unemployed - sign on by text !!!

PCPhoto

Seriously .... theres something fundamentally wrong with the people in the government.... talk about trying to encourage thole on the dole to become lazier*

*= not claiming that dole recipients are lazy or anything like that.

http://examiner.ie/ireland/social-welfare-claimants-to-sign-on-via-text-120978.html

JUST a year after it said social welfare recipients should produce photo ID because it was losing millions in fraudulent claims, the Government is planning to let claimants "sign on" by text.

In a move which Fine Gael TDs say will leave the system wide open to fraud, the Department for Social Protection has awarded a €1m contract to Hewlett Packard in Kildare to "develop and support a mobile phone-based solution for dynamic selection of and self-certification by claimants of unemployment benefits".

To qualify for jobseeker’s benefit or jobseeker’s allowance, a jobseeker must fulfil a number of conditions, including being available for and genuinely seeking work. At regular intervals they must make a declaration that they are still unemployed, available for and actively seeking work.

At present this certification process is done by attending the social welfare local office. However, the department’s new project "examines the potential to develop an additional channel for Jobseeker’s certification via the mobile phone".

It said selected customers would be invited to register for and avail of this service, which would be rolled out on a phased basis, once a "solution performance evaluation" process has been completed.

"This service will potentially allow people who receive Jobseeker’s Allowance and Jobseeker’s Benefit to complete the certification process by mobile phone," a spokeswoman said.

"Potentially the service will provide an alternative to the requirement for Jobseeker’s Allowance and Jobseeker’s Benefit claimants to attend their Social Welfare Local Office to certify and it will provide improved customer service and also reduce the departmental resources required to administer certification."

Cost savings would accrue from reducing the effort required to certify jobseekers at the department’s local offices, meaning staff would be freed to concentrate on client, claim, payment and control issues. However, Fine Gael’s social and family affairs spokes-woman Olwyn Enright said the proposed scheme left "huge room" for fraud, for example claiming while not even in the country.

"Why did they bother changing the legislation so that new people have to sign on and be visible?"

Last year a spot check found up to 10% of dole claims were fraudulent – mostly made by, or in the name of, people living outside of Ireland. At the time it was decided photographic identification would be required of the growing number of people collecting the dole and other social welfare payments.

Hewlett Packard has refused to comment on the new scheme.

Minstrel27

How easy is it going to be to defraud the system now. They have lost their minds in Leinster House.

Fuhrer

Walking down to the office and signing a few pieces of paper is hard.


and the unemployed are busy enough as it is, you cant expect them to have to do that in person.

WindSock

Handy to know for when I leave the country to get another job. Oh but you still have to collect from the Post Office now though?

Bazzy

in before mary harney is mentioned

sponsoredwalk

PCPhoto wrote: »

Seriously .... theres something fundamentally wrong with the people in the government.... talk about trying to encourage thole on the dole to become lazier*

I don't understand how freeing up the employees to devote more time to dealing with claims & reviewing cases will increase fraud? You would think with more time on employee's hands they could cross examine people more, investigate suspicious claims etc...

It would seem to me that that is the view taken by these people & that they have a viable plan in order to convince the government to go along with the situation.

Also, why does the author include 'Fine Gael TD's'? Why them??

Truley

Blah Blah Blah the dole is too much/too easy to get noone will want to get a job now and the country will implode on itself... They should all be given loaves of bread ... I pay taxes etc etc *gets coat*

munchkin_utd

so someone on the dole can now sign on from the beach in Lanzarotte by text!

Niiiiiiiice!!!

stovelid

People should be forced to walk to the furthest possible dole office from their home to sign on. In bare feet. And carrying a rucksack full of bricks.

And OP, despite your protestations, lazier is the comparative of lazy which implies that those who become lazier are indubitably lazy to begin with. I suggest you rephrase if, as you say, you don't want to imply that people on the dole are lazy.

biko

They should hand out the dole every day at 9 somewhere in town.
It would be like having a job to get up to but then you get the rest of the day off.

LoanShark

Why couldn't this have been available when I was on the Dole????

