap is up to the cyclist!

Cookie_Monster

kv4dw0oujg9n3z wrote: »

I dont feel like I'm putting myself in danger is such situations. I wonder if the cyclist does?
If the cyclist is not keeping in to the left then I assume he doesnt want the 1.5 m overtaking gap and I act accordingly - I'm overtaking anyways so the gap is up to the cyclist!

the cyclist may not be keeping left for several reasons. Broken road or junk on the road or they could be preventing you from passing so they can turn right further up, or simply changing lanes for example

glic71rods46t0

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

the cyclist may not be keeping left for several reasons. Broken road or junk on the road or they could be preventing you from passing so they can turn right further up, or simply changing lanes for example

Changing lanes or turning right requires hand indication - so lets rule that out
Broken road - choose a different road if you're not able for the conditions!

There is one certainty - Im overtaking you - you want room, pull the hell in or you won't need a Gillette for a while:D

Wicklowrider

kv4dw0oujg9n3z wrote: »

Changing lanes or turning right requires hand indication - so lets rule that out
Broken road - choose a different road if you're not able for the conditions!

There is one certainty - Im overtaking you - you want room, pull the hell in or you won't need a Gillette for a while:D

I had an encounter about five years ago with a twat like you.He knows better now... He has been re-educated in a fashion he is not ever going to forget. Deliberately put me in danger and there will be consequences.
Provided you understand that, do what you wish.

Cookie_Monster

kv4dw0oujg9n3z wrote: »

There is one certainty - Im overtaking you - you want room, pull the hell in or you won't need a Gillette for a while:D

that is a massivly ignorant attitude you got there. I hope for your and thier sakes you don't come across to many cyclists on a daily basis :mad:

Broken road - choose a different road if you're not able for the conditions!

a road can be damaged from one day to the next, how are you supposed to know in advance.
you are also not going to go an entirely different route because of a few pot hole need to be avoided on a road.

Cabaal

nice guy always wrote: »

Im a car driver and motorbike rider as a profession.....however some time ago I did the Garda mountain bike course. During the weeks training (where we just wore hi vis vests unmarked and no uniform.....we were nearly killed on several occasions from motorists trying their best to overtake us!!! One guy stayed behind us and hooted until we stopped!!! We were in single file, 5 bikes.

Going from a thread in the cycling forum, how about Gardai cycle around unmarked for awhile....similar to driving unmarked gardai cars.

You'd be surprised the amount of fools you'll see breaking red lights, using phones and doing what you said above.

Would be an interesting experiment

SleepDoc

kv4dw0oujg9n3z wrote: »

I dont feel like I'm putting myself in danger is such situations. I wonder if the cyclist does?
If the cyclist is not keeping in to the left then I assume he doesnt want the 1.5 m overtaking gap and I act accordingly - I'm overtaking anyways so the gap is up to the cyclist!

Well of course you don't feel like you're in danger. You're in a car.

In the second part of your reply you advocate the reckless endangerment of other road users. This is akin to swinging a golf club close to someone's head.

You are an ignoramus.

SleepDoc

SleepDoc wrote: »

Well of course you don't feel like you're in danger. You're in a car.

In the second part of your reply you advocate the reckless endangerment of other road users. This is akin to swinging a golf club close to someone's head.

You are an ignoramus.

Relax, Fencer is a rereg of proven troll TimAllen. All of his posts are on this kind of issue and all are intended to provoke this kind of emotional response. He must be getting seriously fat at this stage given how much he's been fed on this thread.

glic71rods46t0

Wicklowrider wrote: »

I had an encounter about five years ago with a twat like you.He knows better now... He has been re-educated in a fashion he is not ever going to forget. Deliberately put me in danger and there will be consequences.
Provided you understand that, do what you wish.

You sound like a right hard man, you do:rolleyes:
Another Walter Mitty cyclist versus motorist story ...yawn yawn.... don't tell me, it was looking good for the scrawny driver as he took a side swipe at Hulk Hogan innocently cycling down the road, but the gods smiled on the Hulkster and the lights turned red suddenly (and out of sequence). The driver cowered as hulkamania ran wild on his ass:rolleyes:
Then Wicklowrider/Walter Mitty woke up and said "I wish real life was like that.... and maybe I'll soon have a car of my own as well":D:D:D

glic71rods46t0

SleepDoc wrote: »

Well of course you don't feel like you're in danger. You're in a car.

In the second part of your reply you advocate the reckless endangerment of other road users. This is akin to swinging a golf club close to someone's head.

You are an ignoramus.

Keep in, you wont even notice me passing you.
I'll leave the last sentence of your post to the mods ...you sir are a gentleman

-Chris-

OK, that's enough!

Deleted User wrote: »

Relax, kv4dw0oujg9n3z is a rereg of proven troll TimAllen. All of his posts are on this kind of issue and all are intended to provoke this kind of emotional response. He must be getting seriously fat at this stage given how much he's been fed on this thread.

If you have a problem with a poster or what they're posting, report it. You're adding fuel to the fire and it's going to do nothing good.

kv4dw0oujg9n3z wrote: »

You sound like a right hard man, you do:rolleyes:
Another Walter Mitty cyclist versus motorist story...

...Then Wicklowrider/Walter Mitty woke up and said "I wish real life was like that.... and maybe I'll soon have a car of my own as well":D:D:D

SleepDoc wrote: »

You are an ignoramus.

Wicklowrider wrote: »

I had an encounter about five years ago with a twat like you.

Attack the post, not the poster. Next person to personalise the arguement gets a 3 day ban.