All those mornings I had to stand in line in the rain and snow and the hail, When I could have stayed in the bed and signed on by text!!


This country makes so many efforts to stop fradulant claims and ALMOST succeeds, then they do something stupid like this.....Back to Square one!!

Antar Bolaeisk

Something like this could work but they could do a random check telling them to go into the office to get their allowance every couple of weeks as a means of cutting down on fraud. If it saves money while not opening up the Dole to massive abuse then it's not too bad.

Of course the easiest way to save money would be to axe the dole....

Stark

WindSock wrote: »

Handy to know for when I leave the country to get another job. Oh but you still have to collect from the Post Office now though?

I got it transferred directly to my bank account when I was between jobs before. As far as I know, you still can. Only had to call in once a month to confirm I was still in the country.

Standard Toaster

You can shedule sending texts on most online mobile sites.

That's it, handing in notice today

gsxr1

there is some bull**** comments on here.

Seriously .... theres something fundamentally wrong with the people in the government.... talk about trying to encourage thole on the dole to become lazier*

*= not claiming that dole recipients are lazy or anything like that.

They should hand out the dole every day at 9 somewhere in town.
It would be like having a job to get up to but then you get the rest of the day off.

People should be forced to walk to the furthest possible dole office from their home to sign on. In bare feet. And carrying a rucksack full of bricks.

And OP, despite your protestations, lazier is the comparative of lazy which implies that those who become lazier are indubitably lazy to begin with. I suggest you rephrase if, as you say, you don't want to imply that people on the dole are lazy.

Do you *****les truly believe that people are unemployed by there own fault!!

Why not go up to Pfizer right now and talk like that. Yeah . The small group of the 100000s who have all there stamps payed and have now no work to go to anymore.

Ye wont be so smug when it happens to yourselves.

as for texting . Its sounds silly to me . If they cant handle the volume, why not employ some of the people crying out to work .

Fizman

This government are so far down the syndrome scale that they need to come up for air.

Mr Benevolent

At last, the government has a single good idea.

Chorcai

Stark wrote: »

I got it transferred directly to my bank account when I was between jobs before. As far as I know, you still can. Only had to call in once a month to confirm I was still in the country.

Last time I signed on was in Sept, everytime I collect at the post office my signing on date gets pushed forward it's now out to the 22/6. I only had to sign on once so far. Bit of a joke if ya ask me.

I don't know how it works if it's paid into the bank, is there a note/comment left by the SW when you get your statment ?

xhappyx

The system is totally screwed up anyway so why not add on something even more ridiculous. For those who think that those on the dole are "lazy" - think again. I have been working for 20 years, paid tens of thousands in taxes and have made redundant. It is humiliating to say the least to have people call you lazy when you spend hours per day trying to find work only to get a PFO letter (if you are lucky!), usually they don't even bother to acknowledge or respond to your application. I spent 1.5 hours in the dole office on Tues last while 6 people sat behind cubicles and not one person was called to the counter for a full 20mins. The place was packed and they didn't give a damn. I only went there in person because no one answered the repeated telephone calls which I made. There was not even an answering machine to leave an irate message on. So finally, if they don't answer the phones, who is going to check the text messages.

28064212

Having to queue up at the welfare office to sign on is no deterrent to fraud. They removed the option to have your dole transferred to a bank account (except in highly specialized circumstances), so you have to go down to the post office and sign for your payment every week anyway. Sign-on days take up a lot of resources from the welfare offices and doesn't do anything useful, so why not get rid of it?

Stark

Chorcai wrote: »

Last time I signed on was in Sept, everytime I collect at the post office my signing on date gets pushed forward it's now out to the 22/6. I only had to sign on once so far. Bit of a joke if ya ask me.

I don't know how it works if it's paid into the bank, is there a note/comment left by the SW when you get your statment ?

You see "CT DFSA" or something similar on your statement.

Text messaging is tracable, if the text was sent from and unusual source it would be easy to spot!

Anyway, random spotchecks would be a far more efficient way to catch fraudsters.

gsxr1

xhappyx wrote: »

The system is totally screwed up anyway so why not add on something even more ridiculous. For those who think that those on the dole are "lazy" - think again. I have been working for 20 years, paid tens of thousands in taxes and have made redundant. It is humiliating to say the least to have people call you lazy when you spend hours per day trying to find work only to get a PFO letter (if you are lucky!), usually they don't even bother to acknowledge or respond to your application. I spent 1.5 hours in the dole office on Tues last while 6 people sat behind cubicles and not one person was called to the counter for a full 20mins. The place was packed and they didn't give a damn. I only went there in person because no one answered the repeated telephone calls which I made. There was not even an answering machine to leave an irate message on. So finally, if they don't answer the phones, who is going to check the text messages.

as said. If they took a few off the dole. Even part time just to help out with admin.

I am off it for now. But know how frustrating it is up there. Even if you have to get a insurance claim form stamped. Its 4 hours in a line.

It seems strange that every 3rd or 4th applicant needs to bring an east European interpretor to communicate in English. There is something really fishy going on there.

If they tightened up on security against the fraud then there would be less admin work in the long run

liah

I was about to be shocked, then I remembered this is the same country that accidentally banned cigarettes and has a blasphemy law in place.

Somehow not surprised.

Thepones

If they really are discussing something like "signing on by mobile service" then they all should be sectioned.

Mongs

marco_polo

I work in IT athough for any of the parties involved, From what I have heard throught 'unofficial pub channels' is that the system will have the ability to initiate automated spot check calls, incorporating voice recognition technology, to ensure that the right person answers the call, as well as the ability to tell if that person is in the country or not from the mobile ringtone.

But anyway rabble rabble rabble .......

Thepones

What if you run out of credit though. Will they set up an allowance for that?

gsxr1

marco_polo wrote: »

I work in IT athough for any of the parties involved, From what I have heard throught 'unofficial pub channels' is that the system will have the ability to initiate automated spot check calls, incorporating voice recognition technology, to ensure that the right person answers the call, as well as the ability to tell if that person is in the country or not from the mobile ringtone.

But anyway rabble rabble rabble .......

What if your missus answered your phone. Jasuzzzz. imagine the trouble ye would get into lol

Banned Account

This is the most ridiculous idea I have ever heard.

punchdrunk

as a dole stealing lowlife myself,I whole heartedly welcome this venture

it means I don't have to wash clean clothes to leave the house that day
and can stay in,watch Jeremy kyle and shoot up between my toes

Banned Account

punchdrunk wrote: »

as a dole stealing lowlife myself,I whole heartedly welcome this venture

it means I don't have to wash clean clothes to leave the house that day
and can stay in,watch Jeremy kyle and shoot up between my toes

You still have the toe option available? - obviously not long term unemployed then, I just used the last of my mickey yesterday.

geeky

I'm normally on the side of the dole-ee, but this idea is just ridiculous.

mickdw

They will certainly have to provide the people on the dole with mobiles free of charge now. After all, it would be unconstitutional to make people who couldnt afford a mobile have to actually do more work to get there payment than those who have a phone.

xhappyx

ha ha, good one - free mobiles yah!!!

ghostdancer

so instead of going to the local welfare office once a month to sign a piece of paper and nothing else, you can do it by text instead.

you still have to go to the post office every week, sign, to collect your money.


not really sure what people's issue here is. it doesn't make fraud any easier, or people any less likely to collect their dole.

if anything, it just creates less of a queue at the local office, so that the welfare office workers can actually process claims and queries quicker, instead of 1/2 of them having to wait for a few hundred people a day to sign a piece of paper.

punchdrunk

any chance of an app for it I wonder?

brendansmith

cn i hv d free $s nw pls? xoxo

Banned Account

ghostdancer wrote: »

so instead of going to the local welfare office once a month to sign a piece of paper and nothing else, you can do it by text instead.

you still have to go to the post office every week, sign, to collect your money.


not really sure what people's issue here is. it doesn't make fraud any easier, or people any less likely to collect their dole.

if anything, it just creates less of a queue at the local office, so that the welfare office workers can actually process claims and queries quicker, instead of 1/2 of them having to wait for a few hundred people a day to sign a piece of paper.