Wicklowrider wrote: »

He knows better now... He has been re-educated in a fashion he is not ever going to forget. Deliberately put me in danger and there will be consequences.

kv4dw0oujg9n3z wrote: »

There is one certainty - Im overtaking you - you want room, pull the hell in or you won't need a Gillette for a while:D

And next person to post some kind of veiled threat gets a 7 day ban.

Wicklowrider

-Chris- wrote: »

OK, that's enough!



If you have a problem with a poster or what they're posting, report it. You're adding fuel to the fire and it's going to do nothing good.



Attack the post, not the poster. Next person to personalise the arguement gets a 3 day ban.


and next person to post some kind of veiled threat gets a 7 day ban.

I was way out of line with my reply - apologies.

BostonB

Cycle lanes that just suddenly stop/disappear confuse everyone.

http://picasaweb.google.com/McCoogy/CyclePaths?authkey=Gv1sRgCN3xjbT899zMjAE#

itac

I'm normally a driver, but one of those occasional cyclists, ie if I just need something small from the shops, I'll take the bike, if it's a sunny day, I'll go out for a wee spin etc. The idiocy of some drivers never ceases to amaze me....but then again, for each muppet that I meet, I also meet some courteous drivers, who'll wait til there's a decent spot to overtake, or who slow down/speed up to let me through.

What does my head in is that I'm living in Maynooth, where there's a cycle path marked out on the footpath along Main St. For me to use this, I have to turn onto the path from the road at the pedestrian lights, where there's normally a few people waiting for the lights to change. The rest of the painted cycle path along the pavement is usually taken up with meandering pedestrians, buggies, and occasionally deliveries.

There's also several side streets, increasing the possibility of a car driving out into the side of me, or me cycling into a pedestrian who's just wandering out. If I cycle on the road, I can go from one end of Main St. to the other in 20 seconds or so, depending on the lights. If I were to try this on the painted cyclepath (can't remember if there's actually signs on the footpath) a) I'd probably cycle straight into someone or b) banjax myself by trying to do so.

Most cyclists aren't cycling way out on the roads just to annoy the drivers behind them, it's because they know (most probably from experience!) that the cycle path is unsafe. Lesser of two evils really....

I'd just love to get everyone who drives and rants about cyclists out on their bikes for a while around Dublin, or around their local town, on a normal day....i.e.
-it's a slightly drizzly day, and you're not sure if that's just a puddle, or a pothole you're about to cycle through...
-you're trying get past the numerous cars blocking the cycle lane...
-whilst watching out for the parents dropping their kids off for school who open car doors without looking, or pull out with no warning...
-and the pedestrians who like to dart across the road thinking that cyclists go slowly....
and all the while, you're also very aware that you have a car whose bumper is nearly on your back wheel because they're trying to get by you to get 2 foot ahead of you before they get into the line of stopped traffic where you'll overtake them again, and the whole cycle begins again....
(pun completely intended...)

Can you tell I've been out on the bike this morning?!:rolleyes:
/ends rant

Glad to hear that they're finally trying raise some sort of awareness....seeing as it's National Bike Week next week too!

Alanstrainor

I have to agree with itac, people just don't realise just how bad cycling infrastructure really is. I completely avoid some cycle lanes as they:
1. Lead to nowhere and mean i have to go out of my way to rejoin traffic.
2. Are very poorly maintained which means i have to risk constant punctures by using them.
3. Often "On path" cycle lanes are used by pedestrians also which is down right dangerous if you are cycling at any speed.

I must say i come across plenty of courteous drivers when cycling too, people just focus on the bad ones in these threads.

SerialComplaint

kv4dw0oujg9n3z wrote: »

Changing lanes or turning right requires hand indication - so lets rule that out
Broken road - choose a different road if you're not able for the conditions!

There is one certainty - Im overtaking you - you want room, pull the hell in or you won't need a Gillette for a while:D

- hilarious, isn't it. You'd be surprised at the number of cyclists with helmet-cams these days, so you can expect to be explaining your Gillette tactic to the Garda who has the video clip of your little manoeuvre.

Andrew33

SerialComplaint wrote: »

- hilarious, isn't it. You'd be surprised at the number of cyclists with helmet-cams these days, so you can expect to be explaining your Gillette tactic to the Garda who has the video clip of your little manoeuvre.

Not admissable in court as evidence.

ironclaw

Andrew33 wrote: »

Not admissable in court as evidence.

If it was time stamped maybe? Although I think to be admitted it has to be locked down as evidence.

Max_Damage

Ah man, you lot will HATE me!

I cycle regularly, and I break lights, cycle on footpaths, and even cycle drunk the occasional time (don't do it much anymore, after I lost my bike one time...)

glic71rods46t0

SerialComplaint wrote: »

- hilarious, isn't it. You'd be surprised at the number of cyclists with helmet-cams these days, so you can expect to be explaining your Gillette tactic to the Garda who has the video clip of your little manoeuvre.

As Andrew says, not admissable in court. Also, I know that gardai keep a log of complainants and complaints from serial complainants are taken with the proverbial pinch of salt - but that would only be something to worry about if you were a serial complainer!;)

BostonB

Andrew33 wrote: »

Not admissable in court as evidence.

That is so daft.

GeorgeBailey

Andrew33 wrote: »

Once again in this bloody country the majority (the motorist who are actually PAYING for this crap) have to bend over for the minority (the loony greens who want us all on bicycles).

*cough* MOTOR tax *cough*

i.e. you're not the ones specifically paying for this crap