Of course, now you can text "yes I am available for work from abroad, the pub, the other end of the country or from that nixer you're doing without having to take a half day off to go home and change your clothes before going to the office.

Crackin' idea:rolleyes:

changes

I would like to think that with the country in the state its in and 21 billion a year going on social welfare that welfare fraud is one of the top targets for this government.

If this system is designed to aid in catching welfare fraudsters then great but if its just some harebrained way to reduce the workload of the admin staff then i really do worry for the future of this country.

ghostdancer

geeky wrote: »

I'm normally on the side of the dole-ee, but this idea is just ridiculous.

why exactly is it ridiculous?

what benefit is there by making people go to their office once a month, sign a piece of paper, then go on their way?

when i was on the dole, it was a complete waste of time, as i still had to go to the post office each week and show them my Social Services card, the same one i show at the Welfare Office, to collect money.

they can still call people to come in and show proof that they're applying for work.



in fact, cost of implementing it aside, it's a bloody great idea.

marco_polo

The only mention of 'by text' is from the author of the piece?

ghostdancer

Fitzcaraldo wrote: »

Of course, now you can text "yes I am available for work from abroad, the pub, the other end of the country or from that nixer you're doing without having to take a half day off to go home and change your clothes before going to the office.

Crackin' idea:rolleyes:

except that's not how it works.

it doesn't mention anything about proving that you're looking for work via text.
it says that you are certifying that you are still seeking work via text, the same as signing the sheet every month.
if they want to see documentation of that, then they will ask for it separately, just like they do now.

this proposal would basically have no impact on fraud whatsoever compared to the current system.

i'm guessing the people that are saying how silly the idea is don't understand the current setup.

gsxr1

Would be great if we could do it Via Face book Status instead.

social networking while signing

Banned Account

ghostdancer wrote: »

except that's not how it works.

it doesn't mention anything about proving that you're looking for work via text.

it says that you are certifying that you are still seeking work via text, the same as signing the sheet every month.

if they want to see documentation of that, then they will ask for it separately, just like they do now.

How did you draw this conclusion from the post you have quoted. If you are signing on and not working, why the hell is it such an inconvenience to go down to the office and present yourself once a month?


P.S. After Hours has spoken, and you are clearly wrong

mikom

Still no job : (
No nixers this wk ; )
More dole pls : )

Banned Account

mikom wrote: »

Still no job : (
No nixers this wk ; )
More dole pls : )

Hi. Your Special Treat is waiting for you. Make sure you drop by socialwelfare.ie/freemoney and click on special traets to collect yours. Opt out by working.

saywhatyousee

out of the 21 billion social welfare bill 4.9 billion goes to the dole the other 16 billion or so goes on child benefit, pension ect

ghostdancer

Fitzcaraldo wrote: »

How did you draw this conclusion from the post you have quoted. If you are signing on and not working, why the hell is it such an inconvenience to go down to the office and present yourself once a month?


P.S. After Hours has spoken, and you are clearly wrong

who said anything about it being an inconvenience?
it's to free up resources and improve efficiency in the public sector, and save money.


PS. AH is full of spastics, ergo, it's a great idea. and i'm right.

Banned Account

ghostdancer wrote: »

it's to free up resources and improve efficiency in the public sector, and save money.

They could do this by actually working a bit.

ghostdancer wrote: »

PS. AH is full of spastics.

Come here often;)

mikom

Fitzcaraldo wrote: »

Hi. Your Special Treat is waiting for you. Make sure you drop by socialwelfare.ie/freemoney and click on special traets to collect yours. Opt out by working.

tks
c u nxt wk.

Run_to_da_hills

munchkin_utd wrote: »

so someone on the dole can now sign on from the beach in Lanzarotte by text!

Nice!!!

Not as easy as that, have you ever tried using Google Maps on a phone?

I gather the Authorities will have cell site analysis and any other high tech GPS tracking technology at their finger tips.